A question about replacing grigson

[Bubbz]

If Grigson was going to be replaced wouldnt we need to do it asap so the new GM can prepare for the upcoming offseason and draft? Is it possible to hire a new gm after the season and allow them to have a successful offseason with limited time?

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

[O-Ther]

If Grigson was going to be replaced wouldnt we need to do it asap so the new GM can prepare for the upcoming offseason and draft? Is it possible to hire a new gm after the season and allow them to have a successful offseason with limited time?

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

 

Answer is yes. We fired our GM after week 6 in the 2012 season. Our cap numbers/contracts guy became interim GM and handled the minor free agent signings and practice squad moves teams do during the season. We hired former Giants GM Ernie Accorsi to consult during the GM search since we had few actual football guys in the front office. He pointed us towards the Senior Pro Personnel Analyst of the Giants and we hired him after an interview on January 10, 2013.

 

The GM usually keeps the pro personnel analysts and scouting department of the former GM. The new GM usually arrives just a couple months before free agency starts and the draft rolls around. Then after the draft is when those departments are culled and filled with who the GM wants. It's actually not a huge seismic shift. Every team uses one of two scouting services that cover the country and do most of the gruntwork. It's up to the GM and team scouting dept. to decide on 300-500 kids to look at in person and study more film on and work out.

[crazycolt1]

If Grigson was going to be replaced wouldnt we need to do it asap so the new GM can prepare for the upcoming offseason and draft? Is it possible to hire a new gm after the season and allow them to have a successful offseason with limited time?

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

You don't know that. That is your speculation. Besides, you are asking in the wrong place. It is in Irsay's court, not this forums. None of us know how this is going to work out. We can speculate, wish, cuss, debate, argue and bring any and every scenario imaginable but the bottom line it's Irsay's call. Racking your brain over this is useless. Till Irsay makes his choices known there is nothing worth getting bent or blowing smoke over. Rehashing this stuff over and over is doing nothing and getting nowhere.

[C0lts088]

Grigson got hired around the start of the offseason

[Yoshinator]

If Grigson was going to be replaced wouldnt we need to do it asap so the new GM can prepare for the upcoming offseason and draft? Is it possible to hire a new gm after the season and allow them to have a successful offseason with limited time?

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

I can give an example as well. My friend is a Redskins fan and I remember how excited he was about Scot Mcgaughlin getting hired after the Redskins 2014 season. He was hired in the offseason and it looks like he has put together a very good first draft for them in his tenure. I can't guarantee that success would happen for us if Grigson goes, but the possibility is there.

[aaron11]

he's probably safe if we win the south.  considering we are in first place now, i dont think he will be fired anytime soon

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

It's obvious he needs replaced, but the bigger question is with who?

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

he's probably safe if we win the south.  considering we are in first place now, i dont think he will be fired anytime soon

If our goal is to win the AFC South then our goals aren't set high enough.

[IndyD4U]

Answer is yes. We fired our GM after week 6 in the 2012 season. Our cap numbers/contracts guy became interim GM and handled the minor free agent signings and practice squad moves teams do during the season. We hired former Giants GM Ernie Accorsi to consult during the GM search since we had few actual football guys in the front office. He pointed us towards the Senior Pro Personnel Analyst of the Giants and we hired him after an interview on January 10, 2013.

 

The GM usually keeps the pro personnel analysts and scouting department of the former GM. The new GM usually arrives just a couple months before free agency starts and the draft rolls around. Then after the draft is when those departments are culled and filled with who the GM wants. It's actually not a huge seismic shift. Every team uses one of two scouting services that cover the country and do most of the gruntwork. It's up to the GM and team scouting dept. to decide on 300-500 kids to look at in person and study more film on and work out.

 

Good insight. Thanks!

[aaron11]

If our goal is to win the AFC South then our goals aren't set high enough.

i agree.  i doubt irsay will fire anyone mid season if we are in first place though.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

i agree.  i doubt irsay will fire anyone mid season if we are in first place though.

You are probably right but you and I could field a team to win the South. 

[DougDew]

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

Well, there should be legitimate discussion of whether or not we spend big money on signing Fleener and/or Allen.

 

If we don't then what?  Go with Doyle?  It seems like a playmaking TE in the first should be a consideration.

 

Also, the running game seems to be much better with guys like Gore and Bradshaw, rather than Boom, Tipton, Robinson.  It would be nice to find a younger version of those guys...

 

I guess we should just expect a GM to find a great RB like Bradshaw in the UDFA pool.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

Answer is yes. We fired our GM after week 6 in the 2012 season. Our cap numbers/contracts guy became interim GM and handled the minor free agent signings and practice squad moves teams do during the season. We hired former Giants GM Ernie Accorsi to consult during the GM search since we had few actual football guys in the front office. He pointed us towards the Senior Pro Personnel Analyst of the Giants and we hired him after an interview on January 10, 2013.

 

The GM usually keeps the pro personnel analysts and scouting department of the former GM. The new GM usually arrives just a couple months before free agency starts and the draft rolls around. Then after the draft is when those departments are culled and filled with who the GM wants. It's actually not a huge seismic shift. Every team uses one of two scouting services that cover the country and do most of the gruntwork. It's up to the GM and team scouting dept. to decide on 300-500 kids to look at in person and study more film on and work out.

 

, I read that whole post before I saw your avi and realized you were a Panthers fan. I assumed Colts fan by default, I was like "what the hell is this guy talking about?"

[LJpalmbeacher2]

We are getting a new HC for next season.

If we Irsay wants to bag a Big name established HC I think Griggs will have to go.

Griggs likes to meddle and throw his weight around. It's been reported that he tells Pagano who to play etc... No coach worth having will come here with Griggs breathing down his neck.

[Corndog]

he's probably safe if we win the south.  considering we are in first place now, i dont think he will be fired anytime soon

Are you saying he's safe after the end of the season or just safe during the season?  

[Bubbz]

You don't know that. That is your speculation. Besides, you are asking in the wrong place. It is in Irsay's court, not this forums. None of us know how this is going to work out. We can speculate, wish, cuss, debate, argue and bring any and every scenario imaginable but the bottom line it's Irsay's call. Racking your brain over this is useless. Till Irsay makes his choices known there is nothing worth getting bent or blowing smoke over. Rehashing this stuff over and over is doing nothing and getting nowhere.

So why bother to post a response? It's a forum. There is really no actual point to discussing anything.

 

{ personal shot removed :  attacking message is fine, attacking messenger is out of bounds}

Feel free to go into every thread I. The draft day forum and let everyone know that it's pointless to speculate on free agents or do mock drafts. After all, it's not up to them it's up to the gm and it's all speculative.

[BigQandTheManiac]

We are getting a new HC for next season.

If we Irsay wants to bag a Big name established HC I think Griggs will have to go.

Griggs likes to meddle and throw his weight around. It's been reported that he tells Pagano who to play etc... No coach worth having will come here with Griggs breathing down his neck.

I agree. Grigson is a jerk. I kinda got that impression of him in some of his interviews over the past couple of seasons. But then when I heard he doesn't give Pags any say so in anything, that did it for me. I've said before, there isn't a coach that's gonna want to coach this team, knowing he doesn't have a say so in anything.

[throwing BBZ]

If Grigson was going to be replaced wouldnt we need to do it asap so the new GM can prepare for the upcoming offseason and draft? Is it possible to hire a new gm after the season and allow them to have a successful offseason with limited time?

 

If the answer is no, it looks like we are stuck with another offseason of Grigson...at least we can look forwards to a new shiny skill position player in round 1

 

 No.  There is plenty of time for the new guy. What do you think he will have been doing for some other team? A lot!

Yes

[Zoltan]

I don't think he will be fired this year, they'll use the coaching as a scapegoat and fire Pagano and then bring in a new guy saying he will save this franchise

[OffensivelyPC]

I don't think he will be fired this year, they'll use the coaching as a scapegoat and fire Pagano and then bring in a new guy saying he will save this franchise

I'd rather them make a scapegoat out of Pep.

[crazycolt1]

so are you going to go into all the other draft/free agent threads and tell everyone its pointless to discuss it, because they arent the gm or irsay and its all speculative? Just curious...

Look. my point of view has just as much validation as yours or anyone else's. There are already enough threads started that have covered all this negative stuff. There seems to be at least three started every day saying the same thing over and over. The points I covered are what is real, not someone's personal opinions or hopes. We can start another 100 threads that all say the same thing, just in a different opinion. That does not make is any more true than what my comment said. The bottom line is it is all left up to Irsay. We as forum members have no say so in the matter.

[Zoltan]

I'd rather them make a scapegoat out of Pep.

Me to but with Pagano on a contract year I think they're most likely to clean house because it will cost them nothing and Grigson can bring in a new coach who gels with him.

[Susie Q]

Me to but with Pagano on a contract year I think they're most likely to clean house because it will cost them nothing and Grigson can bring in a new coach who gels with him.

What has Grigson done to warrant him keeping his job seeing as he hasn't done a great job getting playérs to protect Luck. He has done a lousy job in my opinion and needs to go with Pagano and Pep. JMO

[ColtsBlueFL]

 ^ ^ ^    Hmmmmm  ^ ^ ^

 

Well, Grigson has an extra year on his contract Pagano does not have.  It's all I got....

[CanuckColt]

I don't want Grigson replaced until he finishes his mission of making the Colts the oldest team in the league.

...oh, wait a minute, we already ARE!

[Defjamz26]

What has Grigson done to warrant him keeping his job seeing as he hasn't done a great job getting playérs to protect Luck. He has done a lousy job in my opinion and needs to go with Pagano and Pep. JMO

There's no way he keeps his job. One way or another he goes. A new big name coach might want to pick players himself or want a different GM. Seeing as how the Colts struggles are a combination of everyone, no ones job is safe. His is the least safe of them all IMO.

[Superman]

 ^ ^ ^    Hmmmmm  ^ ^ ^

 

Well, Grigson has an extra year on his contract Pagano does not have.  It's all I got....

 

The team reportedly has an option for Grigson's fifth year.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-01-12/colts-hire-eagles-executive-grigson-as-gm/52510056/1

 

Irsay said after the news conference that Grigson has a four-year contract with a team option for a fifth year.

 

 

Don't know the terms of that option, when it was to be picked up, if it's been picked up already, etc. But it might be possible that Irsay can make a clean break after 2015 from both Grigson and Pagano.

[ColtsBlueFL]

The team reportedly has an option for Grigson's fifth year.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-01-12/colts-hire-eagles-executive-grigson-as-gm/52510056/1

 

 

Don't know the terms of that option, when it was to be picked up, if it's been picked up already, etc. But it might be possible that Irsay can make a clean break after 2015 from both Grigson and Pagano.

 

 

i think it might have been picked up.  in this article-

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2015/6/7/8742065/jim-irsay-confirms-that-ryan-grigson-is-not-entering-the-final-year-of-his-contract-colts

 

The Blue Mare (Heather Lloyd) reported this past June 6th Irsay attend a Blue Ladies event, and she stated {in her tweet}-

 

"Irsay also said ESPN falsely reported that GM Ryan Grigson is in last year of his contract. He has one year left."

 

That's the latest and best I can find.

[Superman]

i think it might have been picked up.  in this article-

 

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2015/6/7/8742065/jim-irsay-confirms-that-ryan-grigson-is-not-entering-the-final-year-of-his-contract-colts

 

The Blue Mare (Heather Lloyd) reported this past June 6th Irsay attend a Blue Ladies event, and she stated {in her tweet}-

 

"Irsay also said ESPN falsely reported that GM Ryan Grigson is in last year of his contract. He has one year left."

 

That's the latest and best I can find.

 

Maybe. But Irsay has also long talked about Luck's rookie contract as a five year deal, well before they were required to pick up the fifth year option. In his mind, if he has an option, then it's a five year deal. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

Maybe. But Irsay has also long talked about Luck's rookie contract as a five year deal, well before they were required to pick up the fifth year option. In his mind, if he has an option, then it's a five year deal. 

 

OK, here's something better.  Dan Pompei writing for Bleacher Report states -

 

"Grigson and the coaches provide a dramatic subplot. The Colts offered Chuck Pagano a one-year contract extension in the offseason. He declined and is in the final year of his deal. Grigson is signed through the 2016 season."

 

in this article:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2566550-the-evolution-of-ryan-grigson-the-nfls-most-unconventional-gm

 

Now ....

 

Comes the chorus of people to create various comments about using a B/R article for reference in 3 ....  2 ...   1....

 

Well, below is the bio of the author of the article referenced-

 

Dan Pompei has covered more than 500 National Football League games over a quarter of a century. He currently writes about the Bears and NFL for the Chicago Tribune. His opinions and analysis also can be found on the National Football Post website. He previously authored the NFL Insider column for The Sporting News. He is one of 44 members on the Pro Football Hall of Fame selectors board and also is one of nine members on the seniors committee. He has covered 23 Super Bowls and served as a pool reporter at five Super Bowls.

 

Boom.

[NewColtsFan]

If the team wants to sever its ties with Grigson, it can do so in December or even January.

 

Plenty of GM's can be hired in January and then hire a new HC within a week or two.

 

We could have a new GM and HC before the Super Bowl.      The process isn't that slow.

 

As for the draft,  the new GM may have notes and information of his own,  but he will be able to use everything that the Colts have generated, so he'll have plenty of information to use.      Grigson was hired in January and did pretty well in his first draft.     So can whoever replaces him -- IF -- he's replaced.

[ColtsBlueFL]

If the team wants to sever its ties with Grigson, it can do so in December or even January.

 

Plenty of GM's can be hired in January and then hire a new HC within a week or two.

 

We could have a new GM and HC before the Super Bowl.      The process isn't that slow.

 

As for the draft,  the new GM may have notes and information of his own,  but he will be able to use everything that the Colts have generated, so he'll have plenty of information to use.      Grigson was hired in January and did pretty well in his first draft.     So can whoever replaces him -- IF -- he's replaced.

 

Of course.  But my question is, does Grigson still get paid because he is signed through 2016. (see above).  Also, is there offset language in his contract, where if he gets a new job that the Colts can recoup the portion paid to Grigson equivalent of his new jobs pay, etc...

 

In other words, is it possible and would be Jim willing to pay two GM's for 2016?  These are not so clear.

[crazycolt1]

The team reportedly has an option for Grigson's fifth year.

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-01-12/colts-hire-eagles-executive-grigson-as-gm/52510056/1

 

 

Don't know the terms of that option, when it was to be picked up, if it's been picked up already, etc. But it might be possible that Irsay can make a clean break after 2015 from both Grigson and Pagano.

If Irsay does decide to cut ties it wouldn't matter if there was a contract? He would just have to pay him I would think. IMO if Grigson does get fired I doubt it will take long at all for him to find a job. If that were to happen wouldn't Irsay be relieved of a Grigson contract if he signed with another team?

[crazycolt1]

Of course.  But my question is, does Grigson still get paid because he is signed through 2016. (see above).  Also, is there offset language in his contract, where if he gets a new job that the Colts can recoup the portion paid to Grigson equivalent of his new jobs pay, etc...

 

In other words, is it possible and would be Jim willing to pay two GM's for 2016?  These are not so clear.

Sorry for pretty much the same question. I guess we were thinking the same thing around the same time.

[Superman]

OK, here's something better.  Dan Pompei writing for Bleacher Report states -

 

"Grigson and the coaches provide a dramatic subplot. The Colts offered Chuck Pagano a one-year contract extension in the offseason. He declined and is in the final year of his deal. Grigson is signed through the 2016 season."

 

in this article:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2566550-the-evolution-of-ryan-grigson-the-nfls-most-unconventional-gm

 

Now ....

 

Comes the chorus of people to create various comments about using a B/R article for reference in 3 ....  2 ...   1....

 

Well, below is the bio of the author of the article referenced-

 

Dan Pompei has covered more than 500 National Football League games over a quarter of a century. He currently writes about the Bears and NFL for the Chicago Tribune. His opinions and analysis also can be found on the National Football Post website. He previously authored the NFL Insider column for The Sporting News. He is one of 44 members on the Pro Football Hall of Fame selectors board and also is one of nine members on the seniors committee. He has covered 23 Super Bowls and served as a pool reporter at five Super Bowls.

 

Boom.

 

That doesn't really address the fifth year option. NFL writers, even the best, are often inaccurate or just lazy when it comes to reporting contract details. Not to nitpick...

 

And as has been mentioned in subsequent posts, it's up to Irsay to decide. Whether he has an option or not, he can break from Grigson whenever he wants. You mention offset language; it's my understand that it's typical in staff contracts, but who knows? 

[ColtsBlueFL]

That doesn't really address the fifth year option. NFL writers, even the best, are often inaccurate or just lazy when it comes to reporting contract details. Not to nitpick...

 

And as has been mentioned in subsequent posts, it's up to Irsay to decide. Whether he has an option or not, he can break from Grigson whenever he wants. You mention offset language; it's my understand that it's typical in staff contracts, but who knows? 

 

A few things tip this for me.  This was a very recent article.  Dan's article focuses on dynamics of GM and HC.  Article address employment status of both GM and HC. With the problems this year, it seems at least some reporter would uncover the shaky ground if Grigson's next season could be nullified in a moments notice. Why a HOF writer would be accurate on a HC status but be lazy on checking GM status seems peculiar.  And If Jim Irsay is refuting ESPN reports and saying the GM has another year, then it is either true in a physical sense, or Irsay has accepted as true in his mind as he did with Luck's 5th year option.

 

Interesting to watch things unfold.  Even if Grigs is let go, it doesn't mean the option wasn't picked up. But it doesn't affect the cap, just Irsay's wallet.  Many coaches GM's have guaranteed contracts, or healthy lead times for extensions.  They don't want to be dumped early or unceremoniously without receiving the balance of their compensation and be prepared for an extended layoff in trying to get re-employed.

 

But in Grigs case, who knows.  I might be off base.

[theanarchist]

i agree.  i doubt irsay will fire anyone mid season if we are in first place though.

I'm not so sure about that. We have a very tough stretch of games coming up here and I think reports are probably correct that if we lose the next two games the ax could fall on the bye week. As for Grigson I dont think his job is safe by any means. Hes spent a lot and I mean a lot of money of failed FA's and I doubt that Jim is real happy about forking over all that money to players that were very disappointing. Time will tell.

[#12.]

As far as replacing him now, it all depends on what coach you might have your eye on and how much control they would want over personnel, naming a GM, etc. Unless you're going after another amateur like Chuck, you probably have to wait.

[TheBlueAndWhite]

I want a good HC who is also The acting GM.This makes more sense to me, its never good to have two guys in charge that have different philosophies.

[lollygagger8]

Ryan Prickson yelling back at Irsay is probably not helping his cause.