Pass defense / pass rush thread (merge)

[cmgww]

Ok, in the game thread we were screaming at why Manusky had us in he soft zone all night. First, remember that Vontae Davis is not nearly 100%. He didn't practice this week and probably gutted that game out. Secondly, yes Toler was terrible. But it was also his first game action since August, and first non preseason action since the AFCC. Rusty! Manusky knew it, IMO, thus the soft zone. But he saved the best for last. One that last INT, he dialed up man press and Hoyer had nowhere to throw. Pick, game over.

Given the short week and the guys as banged up as they are, let's just be happy we got the win. Now we have 10 days to ice up and dial up the pressure against NE

[Colttodd18]

Great point. I just wish we could have gotten more pressure up front. Mathis and Newsome were non factors pass rushing.

[lennymoore24]

I don't know... i know we have had injuries in the secondary this year, but every QB we have played has looked like Joe Montana taking our defense apart.  All time greats like Tyrod Taylor and Brian Hoyer included.  No pass rush, no coverage.  I get a feeling the NE game will be ugly.

[Malakai432]

Ok, in the game thread we were screaming at why Manusky had us in he soft zone all night. First, remember that Vontae Davis is not nearly 100%. He didn't practice this week and probably gutted that game out. Secondly, yes Toler was terrible. But it was also his first game action since August, and first non preseason action since the AFCC. Rusty! Manusky knew it, IMO, thus the soft zone. But he saved the best for last. One that last INT, he dialed up man press and Hoyer had nowhere to throw. Pick, game over.

Given the short week and the guys as banged up as they are, let's just be happy we got the win. Now we have 10 days to ice up and dial up the pressure against NE

 

10 Days of rest is going to really help this D out, hopefully!  I think they're still banged up, Anderson, Vontae, Toler needs to get back in the grove, Mathis is still continuing to find his grove also.  I'm kind of worried about the backfield, but they have plenty of time to improve. 

[achcolts]

I don't know... i know we have had injuries in the secondary this year, but every QB we have played has looked like Joe Montana taking our defense apart.  All time greats like Tyrod Taylor and Brian Hoyer included.  No pass rush, no coverage.  I get a feeling the NE game will be ugly.

 

and the ironic part is they prob wont have to use their joe montana..

[John Waylon]

Toler is usually borderline terrible no matter how much he's recently played...

[Bluefire4]

We have to have tight coverage next week. Maybe Mathis lights it up next week like AJ lit it up today. But so far we have no pass rush. Walden is a step too slow, Cole always falls when he's near the quarterback, and Newsome is invisible. 

[JWF]

No pass rush and soft coverage will result in those types of numbers. Im glad we won and are leading the division but man it gets old seeing the same things on defense over and over. We havnt been able to stop competent passing teams for about 2 seasons now. Its crazy because now we are letting bad passing teams look good. 

[VaAllDay757]

More press coverage you can get better results that soft coverage is killing the defense

[cmgww]

I'm not trying to be condescending here...but what part of "Manuskys hands have been tied" do people not get? All season he has had a makeshift secondary. Even this game the starters were finally back but not at full speed. Butler is bad on the outside, let alone in press. He had street guys pplaying the past few weeks. We will play more press when the guys are back to full tilt. And they should be in 10 days. But to date he hasn't been able to press a lot.

[Jim H.]

Toler is usually borderline terrible no matter how much he's recently played...

Yes, but his hairstyling is stunning.

[JColts72]

Pillsbury dough soft may be tougher. Gave up 14 points with blown coverage and that heave by Hoyer with about 5 Colts players arond doing nothing. A win is a win., but giving up 350 yeards to Hoyer is no laughing matter. 

[spartancolt]

Great point. I just wish we could have gotten more pressure up front. Mathis and Newsome were non factors pass rushing.

maybe Sio can give a rib shot hit on Brady. Lol jk

[BlueStallion]

That soft zone coverage over the past five games has been a consistently bad joke with no punchline.  It's exasperating to watch opposing receivers run wide open down the field and catch the ball unchallenged.  I recall several plays where there were NO Colts defenders within camera view around the Texans receiver at the moment he caught the ball.

 

With the exception of the hit on Hoyer that caused the interception at the end of the game, the lack of any Colts pass rush allowed both Texans QBs to sit in the pocket and take their sweet time going through their progressions.  Any bad QB on any bad team can look like a Hall-of-Famer when given that much time with no duress.  Imagine what a good QB like Peyton, or Brees, or Brady can do against the Colts' soft zone.

 

The Hail Mary play with one second left before halftime was inexcusable.  The Colts 'rushed' one DL against five blockers until two LBs joined in way late.  Hoyer just dropped back and stood there for four seconds, waiting patiently for his receivers to reach the end zone before he launched the ball.  What kind of defense is that?  It didn't stop anything.

[theanarchist]

This team is starting to look like the Colts defense of 1998-2001. No pass rush. No coverage.

 

I realize we have injuries. But It's getting tiresome watching our defense make the below average NFL QB's look like Joe Montana's. High completion percentages and the passing yards pile up.

 

It starts up front. No real threat of a pass rush. Last night the Texans QB's had a clean pocket and plenty of time to find receivers running free.

 

On the back end, I know we have had Davis playing hurt and Toler just returning from injury. It was obvious Toler hadn't played in a while. His boxing out of our other DB's on the hailmary was real nice too. I didn't get a real good look at that but how does he end up face to face with our own players and back to the ball?? Frustrating.

 

Newsome has not done anything this year as a pass rusher. Mathis was getting manhandled when he was in there last night. Trent Cole? I didnt like that signing from the beginning and he hasn't shown that he has much left in his tank either. We need an edge rusher or this season will end in major disappontment. If we don't pressure Brady any better than we pressured Mallet or Hoyer last night the Patriots will hang 60 on us.

[will426]

Mathis was held a lot tbh but outside walden Mathis and the ilb the other linebackers get no pressure

[TheRustonRifle#7]

The pass rush has been virtually non existent....hopefully Mathis and Cole can get something going moving forward? I like what I see from Sio in that regards as well, maybe better utilization of him would help as well?

[Smonroe]

I'm not trying to be condescending here...but what part of "Manuskys hands have been tied" do people not get? All season he has had a makeshift secondary. Even this game the starters were finally back but not at full speed. Butler is bad on the outside, let alone in press. He had street guys pplaying the past few weeks. We will play more press when the guys are back to full tilt. And they should be in 10 days. But to date he hasn't been able to press a lot.

 

Not to mention that both of the Texans TDs were sort of flukes.  The first one never should happen, but Toler did a great job of clearing the coverage for Strong.

 

The second one was pure blown coverage. 

 

So, looking at it that way, the D scheme was really well done.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

I'm not trying to be condescending here...but what part of "Manuskys hands have been tied" do people not get? All season he has had a makeshift secondary. Even this game the starters were finally back but not at full speed. Butler is bad on the outside, let alone in press. He had street guys pplaying the past few weeks. We will play more press when the guys are back to full tilt. And they should be in 10 days. But to date he hasn't been able to press a lot.

 

Yeah, I don't understand it, you'd think it'd be obvious. The injuries to the secondary have been covered in multiple threads.

[John Waylon]

Yes, but his hairstyling is stunning.

With what we're paying him it should be.

[12isthenew18]

vontae playing when he is hurt, toler shouldn'y be playing etc

[BlueStallion]

Mods, merge with "The soft zone..." thread?  Same topic.

[will426]

Sio can play olb and ilb I'd take out the others on specific downs and have him rush the passer

[coltsfanatic24]

It starts with the pass rush. Hoyer had all day to throw. Not many CBs can cover for that long. We need an elite pass rusher.

[Defjamz26]

Toler got worked by Hopkins. I feel like the coaches didn't want Vontae on Hopkins because he wasn't 100. But that was just a bad game for Toler. He was also one of the DBs who had his back turned during the Hail Mary TD to end the half.

[Coffeedrinker]

I was getting ready to post the same thing.  It can't all be blamed on the pass rush, although that is part of it but, my word, receivers are are open by 10 yards.  Butler is not playing well, Davis can only cover one guy, Toler played well for his first game back (other than taking out the other DBs on the hail mary at the end of the half).  The safeties are either being told to play a chase position or they are reading the wrongs things and getting out of position.

[Detectacon]

What I am worried about is this defense next week. The coaches going to over-prepare for the gun because of the last two games against the pats. The Hoodie isn't stupid. He knows our coverage is soft and we have no pass rush. He is going to hit Edelman all over the field on short plays. 

[Narcosys]

I've never liked Tolers' play. And when he takes out 4 other teammates, i don't want him on the field at all anymore.

[Old Colt]

It starts with the pass rush. Hoyer had all day to throw. Not many CBs can cover for that long. We need an elite pass rusher.

Pass rush, or lack of, did not give up the Hail Mary at the end of the half and did not blow the coverage to give up the TD in 2nd half.... NO ONE in the secondary was even looking at Strong...  pass rush was poor, but the secondary was just as bad.... both deserve a D- or F at best!

[Valpo2004]

I think a consistent pass rush would fix a lot of problems on defense at this point.

 

The trick is finding that without losing our ability to stop the run.

[John Waylon]

We've gotta come up with some kind of answer quickly, we're heading into a pretty brutal stretch for this kind of play.

[Tyler Shaw]

We need someone that can rush the passer. It was horrible to watch.

[Defjamz26]

I think a consistent pass rush would fix a lot of problems on defense at this point.

The trick is finding that without losing our ability to stop the run.

I don't think that's possible this year. We just don't have the talent there. Can't blame Mathis, he's doing about as much as you can expect being 30+ and coming off an Achilles tear. Cole is mediocre, Newsome is ineffective and Walden is primarily an edge setter.

Might have to wait until 2016

[Tyler Shaw]

We need someone that can rush the passer. It was horrible to watch. Newsome is taking a step back. He seems to be letting up. Mathis couldn't beat the left tackle.

[BigQandTheManiac]

Toler got worked by Hopkins. I feel like the coaches didn't want Vontae on Hopkins because he wasn't 100. But that was just a bad game for Toler. He was also one of the DBs who had his back turned during the Hail Mary TD to end the half.

I was getting ready to post the same thing.  It can't all be blamed on the pass rush, although that is part of it but, my word, receivers are are open by 10 yards.  Butler is not playing well, Davis can only cover one guy, Toler played well for his first game back (other than taking out the other DBs on the hail mary at the end of the half).  The safeties are either being told to play a chase position or they are reading the wrongs things and getting out of position.

Davis hasn't been playing well all season either.

[lollygagger8]

I've never been a Toler fan, but I think we can all agree that facing backwards and taking out 4-5 team mates allowing for the Texans to complete a hail mary is completely inexcusable. 

[RollerColt]

The one thing our pass defense did right last night, was to stay patient. In the end, it paid off big thanks to Mike Adams and Walden.

[JColts72]

We need someone that can rush the passer. It was horrible to watch.

Was Cole out again? or just invisible? That FA move is not working out.

[Smash Mouth]

The Colts are an awful zone pass defensive team.  The LBs can't  get the depth necessary nor get to the flats.  I cringe every time I see a 3-man pass rush because I know that no one is getting home and we're giving up something down the field.

 

How * must Bill O'Brien be - Hoyer had all day on the interception.  Walden covers the RB heading into the flat, then decides to go after Hoyer.  Hoyer completely panics and throws that ball up for grabs. Hoyer did get hammered by Walden though

[theanarchist]

Was Cole out again? or just invisible? That FA move is not working out.

He played some. Not sure how many snaps he got but he did play