Moves that set us back

[Fx Stryker]

i'm sure irsay didn't tell polian to over pay guys like hayden, brackett, and clark

I'm sure Irsay didn't let Polian control his checkbook.

[turner46992]

i'm sure irsay didn't tell polian to over pay guys like hayden, brackett, and clark

True, didnt think of it in that perspective. So with that said, Ditch Polian when he started over paying players.

[GoColts8818]

True, didnt think of it in that perspective. So with that said, Ditch Polian when he started over paying players.

No one here was calling for that at the time so we can't really fault Irsay for not doing it in fact there was no reason too the Colts were going to the playoffs every year and people were happy with it. We have the advantage now of looking at it with hindsight.

[BOTT]

I'm sure Irsay didn't let Polian control his checkbook.

then why did he hire polian? there is a reason he fired himself from gm duties...

[Warhorse]

5. Giving Quinton Coryatt a monster contract after the 1995 season! Our 1995 defense was probably the best Indy Colts defense ever! But within a couple of years, all of those key guys were gone! Bill tobin had no cash left to do anything. Tony Siragusa was let to. He went on to be a key contributor for Baltimore's Super Bowl team. Ashley Ambrose and Ray Buchannon were let go in successive years. Both guys became Pro Bowlers. Ray was a key leader for Atlanta's Super Bowl team. They also let go of pro bowl left tackle Will Woolford!

Werd. Didn't Ambrose have like 7 int's the next season and lead the league?

Letting Thornton go, Washington, Peterson.........

And how come no one ever mentions our mistake of letting Bertrand Berry go........

[John Dee]

Old news is ... OLD NEWS. We all know the history.

Lets look forward ... and onward.... JMO....

[braveheartcolt]

Signing Hank Basket.

Resting the starters.

Letting Ed Johnson off the hook.

Caldwell.

Caldwell.

Kenton Keith

Larry Coyer.

Not replacing Blue.

[crazycolt1]

One thing that hurt was Polian back loading huge contracts to players who were too old. We are still paying for those mistakes this season. Polian's refusal to see that more of his draft picks were not as good as he thought and then being too stubborn to let them go or deal them away. The regular season wins always put us in the end of the draft and it was hard to find top notch players at those picks. Never having the money and refusing to sign free agents was another negative.

[number28]

Well said. The poor drafts of Chris Polian were also things that set us back a few years, as did the poor choice of having Caldwell as a head coach. We let Jake Scott go and he signed with Tennessee where he helped CJ2K reach his 2K. We let Ryan Lilja go and he went to Kansas City where he helped Jamaal Charles have one of the better RB performances that year.

Agree with everything here, except the Jim Caldwell thing. As far as I can remember he took us to SB. There was no guarantee that Dungy would have taken us to SB back to back.

[number28]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

[jimirsaysdog]

did you even watch the game?

yes. twice. i certainly don't expect you to agree. you've made those two your personal whipping boys for some reason. that's fine. i don't think you'll ever credit either of them on anything so good luck. i hope grigson and pagano have you on speed dial. and yes again both played better than satele.. i just don't understand how seem here don't understand that the first five up front have not played a single whole game as a unit but think they can evaluate already good or bad.

[Gavin]

yes. twice. i certainly don't expect you to agree. you've made those two your personal whipping boys for some reason. that's fine. i don't think you'll ever credit either of them on anything so good luck. i hope grigson and pagano have you on speed dial. and yes again both played better than satele.. i just don't understand how seem here don't understand that the first five up front have not played a single whole game as a unit but think they can evaluate already good or bad.

looking at 1 of Donalds big runs Mcglynn did make a great pull block, much better then Olsen has, the other big run Donald had for a touchdown that was all him, I'd liek to see Mcglynn used in pull blocking more with Allen leading behind him as another blocker

[GoDeep]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

Please elaborate.

How were these guys mistreated, again?

For the record -

1. An unhealthy Manning due $28 million. Andrew Luck also available.

2. Injury

3. Ummmm, WHAT? They could build and staff a clinic just to treat this one guy.

4. What?

5. How was an old and slowing RB looking for a payday mistreated?

6. Garcon - overpaid dropsy, Saturday, old and losing strength, Clark - 10 year vet with freak injuries lately, Addai - I think we wanted more than 10-12 games out of our #1 back.

[fatboy]

heck, how far do you want to go back? I'll just stick with Indy Colts history so no Art Schlister and John Elway stuff.

1. Traded the farm for Eric Dickerson. This move kept the Colts in mediocre land for several years. Dickerson was good enough to keep the Colts competitive but never better than 9-7.

2. Traded two first round picks for Fredd Young, one was a top ten pick the other was a top fifteen I think. This trade happend in 1988. After 1990 Young retired.

3. Traded Andre Rison, Hall of Fame calibre LT Chris Hinton and a bunch of other picks including QB Chris Chandler to Atlanta for ultra talented underachiever Jeff George. George was such a terrible teammate it was rumored his own O-line let pass rushers come free on purpose. Meanwhile Chandler had a very respectable career including leading the Falcons to the Super Bowl in 1998.

4. Colts had the first and second pick overal in the 1992 draft! Unfortunately there was no "can't miss franchise QB." They settled for the two best defensive players in the draft. Both guys crapped out. Steve Emtman was an injury bust. Quinton Coryatt was built like an All-Pro but injuries and a lack of "IT" prevented from ever being anything special. These guys set the Colts defense back ten years!

5. Giving Quinton Coryatt a monster contract after the 1995 season! Our 1995 defense was probably the best Indy Colts defense ever! But within a couple of years, all of those key guys were gone! Bill tobin had no cash left to do anything. Tony Siragusa was let to. He went on to be a key contributor for Baltimore's Super Bowl team. Ashley Ambrose and Ray Buchannon were let go in successive years. Both guys became Pro Bowlers. Ray was a key leader for Atlanta's Super Bowl team. They also let go of pro bowl left tackle Will Woolford!

6. The whole Tarik Glenn/Tony Ugoh thing really hurt the team.

7. Letting Jake Scott and Ryan Lilja go without having compentent talent in place.

8. Going out of their way to make Jim Caldwell the successor to Tony Dungy. Really? I don't recall there being a long line for Caldwell's services. That whole things still baffles me. Last year was a disaster, but if we had an upper tier head coach, I don't think it would have been THAT bad.

9. Drafting Joseph Addai instead of MJD. Polian laments this as one of his greatest regrets. Imagine if Manning had MJD in the backfield with him?!!

10. Drafting Jerry Hughes instead of Roger Saffold was a big mistake.

OJI nailed this one IMO. I totally TOTALLY agree with the Fredd Young one; I might argue against Dickerson being bad because at the time the Colts were a faceless franchise going nowhere, and his arrival suddenly made them relevant in the eyes of many. I was excited thinking maybe, just mabe he and Jeff George will click. A last one that no one remembers was tradiding eithr a #1 or a #2 for Walter Murray who did absolutely nothing for us. If that trade was made today, by comparison Jerry Hughes would be Ring of Honor material.

[SilentHill]

Giving Jim Caldwell the head coaching job.

[NagelHausForge]

Not re-signing Curtis Painter... It cut me... cut me deep... Don't think I will ever get over this betrayal....

[Smonroe]

Wow, with all these setbacks that everyone remembers, it no wonder we were so horrible those last 10 years! I have no experience at being an NFL GM so I'm assuming everyone's comments are spot on.

[BleedBlu8792]

Haydens contract was rediculous.. Polian should have been shot after that deal. 40MIL for an average Cover 2 corner?!? Then the following year give Bethea, who has been a Pro Bowler and injury free, less than Hayden? I'm really surprised Bethea took that and didn't try the market. I think he could have been paid more than he got here.

[Steagles]

Drafting Donald Brown. We could have traded up for Clay Mathews, or drafted Hackeem Nicks, James Lauranaitis, Jarius Byrd, and we could have traded our second for Lesean McCoy.

[OJl]

OJI nailed this one IMO. I totally TOTALLY agree with the Fredd Young one; I might argue against Dickerson being bad because at the time the Colts were a faceless franchise going nowhere, and his arrival suddenly made them relevant in the eyes of many. I was excited thinking maybe, just mabe he and Jeff George will click. A last one that no one remembers was tradiding eithr a #1 or a #2 for Walter Murray who did absolutely nothing for us. If that trade was made today, by comparison Jerry Hughes would be Ring of Honor material.

Thanks Fatboy.

As a kid just falling in love with football when the Dickerson trade went down, I was thrilled with the move at the time. Eric was the best RB in the game and his presence did instantly give us credibility. But I guess in my opinion, in the NFL you want to be either really good or really bad. Dickerson just made us average. As for George and Dickerson being in the backfield together, it was perfect---on paper. Unfortunately Dick cared more about money and George cared more about himself.

[Fx Stryker]

then why did he hire polian? there is a reason he fired himself from gm duties...

Irsay has the final say on the checkbook. He obviously agreed with the amounts.

[lollygagger8]

Na'Polian blaming the O-Line for the Superbowl loss and dismantling it.

[lollygagger8]

HANK BASKETT.

[JoKeR]

Pretending Caldwell was Dungy 2.0 when he wasn't even a competent HC.

[WSO]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

How is it mistreatment?

[GoDeep]

How is it mistreatment?

It's not - see my post above.

[JoKeR]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

I agree we should kept some players like Garçon and Clark( as a 3rd TE ) but the rest just doesn't make sense to me. We mistreated Faulk and James? Even more confussing is how did the Colts mistreat Bob Sanders and Harrison?

[Moose Of Woe]

Na'Polian blaming the O-Line for the Superbowl loss and dismantling it.

It wasn't a very good line after Glenn retired post 2006 Superbowl. After the 2009 Superbowl debacle, once Polian got done with it he made it the worst O-line in football. Even though the O-line was the least of our problems on that particular night.

Major, major setback indeed. He took a poor O-line and made it abysmal.

[BOTT]

Irsay has the final say on the checkbook. He obviously agreed with the amounts.

and he obviously followed the lead of his gm.....that's why he was hired.

[Fx Stryker]

and he obviously followed the lead of his gm.....that's why he was hired.

@JimIrsay If u don't like it buy ur own team and try to make the playoffs 9 seasons n a row n put together 7 straight 12 win seasons n a row as Owner!

Obviously thinks he did more than follow his GM.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

I'll agree letting garcon walk was a bad idea but letting Saturday, Clark, and Addai go were great decisions. All of them were either old or injury prone. And lets be honest Addai is one of the worst backs in the league always hurt averaged crap for yards. we didn't treat marvin harrison like crap, he wanted to much money to return and he was coming off a pretty significant injury. Marshall and James weren't treated badly in my opinion we just decided to move in a different direction which probably wasn't the best one.

[chad72]

My top setback moves some of which that had a repetitive pattern within the organization would be:

1. Introducing nepotism where it could hurt football (Chris Polian and his several moves, including draft moves plus alleged letting go of coaches prematurely etc.).
   
2. Not thinking outside the box when it came to replacing Dungy, wasted a few more good years of Peyton, IMO
   
3. Overpaying for homegrown talent and shunning free agency more often because the Corey Simon and Booger moves did not work out long term (obviously everyone from Irsay to Polians were on board with it)
   

[Poster X]

No Steve Emtman. The guy was the first overall pick in the draft for the Colts, and never made it through half a season.

[FireJimCaldwell]

No Steve Emtman. The guy was the first overall pick in the draft for the Colts, and never made it through half a season.

The drafting of Trevina Alberts has to be on the list as well.

[Superman]

in order...

1. Mistreating of Peyton Manning

2. Mistreating of Marvin Harrison

3. Mistreating of Bob Sanders

4. Mistreating of Marshall Faulk

5. Mistreating of Edgerrin James

6. Letting go of a slew of talented players in 2012 (Garcon, Saturday, Clark, Addai etc.)

there are many more mistreatment of players we did, but these are on the top of my list.

They didn't mistreat any of those guys. Marvin Harrison was offered a reduced salary contract rather than just being released; he refused, and hasn't played football since.

Bob Sanders was made the highest paid safety in NFL history, and then missed 41 of the next 48 games. Keeping him on the roster for so long was the exact opposite of mistreatment.

Edgerrin James was highly overpaid for a year before we let him leave in free agency. And he signed with the Cardinals for far more than he should have been given as an older back who had been playing without breakaway speed for three seasons already.

Letting Garcon walk was a free agency defection. Nothing to do about than other than overpay him, which is the complaint people have about a lot of the free agents we've kept over the years.

Addai is still without a job after failing his physical with the Patriots in camp. How is he talented?

Clark was highly overpaid.

It's as if you expect these players to be coddled and wrapped in silk. Sometimes you make decisions for the good of the team, and it means cutting ties with good people. Many of the moves you're complaining about were a year or two too late. It's amazing that you would refer to any of those players as having been mistreated.

[BOTT]

Obviously thinks he did more than follow his GM.

you're quoting a jim irsay tweet....that's never a good sign. if you wanna argue jimbo was pulling the strings on contracts with guys like hayden and brackett...fine, i'm not going go around and around with you.

[smittywerb]

Mostly picks like Brown over Nicks.

Trading for Tony Ugoh.

Overpaying Peyton Manning.

Giving Kelvin Hayden that contract. Giving Gary Brackett that contract.

Not resigning Lilja, Scott, David Thornton, Cato June.

[BOTT]

Mostly picks like Brown over Nicks.

Trading for Tony Ugoh.

Overpaying Peyton Manning.

Giving Kelvin Hayden that contract. Giving Gary Brackett that contract.

Not resigning Lilja, Scott, David Thornton, Cato June.

cato june?

[Superman]

Mostly picks like Brown over Nicks.

Bad pick.

Trading for Tony Ugoh.

Bad decision.

Overpaying Peyton Manning.

Giving Kelvin Hayden that contract. Giving Gary Brackett that contract.

These are the kinds of deals I hate to see criticized in hindsight. Two players that were playing well at the time, who were good fits for our schemes. I do think Hayden was overpaid a bit, but Brackett's contract wasn't that big, we didn't pay him very much of it, and it will be off the books this year. What hurt more than the contracts were the fact that the players missed a ton of games in the years immediately following the contracts. Bob Sanders goes in that category as well, although he was obviously much better when healthy than either Hayden or Brackett.

Not resigning Lilja, Scott

We resigned Lilja instead of Scott, because Scott wanted more money. He didn't get it; he went to Tennessee for the same money we offered him. I don't blame our front office for that.

What's ironic is that Lilja wound up missing the entire season after we resigned him, then he had a subpar year the next season. And now, we complain about releasing him. He was overpaid, he wasn't playing well, and he had significant injury concerns. I wish we had given Scott a little more and let Lilja walk, but this was a sticky situation.

David Thornton

Kind of agree. But would make a bigger case for Mike Peterson, and maybe even Marcus Washington.

Cato June.

Cato June was awful.

[throwing BBZ]

set us back now? not taking an O Lineman earlier in the draft such as RG and RT while thinking that Mcglynn and Justice were good enough to start for one year (yes I know it was a low level move thats a stop gap but there were better stop gap O Linemen out there and still is)

Keeping Freeney and not spending his Big $$$ in the biggest FA Market ever.

I doubt you know better than Grigson who to sign as stop gap OL. You presume people were willing to come here for the $$$ You would offer. Unknown.