2nd and 40

[cdgacoltsfan]

Im always perplexed when teams run the ball in long yardage situations. I know you want to keep the defense off balance but in todays league, the refs control a lot of the outcomes and they just love to call that illegal contact penalty. Why not take a couple shots down the field and get one of those cheap 5 yard automatic first down illegal contact penalties ?

[MisterChadley]

Because the odds of getting that call are probably lower than the odds of throwing an interception and the interception odds are probably greater than the odds of getting a first down with two plays to get 40 yards and getting no call

 

[Derakynn]

You are basically accepting that the drive is dead and are trying to improve field position to allow for a punt to pin them farther back. There's also the off chance that you get a great run, especially if the defense is expecting the deep ball. I don't know that the proper strategy is to try and bait out a penalty. You never know when the refs will miss a call and the ball ends up being intercepted or something instead. 

[chad72]

Unless you are Hail Mary Flacco, hoping to get a PI, LOL

[jtrester]

They don't exactly draw up plays for 2nd and screwed.  You go conservative and try to flip the field on the punt, not much else you can do unless you are in desperation mode.

[NewColtsFan]

 

There are zero plays for 2nd and 40,  no matter what our resident genius thinks....

 

But if you try to come up with the first,  here's a sample of what could go wrong....

 

-- Interception.

-- Catch and fumble and the D recovers.

-- Sack and a possible fumble....    

-- Or, just a sack and no fumble and worse field position.

 

There's lots that could go wrong,  and the odds are tiny of anything going right.     You're just trying to get back some of the yardage to help your punt team and the field position battle.

 

[lollygagger8]

I don't like how we just gave up. I realize it was a long yardage to achieve, but not even trying to advance the ball with throws was lame. 

 

If you are just going to give up like that, just punt it on 2nd down. 

[cdgacoltsfan]

5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There are zero plays for 2nd and 40,  no matter what our resident genius thinks....

 

But if you try to come up with the first,  here's a sample of what could go wrong....

 

-- Interception.

-- Catch and fumble and the D recovers.

-- Sack and a possible fumble....  

-- Or, just a sack and no fumble and worse field position.

 

There's lots that could go wrong,  and the odds are tiny of anything going right.     You're just trying to get back some of the yardage to help your punt team and the field position battle.

 

Thanks! I thought you were the self crowned resident genius.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

9 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

I don't like how we just gave up. I realize it was a long yardage to achieve, but not even trying to advance the ball with throws was lame. 

 

If you are just going to give up like that, just punt it on 2nd down. 

 

That possession was a disaster, it was best to get the offense off the field and regroup, especially considering that in the end it ultimately worked.

[crazycolt1]

12 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

I don't like how we just gave up. I realize it was a long yardage to achieve, but not even trying to advance the ball with throws was lame. 

 

If you are just going to give up like that, just punt it on 2nd down. 

Had the Colts attempted to get a first down and a turnover happened it would have been very bad for Pagano. No one was giving up. It was setting up a punt to try and get field position. There is more to this game than you seem to know by making a big deal out of this.

[crazycolt1]

16 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

I don't like how we just gave up. I realize it was a long yardage to achieve, but not even trying to advance the ball with throws was lame. 

 

If you are just going to give up like that, just punt it on 2nd down. 

A pooch punt might not have been a bad idea on third down. Like I said, field position.

[Jim H.]

2 hours ago, MisterChadley said:

Because the odds of getting that call are probably lower than the odds of throwing an interception and the interception odds are probably greater than the odds of getting a first down with two plays to get 40 yards and getting no call

 

Hmm.. Very odd, indeed.

 

[SilentHill]

If Ray Rice can complete 4th and 29, Luck can throw it on 2nd and 40.

[21isSuperman]

28 minutes ago, SilentHill said:

If Ray Rice can complete 4th and 29, Luck can throw it on 2nd and 40.

Ray Rice's play is the exception, not the norm.

[CR91]

run a screen and hope for the best. thats what id do.

[RockThatBlue]

Theres nothing you really can do in a 2nd and 40 situation. The chances of getting a first are basically zero. 

 

If Luck threw a pick on that possession people would be mad that we didn't run the ball. 

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, SilentHill said:

If Ray Rice can complete 4th and 29, Luck can throw it on 2nd and 40.

He was in a hurry, he had an elevator to catch.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

You don't have to get the 40 yards in one play..

[ReMeDy]

You know, it's funny though. If it was the New England Patriots in this situation (not that they ever would be), they would indeed probably throw it and prove all the conservative minds wrong. These coaches sometimes over-think themselves. If it's short, QB sneak it. To contain the blitz, throw screens. When ahead, run the ball. Do a trick play here and there to keep the defense honest.

 

When the Colts were ahead, Luck tried throwing it for some bone-headed reason to the flats and it cost us. We should have pounded the rock, and we didn't, especially since Gore was doing so well.

 

Keep it simple!
 

[MSColtsFan]

The funniest thing to me is, we won the game on a play which was little more than a 12 yard pass turned into a 63 yard individual effort, speed, and the QB hitting him in stride.  The point is, I don't care what the play call is, but the best chance to get 40 yards in two downs is to put the ball in your best play makers hands.  And in the case of the Colts, I'd say Luck and TY would be those two...

[MR. Blueblood]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There are zero plays for 2nd and 40,  no matter what our resident genius thinks....

 

But if you try to come up with the first,  here's a sample of what could go wrong....

 

-- Interception.

-- Catch and fumble and the D recovers.

-- Sack and a possible fumble....    

-- Or, just a sack and no fumble and worse field position.

 

There's lots that could go wrong,  and the odds are tiny of anything going right.     You're just trying to get back some of the yardage to help your punt team and the field position battle.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't all those things happen every time you decide to throw the ball?  Regardless if it's first and 10, third and 3, or second and 40.

 

I get the point you're making, just the bullet points you are trying to use can happen on ANY GIVEN PLAY in a game.

[Mitch Connors]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There are zero plays for 2nd and 40,  no matter what our resident genius thinks....

 

But if you try to come up with the first,  here's a sample of what could go wrong....

 

-- Interception.

-- Catch and fumble and the D recovers.

-- Sack and a possible fumble....    

-- Or, just a sack and no fumble and worse field position.

 

There's lots that could go wrong,  and the odds are tiny of anything going right.     You're just trying to get back some of the yardage to help your punt team and the field position battle.

 

 

Try to come up with the first and here are the things that could go right:

  - completions and no 1st down (field position)

  - completions and a 1st down

  - completions and a TD

  - defensive holding/P.I.  1st down

 

[BullsColtsFan1]

Line up in punt formation, maybe it'll catch the defense off guard and force them to take a timeout.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Thanks! I thought you were the self crowned resident genius.

 

No....      I was referring to a poster here who was criticizing the play calling on 2nd and 40.

 

He made more than one critical post about it.

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

31 minutes ago, MR. Blueblood said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't all those things happen every time you decide to throw the ball?  Regardless if it's first and 10, third and 3, or second and 40.

 

I get the point you're making, just the bullet points you are trying to use can happen on ANY GIVEN PLAY in a game.

 

Of course they can happen on every play......   but the odds of them happening go way up when you're trying to get a 1st on 2nd and 40.    

 

The odds are much less on 2nd and 10.

 

In short,  the odds are not the same.     Not even remotely close.

 

[MR. Blueblood]

 

12 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Of course they can happen on every play......   but the odds of them happening go way up when you're trying to get a 1st on 2nd and 40.    

 

The odds are much less on 2nd and 10.

 

In short,  the odds are not the same.     Not even remotely close.

 

That's why I said I get your point.  Just the bullet points you used could be said for any QB who drops back to throw the ball.

 

[NewColtsFan]

13 minutes ago, MR. Blueblood said:

 

That's why I said I get your point.  Just the bullet points you used could be said for any QB who drops back to throw the ball.

 

 

 

Sorry,  your post wasn't clear to me.      Thanks for straightening that out.....

 

[braveheartcolt]

1 hour ago, MSColtsFan said:

The funniest thing to me is, we won the game on a play which was little more than a 12 yard pass turned into a 63 yard individual effort, speed, and the QB hitting him in stride.  The point is, I don't care what the play call is, but the best chance to get 40 yards in two downs is to put the ball in your best play makers hands.  And in the case of the Colts, I'd say Luck and TY would be those two...

And the Bolts defense knew that as well.....

[LockeDown]

I would have found a way to get it to one of our 2 very fast WRs and give them a chance....or maybe a gimmick play like a reverse.  

[thecorn4]

I would think that there is more to it than, oh it's 2nd and 40, let's be conservative, or chuck it from the cheap seats.  I believe there is a lot more to it than that.  Like: what is the score, are we up, tied, behind? At what point in the game are we: is it early in the first, or late in the second and we get the ball to start the third?  During a game you are gonna more than likely get "x" amount of possessions, the colts decided on that particular possession, at that juncture of the game, and the score being what it was, to be conservative.  A ton of factors can play into one series.  Personally, the defense was playing well, no sense in taking an unnecessary risk at that point in the game.

[crazycolt1]

3 hours ago, ReMeDy said:

You know, it's funny though. If it was the New England Patriots in this situation (not that they ever would be), they would indeed probably throw it and prove all the conservative minds wrong. These coaches sometimes over-think themselves. If it's short, QB sneak it. To contain the blitz, throw screens. When ahead, run the ball. Do a trick play here and there to keep the defense honest.

 

When the Colts were ahead, Luck tried throwing it for some bone-headed reason to the flats and it cost us. We should have pounded the rock, and we didn't, especially since Gore was doing so well.

 

Keep it simple!
 

Gore was already at 21 carries. The Colts are not going to go many carries over that because of his age.

There's more games to play. Just saying.

[NorthernBlue]

Man people are really searching hard to say something negative about the coaching staff right now

[crazycolt1]

22 minutes ago, NorthernBlue said:

Man people are really searching hard to say something negative about the coaching staff right now

I know. I said in an earlier statement that when we lose it's all on the coaches. When we win it was because of what the Chargers did and didn't do. IMO if your going to blame any loss on the coaches you have to give them the same credit for wins.

[JPFolks]

11 hours ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Im always perplexed when teams run the ball in long yardage situations. I know you want to keep the defense off balance but in todays league, the refs control a lot of the outcomes and they just love to call that illegal contact penalty. Why not take a couple shots down the field and get one of those cheap 5 yard automatic first down illegal contact penalties ?

If it were me, I'd just run our offense.  If we complete a run of the mill 2nd and 10 pass for 20 yards a number of times during the game, why not do the same on 2nd and 40?  I it's complete, you do the same thing as if it was 3rd and 10... even if you fall short, running for a 3 yard gain gets less field position and you can fumble on any play, any time.  My point is don't try and throw 40 yard bombs but don't surrender either.  

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, JPFolks said:

If it were me, I'd just run our offense.  If we complete a run of the mill 2nd and 10 pass for 20 yards a number of times during the game, why not do the same on 2nd and 40?  I it's complete, you do the same thing as if it was 3rd and 10... even if you fall short, running for a 3 yard gain gets less field position and you can fumble on any play, any time.  My point is don't try and throw 40 yard bombs but don't surrender either.  

Playing safe, protecting the ball and setting up field position is not surrendering.

[zibby43]

10 hours ago, lollygagger8 said:

I don't like how we just gave up. I realize it was a long yardage to achieve, but not even trying to advance the ball with throws was lame. 

 

If you are just going to give up like that, just punt it on 2nd down. 

 

If you punt it on 2nd down there, you haven't improved field position, at all, for the eventual punt on 4th down.

 

Not exactly the ideal move.  The opposing team getting the ball at its own 20 or 30 as opposed to its own 40 is a big, big improvement. 

[braveheartcolt]

Situational football. The drive was a mess, no point in doing something silly. Runaway to fight another day etc. I can just imagine if Andrew chucked a bomb and got intercepted, this place would errupt. Stop searching for things to criticise the team about for goodness sake. Common sense prevailed. 

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

The Colts were heading in the wrong direction at that point of the game it was the safest thing to do especially considering the way the Denver game went there at the end .

 

The Colts needed that win as we all realize the last thing we needed was another mistake 2'nd & 40 was a bad situation in this short season we'v already seen disasterous endings all to much Pagano has made some bad calls this was not one of them .

[lollygagger8]

17 hours ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

That possession was a disaster, it was best to get the offense off the field and regroup, especially considering that in the end it ultimately worked.

 

It was a disaster, I'll give you that. 

 

 

[John Waylon]

Sure, there are no plays in the playbook for that. But couldn't we at least try to get 10 or 15, MAYBE even a good YAC for 20 back? Running a draw to set up 3rd and 37 isn't exactly a shocking playcall that's going to catch them off guard. Most teams are keyed for a draw in that situation to begin with, so they are looking for it the whole way. And it's not like we have some scrub at punter who needs the offense to help him get into position for a good kick. 

 

It's not impossible to convert in that situation by any means.