What will Chris Ballard's approach be in Free Agency? (Merge)

[Colts_Fan12]

4 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

If that.  Davis wasn't really much of a star this year.

 

However that still doesn't disprove my point.  Go look at all the threads on free agents and count how many seriously list as a guy they would like someone who isn't considered a big name star player.  And because I'm pointing it out, I would exclude any of my posts.

 

I even started a thread on Jan. 16 "Less costly FA's to consider" specifically talking about role players to bring in.  That got zero replies.  No one cared the slightest big about role players we could bring in for a moderate cost.

 

Instead everyone focused on the star players.  The 32 quality young players thread which was entirely about star players got 64 responses.  

 

This is what I'm talking about.  GM's who build through the draft as a general strategy use FA to augment their team mostly with middle of the road guys who are role players.  But very few fans understand this strategy because every time FA comes up they immediately go to the top 2 or 3 names at every position of need and start screaming for those guys.  

Most fans are not realistic when it comes to FA but it's not unrealistic imo to want 2 top end FAs like Berry and Ingram if both hit the market. We could afford that and then a role player or maybe 2 we really are not spending much money on D at all right now. But I do still believe Davis is a star just hard for him to do anything with absolutely zero pass rush.

[Valpo2004]

46 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Most fans are not realistic when it comes to FA but it's not unrealistic imo to want 2 top end FAs like Berry and Ingram if both hit the market. We could afford that and then a role player or maybe 2 we really are not spending much money on D at all right now. But I do still believe Davis is a star just hard for him to do anything with absolutely zero pass rush.

 

We could sign them now but what does that do to our cap implications in the future.  

 

 

[Myles]

38 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Your team needs the right combination of stars and middle of the road guys who act as role players.  

 

Not everyone on the team can be a star player.  

 

 

I agree.    We already have the middle of the road guys.    Also quite a few side of the road players. 

[Colts_Fan12]

1 minute ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

We could sign them now but what does that do to our cap implications in the future.  

 

 

From everything I've read here it wouldn't hurt us much the cap will continue to rise as well 

[SaturdayAllDay]

17 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

We could sign them now but what does that do to our cap implications in the future.  

 

 

Two big signings essentially fill the cap space that would have been allocated to the new contracts for our 2013 draft class. Since we have 0 people to resign we are good for a few yrs cap wise. 

[BullsColtsFan1]

I hope it's a successful off season free agency wise and draft wise.  Sure I would love it if he brought a couple of the Chiefs stars over with him but as long as he goes out and gets some solid players(especially on defense), I don't think I can complain. 

[21isSuperman]

If I recall KC's history correctly, they've been moderately active in free agency.  They don't drop $200 mil on contracts in one offseason (a la the Redskins), but they do acquire talent using free agency (unlike teams like the Packers).  I think it'll be the same approach here.

[DarkHorse]

We have money to buy a few players in free agency but will built through draft

[Finball]

55 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

If I recall KC's history correctly, they've been moderately active in free agency.  They don't drop $200 mil on contracts in one offseason (a la the Redskins), but they do acquire talent using free agency (unlike teams like the Packers).  I think it'll be the same approach here.

 

Mitchell Schwartz; 5 years, 33M, '16

Jeremy Maclin; 5 years, 55M, '15

 

 

Those are the FAs from other teams that Chiefs signed for somewhat big money the past 3 years. Then some cheaper signings for a few million and/or just a year or two, like Nick Foles, Tyvon Branch, Vance Walker, Joe Mays etc.

[throwing BBZ]

6 hours ago, superrep1967 said:

Yeah, I would rather see us spend the money on an elite pass rusher. 

 

 please name him and give us your estimated cost.

[21isSuperman]

2 hours ago, Finball said:

 

Mitchell Schwartz; 5 years, 33M, '16

Jeremy Maclin; 5 years, 55M, '15

 

 

Those are the FAs from other teams that Chiefs signed for somewhat big money the past 3 years. Then some cheaper signings for a few million and/or just a year or two, like Nick Foles, Tyvon Branch, Vance Walker, Joe Mays etc.

Maclin was the one who immediately came to my mind, particularly because I remember wanting the Colts to sign him.

[RockThatBlue]

We are going to have about 60 million in cap space. I'd be pretty shocked if he didn't dive into free agency. He almost has too with all the money he will have.

[COLTS449]

^^^^^^

 

We have tons of cap room. Especially after we cut guys like DQ and Jones, and btw, Ballard didn't have the final so when it came to KC's FA signings. 

 

Considering the fact we have Andrew Luck on top of 60 million in cap space I think Ballard will want to go all in and try to completely turn us around next season. Yes if you have an elite QB, and at least a few good pieces you can pretty much fill every hole in one offseason.......IF you also hit big in the draft and come out with 2-3, stud day 1 starters. I think he'll want to grab a top tier Guard like Zeitler, Leary, or Lang, and one of Nick Perry or Melvin Ingram, then one of the CB's. There's a handful of corners I wouldn't mind. Hopefully Bouye hits the market. He established himself as a top 5 corner this year IMO. Stephon Gilmore would be my next pick, but I don't think he hits the market period. But a guy like Trumaine Johnson or Morris Claiborne would be alright. Kirkpatrick and Amukamara would be OK. Amukamara was solid this year, but wasn't Bouye or Claiborne.

 

Hopefully....

Nick Perry

AJ Bouye

Dontari Poe

TJ Lang

 

3 major signings, 1 that wouldn't break the bank. Lang probably wont get as much as Zeitler or Leary because he's like 4 years older than both I think. Pretty sure he's 30, but I'd say he could be had at 4/28. Maybe 4/30ish. Not more than that, but he's still an elite guard and would immediately fix our OL. And Perry is going to get paid, but not Vernon type money, and LOL. Give me Nick Perry over Vernon all day long. Perry's turning into a beast EDGE rusher. He's putting it all together, tapping into his potential and is turning into a double digit sack machine. He had like 12.5 sacks this year am I right? Melvin Ingram might get a little bigger contract...Maybe? But I'd be happy with either. It'd be a hard choice, but I think Perry will definitely hit the market. Ingram may not.

 

We could move Geathers to ILB, permanently, and draft an ILB in the 2nd or 3rd to come in and start day 1. Geathers would probably shine with a beast like Poe at NT. But we have to have one of Anderson or Ridgeway to break out. Anderson was on his way his rookie year. With almost 2 full years removed from the injury I think he'll be a star next season, and Ridgeway has the potential to come out and really make a name for himself next year.

 

[thecorn4]

Not sure we will want to go after a free agent pass rusher, not saying it's not a need, it's a huge need, but they command such a high dollar.  Why spend so much of our cap money on one guy, when it is obvious that we have holes at all three levels.  

 

One of the big questions this off season is: where to play Geathers, that has to be settled.  Do you play him at safety or ILB?  You play him at safety resign Butler to play alongside of him, let Green develop, and resign Adams on the cheap for veteran leadership.  I could deal with that on opening day.  You move Geathers to ILB, now I'm not so sure about our safety situation, and we address it with the draft and or free agency.  Geathers is a talent, who I believe will only get better with time, but he needs to focus on one position.  Once they figure him out and where he needs to play, I believe we will see what direction we will go in free agency.

[Imrryr]

8 hours ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

If that.  Davis wasn't really much of a star this year.

 

However that still doesn't disprove my point.  Go look at all the threads on free agents and count how many seriously list as a guy they would like someone who isn't considered a big name star player.  And because I'm pointing it out, I would exclude any of my posts.

 

I even started a thread on Jan. 16 "Less costly FA's to consider" specifically talking about role players to bring in.  That got zero replies.  No one cared the slightest big about role players we could bring in for a moderate cost.

 

Instead everyone focused on the star players.  The 32 quality young players thread which was entirely about star players got 64 responses.  That was based almost entirely on the top 32 free agents who where under 30.  Basically all of the guys you would have to break the bank for.  

 

This is what I'm talking about.  GM's who build through the draft as a general strategy use FA to augment their team mostly with middle of the road guys who are role players.  But very few fans understand this strategy because every time FA comes up they immediately go to the top 2 or 3 names at every position of need and start screaming for those guys.  

I am sorry i didnt see that post or i would have commented, i was away for a few weeks as every topic was seemingly the same stuff over and over. So not all of us dont understand that.

[TimetobringDfence!]

I would really like to see the Colts snag Jason Pierre-Paul and either a solid LB or CB free agent to go with him.  Maybe take the chance on signing one more O-line man or trading D-Allen for one if anyone would bite on the offer.

[TimetobringDfence!]

15 minutes ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

I think Poe is too big name and expensive, and Berry is worth a shot if Adams walks. I would really like to see the Colts snag Jason Pierre-Paul and either a solid LB or CB free agent to go with him.  Maybe take the chance on signing one more O-line man or trading D-Allen for one if anyone would bite on the offer.

 

[Patagonia Chris]

10 hours ago, csmopar said:

I was wondering the same thing.  It's gonna be an interesting next 6-8 weeks

 

I expect that, defensively, most of the free agent signings on the defensive side of the ball will be much like Grigson's first off-season with the team where he signed low-risk, high-reward no name players. It's all speculation at this point but I don't see Ballard schilling out big dollars to players who don't have a hybrid skill set.

[backshoulderfade]

Nick Perry is a nice second tier guy I could see is bringing in.

[Pacergeek]

Ballard wants team built from within. Team leaders will be guys that he drafts. Not gonna go Grigson, and throw huge $$ at guys off the street. No more mercenary culture 

[buccolts]

1 minute ago, Pacergeek said:

Ballard wants team built from within. Team leaders will be guys that he drafts. Not gonna go Grigson, and throw huge $$ at guys off the street. No more mercenary culture 

Actually, I thought Grigson was pretty good from a financial standpoint. 

 

His drafts couldn't support his FA strategy, though. 

[Pacergeek]

4 minutes ago, buccolts said:

Actually, I thought Grigson was pretty good from a financial standpoint. 

 

His drafts couldn't support his FA strategy, though. 

It's a problem when guys brought in from the outside are getting more money than players that came up with the system. Especially, when Grigson blew money on guys that can't play. Laron Landry and Arthur Jones for example

[aaron11]

3 hours ago, thecorn4 said:

One of the big questions this off season is: where to play Geathers, that has to be settled.  Do you play him at safety or ILB? 

he's a safety that likes to be in the box.  i dont think they will move him to ilb, he would be more than a little undersized for that position.  i dont have all of the exact numbers, but the lighter ilbs in the league are around 230 pounds, while some are much heavier.  CG is listed at 215

[Pacergeek]

Under Grigson we had a culture where if you were a high draft pick, you were playing no matter what. Guys like Trent Richardson and Bjorn Werner stayed a season longer than they should have, and costed us roster spots of potential useful players. Instead of always looking to improve the team, Grigson had a "wait and see" approach when it was clear that these guys could not play.

 

Ballard has no ties to Grigson's draft picks, and if he determines they cannot play, will they be on the roster in 2017. Mainly, I'm referring to Philip Dorsett and TJ Green. I know Green was a Rookie, but he looked terrible. I really hope I'm wrong, but with Grigson's poor draft record, all the signs of bust are with Green. The fact that he was a 2nd round pick means nothing as far as Ballard is concerned. Will Ballard be patient with these under-performing players, or will he be quick to empty the trash can? No more cluttering the roster with lousy players

[Bluefire4]

Ballard said in the press conference that he would do a little in free agency but the draft is more important. This makes me believe we may only see 1-2 signings.

[COLTS449]

3 hours ago, thecorn4 said:

Not sure we will want to go after a free agent pass rusher, not saying it's not a need, it's a huge need, but they command such a high dollar.  Why spend so much of our cap money on one guy, when it is obvious that we have holes at all three levels.  

 

One of the big questions this off season is: where to play Geathers, that has to be settled.  Do you play him at safety or ILB?  You play him at safety resign Butler to play alongside of him, let Green develop, and resign Adams on the cheap for veteran leadership.  I could deal with that on opening day.  You move Geathers to ILB, now I'm not so sure about our safety situation, and we address it with the draft and or free agency.  Geathers is a talent, who I believe will only get better with time, but he needs to focus on one position.  Once they figure him out and where he needs to play, I believe we will see what direction we will go in free agency.

 

Dude. We need like 3 big time EDGE rushers. My dream (for EDGE rushers) is a free agent signing of Perry or Ingram, then one with our 1st round pick and then another in the 2nd or 3rd, then another in the 4th-6th. I want an explosive, speed rusher in the draft and there's a handful of them. Several guys I like, and more I'm starting to like. We need to just straight up load up on OLB's this offseason. I want like what Seattle, Denver, KC, Minnesota, etc has. Seattle has Avril, Bennett, and Clark. KC has Houston, Ford, and Hali. Except I want us to sign one guy and hit big on 2 in the draft. This is a deep class for EDGE rushers, Maybe we can find our own Chandler Jones in the 1st and our own Danielle Hunter in the 3rd. We have to have a couple double digit sack EDGE rushers man.

 

And besides that, with the cap going up year after year it would be simple to give Nick Perry or Melvin Ingram, AJ Bouye, and Dontari Poe big contracts. Plus sign an ILB like Zach Brown at something like 3/15 or maybe he gets 3/20. He's underrated and would immediately give us a very good ILB. Or a guard like TJ Lang 4/28. I think we can easily sign 4 of those guys. Then if we hit big in the draft and come out with 2-3 day 1 impact players we're looking at a completely different team. With Lang at G all of a sudden we have a top 10 OL. With Bouye at CB we instantly have a top of the line 1-2 punch at corner, Perry or Ingram would give us a beast, double digit sack EDGE rusher, and again Brown would instantly upgrade our ILB's. Then come out of the draft with a couple freak EDGE rushers, an all around ILB with coverage skills, and a RB or 2 and man we're set. A legit top 5 team.

[Pacergeek]

1 minute ago, Bluefire4 said:

Ballard said in the press conference that he would do a little in free agency but the draft is more important. This makes me believe we may only see 1-2 signings.

I would expect Ballard to sign a few guys, but no big names. Better to draft well, and then have the money to re-sign our own guys when their Rookie contracts expire. Jerrell Freeman was not retained because we had money tied up in crappy FA's like Trent Cole and Arthur Jones.

 

Ballard is more "Big Picture" kind of GM. No more throwing darts at a dartboard to construct a roster. Have a plan formulated on Day 1. Grigson was essentially winging it, trying to hastily fill holes with players that were not properly scouted. We had money, we needed a safety, so LaRon Landry, a big name guy, is acquired. 

[Pacergeek]

You know your last GM sucked, when Clayton Geathers is deemed as the best defensive prospect. IMO, Geathers did little to inspire confidence that he is one of our long term building blocks for the future. Sure, he can hit, but there were many games where he was invisible. Geathers is just a guy, borderline starter. Our defense should have like 5-6 players on Geathers level lol. 

[NannyMcafee]

You should check out Ballards first press conference. He answers your question in a round about way. Says you have to earn being a colt.

[TDewar1987]

Going from his press conference I'm inclined to say yes, that after evaluation there will probably be multiple players cut for various reasons. Age, talent, work ethic, etc.

[MB-ColtsFan]

It would appear that training camp will be quite "open" and very competitive this year.  Especially in the trenches.  I don't think he will regard draft position at all.  I look forward to FA.

[tvturner]

Oh my goodness that hate on Green is ridiculous, yes he wasn't good, but he wasn't even supposed to play at all... 

[RockThatBlue]

18 minutes ago, Pacergeek said:

You know your last GM sucked, when Clayton Geathers is deemed as the best defensive prospect. IMO, Geathers did little to inspire confidence that he is one of our long term building blocks for the future. Sure, he can hit, but there were many games where he was invisible. Geathers is just a guy, borderline starter. Our defense should have like 5-6 players on Geathers level lol. 

I disagree. I thought Geathers was playing very well before he got hurt, he was not only a good hitter but I thought he looked improved in coverage too. He wasn't getting beat down the field as much. 

[Finball]

36 minutes ago, Pacergeek said:

I would expect Ballard to sign a few guys, but no big names. Better to draft well, and then have the money to re-sign our own guys when their Rookie contracts expire. Jerrell Freeman was not retained because we had money tied up in crappy FA's like Trent Cole and Arthur Jones.

 

 

I usually despise the idea of using free agency as a big tool to build a team but I think Colts should go after few big names*. We have too many holes that could be filled in a draft or two. Not a lot of players who are going to need big raises in a year or two. Guys drafted this year won't be UFAs until 2021. Smart long-term planning is a must but I wouldn't be worrying about not having enough room to re-sign our own players. Not even advocating spend all of our cap space; we have about 50M in cap space and I'm perfectly fine with rolling over like half of that.

 

*If Ballard can find impact players on cheap, then sure but most likely he'll need to spend money to get those.

[Larry Horseman]

45 minutes ago, Pacergeek said:

Under Grigson we had a culture where if you were a high draft pick, you were playing no matter what. Guys like Trent Richardson and Bjorn Werner stayed a season longer than they should have, and costed us roster spots of potential useful players. Instead of always looking to improve the team, Grigson had a "wait and see" approach when it was clear that these guys could not play.

 

Ballard has no ties to Grigson's draft picks, and if he determines they cannot play, will they be on the roster in 2017. Mainly, I'm referring to Philip Dorsett and TJ Green. I know Green was a Rookie, but he looked terrible. I really hope I'm wrong, but with Grigson's poor draft record, all the signs of bust are with Green. The fact that he was a 2nd round pick means nothing as far as Ballard is concerned. Will Ballard be patient with these under-performing players, or will he be quick to empty the trash can? No more cluttering the roster with lousy players

 

No. Dorsett or Green won't be cut, and they don't deserve to be. It is actually funny that you think they should be cut. 

[Colts1324]

I think it largely depends on Pagano's honest assessment of the two players. 

[esmort]

2 hours ago, Pacergeek said:

I would expect Ballard to sign a few guys, but no big names. Better to draft well, and then have the money to re-sign our own guys when their Rookie contracts expire. Jerrell Freeman was not retained because we had money tied up in crappy FA's like Trent Cole and Arthur Jones.

 

Ballard is more "Big Picture" kind of GM. No more throwing darts at a dartboard to construct a roster. Have a plan formulated on Day 1. Grigson was essentially winging it, trying to hastily fill holes with players that were not properly scouted. We had money, we needed a safety, so LaRon Landry, a big name guy, is acquired. 

 

That is not the reason Freeman was not retained.We could have easily afforded Freeman; Grigson badly misjudged and mishandled that situation.

[AZColt11]

I don't know the guy or how he operates, but I would think a young, inexperienced GM would tread carefully while still learning his craft.  I wouldn't think he would go into FA willy-nilly and just blow through the money.  If there are guys you REALLY like, and they are still young or in their prime years, and they fill a big need, then why not?  But this team doesn't need any more old vets who are looking for that last deal for their "retirement" when their prime has clearly passed them by.  That won't help us.  I would think the bulk of his moves would come via the draft.  And if you are REALLY wanting a guy you have a 95+ grade on, and you have already drafted, then do what you  have to do and move up to get him.  So I would think if there are any big moves to be made it would be via the draft, or perhaps the Chiefs where he already knows his personnel.  I can't see either Berry or Poe leaving KC though.

[funktacious2]

On 1/29/2017 at 11:08 PM, CR91 said:

This is Ballard's first time running the show so there is no past experience to say how he will approach free agency, but we do have plenty of money to play with. One thing I am sure of, we're gonna have a roster overturn coming soon.

That last part has been my initial thinking. Our roster has holes, but it might have even more soon because I could see Ballard shaving away some of the rough edges on this roster in order to rebuild it from a better foundation. I think it would be a good think for our roster long-term, but it'll certainly need more than one season for our roster to reach its full potential.

[loudnproudcolt]

After reading and listening to Ballard, I will state a few things I have already said, but one thing stands out about what I read in the paper today when he interviewed for the Chicago Bears GM job last year. I don't think him being a new GM is going to make a difference as to how he approaches the craft. When he interviewed with Chicago, he had a good shot at the job, but he told Chicago what he felt the problems were, and they could be fixed through organizational changes. Chicago did not want to hear that, and supposedly this was the reason he did not get the job. He was honest with him and had a vision. I expect him to do the same thing, in fact I believe it is what Irsay liked so much about him. He is going to evaluate all our players, and you are going to see cuts made.

 

Second, as I have stated before, I believe he will want to build through the draft, but after getting done with his evaluation, he is going to be faced with a talent deficit and a large amount of cap space for the next two years.

We have over 60M this year, assuming Jones and DQ are gone which I think is safe, and I think once he looks at tape, the number is going to grow. This year the only players we need to extend to what I would deem more than small numbers is Mewhort, Montcrief, and Doyle. There are others, but they won't be large contracts.

 

Grigson's terrible draft choices, especially in 2013 left us in a position where we don't have our own players to extend. We are going to have to use FA in some fashion to fill some of the holes!

 

In 2018, without any carry over from this year's large amount of cap space, we have 79M in cap space, and we are going to be facing the same situation thanks to Grigson. In 2019 we should start extending some of this years draft group which I actually like some of the players, Kelly especially, and I think the OL we drafted is going to grow and surprise. They improved over the course of the year, and because of the college game, very few lineman come in and make an impact. I think we will be signing our last draft class and some of 2015 to extensions. Regardless, we are going to have a huge amount of cap space the next two years, and holes to fill. In 2018 and 19 we hopefully will start signing our own draft picks to extensions and not have to worry about FA too much except to fill certain holes like Denver has done and excellent job of lately.

 

FA is about understanding players who are highly touted are good many times because of the system they play in and the players who are beside them. These two things are huge impacts to how good most guys play and system must be taken into account when looking at players. Certain positions though are more independent. Safety is one of them, DL of the system you run, and OL. CB you need to consider if your FA plays zone or press. We play press.

 

We have a lot of holes to fill, and I would love to have Berry as our safety. We need a captain for this defense. I would prefer Williams from Baltimore over Poe. Poe has underperformed the last few years, and Williams would be a little cheaper. I like our OL for the most part but their are some guards I would really like to look at. Zeitler is going to be expensive, but there are some like Lang, who may be a little cheaper and are very good. I look at Bouye and yes he had a great year, but it was still only his first year where he shined, and he had a really good defense, who pressured the QB, which really makes a CB's job easier. I also don't know if he is zone or press, and we are press. I like Johnson, although he under performed this year, and he is going to get big money, but he is a press corner I believe. I think since Cleveland hired Williams as their DC, they are going to toss huge money his way. Question is will he want to go to Cleveland?

 

My point, I want quality over quantity. If we find system fits that are cheaper then great. We are going to have to spend some of our cap space the next two years due to the simple fact Grigson drafted terribly and we will have few extensions to sign, and the amount of cap space we are going to have. Cleveland and SF both are going to have over 100M this year in cap space. The reason, lack of talent due to drafting. I don't want to be in this position in two years.

 

I think next year is going to be a tough one. All the teams in our division should continue to improve. I would love to make the playoffs, and with a healthy Luck and some good FA pickups, a great draft, and an improved OL, who knows. If not, at least we will have one more year of high draft choices, and huge cap space to pick up one or two more FA studs. Dave Toub I believe would be the new head coach and I believe the arrow is pointing up. I really like the GM we picked, but FA will have to be part of the plan.

 

Sorry for how long this was, but it summarizes a lot of thoughts I have had lately!