pagano is too soft

[krunk]

I've been kind of so so on T Rich, but I still maintain it's hard to make a really sound judgement when you are only getting about 4 to 6 carries a game. I'm still looking to see a bigger body of work from the guy.

[Gavin]

I've been kind of so so on T Rich, but I still maintain it's hard to make a really sound judgement when you are only getting about 4 to 6 carries a game. I'm still looking to see a bigger body of work from the guy.

17.6 in his starts as a Colt actually, Day we got down early so could not hand it off much to him (5  carries)

[FicmanS]

This team was clearly not prepared, we got smoked is all phases today...  Hell even the plunko game failed

[gtswaim3]

I agree, DHB needs to go. He hurts the team . If Reed can not use better judgment, he certainly should not be returning kick-offs. If he is useful as a WR maybe he can learn DHB's job.

Seems to me that the entire team must have been reading their newspaper clippings as none of them played very well today. If they are waiting for TR to be their savior, they will have a long wait. Brown needs to be given the first position based on his performance. He is a better runner, cuts better and is faster. I guess this will give you some more food for the arguments.

The best HC was Dungy. You knew that after a poor half, corrections will have been made so that the team had a chance. It seems at the moment what we have is more of the same.

[jwilli69]

I know you're emotional after the whipping.  But I also know you've made a lot of decent posts in the past.  You know we're not going to cut players in the middle of the season for a few bad plays.  

 

And surely you know that Pagano is not 'soft'.  I won't bother to even comment on other ridiculous posts, but I'm hoping you'll settle down and be logical.

 

Take a breath.

im actually not to emotional at the time of the posting. I havent called for anyones head this season with bad play and there has been some. If you take the whole year of play this year, DHB has not played well enough to be the number 2 let alone a number 3 or 4. He just cant catch the ball, its really not about just this game, its about his year of non production and you cant trust himto make a catch. TY makes some drops too but I dont call for him to be demoted or cut as hse pulls through far more than he ddoesn't. Trent isn't making big gaines but I don't call for him to be cut. Same could be said for Fleener as well, they have talent and make more plays than not.

As for Pagano, I'm really disappointed in how bad the teams have been prepared the team has looked the last several games. In game decisions have had some head scratching moments but all in all, he is still a young head coach but he needs to show some emotion, if nothing more than for the fan base. I dont think he needs replaced, but he is not the same firey guy from baltimore.

I dont think having an opinion that a few non producing guys is irrational. Will it happen, you never know, I will root for them either way though.

[jskinnz]

Holy Smokes there are some really bad thoughts in here - clearly knowing the game or the Colts is not a prerequisite for commenting on a message board. You would think there would be some sort of football intellect but... evidently not.

Pagano is soft? Clearly this is the ranting of an overly emotional fan after a bad day.

For a team that is thin at WR, what good does cutting two players at that position? At this point in the season, they are far better options than bringing in someone off the street. It will be December before that guy would be up to speed.

The love for Rogers is lost on me. Maybe he turns into something worthwhile, but my suspicion is what he has proven to be. But the coaches are around him everyday and there has to be a reason he is still on the PS. He simply is not ready to contribute.

The season is marathon - it ain't a sprint. There will be other great games and likely some clunkers before the year turns. Getting worked up to extreme and talking nonsense is just bad form.

[Nadine]

Holy Smokes there are some really bad thoughts in here - clearly knowing the game or the Colts is not a prerequisite for commenting on a message board. You would think there would be some sort of football intellect but... evidently not.

Pagano is soft? Clearly this is the ranting of an overly emotional fan after a bad day.

For a team that is thin at WR, what good does cutting two players at that position? At this point in the season, they are far better options than bringing in someone off the street. It will be December before that guy would be up to speed.

The love for Rogers is lost on me. Maybe he turns into something worthwhile, but my suspicion is what he has proven to be. But the coaches are around him everyday and there has to be a reason he is still on the PS. He simply is not ready to contribute.

The season is marathon - it ain't a sprint. There will be other great games and likely some clunkers before the year turns. Getting worked up to extreme and talking nonsense is just bad form.

 

It is just one game and we were outplayed and outexecuted. It happens to half the teams in the NFL every week

[jwilli69]

Ok I give, DHB is a pro bowl player and just can't be replaced. He is a certain keeper, must have been mybemotional state not allowing me to see his wonderful catching style. Thanks for keeping me grounded

[jskinnz]

Ok I give, DHB is a pro bowl player and just can't be replaced. He is a certain keeper, must have been mybemotional state not allowing me to see his wonderful catching style. Thanks for keeping me grounded

Yep, that is exactly what I said. We ain't building rockets - try to keep up.

[CanuckColt]

Pagano is a 'players friend' kind of coach...probably too close to his players to be objective and make the tough decisions...coaches like that get quickly replaced.

[chrisfarley]

we broke even this week, titans lost, lets thank our lucky stars.  we aren't going to lay an egg every week and neither is Pagano, DHB, Luck, and the rest.  We can be thankful that we don't have to play the Rams again, the NFC can have them.  they are pretty tough. Our players can and do play better than we saw today including players you suggest we cut.  Pagano saw what we saw, he can't play and neither can we.  We saw our team implode today.  Do you really think DHB is not an NFL quality WR?  He is but he is also learning route running as one of Andrew Lucks weapons and the finer art of being "on the same page".  Did Manning and his receivers lay any eggs over the years, yes they did, some REAL stinkers and not just in year two---beyond as well. Did we have coaches who weren't yellers and didn't make knee-jerk "you're fired" reactions but still got the job done and got the most out of his players, yes we did.  Let's take a step back and look at a 6-3 team that just came together in the past 2 months or so on the playing field.  New faces, new coaches, missing pieces, Injured reserve disasters, etc.,  I'm going to take a deep breath and ignore the rear-view mirror.

[Thewholefnshow28]

Ok I give, DHB is a pro bowl player and just can't be replaced. He is a certain keeper, must have been mybemotional state not allowing me to see his wonderful catching style. Thanks for keeping me grounded

Oh no DHB is awful, but given how thin we are at WR cutting him now would be problematic for this offense. Brazil and Whalen cannot step and be that second WR right. Now once we get Allen and Wayne back next season and a draft to find a WR he will be gone. Until then his position coach needs to show him game film of Wayne actually catching the ball with his hand and not his freaking body.

Reed really needs to work on his decision making when deciding when to return. His special team coach better be hitting the film as well. I would not mind giving someone else a shot, but who are you going to put out there?

[jwilli69]

Oh no DHB is awful, but given how thin we are at WR cutting him now would be problematic for this offense. Brazil and Whalen cannot step and be that second WR right. Now once we get Allen and Wayne back next season and a draft to find a WR he will be gone. Until then his position coach needs to show him game film of Wayne actually catching the ball with his hand and not his freaking body.

Reed really needs to work on his decision making when deciding when to return. His special team coach better be hitting the film as well. I would not mind giving someone else a shot, but who are you going to put out there?

that doesn't even make logical sense. You're saying he sucks but it's better than trying someone else who may or may not suck because nobody else can step into the #2 role? If he drops 3 of 5 balls thrown to him, how can anything else be much worse? What, drops 4 of 5? I hate to even bring up thenname bill bellycheck but that teat made #1's out of discarded players mid season pick ups so it is not out of the realm of possibility to do it but people want to hold on to how you grow players over time. Coaches have to step it up and players have to play better. I just dont see DHB doing it and you are setting up for more drops when thrown to.

[House]

Ok I give, DHB is a pro bowl player and just can't be replaced. He is a certain keeper, must have been mybemotional state not allowing me to see his wonderful catching style. Thanks for keeping me grounded

At least you're not emotional about this.

[Malakai432]

Yep, that is exactly what I said. We ain't building rockets - try to keep up.

 

[Smonroe]

im actually not to emotional at the time of the posting. I havent called for anyones head this season with bad play and there has been some. If you take the whole year of play this year, DHB has not played well enough to be the number 2 let alone a number 3 or 4. He just cant catch the ball, its really not about just this game, its about his year of non production and you cant trust himto make a catch. TY makes some drops too but I dont call for him to be demoted or cut as hse pulls through far more than he ddoesn't. Trent isn't making big gaines but I don't call for him to be cut. Same could be said for Fleener as well, they have talent and make more plays than not.

As for Pagano, I'm really disappointed in how bad the teams have been prepared the team has looked the last several games. In game decisions have had some head scratching moments but all in all, he is still a young head coach but he needs to show some emotion, if nothing more than for the fan base. I dont think he needs replaced, but he is not the same firey guy from baltimore.

I dont think having an opinion that a few non producing guys is irrational. Will it happen, you never know, I will root for them either way though.

 

You sound a lot more rational now.  DHB probably has less drops than anyone on the team.  Luck had a horrible game today.  The STs were all around terrible.  TRich had no where to run, and when DB ran from those same sets he had the same results.  We all know Satele and McGlynn are below average.  And we saw what happens when you put Link in as McGlynn's backup.  He's worse.

 

I'll agree, the coaching staff takes a lot of the blame too.  All around, everyone was bad.

 

But I can't agree that this is because Pagano is soft.  You don't cut guys for bad games unless it's consistently bad and you have someone better.  You know that, you've been around for a while.  

 

However, if you want to rant, go right ahead.  It is cathartic.  Let the poison out here, it's better than carrying it with you, right?

 

Obviously, you

[dw49]

It is just one game and we were outplayed and outexecuted. It happens to half the teams in the NFL every week

 

 

It's not the end of the world and life will go on , but the above is a bit simplistic and really isn't on point. When you are down 35-0 to a team that is 3-6 and your offense has been blown sky high until garbage time , it means you have some serious issues. Half the teams in the NFL do not get slammed at home by 9 point underdogs. Half the teams in the NFL do not get a total of 2 , that's TWO yards rushing by their RBs. Besides that horrific attempt to run the ball , the O line was just as putrid in pass protection. To make matters worse , today Andrew Luck even joined the party with bad throws and bad decisions.

 

Half the teams in the NFL do not look helpless , out of synch and stale because they lost a WR. We now have played better than 6 of 8 quarters of scary horrific football. This was far worse than last week when we got a little lucky and it even looks like teams have decided that they can take deep shots on us and convert at an alarming rate.

 

Can we regroup and win the division ? IMO , yes and we are still heavy favorites to do so. Is this offensive line truly offensive and is our coaching staff maybe a little "under fire ?"  Is it suddenly very doubtful that this team is a contender to go deep in the playoffs ? Or are we just a player or two away when we get our guys back ? I'm leaning toward yes , yes and no it this point in time. 

[Susie Q]

Its far from Pagano, Its our interior O Line, Its Andrew Luck throwing some bad passes, its our special teams not showing up...A coach can put whatever gameplan he wants out to his players but if they dont have enough talent to execute then that coach cant do a thing about it

Well they must have enough talent because some think the Colts are going to and  win the  SB so it must be the coach.

[throwing BBZ]

What do we have to lose by playing Brazill and Rogers?  They can't do any worse.

 

As much as I want Bey to succeed, he just does not seem to have the hand-eye co-ordination necessary to consistently play WR in the NFL...very sad.

 

 Hmmm! Brazill dropped one in the end zone. kinda worser. LOL

[Nadine]

It's not the end of the world and life will go on , but the above is a bit simplistic and really isn't on point. When you are down 35-0 to a team that is 3-6 and your offense has been blown sky high until garbage time , it means you have some serious issues. Half the teams in the NFL do not get slammed at home by 9 point underdogs. Half the teams in the NFL do not get a total of 2 , that's TWO yards rushing by their RBs. Besides that horrific attempt to run the ball , the O line was just as putrid in pass protection. To make matters worse , today Andrew Luck even joined the party with bad throws and bad decisions.

 

Half the teams in the NFL do not look helpless , out of synch and stale because they lost a WR. We now have played better than 6 of 8 quarters of scary horrific football. This was far worse than last week when we got a little lucky and it even looks like teams have decided that they can take deep shots on us and convert at an alarming rate.

 

Can we regroup and win the division ? IMO , yes and we are still heavy favorites to do so. Is this offensive line truly offensive and is our coaching staff maybe a little "under fire ?"  Is it suddenly very doubtful that this team is a contender to go deep in the playoffs ? Or are we just a player or two away when we get our guys back ? I'm leaning toward yes , yes and no it this point in time. 

 

To me it just does no good to freak out

It is what it is.  Nothing good about this game

[dw49]

To me it just does no good to freak out

It is what it is.  Nothing good about this game

 

 

 

Now that I agree 100% with. I love the Colts and haven't missed a game in probably 15 years. But it is what it is and we are what we are ... I just thought you were "sugar coating " a bit. 

[Nadine]

Now that I agree 100% with. I love the Colts and haven't missed a game in probably 15 years. But it is what it is and we are what we are ... I just thought you were "sugar coating " a bit. 

matter of fact, I had to do an m & m run after that game

[Iancolts]

Well maybe just maybe TY is not a true number 1 reciever, Andrew Luck is not as good as we all think yet I said yet, and DHB hands are hurting from using the jugg machine too much in practice?

[Tark The Shark]

I think Pagano is a very good coach and he still hasn't even coached a full season.

 

And what is the point of cutting these guys? They are obviously starting over guys for a reason. Some games you will be good, some games  you will be bad.

[jwilli69]

To me it just does no good to freak out

It is what it is.  Nothing good about this game

What constitutes freaking out? Pointing out that DHB can't catch and doesn't contribute? Now should I have been consistent from the game one like many others questioning how bad he was instead of looking at his body of work on the colts? 9 games in and it's the misses he has when the ball hits his hands that has me saying enough is enough. He isnt a starter and I can barely qualify him as a reserve with the hands he brings to work. Its not like it's fixable things like running wrong routes, it's that his trade, his tools, they are nogood. I can't stress enough that its not a reaction to this game alone.

[Nadine]

What constitutes freaking out? Pointing out that DHB can't catch and doesn't contribute? Now should I have been consistent from the game one like many others questioning how bad he was instead of looking at his body of work on the colts? 9 games in and it's the misses he has when the ball hits his hands that has me saying enough is enough. He isnt a starter and I can barely qualify him as a reserve with the hands he brings to work. Its not like it's fixable things like running wrong routes, it's that his trade, his tools, they are nogood. I can't stress enough that its not a reaction to this game alone.

For me freaking out is people calling each other names, reacting to trolls........creating multiple threads on the same topic..........and then complaining that moderators are not doing a good enough job

 

reporting a post 2 minutes after it's been posted and expressing outrage that moderators have allowed this

 

sadly, I have no control over what people submit to this site and people will just have to be patient and wait for the venting to finish and for the mods to clean up the mess

 

Happens when the colts play poorly.  Up to my eyeballs in it so, I've moved passed the loss

 

There were lots of things wrong today that are valid discussion points

[ColtsFanMikeC]

DHB and REED should be cut after this game. DHB hasn't caught balls hitting his hands all season and Reed keeps taking the ball out when he has no reason to and he is nothing special. Satele should not be the starter at center, maybe Mclynn but even then, he is marginal and should not be stRting at RG. You can be sure if there was a tough coach here, these changes would have been made already and you live with those changes but DHB has to get cut.

This is a terrible team that has been fortunate to win games with come backs, its not well coached.

We have noone on our roster that would be able to fill in if we benched/cut both McGlynn and Satele -- Grigs has done a great job building this team so far -- obviously the injury to Donald Thomas was a big one and I am sure we will be addressing our OL problems this offseason (it may not be all that difficult, if the staff thinks Holmes is developing well at C and if it looks like D thomas will come back fully healthy).

 

DHB should not be cut -- he has had his drops, but again we have nobody on our current roster that could fill in if we got rid of both DHB and Reed.  I am all for giving Rogers a shot to come up and axe Reed (I think Brazzill is just as good, if not better returner and a better WR).  However, I am not at practice and do not know how Rogers has been developing, if he knows the full playbook, etc. etc....

 

This week and last week have shown that the loss of Reggie has had a major impact to our offense -- however, I think Pagano is a very good coach and we will make the right adjustments to move forward.

 

We still have a solid lead in our division, and Tennessee just lost to the Jags -- we still hold our own fate and we will be sitting in a very good spot if we win Thursday.

 

Remember, Luck has never lost 2 consecutive games -- I don't expect that trend to start now.   Our players and staff are solid enough that we will fix things a bit and go out and execute on Thursday.

[GoColts8818]

For me freaking out is people calling each other names, reacting to trolls........creating multiple threads on the same topic..........and then complaining that moderators are not doing a good enough job

 

reporting a post 2 minutes after it's been posted and expressing outrage that moderators have allowed this

 

sadly, I have no control over what people submit to this site and people will just have to be patient and wait for the venting to finish and for the mods to clean up the mess

 

Happens when the colts play poorly.  Up to my eyeballs in it so, I've moved passed the loss

 

There were lots of things wrong today that are valid discussion points

Colts sure trolled us good today...

 

That's a joke people not meant to be taken seriously!

[jskinnz]

What constitutes freaking out? Pointing out that DHB can't catch and doesn't contribute? Now should I have been consistent from the game one like many others questioning how bad he was instead of looking at his body of work on the colts? 9 games in and it's the misses he has when the ball hits his hands that has me saying enough is enough. He isnt a starter and I can barely qualify him as a reserve with the hands he brings to work. Its not like it's fixable things like running wrong routes, it's that his trade, his tools, they are nogood. I can't stress enough that its not a reaction to this game alone.

How about the thread title alone. Does that scream a reasonable, rational thought?

[indyagent17]

I would sure hope the team heard an earful after the game!

 

There is no excuse for the lack of effort, horrible game plan, even more the horrible execution today

 

This was a complete beat down in front of the home fans and I had to set in front of some very happy Rams fans today, even they felt sorry for us. They know there team is not good but it looked like a pro team playing a high school team today and I agree

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

It is just one game and we were outplayed and outexecuted. It happens to half the teams in the NFL every week

Obligatory:

There ya go with your logic again... 

[Ohio Colt]

I don't know if Pagano is that good of a coach. I know the guys love him. I know i really like him as a person. I just haven't been impresed yet. He's been extremely lucky. No excuse for getting whooped like that at home. That's ridiculous. We could easily be like 2-7 right now, honestly. Just havne't been impressed with Pagano's ability to adjust or build either unit yet.

[Restored]

I don't know if Pagano is that good of a coach. I know the guys love him. I know i really like him as a person. I just haven't been impresed yet. He's been extremely lucky. No excuse for getting whooped like that at home. That's ridiculous. We could easily be like 2-7 right now, honestly. Just havne't been impressed with Pagano's ability to adjust or build either unit yet.

Did you see the Denver game? Or what about the Seattle game in the 2nd half?

Teams lose big and sometimes those come at home.

Also, TRich didn't get that many touches because they fell down by 21 fast.

[ColtJ82]

I'm done, this is pathetic. T.y hilton falls down when he has a clear touchdown and we.can't even get a damn field goal

Actually, he tripped over the 20 yard line. 

[esmort]

DHB is getting more hatred than he deserves. Yes, he has dropped some balls, but he has also made some clutch plays and he is not the only one who has dropped balls this season or performed poorly today.

 

I won't disagree about Reed I think he should have been cut a while back.

 

Pagano is definitely a players' coach, but I don't know that he is soft. I have seen him lose composure a few times on the sideline and I have no doubt that he has let some people have "both barrels" behind closed doors.

 

I also don't think that cutting them is even Pagano's call ... he might be able to bench them  and his suggestions probably carry a lot of weight, but I think Grigs is going to be doing the hiring and firing; and judging from what I have seen I don't think he is going to be turning those decisions over to anyone.

[Johnny Bui]

I don't like to play the blame game, but we really need some better play calls on offense. We all know that our Oline is bad, but we need to adjust and call better plays.  You'd think when we have a franchise QB his safety would be the main concern.  No pun intended, but we are very lucky that our QB is very sturdy. I don't think any other QB can survive the beating luck has been taken for the second year of his career.

[Gavin]

Well they must have enough talent because some think the Colts are going to and  win the  SB so it must be the coach.

To be honest......with Wayne out were not sniffin the SB this year

[jwilli69]

We have noone on our roster that would be able to fill in if we benched/cut both McGlynn and Satele -- Grigs has done a great job building this team so far -- obviously the injury to Donald Thomas was a big one and I am sure we will be addressing our OL problems this offseason (it may not be all that difficult, if the staff thinks Holmes is developing well at C and if it looks like D thomas will come back fully healthy).

 

DHB should not be cut -- he has had his drops, but again we have nobody on our current roster that could fill in if we got rid of both DHB and Reed.  I am all for giving Rogers a shot to come up and axe Reed (I think Brazzill is just as good, if not better returner and a better WR).  However, I am not at practice and do not know how Rogers has been developing, if he knows the full playbook, etc. etc....

 

This week and last week have shown that the loss of Reggie has had a major impact to our offense -- however, I think Pagano is a very good coach and we will make the right adjustments to move forward.

 

We still have a solid lead in our division, and Tennessee just lost to the Jags -- we still hold our own fate and we will be sitting in a very good spot if we win Thursday.

 

Remember, Luck has never lost 2 consecutive games -- I don't expect that trend to start now.   Our players and staff are solid enough that we will fix things a bit and go out and execute on Thursday.

We are in a bad division, the one strong rival team that has any real talent on it is having a horrible year. We should win the division by default and make it to the playoffs. One and done is not what I look forward to every year.

As for DHB, I still feel today he doesn't deserve to be on the team any longer, it's time to elevate or bring in something else for a look, he just can't catch and it's not going to suddenly get better. What is the benefit of having a guy that knows the play book yet can't catch the ball when it comes to the right spot?

As for Reed, he is a return guy and little upside past that. He is replacable by any aspect of the word of plug and play. His terrible judgment of coming out when he shouldn't over and over shouldn't even be a difficult choice to move on from.

At the very least, coach should sit these guys and let any one of the other guys start at the former spot but will the "players coach" be able to pull that trigger? It appears as though he can't and thats why I say he seems soft, little accountability. At least I can understand the somewhat handicapped choices from replacing bad olineman, they are tougher to swap out.

[IndyD4U]

The love for Rogers is lost on me. Maybe he turns into something worthwhile, but my suspicion is what he has proven to be. But the coaches are around him everyday and there has to be a reason he is still on the PS. He simply is not ready to contribute.

 

 

Reminds me of all the Roy Hall talk back in the day

[pgt_rob]

Can't perform great and win them all.

 

On to the next one guys.