Jump to content
Indianapolis Colts
Indianapolis Colts Fan Forum

DeflateGate: Brady suspension expected (mega merge / updated)

HtownColt

By HtownColt
in NFL General

 Share

Recommended Posts

basspapaw Walk On

basspapaw

Posted
Posted

Hard to put a lot of stock in NFL "reports" given their track record and the fact that this report is completely circumstantial and speculative.

I guess I should give you props for showing up but you have to be kidding, You still dont believe your team cheated again, It looks like they have done it for a long time and your boy who should be banned from the HOF LIED about it. Give it up, have some dignity your team doesnt.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 2.8k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Posted Images

bestQBever Team Captain

bestQBever

Posted
Posted

The long-awaited Ted Wells report is in, and we have had plenty of time to read the details of the investigation. A lot of people are debating the wording of "More probable then not", but those are the NFL's words, not Ted's. According to the NFL rules, if the violation is "More probable then not", then sanctions will be issued.

 

So essentially, the report says that Tom Brady, Jim McNally, and John Jastremski should be subject to NFL punishment. Troy Vincent, as reported, will "hand down" any and all punishment, Roger Goodell will not be directly involved.

 

So after I read the entire report (skipped the scientific study at the end), here's my best guess:

 

McNally and Jastremski: Both will be gone, never to work for an NFL team again, probably banned from even attending the games. Will likely be hit by fines, but on a smaller scale. It will be easy to "banish" these guys, considering the fans don't pay to see the equipment managers.

 

Robert Kraft/Patriots Organization: The report suggests that the Patriots organization withheld McNally from a follow-up interview, and this was a violation of the league's investigation rules. They were not "fully cooperating" with the investigation, and even withheld the identity of "Jastremski's Friend." This is probably good enough for a $100,000 fine, paid by Robert Kraft. I don't believe a draft pick should be forfeited, and Kraft should not be suspended.

 

Bill Belichick: There's no evidence that ties Belichick to this, he will probably not get fined, or suspended.

 

Tom Brady: This is the hardest one to pinpoint, because at this point, 'deflating footballs' is not his only violation. On my count we got:

 

o Conspiracy to circumvent the rules, along with McNally and Jastremski.

 

 

o Withheld cell phone records from investigators, not "fully cooperating" with their efforts.

 

 

o Lied to Head Coach Bill Belichick, denying any involvement.

 

 

o Lied to the press, in his press conferences regarding the controversy in the days leading up to the Superbowl.

 

 

o Lied to the investigators, claiming that he did not know McNally before the AFCCG, while Jastremski's account directly contradicts Brady's claims. Several of Tom's claims made to the investigators directly contradicted what he said during the press conferences.

 

 

o By repeatedly denying involvement, he forced the NFL to bring in an independent investigating team. That investigation took over three months, cost the NFL several thousands (or millions) of dollars. The whole time the investigation went on, speculation and the image of a "cheating champion" stained a league that has hit an all-time low from a PR perspective. This would certainly qualify as "conduct detrimental to the league", which got Greg Hardy a 10-game ban.

 

So this is what I would propose.

 

$100,000 fine, paid by Tom Brady ("Conspiring" and insisting on using deflated, non-approved footballs)

Unpaid Suspension, 6 Games (For violating the "integrity of the game" in regards to Rule 2, Section 1)

Consecutive Unpaid Suspension, 10 Games (For "conduct detrimental to the league", his deceit led to a costly and time-consuming investigation that makes the league look awful. The fact that your World Champion is a "cheater" is something some fans can't get past, and suggests to young fans that "cheaters" will, in fact, prosper.)

 

Out for an entire season, eligible for return in 2016 season would send the message. And you factor in that he lied to Belichick, and by proxy, lied to Robert Kraft...it's possible we have seen the last of Tom Brady as a New England Patriot. 

 

What do you think? Would these sanctions be appropriate? Too light, too heavy?

I'm conflicted. As much as I would love to see Brady get suspended the whole year, if/ when we beat them, the pats will have an excuse.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
NewColtsFan Ring of Honor

NewColtsFan

Posted
Posted

Pretty good break down of the report here and why the "evidence" against Brady is weak, http://boston.cbslocal.com/2015/05/06/hurley-wells-report-doesnt-have-enough-information-to-condemn-tom-brady/

 

Wow....

 

A Boston TV station with a story saying in their judgement,  the "evidence" is weak.....   WHAT A SURPRISE!!

 

The odds were virtually 100 percent of this happening.

 

Please feel free to check-out ESPN,  where there are about 3-4 separate stories saying the evidence is pretty damning against Brady.....   and the only reason it's not even WORSE for Brady is that he didn't cooperate with the investigation.

 

By the way,  you keep saying in post after post about how the evidence is "circumstantial and suspect..."

 

The problem is,  according to Polian,  the NFL voted in to it's own laws years and years ago that they'd be going by a "preponderance of the evidence" in cases like this....   which basically mean's something more than 50 percent.

 

So,  it's the NFL laws that are convicting Brady not Goodell....     this isn't something new done to mess with New England or Brady.     It's right there in the NFL by-laws....

 

But here is just one story about how damning the evidence is....   but feel free to visit ESPN.   these stories are NOT premium.  They're there for anyone to read.....    even Patriots fans....

 

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12834679/tom-brady-sacked-never-deflategate-findings

Link to comment
Share on other sites
AndreRison Walk On

AndreRison

Posted
Posted

Brady will be suspended at least 6 games.

People are acting like this is no big deal. There is no way Brady gets less games than the bountygate players. Brady single handedly tarnished the validity of the entire 2014 season in the NFL, and went on trying to cover it up.

Anybody saying otherwise, come back to this thread when punishment is handed out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
basspapaw Walk On

basspapaw

Posted
Posted

The HOF ban is awesome basspawpa

Thanks Ive been waiting for this day for three months ,To bad i had to work earlier or id have been slinging it all day! Really by all rights they should replay the afccg between colts and ravens  then the superbowl!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
basspapaw Walk On

basspapaw

Posted
Posted

I think you're spot on. It's sad that a player so highly regarded decided to cheat and cover it up.

But everyone (with half a brain) new they did it and the reason we new they cheated was because the pats cheated before and will probably again,The folks that continue to deny the truth are probably liars and cheats too. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
DoubleE Colt Active Roster

DoubleE Colt

Posted
Posted

It's poor old BB I feel sorry for the most in all this. Fancy being such a renowned control freak as him and obviously having absolutely not even the slightest idea what your star QB is up too!!!! Seriously though is anyone really buying that! I think BB is just smarter at covering his tracks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
AndreRison Walk On

AndreRison

Posted
Posted

A lot of the media is trying to downplay the cheating and cover up... Costas is calling it gamesmanship. The media is extreme when it comes to other players, but somehow Brady's getting a pass for his involvement in a conspiracy to cheat. I really don't understand the double standard.

It doesn't matter, though. The other owners are gonna want major punishment. So, he will be suspended at least 6 games.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
basspapaw Walk On

basspapaw

Posted
Posted

I hope with all my being he gets a year ,It makes me mad that  thinks he can get away with it, as a person he does not deserve any special treatment  he puts his pants on one leg at a time just like everyone else , The gull this cheater has is just not fathomable ,and all the brady lovers are just as full of#### as he is .  Cheater cheater cheater cheater cheater cheater cheater cheater cheater Cheater  wait, cheater, one more CHEATER Im feeling better cheat  errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

 ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Im a new man.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Buck Showalter Walk On

Buck Showalter

Posted
Posted

How many games did Irsay get, 6 games?

I was thinking about Irsay and other players recent, "transgressions" too with this, and how it might relate in terms of cosiderirng what "fair" or equitable punishment should be, but I don't think there is any precedent, as no one single player has been identified with "tampering" or "compromising" the rules of the game quite like this case, and it looks worse on Brady as it is not his teams first offense ... so 6 games could be about right...

It's apples to oranges really in comparison to Irsay's issues, as they were medical/legal issues, and non-game related, plus there was no type of cover up, Jimmy admitted himself directly into rehab, etc. etc.

anyways it is all a moot point as Jimmy's problem was non-game related, but he still served his disciplinary action as he is an owner and held to a higher level, etc, etc..

anyways...

It'll be interesting to see what goes down, and I'll find is almost as interesting  WHEN, Goodell decides to do something abouteth...

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Eagle FL Walk On

Eagle FL

Posted
Posted

Yall got dragged though a litteral % storm when people from this organization called out the pats.Brady not only lied to the media and public in general but mostly he lied to you guys, his accuser. If Brady gets anything less then a suspension, something in indy is going to burn.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Chucklez Team Captain

Chucklez

Posted
Posted

1,2,3,4.....Asterisks**** :)

 

I don't think the Patriots needed the air to come out of the ball to beat the Colts but it is a shame that it happened that way. Now the air is out of their high flying balloons, too bad.

I think the problem lies more in the fact that:

 

A) They have tarnished the integrity of the game.

B) The patriots organisation denied ALL KNOWLEDGE of any wrong doing, further tarnishing the games image, and their own.

C) Tom Brady himself was directly asked on multiple occasions and flat out lied to everyone.

D) The Patriots have previous for this type of activity and clearly didnt learn anything from their last punishment...

 

If there isn't some serious recourse for this, it would be so unfair.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
chrisfarley Practice Squad

chrisfarley

Posted
Posted

so are they guilty or not? I find this so annoying by them leaving so many holes in the investigation.  with brady having all his lawyer "dream team" and agent present, he would not hand over all the evidence (texts, cell phone, etc).  THIS IS LIKE DRIVING IN FOG.  Nice job Wells (FAIL), make the Colts look bad, exonerate the guilty PATS, and now go on vacation so no one can ask you questions.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bababooey Walk On

bababooey

Posted
Posted

so are they guilty or not? I find this so annoying by them leaving so many holes in the investigation. with brady having all his lawyer "dream team" and agent present, he would not hand over all the evidence (texts, cell phone, etc). THIS IS LIKE DRIVING IN FOG. Nice job Wells (FAIL), make the Colts look bad, exonerate the guilty PATS, and now go on vacation so no one can ask you questions.

Ummmm.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ColtsBlueFL Team Captain

ColtsBlueFL

Posted
Posted
{snipped good analysis}

 

So this is what I would propose.

 

$100,000 fine, paid by Tom Brady ("Conspiring" and insisting on using deflated, non-approved footballs)

Unpaid Suspension, 6 Games (For violating the "integrity of the game" in regards to Rule 2, Section 1)

Consecutive Unpaid Suspension, 10 Games (For "conduct detrimental to the league", his deceit led to a costly and time-consuming investigation that makes the league look awful. The fact that your World Champion is a "cheater" is something some fans can't get past, and suggests to young fans that "cheaters" will, in fact, prosper.)

 

Out for an entire season, eligible for return in 2016 season would send the message. And you factor in that he lied to Belichick, and by proxy, lied to Robert Kraft...it's possible we have seen the last of Tom Brady as a New England Patriot. 

 

What do you think? Would these sanctions be appropriate? Too light, too heavy?

 

Too heavy. 

 

My main reason was burden of proof was minimal  -  50.1% tips the scales and wins the case,  There's not enough evidence there to claim he was guilty by Clear and Concise evidence, and no where near the Beyond any Reasonable doubt standard.  IMO, since the burden of proof was the minimum necessary to convict, the punishment should likewise be commiserate, thus minimal.

 

I've been in the 3 game group from early on.  1 game for the violation, 1 each for lying to fans/media (press conference) and one for lying to league/investigators.  I expect Troy Vincent wants to come down hard, but lack of hard evidence lessens his backing to do so.  No mmore than 4 is likely.

 

$100,000 fine seems right.

 

As far as not surrendering the phone, the NFL is not the police/government agency.  Tom and Giselle are stars.  The NFL couldn't keep all the 'non NFL' items on Tom's phone securely locked away from a leak and thus huge public consumption.  Don't blame Tom for refusing to hand over his whole life to the NFL for a few Text message that would apply to the investigation.  The consequences of handing it over could potentially be worse than not, IMO.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ÅÐØNϧ 1 Practice Squad

ÅÐØNϧ 1

Posted
Posted

so are they guilty or not? I find this so annoying by them leaving so many holes in the investigation.  with brady having all his lawyer "dream team" and agent present, he would not hand over all the evidence (texts, cell phone, etc).  THIS IS LIKE DRIVING IN FOG.  Nice job Wells (FAIL), make the Colts look bad, exonerate the guilty PATS, and now go on vacation so no one can ask you questions.  

 

The Patriots are not exonerated - Ignorance is not a defense the falcons had a excessive crowd noise issue that ownership while clueless was held responsible for plus

 

In the past repeat offenders receive harsher punishments plus neither the Patriot organization or Tom Brady cooperated 100% IMO .

 

Loss of a first rd pick in 2016 - 2-4 game suspension for Tom Brady & 1 million dollar fine for the organization is a possibility .

 

Its not the crime but the cover up the Patriot Organization are like Nixon I am not a crook , In my opinion the Roger Goodell in Nov stated The Patriots since 2000 have been cheating its time he put a stop to it once & for all..

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ÅÐØNϧ 1 Practice Squad

ÅÐØNϧ 1

Posted
Posted

Yall got dragged though a litteral % storm when people from this organization called out the pats.Brady not only lied to the media and public in general but mostly he lied to you guys, his accuser. If Brady gets anything less then a suspension, something in indy is going to burn.

 

Yeah somethings gonna burn alright - My wifes cooking its an annual event . 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ÅÐØNϧ 1 Practice Squad

ÅÐØNϧ 1

Posted
Posted

you can say don't condone it, but your words in your other posts say other wise.

Rule number 1 in life...everyone lies. I agree whole heartedly in that.

But I do not buy that he should get off just because he was scared he might get suspended for the super bowl.

Actions have consequences, as does lying, does it happen a lot, yes. Is it right no, when you get caught, if you tell a lie, eventually it'll unravel...

I'd let brady off on the lie if it wasn't for one other thing.....

Brday paid these people off To get them to knowingly violate league rules.... Forget a white lie, that's corruption and he's lucky I'm not the commissioner, cause if i was, it'd be a life time ban and stripped of the mvp title. This is worse than what Pete rose did by far. This is conspiring, corruption and cheating that directly impacts the game Of football.

And I'd say the same thing if Manning or Luck or any other player got caught in something like this

 

Rule number 1 in life...everyone lies. I agree whole heartedly in that.

 

 

 

Stupid people lie -  As a person accused of lying by a fellow poster this week I take exception , I will point out that not every one lies or feels the need .

 

I will change the subject or ignore something or filibuster a lil In my life I learned at a young age thanks to my grandparents that no one likes a liar or thief & considering i was both as a child I have spent the rest of my life living by what I was taught .

 

I allow people to prove themselves my bull detector is generally pretty good .

 

for instance I had over the years built up a ton of respect for Tom Brady I thought he was a decent fellow but I now realize his moral compass is broke & he is a liar at the least in a world where the Hoodie was always protrayed as the bad guy Tom Brady has proved hes no better .

Link to comment
Share on other sites
csmopar Ring of Honor

csmopar

Posted
Posted

The long-awaited Ted Wells report is in, and we have had plenty of time to read the details of the investigation. A lot of people are debating the wording of "More probable then not", but those are the NFL's words, not Ted's. According to the NFL rules, if the violation is "More probable then not", then sanctions will be issued.

 

So essentially, the report says that Tom Brady, Jim McNally, and John Jastremski should be subject to NFL punishment. Troy Vincent, as reported, will "hand down" any and all punishment, Roger Goodell will not be directly involved.

 

So after I read the entire report (skipped the scientific study at the end), here's my best guess:

 

McNally and Jastremski: Both will be gone, never to work for an NFL team again, probably banned from even attending the games. Will likely be hit by fines, but on a smaller scale. It will be easy to "banish" these guys, considering the fans don't pay to see the equipment managers.

 

Robert Kraft/Patriots Organization: The report suggests that the Patriots organization withheld McNally from a follow-up interview, and this was a violation of the league's investigation rules. They were not "fully cooperating" with the investigation, and even withheld the identity of "Jastremski's Friend." This is probably good enough for a $100,000 fine, paid by Robert Kraft. I don't believe a draft pick should be forfeited, and Kraft should not be suspended.

 

Bill Belichick: There's no evidence that ties Belichick to this, he will probably not get fined, or suspended.

 

Tom Brady: This is the hardest one to pinpoint, because at this point, 'deflating footballs' is not his only violation. On my count we got:

 

o Conspiracy to circumvent the rules, along with McNally and Jastremski.

 

 

o Withheld cell phone records from investigators, not "fully cooperating" with their efforts.

 

 

o Lied to Head Coach Bill Belichick, denying any involvement.

 

 

o Lied to the press, in his press conferences regarding the controversy in the days leading up to the Superbowl.

 

 

o Lied to the investigators, claiming that he did not know McNally before the AFCCG, while Jastremski's account directly contradicts Brady's claims. Several of Tom's claims made to the investigators directly contradicted what he said during the press conferences.

 

 

o By repeatedly denying involvement, he forced the NFL to bring in an independent investigating team. That investigation took over three months, cost the NFL several thousands (or millions) of dollars. The whole time the investigation went on, speculation and the image of a "cheating champion" stained a league that has hit an all-time low from a PR perspective. This would certainly qualify as "conduct detrimental to the league", which got Greg Hardy a 10-game ban.

 

So this is what I would propose.

 

$100,000 fine, paid by Tom Brady ("Conspiring" and insisting on using deflated, non-approved footballs)

Unpaid Suspension, 6 Games (For violating the "integrity of the game" in regards to Rule 2, Section 1)

Consecutive Unpaid Suspension, 10 Games (For "conduct detrimental to the league", his deceit led to a costly and time-consuming investigation that makes the league look awful. The fact that your World Champion is a "cheater" is something some fans can't get past, and suggests to young fans that "cheaters" will, in fact, prosper.)

 

Out for an entire season, eligible for return in 2016 season would send the message. And you factor in that he lied to Belichick, and by proxy, lied to Robert Kraft...it's possible we have seen the last of Tom Brady as a New England Patriot. 

 

What do you think? Would these sanctions be appropriate? Too light, too heavy?

 

 

That actually sounds quite fair.....in my opinion. Course, I'd be all for a life time ban for Brady and the pete rose treatment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
ricker182 Walk On

ricker182

Posted
Posted

It's poor old BB I feel sorry for the most in all this. Fancy being such a renowned control freak as him and obviously having absolutely not even the slightest idea what your star QB is up too!!!! Seriously though is anyone really buying that! I think BB is just smarter at covering his tracks.

Nobody in that building can sneeze without BB knowing.

It's doubtful he didn't know what was going on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
radiogirl Walk On

radiogirl

Posted
Posted

Stupid people lie -  As a person accused of lying by a fellow poster this week I take exception , I will point out that not every one lies or feels the need .

 

I will change the subject or ignore something or filibuster a lil In my life I learned at a young age thanks to my grandparents that no one likes a liar or thief & considering i was both as a child I have spent the rest of my life living by what I was taught .

 

I allow people to prove themselves my bull detector is generally pretty good .

 

for instance I had over the years built up a ton of respect for Tom Brady I thought he was a decent fellow but I now realize his moral compass is broke & he is a liar at the least in a world where the Hoodie was always protrayed as the bad guy Tom Brady has proved hes no better .

Regardless of the circumstances and anyone's take on any of this report.  Liars and cheater suck.  True story.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
csmopar Ring of Honor

csmopar

Posted
Posted

Man, the media trying to sling false crap now. Mike Florio on PFT just posted an article claiming that in the report, it says 3 of the 4 Colts footballs were under the 12.5 psi as well....Now I'm up to page 178 of the report thus far....I've not found that anywhere.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...