Sources: Make or Break Year for HC Chuck Pagano

[jmac_48]

Although the goal of every team in the league is to get to and win the Super Bowl,

I am not sure the whole "Super Bowl or Bust" mindset is a healthy approach.

 

If Pagano et. al. can achieve the original said goals of "Run the Ball" and "Stop the Run"

and show marked progress as a team that would be a solid achievement.

 

Win it all or you are gone is not a good way to build a team, it puts too much pressure all around.

Yeah, the blowouts are hard to take, and I want to see better it's just not a sane approach.

 

Pagano's head is on the line this year, but I'm not sure if this team has to win it all to save his job.

BIG progress as a team, especially on the D, will suffice.

Except for a few games I like what the man has done for this team.

Progress not Perfection.

[SilentHill]

I think at the very least, this is Manusky's final year. If we do get BTFO by New England again, I could see Manusky getting scapegoated. 

 

scapegoat really isn't the word I'd use.

[BrentMc11]

I'm going to need to buy a vowel???

That's a cop out...and a waste of money.  

[PuntersArePeopleToo]

@greggrosenthal 22s22 seconds ago

Pagano reminds me a little of Brian Billick in Baltimore. Lots of wins but “his” side of the ball never gets better.

The thing is though that Pagano has done wonders with our DBs which is what he was a coach for not dline which is where we are bad. If we could get a new dc that came from dline background then our d could be really good

[Restored]

Some things to note here:

 

1. I don't want Jim Harbaugh. While he is a good coach and has had success, he always seems to wear our his welcome fairly quickly wherever he's been. It's not necessarily a knock against him, it's just how his personality is based upon what's been said about him over the years.

 

2. The lack of defensive success thus far must fall on his shoulders as much as it does Grigson's. Grigson has preached non-stop about building the offensive and defensive lines but has had very little success in bringing in players that make a lasting impact. Now, some of that has been to injuries but overall, it's been a disappointment thus far.

 

3. On the other side of the ball, the main issue has been getting Andrew Luck a true weapon outside of TY and lack of running success. I'm not sure this can exactly fall on Pagano. They simply haven't had the outside weapon (until this year with Andre Johnson) nor the RB (Frank Gore changes this as well) to really make the Colts offense balanced in the way it needs to be. This year could see a change in that.

 

4. Like the saying goes, "It's sometimes better to stick it out with the devil you know then go looking for the angel you don't". While I'm sure there will be a boatload of coordinators and the like avaliable come end of this year, it may not exactly best for the Colts to shake up what they already have in place. There are plenty of teams that would be fine with the progress the Colts have made in such a short amount of time after a rebuild.

[BrentMc11]

We still need big time help up front and in the secondary fr us to shine against the run.

 

This is not Pagano's last year.  If anything he would resign to an office job.  The atmosphere of the Colts TEAM is as good as any Family in football.

[BrentMc11]

The thing is though that Pagano has done wonders with our DBs which is what he was a coach for not dline which is where we are bad. If we could get a new dc that came from dline background then our d could be really good

Emmanual is a great teacher of the DL...ask Cliff Avril and Ryan Kerrigan.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

I got a few coaches in mind I like if this actually happens HOWEVER if this does happen I think our HC will be right on the staff already...Chud

That's what I'm afraid of.

[amfootball]

What is the judging stick for Pagano? He just made the AFCCG. Does he have to win the SB to keep his job? That seems extreme.

[csmopar]

See just talking about the Colts being on hard knocks causes drama...

Seriously though,

I don't like this talk about Pagano having a make or break year. Especially when right now, we have the chemistry I think to win it all. Plus only an * would fire a coach who's gone 11-5 and improved in the playoffs each time Over the past 2 years. I don't count the first year since Bruce was coaching that team.

[TKnight24]

What is the judging stick for Pagano? He just made the AFCCG. Does he have to win the SB to keep his job? That seems extreme.

Beating your I'd imagine

Haven't won since Andrew came into the league and all losses have been blowouts

So if he beats NE, guess they'd bring him back. Which I understand. Losing to the same team is rather concerning, and also depressing

[csmopar]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000481648/article/colts-not-expected-to-extend-chuck-pagano-before-season

Sounds more like a money motivated move

[amfootball]

Beating your I'd imagine

Haven't won since Andrew came into the league and all losses have been blowouts

So if he beats NE, guess they'd bring him back. Which I understand. Losing to the same team is rather concerning, and also depressing

That seems like an even worse barometer if true. What if the Pats are just a more talented team as was the case last year? I get the not wanting to be blown out but what about beating Denver in Denver in the playoffs? I would think that type of win would buy him an extension.

[Nobody]

Some things to note here:

1. I don't want Jim Harbaugh. While he is a good coach and has had success, he always seems to wear our his welcome fairly quickly wherever he's been. It's not necessarily a knock against him, it's just how his personality is based upon what's been said about him over the years.

This is just flat wrong. The only place he was accused of wearing out his welcome was San Francisco, which turned out to be entirely fabricated by the *ic front office. The players adored him in SF, they've all said this. It was the worst owner in the league (except maybe Snyder?) creating a reason to get rid of a successful coach because Jed wanted full control.

[throwing BBZ]

 All the coaches and the GM have something to prove.
 Our Division is not going to remain the cakewalk it has been.

 Our young guys are going to have to show something this season.

[SilentHill]

What is the judging stick for Pagano? He just made the AFCCG. Does he have to win the SB to keep his job? That seems extreme.

 

When you are the owner of the team, and you see the talent you have, I'd have to imagine that he thinks this team under achieved.

[throwing BBZ]

That seems like an even worse barometer if true. What if the Pats are just a more talented team as was the case last year? I get the not wanting to be blown out but what about beating Denver in Denver in the playoffs? I would think that type of win would buy him an extension.

 

 Denver played without  a QB. Like Cincinnati played without any offensive weapons or the middle of their defense. Gift games.

[lollygagger8]

[TKnight24]

That seems like an even worse barometer if true. What if the Pats are just a more talented team as was the case last year? I get the not wanting to be blown out but what about beating Denver in Denver in the playoffs? I would think that type of win would buy him an extension.

We beat a crippled Peyton, good win but healthy Peyton wins that game. 2 turnovers that weren't capitalized on and 3 over throws of Sanders who beat Greg Toler a few times in that game

Was a good win, but luck of the draw really. Would've been eliminated in the divisional round if we played any other team that week like Pit..... maybe Bal but we beat them earlier in the year so maybe we could've beat them again

[TKnight24]

If you're referring to the thread title I only put one source cause I was calling myself being considerate to the forum by picking a "known" NFL person in Ian

[amfootball]

We beat a crippled Peyton, good win but healthy Peyton wins that game. 2 turnovers that weren't capitalized on and 3 over throws of Sanders who beat Greg Toler a few times in that game

Was a good win, but luck of the draw really. Would've been eliminated in the divisional round if we played any other team that week like Pit..... maybe Bal but we beat them earlier in the year so maybe we could've beat them again

I guess you can look at that way but is that worthy of a coach firing? I mean Lewis hasn't won a playoff game yet and he is still going ...

[TKnight24]

I guess you can look at that way but is that worthy of a coach firing? I mean Lewis hasn't won a playoff game yet and he is still going ...

Yeah, true. But each owner is different. Bengals are really just Andy Dalton being replaced away from making more noise. And then they have a very solid defense

Irsay obviously feels that Grigson (outside of the foolery like the Trent trade) has build this team to be better than what it's showing and I agree

We get blown out more than the likes of the Jags, Jets, Browns, etc etc

[TKnight24]

Not surprising that the Colts wouldn't extend Chuck Pagano prematurely, but I don't think that means he's on thin ice by any means.

— Kyle J. Rodriguez (@ColtsAuth_Kyle)

March 26, 2015

[NBColtsFanatic]

If they don't make/win the superbowl either Pagano/Manusky/Grigson will be gone, or all. It's really hard to see who to place the blame on. Grigson has had his highs but he hasn't done well to improve pass rushing, defensive line, running back or safety. That hurts Manusky because then Manusky can't utilize a real monster on the line or a sack machine and then he gets blamer for it. Grigsons inability to improve the RBs and the OL, ( as well as defense) hurts Pagano too. Although Grigson has done really well in areas, I say the Colts fire Grigson, then Manusky (he just hasn't done well and he was never stout in San Diego either), and fire the D line coach if that doesn't work. They should keep Pagano, re evaluate him and see how Pagano does with a GM that actually goes after proven players rather than RJF'S or Waldens or Landrys and see how Pagano does with a Defensive Coordinator that is capable of making the defense a top 10-15 defense. So for now wait out the season, evaluate, if no superbowl- fire Grigson, Manusky, D line coach ( if can't improve), extend Pagano for a year and see how he does with new people around him. I DO NOT want to see Andrew Lucks career go wasted like Mannings, we CANNOT have a top 5 QB in the league every year for 30 years and have 1 SB from one pathetic regime and 0 from another. We need to imitate what Seattle and New England are doing which is signing proven people, being hard and not being friendly, making adjustments and sticking with what works. This is just too **** frustrating too have such good QBs, go to the playoffs and not win a superbowl. Thank You.

[TKnight24]

Via @RapSheet, #Colts not expected to extend Chuck Pagano (on last year of deal) before season. Which basically means: Team better deliver.

— Zak Keefer (@zkeefer)

March 26, 2015

[Gavin]

Long story short......Nobody really knows

[TKnight24]

If they don't make/win the superbowl either Pagano/Manusky/Grigson will be gone, or all. It's really hard to see who to place the blame on. Grigson has had his highs but he hasn't done well to improve pass rushing, defensive line, running back or safety. That hurts Manusky because then Manusky can't utilize a real monster on the line or a sack machine and then he gets blamer for it. Grigsons inability to improve the RBs and the OL, ( as well as defense) hurts Pagano too. Although Grigson has done really well in areas, I say the Colts fire Grigson, then Manusky (he just hasn't done well and he was never stout in San Diego either), and fire the D line coach if that doesn't work. They should keep Pagano, re evaluate him and see how Pagano does with a GM that actually goes after proven players rather than RJF'S or Waldens or Landrys and see how Pagano does with a Defensive Coordinator that is capable of making the defense a top 10-15 defense. So for now wait out the season, evaluate, if no superbowl- fire Grigson, Manusky, D line coach ( if can't improve), extend Pagano for a year and see how he does with new people around him. I DO NOT want to see Andrew Lucks career go wasted like Mannings, we CANNOT have a top 5 QB in the league every year for 30 years and have 1 SB from one pathetic regime and 0 from another. We need to imitate what Seattle and New England are doing which is signing proven people, being hard and not being friendly, making adjustments and sticking with what works. This is just too **** frustrating too have such good QBs, go to the playoffs and not win a superbowl. Thank You.

Don't forget the good ol stubborn Pep Hamilton who insists on running pulling guard plays with Guards who can't do it

Some blame goes to everyone. Lack of running game was a problem sure, but good OC have the ability to make up for it

Remember how the media tried to trash Bill when the Pats sent that OL (who's name I forgot) packing? Look how their offensive line handled it. It's all in the coaching. Not every player is an all star. Gotta learn to work with what you have

[Freenyfan102]

I hope so the defense still stinks

[TKnight24]

I hope so the defense still stinks

Only against top teams, they do pretty good against the bottom half of the league at least lol

[krunk]

I'm cool with Chuck. Just think the coaching needs to go up a notch in these Patriot games and stop abandoning the running game.

My clock is ticking on Manusky but I'll deal with it for right now.

[TKnight24]

I'm cool with Chuck. Just think the coaching needs to go up a notch in these Patriot games and stop abandoning the running game.

My clock is ticking on Manusky but I'll deal with it for right now.

My clock expired on Manusky in the Steelers game after Vontae got hurt

Made no adjustments, just lined up in straight man as if Gordy really is that good and we got torched for a record setting day

All of our coaches need to learn how to make in-game adjustments

[Superman]

This is why I keep talking about how the Falcons fell apart. Irsay wants the team to keep getting better, not stall out and come crashing down to earth. Sometimes a little discomfort is good for your staff. Irsay isn't a drastic, overreacting kind of owner. I don't think his decision is about whether or not we beat the Patriots, or whether or not we get to and win the Super Bowl. But he does want to make sure he has the right people in charge. This is probably the best way.

[NBColtsFanatic]

Don't forget the good ol stubborn Pep Hamilton who insists on running pulling guard plays with Guards who can't do it

Some blame goes to everyone. Lack of running game was a problem sure, but good OC have the ability to make up for it

Remember how the media tried to trash Bill when the Pats sent that OL (who's name I forgot) packing? Look how their offensive line handled it. It's all in the coaching. Not every player is an all star. Gotta learn to work with what you have

Agreed. Everyone should have accountability, not just Pagano. It should be from the bottom to the top.

[Valpo2004]

Pagano will be back.  Gone 11-5 every year for the last 3 years, albeit the first one he was on sick leave for most of the season.

 

Gone to playoffs every year, gotten progressively further every year.

 

If he makes the playoffs, Pagano is back.

[TKnight24]

This is why I keep talking about how the Falcons fell apart. Irsay wants the team to keep getting better, not stall out and come crashing down to earth. Sometimes a little discomfort is good for your staff. Irsay isn't a drastic, overreacting kind of owner. I don't think his decision is about whether or not we beat the Patriots, or whether or not we get to and win the Super Bowl. But he does want to make sure he has the right people in charge. This is probably the best way.

Bingo

Irsay has been on top before, this just shows he wants to be there again. He isn't satisfied with just one ring, he wants more

This is a subtle way of doing it. He could just come out and hold a press conference and say "If Chuck doesn't have us a SB this year, he and his staff are out the door. Heads will ROLL!"

[TKnight24]

Pagano will be back. Gone 11-5 every year for the last 3 years, albeit the first one he was on sick leave for most of the season.

Gone to playoffs every year, gotten progressively further every year.

If he makes the playoffs, Pagano is back.

Making the playoffs would actually be going Backwards. We gotta make the SB this year. May not win it, but should at least be in it

[Nadine]

The only possible sources would be Grigson or the Irsays and I highly doubt they would throw that out there.  Me thinks the sources made this up

[Superman]

Bingo

Irsay has been on top before, this just shows he wants to be there again. He isn't satisfied with just one ring, he wants more

This is a subtle way of doing it. He could just come out and hold a press conference and say "If Chuck doesn't have us a SB this year, he and his staff are out the door. Heads will ROLL!"

 

I don't think that's his point. Making or winning the SB this year isn't a condition of Pagano's employment, nor is beating the Pats. 

 

I think the point is that there's a difference between coaching a fringe contender and coaching a perennial powerhouse. We know Pagano can do the former. He needs to show that he can do the latter, and coming off of a year where the team went to the AFCCG, the standard is set very high. Pagano was most certainly the right man for the rebuilding Colts. He has to prove he's the right man for the championship contending Colts.

 

I'm rooting for him. I'm a fan of his. But I have no problem with Irsay's approach here.

[TKnight24]

The only possible sources would be Grigson or the Irsays and I highly doubt they would throw that out there. Me thinks the sources made this up

Well, there's this

https://twitter.com/NBCdianna/status/581180546396643328

[Tracy Denton]

I think this "make or break" stuff is ridiculous ! And just who would take over ? Chud ? Pagano will get better as a HC ! give him more than just a few 11-5 seasons. Even the great Hoodie went 36-44 with his first HC job with the Browns.