What's the plan?

[JMichael557]

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

[chad72]

They need to show up and execute. Starts with the trenches controlling tempo and forcing more 3rd downs and secondary forcing more incompletions. Everyone needs to improve, from coaches to players on the execution front.

 

Familiar surroundings should help, with home. Just need to find a way to be louder than the piped in noise.  

[Gyworks]

56 minutes ago, JMichael557 said:

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

Watching most of the games in the past 10 or so years this team provided us with enough opportunities to be disappoimted. This is just part of the deal being a fan. We always keep sitting down for the next game with the hope that we’ve got the best team in the world and that we’ll win out the rest of the season. The problem is with us being fans and thus being hopelessly biased...

[MCurtis32]

23 hours ago, JMichael557 said:

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

That the problem being a colts fan. Too much wondering thru the desert. About every 20 years or so the Colts get good enough to make a showing. When Harbough was in town, I met him and Marchibroda playing golf in ST. Augustine. They must have thought I was crazy with my enthusiasm. Harbaugh gave me a colts hat and they both sighned it! I had not seen a Colts hat since the 70's. 

[WoolMagnet]

Plan?  Whats that?

We dont need no stinkin’ plan!

 

[RollerColt]

[JMichael557]

What bothers me is that you cannot win with a good QB in the nfl. When you start bringing in old QB's or promising backups it just does not work long term. We are not going to the superbowl this year with the current makeup of this team. I hope we get the young guys in asap. If they do not show improvement then we go back to the draft well next year. Just running in place serves no purpose.

[GoColts8818]

Losing the Super Bowl hurt a lot more than Sunday for me.

[Smonroe]

@JMichael557 You're looking at the wrong side of the ball.  Yes, Rivers is a dead end as far as the Colts future.  We knew that from the day he was signed.  But he is good enough.  Look how many yards we had in that game.

 

The problem is the defense.  We've played that soft zone for over two years now.  Flus even said something has to change.  When mediocre teams can keep possessions going, you know it's not working.

 

[shasta519]

On 9/15/2020 at 12:26 PM, JMichael557 said:

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

 

The younger QB you mean? Because if Rivers gets benched for JB...in some desperate effort to meander their way to 7 wins or so...I will have to consider passing on Colts games the rest of the way...which has never happened.

[krunk]

Why exactly would Rivers throw deep if the clear intent of the Jax D was to take away the deep pass? Usually when defenses do that you respond by throwing short passes and screens plus running the football to force the to abandon the two deep coverage. Rivers and some perceived inability to throw deep due old manisms was not the problem. Problem was it made no sense to throw deep. We were chunking them with short stuff anyway. I think youre overblowing that stat

[Patagonia Chris]

On 9/15/2020 at 12:26 PM, JMichael557 said:

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

40 minutes ago, krunk said:

Why exactly would Rivers throw deep if the clear intent of the Jax D was to take away the deep pass? Usually when defenses do that you respond by throwing short passes and screens plus running the football to force the to abandon the two deep coverage. Rivers and some perceived inability to throw deep due old manisms was not the problem. Problem was it made no sense to throw deep. We were chunking them with short stuff anyway. I think youre overblowing that stat

Going to be a lot of check downs this year. Book it.

[lollygagger8]

I said this in the other thread, but it really looks to me like Rivers has to really try hard to throw the ball with any zip. Maybe it's just me, but I hope his arm is alright. 

[GoColts8818]

1 minute ago, lollygagger8 said:

I said this in the other thread, but it really looks to me like Rivers has to really try hard to throw the ball with any zip. Maybe it's just me, but I hope his arm is alright. 

He’s always had a funky delivery.

[Nickster]

On 9/15/2020 at 11:26 AM, JMichael557 said:

I think that Sunday was the most disappointed that I have been since the Colts lost Bert Jones and went through several years of wandering the desert before Jim Harbaugh and then Peyton Manning. I was not disappointed by the loss per se (never like the team losing), but by a feeling of I do not know what they are doing. Rivers is a dead end. We will not win this year with Rivers and he provides zero future value. I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now. The same with Rhodes. Why did we sign him and why are we playing him? Let the young guys play so at least we can see some growth by the end of the year. It appears that right now we are just treading water. 

 

FYI i am looking at stats and Rivers average completed pass only traveled 4.2 yards. Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage. Should Hilton had caught the last pass. The answer is yes. Would it have been easier if the ball had been thrown with more zip so the DB could not get back into the play also yes.  Could the Oline played better? Maybe. But once Jacksonville figured ou that Rivers could not throw deep did they begin to crowd the line? Yes.

 

Rivers had a few really nice throws down the field into decent coverage.  That one in the face of the blitz of his back foot was as good as it gets.   

 

But then he had 3 boneheaded throws that killed us.  They weren't a velocity issue.  You couldn't have fit a bullet from a high powered rifle fired by a Navay SEAL into those coverages.

[AwesomeAustin]

1 hour ago, GoColts8818 said:

Losing the Super Bowl hurt a lot more than Sunday for me.

I actually didn’t mind that SB as much.  We played well and were beat by a great team that played just a little bit better.  Sure it stung a bit but was way better than losing in the playoffs to inferior teams.  

[Superman]

These threads crack me up. 

 

Rivers is 38. He wasn't signed to be the savior. He signed for one year, he's a bridge QB until we have someone better. And he's an upgrade on JB. (By the way, it's not close. Rivers is a substantially better QB than JB, even at 38, even with a couple turnovers/game.) He has to be more sharp than he was Sunday.

 

Also, the defense has to play better. Speaking of, aside from the penalty, Rhodes wasn't bad. Not good, has to do better at the snap, but it's not like he specifically got torched, so I'm not sure why OP is calling him out as if him being on the field doesn't make sense. 

 

Going back to Rivers, he only attempted three passes more than 20 yards down field. I think that will vary week to week. The Jags specifically attempted to take away deep passes. What was good is that, despite not throwing down field, he still averaged 7.9 yards/attempt. And that's because he completed passes quickly and let the receivers gain YAC. We actually ran screen plays successfully (something we've never done). I'm good with a quick, short game that produces yards. Take away two turnovers, a 4th down stop and a missed field goal, and the offense easily would have put up 30 points.

 

So again, he needs to tighten up, but we also have to run better, and the defense especially has to play better.

 

Acting like having Rivers and Rhodes on the field means there's no plan for the team is strange. The plan is pretty obvious. 

[AwesomeAustin]

8 minutes ago, Superman said:

These threads crack me up. 

 

Rivers is 38. He wasn't signed to be the savior. He signed for one year, he's a bridge QB until we have someone better. And he's an upgrade on JB. (By the way, it's not close. Rivers is a substantially better QB than JB, even at 38, even with a couple turnovers/game.) He has to be more sharp than he was Sunday.

 

Also, the defense has to play better. Speaking of, aside from the penalty, Rhodes wasn't bad. Not good, has to do better at the snap, but it's not like he specifically got torched, so I'm not sure why OP is calling him out as if him being on the field doesn't make sense. 

 

Going back to Rivers, he only attempted three passes more than 20 yards down field. I think that will vary week to week. The Jags specifically attempted to take away deep passes. What was good is that, despite not throwing down field, he still averaged 7.9 yards/attempt. And that's because he completed passes quickly and let the receivers gain YAC. We actually ran screen plays successfully (something we've never done). I'm good with a quick, short game that produces yards. Take away two turnovers, a 4th down stop and a missed field goal, and the offense easily would have put up 30 points.

 

So again, he needs to tighten up, but we also have to run better, and the defense especially has to play better.

 

Acting like having Rivers and Rhodes on the field means there's no plan for the team is strange. The plan is pretty obvious. 

I believe Rhodes was the trailing defender on Jacksonville’s last receiving TD. If that was his assignment he was torched by a good 5-7 yards and the receiver was wide open. 

[stitches]

@SupermanAgree on everything except for Rhodes. Now I haven't seen the all 22 which is important for watching DBs, but while watching the game it felt like he was always late or confused. I think he was responsible for one of the TDs we gave up too.

[AwesomeAustin]

14 minutes ago, Superman said:

These threads crack me up. 

 

Rivers is 38. He wasn't signed to be the savior. He signed for one year, he's a bridge QB until we have someone better. And he's an upgrade on JB. (By the way, it's not close. Rivers is a substantially better QB than JB, even at 38, even with a couple turnovers/game.) He has to be more sharp than he was Sunday.

 

Also, the defense has to play better. Speaking of, aside from the penalty, Rhodes wasn't bad. Not good, has to do better at the snap, but it's not like he specifically got torched, so I'm not sure why OP is calling him out as if him being on the field doesn't make sense. 

 

Going back to Rivers, he only attempted three passes more than 20 yards down field. I think that will vary week to week. The Jags specifically attempted to take away deep passes. What was good is that, despite not throwing down field, he still averaged 7.9 yards/attempt. And that's because he completed passes quickly and let the receivers gain YAC. We actually ran screen plays successfully (something we've never done). I'm good with a quick, short game that produces yards. Take away two turnovers, a 4th down stop and a missed field goal, and the offense easily would have put up 30 points.

 

So again, he needs to tighten up, but we also have to run better, and the defense especially has to play better.

 

Acting like having Rivers and Rhodes on the field means there's no plan for the team is strange. The plan is pretty obvious. 

I just watched the replay of the last TD.  Receiver was lined up in the slot with Rhodes playing off the line with a soft cushion.  Lb jammed the receiver 2 yards off the line then passed him off to play containment. Minshew ran play action and Rhodes bit allowing a clean release by the receiver on a crossing route.  

[Defjamz26]

The plan is to hope they gel and hope this is just the by product of a weird offseason. If it doesn’t look much better after week 5 then the plan will be what it has always been the last few years: sitting back and waiting for the draft to roll around because the team just lacks talent at certain key positions to really compete for a title.

[Superman]

22 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I believe Rhodes was the trailing defender on Jacksonville’s last receiving TD. If that was his assignment he was torched by a good 5-7 yards and the receiver was wide open. 

 

12 minutes ago, stitches said:

@SupermanAgree on everything except for Rhodes. Now I haven't seen the all 22 which is important for watching DBs, but while watching the game it felt like he was always late or confused. I think he was responsible for one of the TDs we gave up too.

 

11 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I just watched the replay of the last TD.  Receiver was lined up in the slot with Rhodes playing off the line with a soft cushion.  Lb jammed the receiver 2 yards off the line then passed him off to play containment. Minshew ran play action and Rhodes bit allowing a clean release by the receiver on a crossing route.  

 

Maybe I had his # mixed up when I rewatched... I didn't think that was him.

 

If so, he was part of the problem on a TD pass. Fair enough.

 

The previous TD pass, Minshew shoulder faked Khari Willis out of position, which led to the throw in the corner of the end zone. So let's bench Willis too, right? 

[stitches]

22 minutes ago, Superman said:

Maybe I had his # mixed up when I rewatched... I didn't think that was him.

 

If so, he was part of the problem on a TD pass. Fair enough.

 

The previous TD pass, Minshew shoulder faked Khari Willis out of position, which led to the throw in the corner of the end zone. So let's bench Willis too, right? 

 

I mean, we don't really have anyone else to play in the secondary. This is all on Ballard. We literally have no other outside corner on this team right now. TJ Carrie is not an outside corner, Isaiah Rodgers is a rookie and is extremely weak tackler and lacks physicality in the run game(not an ourside corner in this defense). We have noone else to play. This secondary's construction is so bad right now. Tell opting out didn't help, but Ballard had months to address it and still hasn't. Our depth is horrific. This is how teams underperform in the league - put horrible secondary on the field and don't give them depth... watch a dumpster fire. 

 

So yeah... I don't think I want Rhodes benched, but it's not because he's good or I expect him to become good. It's because we have noone else.

 

This is something that's been getting crystalized in my head more and more clearly as the time has gone - Ballard has done very well drafting/picking up players for the least important positions in football(LB, RB, IOL) and has done extremely poorly building up the most important positions on this team(QB, WR, CB, EDGE). This is part of the reason that despite us doing relatively well when it comes to getting talent on the roster(I think we undoubtedly have much more talent now than in the Grigson era),  that talent is mostly concentrated on positions that don't impact winning as much and thus... we don't win much. We have no long-term QB, we have all question marks at WR(past Hilton, who is getting old), we have nothing but questionmarks at EDGE, we are horrible in the secondary and even if Rock pans out(far from a sure thing), we are still about 3 players short of a good secondary.

 

It's not like Ballard has not invested in those positions but at some point you have to hit. 

 

Anyways, apologies for the rant/sidetrack I took.

[Mr.NotSoCreative]

Maybe we over hyped our team and under estimated the Jags. Take a deep breath, back to reality. Our plan on offense, or I thought at least, was to use our big athletic WRs to dominate smaller DBs, and allowing TY and Campbell to avoid doubles. Rivers has always shown to utilize RBs and TEs, the latter hasn't happened yet. And of course run the dam ball. Most importantly, they have to play clean ball. Gonna lose to worst of em if you don't. With that said, our O wasn't completely inept. I was disappointed with the TY drops in crunch time for sure. 

Defense, well no need to beat a dead horse here, didnt make game changing plays. Sacks were good, and actually yardage wise on paper looked good. But man I do not envy Flus on figuring out this secondary.

 

[Moosejawcolt]

3 hours ago, Smonroe said:

@JMichael557 You're looking at the wrong side of the ball.  Yes, Rivers is a dead end as far as the Colts future.  We knew that from the day he was signed.  But he is good enough.  Look how many yards we had in that game.

 

The problem is the defense.  We've played that soft zone for over two years now.  Flus even said something has to change.  When mediocre teams can keep possessions going, you know it's not working.

 

Flus needs to go.  2 years and a 1 game under his leadership and the D looks like it has been regressing. This is a zone based scheme. Suppossedly easy to learn yet secondary looks like they r lost. Wasnt that the reason for employing this D? It is easy to learn and u can draft  in the mid rounds with less than elite talent. Just saying. If Vikes beat the Colts and the D gives it up, they better ditch Flus while the season is young.

[hoosierhawk]

I see a great deal of criticism about the DB play but not much concerning the pass rush. Minshew appeared to have way to much time in the pocket and was very seldom pressured. We need to have much better pressure if we are going to sit back in zone coverage. Just my observations.

[Smonroe]

35 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Flus needs to go.  2 years and a 1 game under his leadership and the D looks like it has been regressing. This is a zone based scheme. Suppossedly easy to learn yet secondary looks like they r lost. Wasnt that the reason for employing this D? It is easy to learn and u can draft  in the mid rounds with less than elite talent. Just saying. If Vikes beat the Colts and the D gives it up, they better ditch Flus while the season is young.

 

They've stuck with the same scheme for two years.  It's pretty clear that a decent QB will pick it apart, the way they play it.  It can work if played right.  I don't see them making a scheme change during the season.  

 

I hate to say it, but the team played 'soft' on defense.  Too much cushion by the DBs (when they were in the right spots), and we were getting gashed on the edge in the first half.  The front seven tightened up in the second half at least.

[AwesomeAustin]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

 

Maybe I had his # mixed up when I rewatched... I didn't think that was him.

 

If so, he was part of the problem on a TD pass. Fair enough.

 

The previous TD pass, Minshew shoulder faked Khari Willis out of position, which led to the throw in the corner of the end zone. So let's bench Willis too, right? 

Not sure Colts can bench either of them.  Break down the film and understand their assignments.  Play fakes can kill an inexperienced attacking defense.  Stay disciplined and force the other team to make a play instead catching you out of position.  Hopefully Eberflus and the DBs coach will go over this and we see improvement. 

[Nickster]

20 hours ago, Mr.NotSoCreative said:

Maybe we over hyped our team and under estimated the Jags. Take a deep breath, back to reality. Our plan on offense, or I thought at least, was to use our big athletic WRs to dominate smaller DBs, and allowing TY and Campbell to avoid doubles. Rivers has always shown to utilize RBs and TEs, the latter hasn't happened yet. And of course run the dam ball. Most importantly, they have to play clean ball. Gonna lose to worst of em if you don't. With that said, our O wasn't completely inept. I was disappointed with the TY drops in crunch time for sure. 

Defense, well no need to beat a dead horse here, didnt make game changing plays. Sacks were good, and actually yardage wise on paper looked good. But man I do not envy Flus on figuring out this secondary.

 

I can't imagine that the Jags are any good.  They are geniuses and will be contenders within a few years if they are.

 

I think they will be competing for the 1st round draft picks.

 

One the other hand, Fournette ain't no good possibly, etc.  Maybe they just cleared out the brush.

[Myles]

On 9/16/2020 at 12:46 PM, JMichael557 said:

What bothers me is that you cannot win with a good QB in the nfl. When you start bringing in old QB's or promising backups it just does not work long term. We are not going to the superbowl this year with the current makeup of this team. I hope we get the young guys in asap. If they do not show improvement then we go back to the draft well next year. Just running in place serves no purpose.

So you have already given up on this team?

Not me.  I thought Rivers looked good and is the best QB on the roster right now.   Despite the defenses effort and all the blunders (poor play calling, missed kick, dropped passes and penalties) We were still in it till the end and put up the 3rd most yards in the NFL.   The offense was clicking.  

[FortheWin]

23 hours ago, Superman said:

These threads crack me up. 

 

Rivers is 38. He wasn't signed to be the savior. He signed for one year, he's a bridge QB until we have someone better. And he's an upgrade on JB. (By the way, it's not close. Rivers is a substantially better QB than JB, even at 38, even with a couple turnovers/game.) He has to be more sharp than he was Sunday.

 

Also, the defense has to play better. Speaking of, aside from the penalty, Rhodes wasn't bad. Not good, has to do better at the snap, but it's not like he specifically got torched, so I'm not sure why OP is calling him out as if him being on the field doesn't make sense. 

 

Going back to Rivers, he only attempted three passes more than 20 yards down field. I think that will vary week to week. The Jags specifically attempted to take away deep passes. What was good is that, despite not throwing down field, he still averaged 7.9 yards/attempt. And that's because he completed passes quickly and let the receivers gain YAC. We actually ran screen plays successfully (something we've never done). I'm good with a quick, short game that produces yards. Take away two turnovers, a 4th down stop and a missed field goal, and the offense easily would have put up 30 points.

 

So again, he needs to tighten up, but we also have to run better, and the defense especially has to play better.

 

Acting like having Rivers and Rhodes on the field means there's no plan for the team is strange. The plan is pretty obvious. 

Bridge QB is spot on. The Patriots are pretty much doing the same thing with Cam as well. Although they are paying him significantly less than what we are paying Rivers. It is what it is. You have to get THE GUY at some point and until then things are can be unsatisfying if you are expecting a championship.

[Superman]

23 hours ago, stitches said:

 

I mean, we don't really have anyone else to play in the secondary. This is all on Ballard. We literally have no other outside corner on this team right now. TJ Carrie is not an outside corner, Isaiah Rodgers is a rookie and is extremely weak tackler and lacks physicality in the run game(not an ourside corner in this defense). We have noone else to play. This secondary's construction is so bad right now. Tell opting out didn't help, but Ballard had months to address it and still hasn't. Our depth is horrific. This is how teams underperform in the league - put horrible secondary on the field and don't give them depth... watch a dumpster fire. 

 

So yeah... I don't think I want Rhodes benched, but it's not because he's good or I expect him to become good. It's because we have noone else.

 

This is something that's been getting crystalized in my head more and more clearly as the time has gone - Ballard has done very well drafting/picking up players for the least important positions in football(LB, RB, IOL) and has done extremely poorly building up the most important positions on this team(QB, WR, CB, EDGE). This is part of the reason that despite us doing relatively well when it comes to getting talent on the roster(I think we undoubtedly have much more talent now than in the Grigson era),  that talent is mostly concentrated on positions that don't impact winning as much and thus... we don't win much. We have no long-term QB, we have all question marks at WR(past Hilton, who is getting old), we have nothing but questionmarks at EDGE, we are horrible in the secondary and even if Rock pans out(far from a sure thing), we are still about 3 players short of a good secondary.

 

It's not like Ballard has not invested in those positions but at some point you have to hit. 

 

Anyways, apologies for the rant/sidetrack I took.

 

I guess we'll see. I don't necessarily agree with the way Ballard has allocated resources over the last three seasons. Nelson is great, but I always felt like drafting a guard at #6 wasn't maximizing value. Still, I'd rather have him than not. (My favored alternative was trade down and draft Derwin James; he hasn't been able to stay on the field, so continuing to second guess the Nelson pick isn't reasonable, IMO. I'm glad we have him.)

 

Funchess for $10m, big extension for JB, can't find an edge player high in the draft, etc. Some of the premium positions you mentioned, we're still light on, despite using a lot of money on those positions.

 

Still not a lot of draft resources at any of those positions, though. No use trying to make a determination on Campbell or Pittman yet, he hasn't used a meaningful draft pick on a QB, instead signing Rivers who can work for a year or so.

 

And I don't think they have CB as a prime position in their matrix. I don't either, I think they want to run a defense that doesn't prioritize sticky cover guys, rather long and fast guys who can tackle well. For the scheme, I don't see the secondary as deficient. Reliant on a couple of young players, and a safety who probably isn't at his best in this scheme, but can still be good. I definitely think they need to deploy the scheme better.

 

You must have been out on Rhodes before Sunday. I'm not writing him off after one game. 

[BigO]

On 9/16/2020 at 1:51 PM, lollygagger8 said:

I said this in the other thread, but it really looks to me like Rivers has to really try hard to throw the ball with any zip. Maybe it's just me, but I hope his arm is alright. 

Why do you think they call him shotput Rivers. He throws it like a shotput. Should have known what we were getting. He is 38 years old

[BigO]

2 hours ago, Myles said:

So you have already given up on this team?

Not me.  I thought Rivers looked good and is the best QB on the roster right now.   Despite the defenses effort and all the blunders (poor play calling, missed kick, dropped passes and penalties) We were still in it till the end and put up the 3rd most yards in the NFL.   The offense was clicking.  

Glad you are excited about all of that since we were playing  probably the worst team in the nfl and has been getting rid of most of their star players

[Myles]

1 minute ago, BigO said:

Glad you are excited about all of that since we were playing  probably the worst team in the nfl and has been getting rid of most of their star players

Putting up that many yards is what the team should have done, so yes I'm OK with it.  That first drive was the best Colts drive I have seen in a few years.  I was excited to see the offense spread out and using RB to catch the ball.  Even the skeptics were wow'd in the game thread.   The INT's stunk, no question, but outside of them the offense looked pretty darn good.  

[BeanDiasucci]

20 minutes ago, BigO said:

Glad you are excited about all of that since we were playing  probably the worst team in the nfl and has been getting rid of most of their star players

Who knows how their season will turn out, but Jacksonville might not be the worst team. Here's part of an article from after the game with a different take on the Jaguars and their changes: 
 

Quote

 

For the first time in what seems like forever, the Jaguars truly looked like a team, one that was better than the sum of its young parts. Under Marrone, they were never close to providing any such evidence with more proven veteran players the last two years.

 

But like the mantra Marrone and his players have been emphasizing all preseason, about team chemistry making up for lack of experience, these Jaguars went out on a big NFL stage for the first time and actually practiced what they preached.

 

As Marrone said about the goal line stand: “This is the point I'm trying make about this team. If it wasn't Abe [Jones], it would've been someone else [making the play].”

 

Everything was about team. The swashbuckling Minshew has refrained despite numerous opportunities in the past month to fire verbal salvos at Jaguars’ skeptics. After pitching nearly a perfect game — his only incompletion went off the hand of rookie Laviska Shenault — he didn’t puff out his chest like some pro wrestler who just body-slammed an opponent.

 

The second-year quarterback, whose fun-loving personality often masks his genuine humility, simply acted like someone who had faith in his team’s preparation. This outcome for an 8-point underdog was only a big surprise to the rest of the NFL world, but not those inside the Jaguars’ locker room.

 

“I think one of the things that served us well today was that we all have so much belief in each other,” Minshew said. “Whether it is me in them or them in me, when you have that, you can trust people to do their jobs.”

 

 

https://www.jacksonville.com/story/sports/columns/gene-frenette/2020/09/13/jaguars-beat-indianapolis-colts-show-nfl-theyre-not-leagues-worst/5788771002/

[Four2itus]

As always, is it the players, the scheme, or the execution?  Way too early to give a definitive answer to that just yet. That said, execution was the devil in the details on Sunday. Rivers is an upgrade over Brissett. That I will make as a definitive statement. That doesn't mean that he was free from execution mistakes as well. 

On 9/15/2020 at 9:26 AM, JMichael557 said:

I would rather play the younger QB's and let them gain experience and to see what we have then what we are doing now.

Personally, that is the last thing I would want the Colts to do. Detrimental to the team, as well as to the QB.

On 9/15/2020 at 9:26 AM, JMichael557 said:

Zero ability to throw the ball down the field into tight coverage.

Can't agree with that. 

On 9/15/2020 at 9:28 AM, chad72 said:

They need to show up and execute. Starts with the trenches controlling tempo and forcing more 3rd downs and secondary forcing more incompletions. Everyone needs to improve, from coaches to players on the execution front.

Exactly.

On 9/16/2020 at 11:22 AM, Superman said:

We actually ran screen plays successfully (something we've never done)

I was literally fist pumping the air in celebration of this very fact. 

On 9/16/2020 at 12:05 PM, stitches said:

Tell opting out didn't help, but Ballard had months to address it and still hasn't.

Tell opting out was a big deal. I would doubt that Ballard passed on an opportunity to upgrade the corner if it was realistically and financially wise. 

[NannyMcafee]

On 9/16/2020 at 3:05 PM, stitches said:

 

I mean, we don't really have anyone else to play in the secondary. This is all on Ballard. We literally have no other outside corner on this team right now. TJ Carrie is not an outside corner, Isaiah Rodgers is a rookie and is extremely weak tackler and lacks physicality in the run game(not an ourside corner in this defense). We have noone else to play. This secondary's construction is so bad right now. Tell opting out didn't help, but Ballard had months to address it and still hasn't. Our depth is horrific. This is how teams underperform in the league - put horrible secondary on the field and don't give them depth... watch a dumpster fire. 

 

So yeah... I don't think I want Rhodes benched, but it's not because he's good or I expect him to become good. It's because we have noone else.

 

This is something that's been getting crystalized in my head more and more clearly as the time has gone - Ballard has done very well drafting/picking up players for the least important positions in football(LB, RB, IOL) and has done extremely poorly building up the most important positions on this team(QB, WR, CB, EDGE). This is part of the reason that despite us doing relatively well when it comes to getting talent on the roster(I think we undoubtedly have much more talent now than in the Grigson era),  that talent is mostly concentrated on positions that don't impact winning as much and thus... we don't win much. We have no long-term QB, we have all question marks at WR(past Hilton, who is getting old), we have nothing but questionmarks at EDGE, we are horrible in the secondary and even if Rock pans out(far from a sure thing), we are still about 3 players short of a good secondary.

 

It's not like Ballard has not invested in those positions but at some point you have to hit. 

 

Anyways, apologies for the rant/sidetrack I took.

 

 

Ballard addresses weaknesses every off season. Every year, a new position group just sucks. The following draft, and FA, he goes out and does something about it. 

 

I get the frustration. But every year someone talks like this. 

 

It is quite hard to find the right players all the time, and 31 other teams are competing for these players. Its not like Ballard has his pick of the litter, and your comment makes it sound like that isnt the case at all, just that he hasn't addressed it. 

 

If you were talking about letting Desir go, I'd agree with you, i dont get that, but everything you said is pure frustration and nothing else.