Ballard is not impressing me.....

[The Fish]

10 hours ago, SteelCityColt said:

So we’re judging a draft class before it’s even played a NFL down now? Amazingly sound thinking, let’s fire Ballard now. 

I said it last week. BENCH BALLAARRD FIRE LUCK (or something..) 

 

where's the ZIP!??

 

 

[throwing BBZ]

9 minutes ago, needanoline63 said:

Ya letting Melvin go was stupid! Like we don’t need a good corner Lol. Instead we go into the season with guys that will get destroyed 

 

 You aren't even aware Ballard didn't let Melvin go. Melvin made a CHOICE.
Pay attention, get a grip.

 And the odds are decent those ten games he played in last year were his Career year.

[Scott Pennock]

18 minutes ago, Surge89 said:

 

Wait so because you haven't heard of the player my argument is faulty? Lol ok.  Except that Tuitt was taking more snaps at DE in his first year than his entire draft class in a 3-4 allignment and was a regular starter in his 2nd year.... Not his 3rd

 

Sean Davis was a highly touted safety by those who followed the draft process and immediately started... Yet again just becaus you don't know who he is doesn't mean everyone else doesn't. 

 

Golson is solely based on his pre-draft status and never got a shot how does that murder my argument? He was a highly touted player that they took based on production and ability. Not question marks and risks.  No one could tell that aplayer with no injuries would all of a sudden become the most injured player of the class .

 

Im not comparing 1st year players with established vets in comparing draft strategies.  The Steelers took low question high potential players with production and have had a great return we have not. And the proof is solely in the play of their 2nd round players and the lack of ours. 

 

My platform is fine I can't foresee that you don't know the players I speak of. 

I know the players and your platform still sucks, at best.

 

Apples and oranges are aleays a horrible comparison.

 

Sorry you don't comprehend the fact that these players (11 of them to be exact) still have not even made it to game 1 of thier first NFL season.

 

Compare in 3 years - that's always been the rule of thumb. 

 

But you like your instant gratification and want your hide to tan so go ahead and complain and mock the process.....

[Surge89]

2 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

I know the players and your platform still sucks, at best.

 

Apples and oranges are aleays a horrible comparison.

 

Sorry you don't comprehend the fact that these players (11 of them to be exact) still have not even made it to game 1 of thier first NFL season.

 

Compare in 3 years - that's always been the rule of thumb. 

 

But you like your instant gratification and want your hide to tan so go ahead and complain and mock the process.....

 

Lol.  Instant gratification? Who here is saying all of these players are busts?

 

Assume much you do.

 

No I'm pointing out errors that I think are errors with a GM who wants to build like a team such as the Steelers and he isn't hitting that Mark yet. Never once have I said he's a bad GM and the players are bad players. I'm talking effeciency and ways to improve even the GM position . If all your going to do is wholistically lump everyone into haters or supporters then why partake in a forum whose main purpose is this discussion? 

[shasta519]

4 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

   Fowler was not added until the young guns were ready, JA was pulled of the scrap heap, KH and Addy were traded as Minor Leaguers and were groomed by the Cubs not to mention that Theo and Ballard have the same philosophy of building through the draft

 

The Fowler trade happened before the 2015 season...which was the breakout season. Addy was already a top 20 prospect when acquired. It would be akin to getting a 1st round pick for  trading Hankins. 

 

What I am saying is there isn't "selling" that happens in the NFL...and trades are rare overall. If Ballard could dump players for valuable assets...I am sure he would. But this is just something that Ballard doesn't really have access to...so he has to be willing and able to supplement elsewhere. Theo was able to forego FA because he had other means of player acquisition...Ballard doesn't have that.

 

But despite that, in reality it shouldn't take Ballard as long as it took Theo. In MLB, players take years just to arrive in the majors (at which point they are now rookies). This is what often necessitates the multi-year rebuild term. In the NFL, players are on the pro roster immediately and expected to contribute. This is why teams in the NFL go from bad to good very quickly...because 2-3 good rookies (and a few FAs) can make a huge difference. And this is especially true when you have the single most important piece...a franchise QB. 

 

Not trying to criticize Ballard...I just think it's a tough comparison to make.

 

 

 

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, adubb84 said:

What kills my soul is when a nonsensical post is made that teters on the fence of trolling, or just doesn’t have much depth is met with actual logic. Then their rebuttal is met with more craziness that doesn’t hold water. Ugh.... color me not impressed with another negative thread BEFORE the season begins. Guess people like being miserable 

Hence why I said "misery loves company" in another thread....but some didn't get it ;)

[PrincetonTiger]

Just now, shastamasta said:

 

The Fowler trade happened before the 2015 season...which was the breakout season. Addy was already a top 20 prospect when acquired. It would be akin to getting a 1st round pick for  trading Hankins. 

 

What I am saying is there isn't "selling" that happens in the NFL...and trades are rare overall. If Ballard could dump players for valuable assets...I am sure he would. But this is just something that Ballard doesn't really have access to...so he has to be willing and able to supplement elsewhere. Theo was able to forego FA because he had other means of player acquisition...Ballard doesn't have that.

 

But despite that, in reality it shouldn't take Ballard as long as it took Theo. In MLB, players take years just to arrive in the majors (at which point they are now rookies). This is what often necessitates the multi-year rebuild term. In the NFL, players are on the pro roster immediately and expected to contribute. This is why teams in the NFL go from bad to good very quickly...because 2-3 good rookies (and a few FAs) can make a huge difference. And this is especially true when you have the single most important piece...a franchise QB. 

 

Not trying to criticize Ballard...I just think it's a tough comparison to make.

 

 

 

You were the one that brought up the Players @Scott Pennock was talkIng about the fans and I was referring to the GM Philosophy 

[Luck 4 president]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

that's exactly my point. Second rounders are not always going to be superstuds like many on here expect.

I don’t think anyone on here expects our 2nd rounders to be all pros. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I expected us to get 3 starters with our 2nd round picks. Instead we reached for an FCS LB, got a backup guard (who drafts an FCS LB and a backup guard in the first 40 picks??), an injury prone DE who had one good season 4 years ago, and a 4th round Graded DE in hopes of transitioning him into a situational DT. Leonard is the only one who looks like he will make an impact this year but he was still overdrafted imo. 

[PrincetonTiger]

8 minutes ago, Luck 4 president said:

I don’t think anyone on here expects our 2nd rounders to be all pros. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I expected us to get 3 starters with our 2nd round picks. Instead we reached for an FCS LB, got a backup guard (who drafts an FCS LB and a backup guard in the first 40 picks??), an injury prone DE who had one good season 4 years ago, and a 4th round Graded DE in hopes of transitioning him into a situational DT. Leonard is the only one who looks like he will make an impact this year but he was still overdrafted imo. 

 3 of the 4 2nd Rounders are going to be Day 1 Contributors 

    Everyone must remember some of the 2nd Rounders of today would have been 3rd Rounders just 25 years ago

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

22 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 You aren't even aware Ballard didn't let Melvin go. Melvin made a CHOICE.
Pay attention, get a grip.

 And the odds are decent those ten games he played in last year were his Career year.

Melvin left because he didn't feel respected IMO!

[throwing BBZ]

8 minutes ago, Surge89 said:

 

Lol.  Instant gratification? Who here is saying all of these players are busts?

 

Assume much you do.

 

No I'm pointing out errors that I think are errors with a GM who wants to build like a team such as the Steelers and he isn't hitting that Mark yet. Never once have I said he's a bad GM and the players are bad players. I'm talking effeciency and ways to improve even the GM position . If all your going to do is wholistically lump everyone into haters or supporters then why partake in a forum whose main purpose is this discussion? 

 

 Malik Hooker and Quentin Nelson have the highest potential to be All-Pros.
 Braden Smith and darius Leonard have very good physical tools and were Highly Rated by All.

Im not comparing 1st year players with established vets in comparing draft strategies.  The Steelers took low question high potential players with production and have had a great return we have not. And the proof is solely in the play of their 2nd round players and the lack of ours. 

 

  Well, if you can't comprehend the meaning of Instant Gratification, the Obvious case of your comparing select successes of one teams draft picks several years after they were drafted, to rookies that haven't played a game or several just about to make the 2nd year jump, what a joke it is to have an amateur establish draft picks with Potential to be Errors. Just laughable.
 ALL draft picks are only potentially good.

[Cynjin]

15 minutes ago, Luck 4 president said:

I don’t think anyone on here expects our 2nd rounders to be all pros. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I expected us to get 3 starters with our 2nd round picks. Instead we reached for an FCS LB, got a backup guard (who drafts an FCS LB and a backup guard in the first 40 picks??), an injury prone DE who had one good season 4 years ago, and a 4th round Graded DE in hopes of transitioning him into a situational DT. Leonard is the only one who looks like he will make an impact this year but he was still overdrafted imo. 

 

Jerry Rice

Carson Wentz

Robert Mathis

Michael Strahan

Randy Moss

 

All came from FCS schools, I could go on.  I could also include other players from small schools that have been excellent NFL players like K. Mack that were drafted high.

 

Smith is probably not going to be a "back up guard" for very long.  Your grade or anyone else's grade other than the Colts grade is useless in regards to who the Colts draft.

 

 

[Surge89]

14 minutes ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

 Malik Hooker and Quentin Nelson have the highest potential to be All-Pros.
 Braden Smith and darius Leonard have very good physical tools and were Highly Rated by All.

Im not comparing 1st year players with established vets in comparing draft strategies.  The Steelers took low question high potential players with production and have had a great return we have not. And the proof is solely in the play of their 2nd round players and the lack of ours. 

 

  Well, if you can't comprehend the meaning of Instant Gratification, the Obvious case of your comparing select successes of one teams draft picks several years after they were drafted, to rookies that haven't played a game or several just about to make the 2nd year jump, what a joke it is to have an amateur establish draft picks with Potential to be Errors. Just laughable.
 ALL draft picks are only potentially good.

 

Lol... C'mon man. I'm not comparing their play.  Haven't compared it yet.  I'm talking drafting techniques and draft ability.  Am I saying Leonard is a bust and never amounting to Sean Davis? No I'm not. In fact I'm very high on Leonard and think that's Ballard's best pick.  My issue has been that we had 2nd round picks this year.  And those 2nd round picks should be projected starters or high level depth that's pushing for start.  And while we may still get that (I haven't once said this draft class is horrible and never succeeding) I'm saying there were better ways to go about drafting players than taking a reach at guard and double dipping in a weak defensive end pool.  

 

What's the point of this forum exactly when all everyone does is skip over the main point you are making, assume you are saying everyone is bad and then turn around and call you misinformed.  No one is allowed to have any type of opinion here and if it even remotely isnt kissing the ground Ballard walks on no one even bothers to read what you put and just put some asinine instant gratification rambles.  It's rediculous. 

[TdungyW/12]

12 hours ago, threeflight said:

I said this last winter and I will say it again after this draft.

 

IMO GM Ballard is not impressing me in the least.   I know he talks a good game, and comes across as someone who seems to know what he is doing, but his actions imo leave much to be desired.

 

FA signings have been mediocre at best.  And he has not used the plethora of money he has at his disposal to really get anyone of consequence.

 

Totally bungled the backup QB situation last year expecting to go into the season starting the worst Qb in the world.  Is that guy even still in the league?

 

Bungled the coaching search.

 

His drafts have been this.

 

Malik Hooker FSOhio State

Quincy Wilson CBFlorida

Tarell Basham OLBOhio

Zach Banner OTUSC

Marlon Mack RBSouth Florida

Grover Stewart DTAlbany State

Nate Hairston CBTemple

Anthony Walker Jr.ILBNorthwestern

 

Quenton Nelson Guard Notre Dame

Darius Leonard LinebackerSouth Carolina State

Braden Smith GuardAuburnFrom NY Jets

Kemoko Turay Defensive endRutgersFrom Baltimore via Philadelphia

Tyquan Lewis Defensive endOhio StateFrom Philadelphia via Cleveland

Nyheim Hines Running backNC State

Daurice Fountain Wide receiverNorthern IowaFrom Kansas City via Cleveland, New England, and Oakland

Jordan Wilkins Running backOle MissFrom Philadelphia

Deon Cain Wide receiverClemsonFrom Oakland

Matthew Adams LinebackerHouston

Zaire Franklin LinebackerSyracuse

For a guy who says he is wanting to build through the draft, and yes I realize it is early in the process, but besides a couple of guys...do we really see any standouts here?

 

Hooker, Nelson, Leonard and then???

 

Mack?  Maybe.

Hariston????

 

All those guys and so far we see just a few that look like they may amount to something more than just filler??

 

I mean cmon.  What is this guy doing?  I want to root for him more than anyone but so far, color me not impressed.

I didn’t know he was hired to impress you.

[IndyD4U]

"Ballard is not impressing me....."

 

I say the same about your profile pic 

 

[zibby43]

4 hours ago, Surge89 said:

 

Hmmm despite the original topic these player evaluations are mind numbing. 

 

Out of 4 2nd round picks we have one starter?  That's worrying.

 

Also Braden is a potential starter because of how much trash is around him as far as depth is concerned. 

 

Grover Stewart is a whiff?

 

Anthony Walker is an ill fit? He transitioned at NW from Will to Mike no?

 

Turay is talented but he's raw and has some serious flaws that may or may not he worked out.  That doesn't sound like a 2nd round pick.

 

Lewis was an unnecessary pick and despite being injured brought little to no value to the team due to similar style players being drafted the year before.  Give those a chance to grow...

 

Not sure how Hines is talented as a RB he has no vision and for all that speed can't wiggle past a defender in space (see the few screen plays he got in the Seattle game where he just ran into a guy 40 pounds bigger than him)

 

Adams and Franklin are not camp bodies... What?

 

All in all my issue with Ballard is that he wastes high draft picks on unnecessary risks but finds gems in the late rounds.  Gems are nice but it's better to capitalize on your initial draft stock than hope you get 5th round to undrafted gems every year. Sounds a lot like Polian in the end. 

 

Tell me what Anthony Walker, Grover Stewart, Adams, and Franklin are doing right now.  With specificity.

 

Walker is an ill fit.  He’s a hulking, slow LB that was suited to play in the 3-4.

 

And anyone with common sense can see that my one liners were not “evaluations” - but indicators that most of the picks have been contributors (some significant) while others still have the chance to be.

 

I couldn’t make any sense of your reply whatsoever.

[Surge89]

8 minutes ago, zibby43 said:

 

Tell me what Anthony Walker, Grover Stewart, Adams, and Franklin are doing right now.  With specificity.

 

Walker is an ill fit.  He’s a hulking, slow LB that was suited to play in the 3-4.

 

And anyone with common sense can see that my one liners were not “evaluations” - but indicators that most of the picks have been contributors (some significant) while others still have the chance to be.

 

I couldn’t make any sense of your reply whatsoever.

 

Walker first and foremost is the projected starter since before the preseason... Also he was touted for his athletic ability not a "hulking slow" LB.  Some I'm not sure where that comes from.

 

Stewart has been doing decent lately and while yes he may be on the bubble I wouldn't call it a whiff like Banner.  He still has a solid chance to be a good depth player for us. 

 

Both Adams and Franklin are filling out the non-existant LB Depth that we didn't have last year.  Those players are definitely important in both special teams and in case injuries arise. 

 

Apologies didn't mean to offend with the word "evaluations" I just didn't know how else to label.  Indicators is a good word. 

 

What did you not make sense on? I can't help explain without you telling me what didn't complete thought. 

[deedub75]

I wouldn't go as far as the OP did but I wouldn't say the Ballard has been impressive.  It's still to early to judge him.  I'm not too concerned with Ballard - Yet.  Hell, Grigson was crowned way to early and we see how that turned out.  If the team doesn't show improvement this season and be contending next season then judge him at that time.  Some would say the this is the least talented team Luck has had around him.  I wish Ballard's first order of business would have been to get rid of Pagano and install his on coach but I guess Irsay didn't want that to happen. 

[Luck 4 president]

57 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

Jerry Rice

Carson Wentz

Robert Mathis

Michael Strahan

Randy Moss

 

All came from FCS schools, I could go on.  I could also include other players from small schools that have been excellent NFL players like K. Mack that were drafted high.

 

Smith is probably not going to be a "back up guard" for very long.  Your grade or anyone else's grade other than the Colts grade is useless in regards to who the Colts draft.

 

 

There were better players available at positions of need, we likely could have gotten him with our 3rd second round pick, and he wasn’t even the clear cut best LB available imo. We will see though. If he ends up being better than Harold Landry, Josh Jackson, and Fred Warner then I’ll eat my words. 

[shakedownstreet]

<insert artificial news here>

[superrep1967]

13 hours ago, threeflight said:

I said this last winter and I will say it again after this draft.

 

IMO GM Ballard is not impressing me in the least.   I know he talks a good game, and comes across as someone who seems to know what he is doing, but his actions imo leave much to be desired.

 

FA signings have been mediocre at best.  And he has not used the plethora of money he has at his disposal to really get anyone of consequence.

 

Totally bungled the backup QB situation last year expecting to go into the season starting the worst Qb in the world.  Is that guy even still in the league?

 

Bungled the coaching search.

 

His drafts have been this.

 

Malik Hooker FSOhio State

Quincy Wilson CBFlorida

Tarell Basham OLBOhio

Zach Banner OTUSC

Marlon Mack RBSouth Florida

Grover Stewart DTAlbany State

Nate Hairston CBTemple

Anthony Walker Jr.ILBNorthwestern

 

Quenton Nelson Guard Notre Dame

Darius Leonard LinebackerSouth Carolina State

Braden Smith GuardAuburnFrom NY Jets

Kemoko Turay Defensive endRutgersFrom Baltimore via Philadelphia

Tyquan Lewis Defensive endOhio StateFrom Philadelphia via Cleveland

Nyheim Hines Running backNC State

Daurice Fountain Wide receiverNorthern IowaFrom Kansas City via Cleveland, New England, and Oakland

Jordan Wilkins Running backOle MissFrom Philadelphia

Deon Cain Wide receiverClemsonFrom Oakland

Matthew Adams LinebackerHouston

Zaire Franklin LinebackerSyracuse

For a guy who says he is wanting to build through the draft, and yes I realize it is early in the process, but besides a couple of guys...do we really see any standouts here?

 

Hooker, Nelson, Leonard and then???

 

Mack?  Maybe.

Hariston????

 

All those guys and so far we see just a few that look like they may amount to something more than just filler??

 

I mean cmon.  What is this guy doing?  I want to root for him more than anyone but so far, color me not impressed.

The season hasn’t started yet and your already complaining. 

[threeflight]

First of all thank you to all who answered my OP with thoughtful analysis.  I don't care if you disagree with me, but at least come back with something better than 'troll'.

 

I'm not a troll.  Far from it.  I go back to the Bert Jones days.  I used to sit for hours in the car trying to pick up games on the radio as a kid or moving the TV antenna around to see a snowed tv screen that 'might' have the Colts on that channel.

 

I literally cried when the Colts beat the Pats to go to the SB.

 

I used to wear only Colt clothes.  I'm just a huge fan.

 

That being said, I am just not impressed with Ballard so far.  Maybe people were so sick of Grigson that Ballard's professionalism makes him seem better than he is, but as far as his actions that affect the team I don't see much.

 

I remember back in some of the Polian drafts, and even Grigsons first, you could just see "it" in some of the picks.  And I just don't see it when looking at most of Ballards picks so far.  I hope I'm wrong, maybe I am, but so far nothing really impresses me besides the obvious first round picks and Leonard.  I didn't like either of the lineman taken early this year for example, and I didn't like Basham last year.  We will see.

 

As far as FA's, I like Simon, Sheard, and that's about it.  I thought he could have done much more to improve the OL and LB positions.  He didn't.  Maybe he will.

 

And btw...if I can?  I trade for Mack in a heart beat.  People way way wayyyyyyyyy overestimate early picks imo.  Look at our picks.  How many will be stars?  Or even starters??

 

If you can get Mack for a first and second imo you do that no questions asked.  He is a star.  Chances are those 2 picks might only have one starter, and the chances of being a star or slim if you look at draft history.

 

[tfunky14]

14 hours ago, threeflight said:

I said this last winter and I will say it again after this draft.

 

IMO GM Ballard is not impressing me in the least.   I know he talks a good game, and comes across as someone who seems to know what he is doing, but his actions imo leave much to be desired.

 

FA signings have been mediocre at best.  And he has not used the plethora of money he has at his disposal to really get anyone of consequence.

 

Totally bungled the backup QB situation last year expecting to go into the season starting the worst Qb in the world.  Is that guy even still in the league?

 

Bungled the coaching search.

 

His drafts have been this.

 

Malik Hooker FSOhio State

Quincy Wilson CBFlorida

Tarell Basham OLBOhio

Zach Banner OTUSC

Marlon Mack RBSouth Florida

Grover Stewart DTAlbany State

Nate Hairston CBTemple

Anthony Walker Jr.ILBNorthwestern

 

Quenton Nelson Guard Notre Dame

Darius Leonard LinebackerSouth Carolina State

Braden Smith GuardAuburnFrom NY Jets

Kemoko Turay Defensive endRutgersFrom Baltimore via Philadelphia

Tyquan Lewis Defensive endOhio StateFrom Philadelphia via Cleveland

Nyheim Hines Running backNC State

Daurice Fountain Wide receiverNorthern IowaFrom Kansas City via Cleveland, New England, and Oakland

Jordan Wilkins Running backOle MissFrom Philadelphia

Deon Cain Wide receiverClemsonFrom Oakland

Matthew Adams LinebackerHouston

Zaire Franklin LinebackerSyracuse

For a guy who says he is wanting to build through the draft, and yes I realize it is early in the process, but besides a couple of guys...do we really see any standouts here?

 

Hooker, Nelson, Leonard and then???

 

Mack?  Maybe.

Hariston????

 

All those guys and so far we see just a few that look like they may amount to something more than just filler??

 

I mean cmon.  What is this guy doing?  I want to root for him more than anyone but so far, color me not impressed.

And you want who then?

[threeflight]

4 hours ago, IndyD4U said:

"Ballard is not impressing me....."

 

I say the same about your profile pic 

 

Oh brah.  Brah brah brah.

 

It's all about working out and lots and lots of vit C and lysine.  In fact I even own a supp company based on heavy vit C.  I take up to 20 grams a day.  That is about 20,000% more than most people get a day.  Humans are one of only 3 animals in the world that don't make it in our bodies, hence why we suffer so many diseases. 

 

Believe it or not I just turned 50.

 

 

Edited August 31, 2018 by SteelCityColt
No promotion allowed - see rules

[Scott Pennock]

2 hours ago, Surge89 said:

 

Lol.  Instant gratification? Who here is saying all of these players are busts?

 

Assume much you do.

 

No I'm pointing out errors that I think are errors with a GM who wants to build like a team such as the Steelers and he isn't hitting that Mark yet. Never once have I said he's a bad GM and the players are bad players. I'm talking effeciency and ways to improve even the GM position . If all your going to do is wholistically lump everyone into haters or supporters then why partake in a forum whose main purpose is this discussion? 

Instant gratification is summed up wholly in the fact that you somehow think that these 4 Second Round choices: Leonard, Smith, Turay and Lewis are bad players.....

 

Please just stop with your argument there.

 

They have not played one single down of official NFL football and you're still comparing them to known commodities.

 

Just stop...

[zibby43]

1 hour ago, Surge89 said:

 

Walker first and foremost is the projected starter since before the preseason... Also he was touted for his athletic ability not a "hulking slow" LB.  Some I'm not sure where that comes from.

 

Stewart has been doing decent lately and while yes he may be on the bubble I wouldn't call it a whiff like Banner.  He still has a solid chance to be a good depth player for us. 

 

Both Adams and Franklin are filling out the non-existant LB Depth that we didn't have last year.  Those players are definitely important in both special teams and in case injuries arise. 

 

Apologies didn't mean to offend with the word "evaluations" I just didn't know how else to label.  Indicators is a good word. 

 

What did you not make sense on? I can't help explain without you telling me what didn't complete thought. 

 

No offense taken.  It was the “mind-numbing evaluations” description that confused me.  They were one-word takes on the last 2 years of draft picks.

 

Walker is on the slow side.  Teams had concerns about how much muscle he packed onto his frame his final year in school and the subsequent consequences it had on his flexibility and agility.

 

There have also always been questions about his coverage skills.  In the 3-4, you can survive with a thicker, less mobile “phone booth” LB like Walker but, he, IMHO, is not a good fit in the speed-obsessed 4-3.

 

What group is Stewart getting reps with?  I hadn’t seen his name much this preseason.  He only got about 33 snaps last night.

 

And Franklin?  Maybe a dozen or so.  Plus a handful on ST.

 

So now that I’ve clarified my “one takes,” on the mostly marginal players (some may be PS guys) you pointed out, excluding Walker (not marginal), what other observations did you find problematic?  

 

 

[Surge89]

15 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

Instant gratification is summed up wholly in the fact that you somehow think that these 4 Second Round choices: Leonard, Smith, Turay and Lewis are bad players.....

 

Please just stop with your argument there.

 

They have not played one single down of official NFL football and you're still comparing them to known commodities.

 

Just stop...

I did not and have not said they are bad players.

 

In fact twice in this thread alone have I mentioned how high I am on Leonard.

 

My issue is with the approach to the draft and how we took players with questions instead of players who had a more solid 2nd round grade. This was a weak defensive end class. That has not been argued and we double dipped on 2 players from that class.  

 

We took an athletic guard (whom I actually liked BTW) over a left tackle and 2 right tackles. One of those whom had first round production in a big school. 

 

So how about you just stop with your argument since you aren't even arguing the point I'm trying to make?

 

Just stop...

[Dark Superman]

14 hours ago, threeflight said:

I said this last winter and I will say it again after this draft.

 

IMO GM Ballard is not impressing me in the least.   I know he talks a good game, and comes across as someone who seems to know what he is doing, but his actions imo leave much to be desired.

 

FA signings have been mediocre at best.  And he has not used the plethora of money he has at his disposal to really get anyone of consequence.

 

Totally bungled the backup QB situation last year expecting to go into the season starting the worst Qb in the world.  Is that guy even still in the league?

 

Bungled the coaching search.

 

His drafts have been this.

 

Malik Hooker FSOhio State

Quincy Wilson CBFlorida

Tarell Basham OLBOhio

Zach Banner OTUSC

Marlon Mack RBSouth Florida

Grover Stewart DTAlbany State

Nate Hairston CBTemple

Anthony Walker Jr.ILBNorthwestern

 

Quenton Nelson Guard Notre Dame

Darius Leonard LinebackerSouth Carolina State

Braden Smith GuardAuburnFrom NY Jets

Kemoko Turay Defensive endRutgersFrom Baltimore via Philadelphia

Tyquan Lewis Defensive endOhio StateFrom Philadelphia via Cleveland

Nyheim Hines Running backNC State

Daurice Fountain Wide receiverNorthern IowaFrom Kansas City via Cleveland, New England, and Oakland

Jordan Wilkins Running backOle MissFrom Philadelphia

Deon Cain Wide receiverClemsonFrom Oakland

Matthew Adams LinebackerHouston

Zaire Franklin LinebackerSyracuse

For a guy who says he is wanting to build through the draft, and yes I realize it is early in the process, but besides a couple of guys...do we really see any standouts here?

 

Hooker, Nelson, Leonard and then???

 

Mack?  Maybe.

Hariston????

 

All those guys and so far we see just a few that look like they may amount to something more than just filler??

 

I mean cmon.  What is this guy doing?  I want to root for him more than anyone but so far, color me not impressed.

 

Ryan Grigson, is that you?

[threeflight]

1 minute ago, Savage21 said:

 

Ryan Grigson, is that you?

No.  I'm Bill Polian.

[OffensivelyPC]

39 minutes ago, threeflight said:

First of all thank you to all who answered my OP with thoughtful analysis.  I don't care if you disagree with me, but at least come back with something better than 'troll'.

 

I'm not a troll.  Far from it.  I go back to the Bert Jones days.  I used to sit for hours in the car trying to pick up games on the radio as a kid or moving the TV antenna around to see a snowed tv screen that 'might' have the Colts on that channel.

 

I literally cried when the Colts beat the Pats to go to the SB.

 

I used to wear only Colt clothes.  I'm just a huge fan.

 

That being said, I am just not impressed with Ballard so far.  Maybe people were so sick of Grigson that Ballard's professionalism makes him seem better than he is, but as far as his actions that affect the team I don't see much.

 

I remember back in some of the Polian drafts, and even Grigsons first, you could just see "it" in some of the picks.  And I just don't see it when looking at most of Ballards picks so far.  I hope I'm wrong, maybe I am, but so far nothing really impresses me besides the obvious first round picks and Leonard.  I didn't like either of the lineman taken early this year for example, and I didn't like Basham last year.  We will see.

 

As far as FA's, I like Simon, Sheard, and that's about it.  I thought he could have done much more to improve the OL and LB positions.  He didn't.  Maybe he will.

 

And btw...if I can?  I trade for Mack in a heart beat.  People way way wayyyyyyyyy overestimate early picks imo.  Look at our picks.  How many will be stars?  Or even starters??

 

If you can get Mack for a first and second imo you do that no questions asked.  He is a star.  Chances are those 2 picks might only have one starter, and the chances of being a star or slim if you look at draft history.

 

Be patient.  I say this like 50 times a day to my 4 year old.  She's still learning, but you are old enough you should know what patience is. 

 

You can speculate on a draft class after their rookie year, give an educated opinion after year two, and make informed judgements after year 3.  GMs get bare minimum 3 or 4 years because of this simple truth and as long as they aren't making obvious long term mistakes signing guys to mega deals they have no business signing or giving up the farm for someone, they'll likely get a year or two on top of that.

 

Knowing all of this to be true, what about your misguided opinion can you possibly say is legitmate?

[basketballsteve]

4 hours ago, Four2itus said:

Merlin's beard!

Holy Toledo

[IndyD4U]

1 hour ago, threeflight said:

Oh brah.  Brah brah brah.

 

It's all about working out and lots and lots of vit C and lysine.  In fact I even own a supp company based on heavy vit C.  I take up to 20 grams a day.  That is about 20,000% more than most people get a day.  Humans are one of only 3 animals in the world that don't make it in our bodies, hence why we suffer so many diseases.  www.c-fitlife.com

 

Believe it or not I just turned 50.

 

 

 

Good for you, man. I was just razing you.

 

Former power-lifter here so I know all about creatine, protein and stacks.

 

Keep at it!

 

Now back to the Colts

[Scott Pennock]

2 hours ago, Surge89 said:

I did not and have not said they are bad players.

 

In fact twice in this thread alone have I mentioned how high I am on Leonard.

 

My issue is with the approach to the draft and how we took players with questions instead of players who had a more solid 2nd round grade. This was a weak defensive end class. That has not been argued and we double dipped on 2 players from that class.  

 

We took an athletic guard (whom I actually liked BTW) over a left tackle and 2 right tackles. One of those whom had first round production in a big school. 

 

So how about you just stop with your argument since you aren't even arguing the point I'm trying to make?

 

Just stop...

Bad approach equates to poor choices with equates to bad personnel - semantics......all because you or some talking head or a magazine said X should be drafted before Y...

 

Give it a rest. None of us are GM's or Scouts.....let them do thier jobs and build the foundation.

 

T.J. Green would have been a better example to use versus this years crop....3 off-seasons and 2 full seasons and it didn't work out, so the current regime let him go. Who *could* we have had instead of him that year?

 

Come back in 3 years and revisit this bad approach/bad player conundrum.

[BeanDiasucci]

I am generally impressed with Ballard and his approach, but some of these draft picks do concern me. Kemoko Turay seems like a high-risk, potentially high-reward pick who was somewhat injury prone in college, and him missing much of training camp is at least a little concerning to me. At Rutgers, he played 12, 8, 3 and 11 games during his four seasons (those are in order - fr, so, jr, sr years). He is credited with 7.5, 2, 2, and 3 sacks during those seasons.  He made All-Big Ten Honorable Mention as a freshman, but didn't make the Coaches or Media 1st, 2nd, or 3rd teams, or Honorable Mention as a soph, junior or senior.  Here are the results from last year, a lot of honorees, but no Turay: http://btn.com/2017/11/28/view-the-2017-all-big-ten-football-defensive-teams/ . He apparently has a ton of talent and I know the Colts loved his film, but the questionable durability combined with the lack of recognition by the conference coaches and media seem atypical for a second round pick. 

[Douzer]

Ballard is impressing me

 

 

[DownHillRunner]

This thread seems like a troll bait thread to me. Ballard has been our GM for going on 3 seasons now. Fixing this team is not an overnight fix. He said we have a way to go before we see greatness with this team again. Nelson, Smith, and Leonard have played solid this preseason. Leonard looks like the real deal.

 

 

 

A couple of passes he should've had for picks tells me his football instincts are off the charts. As far as Malik Hooker goes, he looked solid last year before his injury. Its way too early in the process to pass judgement on Chris Ballard. 

[Jdubu]

14 hours ago, DougDew said:

Your post made a lot of sense until you got here.  The crap team in which RG won the award was the result of Polian's roster and cap constraints the previous few years.  We went 11-5 that year and that's why he won the award and nobody wanted him gone after that season.

 

To your point, winning and losing is all that matters.  Polian started losing, in part, because of wasted 1st round picks like Anthony Gonzalez, Tony Ugoh, Donald Brown, and Jerry Hughes (4 bad ones in a row); and RG because of Werner, TRich, and Dorsett. 

 

Ballard's 2 ist round players will probably be more successful, but he gave up a lot of value and other roster spots to get those sure things, IMO.

Nobody wanted him gone after his first season, but there sure was a lot of people questioning his selections after that first season. That’s what I meant. Luck made that first season a success looking back, not Grigson. He was engaged the first season and then His head swelled up and he lost the battle after that. 

[GoColts8818]

11 hours ago, Luck 4 president said:

I don’t think anyone on here expects our 2nd rounders to be all pros. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I expected us to get 3 starters with our 2nd round picks. Instead we reached for an FCS LB, got a backup guard (who drafts an FCS LB and a backup guard in the first 40 picks??), an injury prone DE who had one good season 4 years ago, and a 4th round Graded DE in hopes of transitioning him into a situational DT. Leonard is the only one who looks like he will make an impact this year but he was still overdrafted imo. 

Who cares where he went to school?  Leonard looked worthy of a second round pick in the pre-season.  That’s all we have to go on.  It doesn’t matter where they went to school if they can play.

[dodsworth]

18 hours ago, threeflight said:

First of all thank you to all who answered my OP with thoughtful analysis.  I don't care if you disagree with me, but at least come back with something better than 'troll'.

 

I'm not a troll.  Far from it.  I go back to the Bert Jones days.  I used to sit for hours in the car trying to pick up games on the radio as a kid or moving the TV antenna around to see a snowed tv screen that 'might' have the Colts on that channel.

 

I literally cried when the Colts beat the Pats to go to the SB.

 

I used to wear only Colt clothes.  I'm just a huge fan.

 

That being said, I am just not impressed with Ballard so far.  Maybe people were so sick of Grigson that Ballard's professionalism makes him seem better than he is, but as far as his actions that affect the team I don't see much.

 

I remember back in some of the Polian drafts, and even Grigsons first, you could just see "it" in some of the picks.  And I just don't see it when looking at most of Ballards picks so far.  I hope I'm wrong, maybe I am, but so far nothing really impresses me besides the obvious first round picks and Leonard.  I didn't like either of the lineman taken early this year for example, and I didn't like Basham last year.  We will see.

 

As far as FA's, I like Simon, Sheard, and that's about it.  I thought he could have done much more to improve the OL and LB positions.  He didn't.  Maybe he will.

 

And btw...if I can?  I trade for Mack in a heart beat.  People way way wayyyyyyyyy overestimate early picks imo.  Look at our picks.  How many will be stars?  Or even starters??

 

If you can get Mack for a first and second imo you do that no questions asked.  He is a star.  Chances are those 2 picks might only have one starter, and the chances of being a star or slim if you look at draft history.

 

You would give up our first and second round draft picks for Mack and you are

questioning Ballard's GM decisions?

[threeflight]

30 minutes ago, dodsworth said:

You would give up our first and second round draft picks for Mack and you are

questioning Ballard's GM decisions?

That's a pretty moderate package for someone of his caliber.

 

You don't remember who some of our first round picks have been over the years?

 

Do names like Dorsett, Werner, Kelly, Brown, Hughes, and Gonzales not ring a bell???