Oh no!! Not another one!

[cdgacoltsfan]

EJ Speed has 8 straight games with 10 plus tackles...tying an NFL record.

Cross

Pierce

Fries

Reinman

Jones

All have been targets for our forum GMs

C'mon Ballard...do something!!!!

Let's see our resident forum GMs do some more spinning...I'm sure they are upset.

[KB]

Let's hope all this equals to us getting into the playoffs, and winning a playoff game. If it dosnt then it dosnt really mean much. Been quiet awhile since we've been able to enjoy playoff football.

[Smonroe]

Don't forget, we are the QB Healers. 

 

After Lawrence returns to form and throws for 350 yards, the forum GMs will be back.

[DavePSL]

Wow, how far the standard for the Colts has fallen...Are we for real....a 500 record and some fans are beating their chest!!!! Sad that some consider this some great feat!

 

I really hope I'm wrong but when this team ends up with a losing record and misses the playoffs, the Ballard apologist will be out in full force. ...................................Again, I will be the first one on here saying I was wrong if that doesn't happen and will be thrilled to admit it but I don't think I am wrong even though I want to be. Wonder if the rest of us will be so quick to admit they were wrong. Doubt it!

[New Zealands #1 Colts Fan]

Phew, I was worried this was another injury thread.......

[Flash7]

7 minutes ago, New Zealands #1 Colts Fan said:

Phew, I was worried this was another injury thread.......

My first thought as well.

[Solid84]

[cdgacoltsfan]

57 minutes ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

EJ Speed has 8 straight games with 10 plus tackles...tying an NFL record.

Cross

Pierce

Fries

Reinman

Jones

All have been targets for our forum GMs

C'mon Ballard...do something!!!!

Let's see our resident forum GMs do some more spinning...I'm sure they are upset.

I forgot about AR....he leads the league in 40+ yard completions. This has been an awful year for our glass half empty forum GMs

[Shadow_Creek]

1 hour ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

EJ Speed has 8 straight games with 10 plus tackles...tying an NFL record.

Cross

Pierce

Fries

Reinman

Jones

All have been targets for our forum GMs

C'mon Ballard...do something!!!!

Let's see our resident forum GMs do some more spinning...I'm sure they are upset.

[Defjamz26]

2 hours ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

EJ Speed has 8 straight games with 10 plus tackles...tying an NFL record.

Cross

Pierce

Fries

Reinman

Jones

All have been targets for our forum GMs

C'mon Ballard...do something!!!!

Let's see our resident forum GMs do some more spinning...I'm sure they are upset.

No one really said anything about Rainman. People were screaming for him to start over Pryor after week 2.

 

Jones had 1 good game with 2 INTs but he’s still a liability in man, and tends to always give up 1-2 big catches a game and a penalty. He’s fine as a number 3 corner.

 

Lot of people also wanted Cross, just at SS instead of FS which is why he has had success. I’ve always thought he was better than Thomas.

 

Fries has been a surprise and this is easily the best we’ve seen from Pierce. Ryan and Minshew definitely limited him.

[DougDew]

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

[Solid84]

11 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

I don't really care where a player is picked, because if he's starting he's likely been deemed to be the best we have. That in itself CAN of course be pretty unfortunate and that's where it starts to be a Ballard problem.

 

To the OP:

Cross, Speed and Franklin have all been questioned because of their questionable coverage abilities - especially Speed and Franklin. What gets brought up in the OP completely misses the point. Speed and Franklin have also been called out because too many of their tackles seem be be made 5+ yards downfield. I don't see anything disproving that here either.

[jvan1973]

27 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

Pretty sure Leonard was an all pro 4 times.  Defense rookie of year..  no one cares about your averages.   You are wrong most of the time.   I wish I could give you an "aggressive laugh emoji"

[DougDew]

38 minutes ago, Solid84 said:

I don't really care where a player is picked, because if he's starting he's likely been deemed to be the best we have. That in itself CAN of course be pretty unfortunate and that's where it starts to be a Ballard problem.

I never argue much about individual players. 

 

Big picture: Ballard is .500 because he's gotten mileage from the mid to later rounds, which kept him from having a losing record.  He hasn't delivered on getting enough of the top kinds of picks with the top end draft choices and extra capital from trade downs.  I thought this was evident the time he was making the picks as far as positions relative to capital.  Just not very efficient uses, IMO.

22 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Pretty sure Leonard was an all pro 4 times.  Defense rookie of year..  no one cares about your averages.   You are wrong most of the time.   I wish I could give you an "aggressive laugh emoji"

Oh, so you're the reason it was removed.  We were wondering.  Not surprised folks finally caught on. 

[Yoshinator]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

Generally the Ballard-apologists can only bash forum members because they don't work in the FO and they try to make their opinions worthless by saying that they are armchair GMs. You rarely see any Ballard-apologist compare Ballard to other NFL GMs because 1.) They work in the NFL, 2.) They are more qualified than Ballard by record, division wins, playoff appearances and wins and possibly SB appearances and wins. 

 

Ballard is a great scout that got put in a GM role he has no idea how to operate in. He has ideas that haven't worked for us and would have only worked if we had Andrew Luck at QB the entire time. However, since he retired we traded for and signed band-aids at QB and never even moved up in the draft for one. Even with AR, we took him at 4 when we had a high pick and didn't trade from 4 to 1 to get Stroud ahead of the Texans when there was evidence the Bears would have moved down with us because they moved down to 9.

 

It's the same excuses and insults from the Ballard crowd to try and prop Ballard up and demean the fanbase who questions him because all we want to do is win, and we have recognized Ballard isn't the GM that will win. Ballard is a great scout that can draft well and can't do anything else as he is ultra-conservative. My preferred path is to make the playoffs this year and have AR improve, but if we miss the playoffs, the 2nd best option is to fire Ballard and let Steichen pick a GM he wants to work with.

[csmopar]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

Technically Darius Leonard was an All Pro…

[Chrisaaron1023]

4 hours ago, Smonroe said:

Don't forget, we are the QB Healers. 

 

After Lawrence returns to form and throws for 350 yards, the forum GMs will be back.

[Dobbinblitz]

It’s great to see the tackle totals for Speed - I pull for him each and every week. He is in a contract year. However, other metrics such as PFF has him graded as the #88th ranked linebacker after 4 games; led by a 50.2 pass coverage grade; and that has not been against the top tier QB’s to date.  

[husker61]

2 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Pretty sure Leonard was an all pro 4 times.  Defense rookie of year..  no one cares about your averages.   You are wrong most of the time.   I wish I could give you an "aggressive laugh emoji"

i think Doug’s point was. 1st round picks not being allpro players,Leonard was a 2nd round pick. He gave him credit for his non 1st round picks.

[DougDew]

26 minutes ago, husker61 said:

i think Doug’s point was. 1st round picks not being allpro players,Leonard was a 2nd round pick. He gave him credit for his non 1st round picks.

It was pretty clear I was talking about 1st round capital, including trade downs.   I have learned that the anti-dougdew crowd gets so quickly triggered with rage they can't even read straight.  I used to confront it, but now its so obvious it needs no response.

 

I made a broader point after that, so the trivial aspect of 1st or 2nd or which specific player where isn't even germane.  Its pretty easy to strike bright lines where the inefficiencies have been.

[dw49]

3 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

No one really said anything about Rainman. People were screaming for him to start over Pryor after week 2.

 

Jones had 1 good game with 2 INTs but he’s still a liability in man, and tends to always give up 1-2 big catches a game and a penalty. He’s fine as a number 3 corner.

 

Lot of people also wanted Cross, just at SS instead of FS which is why he has had success. I’ve always thought he was better than Thomas.

 

Fries has been a surprise and this is easily the best we’ve seen from Pierce. Ryan and Minshew definitely limited him.

 

Jones , IMO , has been a bit unlucky. To my recollection , most of the receptions he's given up have been on great throws and or great catches. He's had excellent coverage on most of the big plays he's given up.

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

Come back in week 18 when the colts need to show up most and show me the stats then and how much they matter. 

[lollygagger8]

To me, Speed is decent. I just hope Ballard doesn't go wild on the extension $ and finds some LB studs in the draft, as that is one of his (or whoever he has scouting) stronger points. 

 

I think Olubi is decent, but I really hope Franklin gets back to the level he used to play at. 

 

 

[John Hammonds]

12 hours ago, DougDew said:

Its come to my attention that some members just can't take anybody second-guessing the Colts.

 

I probably fit in the nonsupport of Ballard group, but I've never targeted the players mentioned because I thought they were decent picks at the spot they were taken.  If you average out the draft spot of those players, I'd say they average to about pick 90...mid to late 3rd round.

 

My target was the lack of attention in picking impact players with first round picks, identifying them in college.  One All Pro in 8 drafts, plus capital from trade downs.  And that one All Pro is/was a G.  Doesn't seem like our recent pick #4 is headed there either, but its very early.

I agree with you.  I've said it before:  Jim Irsay was correct when he talked about the early 2000's team being "rare air".  Yeah, they were.  They were a rare air team because they had rare air players.  They were lining up with a potential seven hall of fame players on the field at the same time.  Yeah.  Look over the Ballard rosters.  How many potential hall of fame players have we had?  Be honest.  There's a reason why the recent teams haven't been rare air teams.  They haven't had rare air players.  And I say this as a Ballard supporter:  this situation is the responsibility of one man.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, John Hammonds said:

I agree with you.  I've said it before:  Jim Irsay was correct when he talked about the early 2000's team being "rare air".  Yeah, they were.  They were a rare air team because they had rare air players.  They were lining up with a potential seven hall of fame players on the field at the same time.  Yeah.  Look over the Ballard rosters.  How many potential hall of fame players have we had?  Be honest.  There's a reason why the recent teams haven't been rare air teams.  They haven't had rare air players.  And I say this as a Ballard supporter:  this situation is the responsibility of one man.

I've talked about where winning teams have their high talent and where the mediocre talent is...for like 7 years.  Cap constraints mean there has to be a priority upon what positions the stars play.  It comes down to passing, protecting the passer, and rushing the passer...most often in critical situations....but consistent positive performance in those situations.  IMO, those positions are QB, LT, impact receiver, and edge rusher (unless you're Aaron Donald).  Its not just the Colts in the PM days, its all NFL teams (with few exceptions, see NE and BALT) that reach(ed) AFCCG contention on a consistent basis.  I mean, just look around and be honest.

 

The players listed can certainly contribute to a perennial playoff team, and they should be praised for "outplaying" their originally drafted position.  But I would say that finding players like that is what kept us out of the basement and elevated Ballard's record into the .500 area.

 

Has Ballard drafted a player that another team would consider giving up 2 first round picks for?  Or even a 1st and another pick?  Or even a 1st at all...hmmm...maybe?  Even the great players on the Colts; Nelson, Leonard, JT, Pitt, probably wouldn't fetch those prices because the positions they play are somewhat easy to replace with production/impact that isn't much less than what they provide.

 

Having said that, I like the potential of AR, Raimann, AP/Downs, and Latu, so I'm not a huge Ballard basher like some are.

[MikeCurtis]

13 hours ago, Solid84 said:

I don't really care where a player is picked, because if he's starting he's likely been deemed to be the best we have. That in itself CAN of course be pretty unfortunate and that's where it starts to be a Ballard problem.

 

To the OP:

Cross, Speed and Franklin have all been questioned because of their questionable coverage abilities - especially Speed and Franklin. What gets brought up in the OP completely misses the point. Speed and Franklin have also been called out because too many of their tackles seem be be made 5+ yards downfield. I don't see anything disproving that here either.

This !

[BlackTiger]

He's pretty good when pressing forward, less so when dropping into coverage

[BeanDiasucci]

It's not just some of the "Forum GMs" who think Ballard is not among the best at his job. The Athletic last week released the results of a poll "of 40 league insiders, including 35 high-ranking executives and five coaches, to compile the NFL Front Office Rankings. Respondents, who were granted anonymity for both their votes and conversations discussing them in exchange for their candor, were asked to submit their top-five front offices, in rank order, based on each franchise’s football operations side. (Respondents were not allowed to vote for their own team.)"

 

Does anybody here think Ballard and the Colts' front office were ranked by their peers as being among the best in the league? They were not. The  Front Office Rankings from the 40 league insiders were: 1. Baltimore, 2. Kansas City, 3. San Francisco, 4. Philadelphia, 5. Detroit, 6. Green Bay, 7. Seattle, 8. Los Angeles, 9. Buffalo, and 10. Pittsburgh -- with Houston and Cleveland also receiving multiple votes. 

 

 

Others receiving votes: Only two other teams — the Houston Texans and Cleveland Browns — received multiple top-five votes from our panelists. The Dallas Cowboys appeared on one ballot, receiving a first-place vote. Six other teams received a single vote.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5777310/2024/09/26/nfl-front-office-rankings/

[Defjamz26]

On 10/2/2024 at 10:20 PM, dw49 said:

 

Jones , IMO , has been a bit unlucky. To my recollection , most of the receptions he's given up have been on great throws and or great catches. He's had excellent coverage on most of the big plays he's given up.

Theres no such thing as a good player who is just consistently “unlucky”. Thats why he’s a CB3/2. Nothing wrong with that since we know the Colts need a CB1.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

On 10/2/2024 at 5:29 PM, cdgacoltsfan said:

I forgot about AR....he leads the league in 40+ yard completions. This has been an awful year for our glass half empty forum GMs

 

Actually, if the colts miss the playoffs AGAIN, then it will be another bad year for the Ballard worshippers who look for any stat to validate their hero. 

The only relevant stat(for most)should be is Wins and enough of them to make playoffs, win division titles and  playoff runs.

[AKB]

On 10/2/2024 at 4:30 PM, cdgacoltsfan said:

EJ Speed has 8 straight games with 10 plus tackles...tying an NFL record.

Cross

Pierce

Fries

Reinman

Jones

All have been targets for our forum GMs

C'mon Ballard...do something!!!!

Let's see our resident forum GMs do some more spinning...I'm sure they are upset.

bait and it ain't even good bait. 

[Superman]

On 10/2/2024 at 7:20 PM, dw49 said:

 

Jones , IMO , has been a bit unlucky. To my recollection , most of the receptions he's given up have been on great throws and or great catches. He's had excellent coverage on most of the big plays he's given up.

 

He needs to be tougher at the catch point. Some of those plays he's getting overpowered by the receiver. I give him credit for being in position, but it doesn't matter if he can't make a play on the ball. 

[NewColtsFan]

On 10/3/2024 at 5:59 AM, BeanDiasucci said:

It's not just some of the "Forum GMs" who think Ballard is not among the best at his job. The Athletic last week released the results of a poll "of 40 league insiders, including 35 high-ranking executives and five coaches, to compile the NFL Front Office Rankings. Respondents, who were granted anonymity for both their votes and conversations discussing them in exchange for their candor, were asked to submit their top-five front offices, in rank order, based on each franchise’s football operations side. (Respondents were not allowed to vote for their own team.)"

 

Does anybody here think Ballard and the Colts' front office were ranked by their peers as being among the best in the league? They were not. The  Front Office Rankings from the 40 league insiders were: 1. Baltimore, 2. Kansas City, 3. San Francisco, 4. Philadelphia, 5. Detroit, 6. Green Bay, 7. Seattle, 8. Los Angeles, 9. Buffalo, and 10. Pittsburgh -- with Houston and Cleveland also receiving multiple votes. 

 

 

Others receiving votes: Only two other teams — the Houston Texans and Cleveland Browns — received multiple top-five votes from our panelists. The Dallas Cowboys appeared on one ballot, receiving a first-place vote. Six other teams received a single vote.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5777310/2024/09/26/nfl-front-office-rankings/

Maybe many others would disagree with me….   But I don’t find this surprising or damning. 
 

Look at the graphic again.   You’ll see that every team on the list is a consistent winning team.   Year after year.   For a wide variety of reasons that we’ve debated to death the Colts aren’t among them.   I think it would’ve been a bigger surprise if the Colts were on this list.   
 

But this doesn’t mean the Colts front office is bad or not respected.  Of course, your mileage may vary.

 

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

21 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe many others would disagree with me….   But I don’t find this surprising or damning. 
 

Look at the graphic again.   You’ll see that every team on the list is a consistent winning team.   Year after year.   For a wide variety of reasons that we’ve debated to death the Colts aren’t among them.   I think it would’ve been a bigger surprise if the Colts were on this list.   
 

But this doesn’t mean the Colts front office is bad or not respected.  Of course, your mileage may vary.

 

 

I have Ballard around 15th FWIW, so he doesn't suck. He is not great but good, but I think if we beat the Jags on Sunday we may have something brewing this season.

[BeanDiasucci]

38 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe many others would disagree with me….   But I don’t find this surprising or damning. 
 

Look at the graphic again.   You’ll see that every team on the list is a consistent winning team.   Year after year.   For a wide variety of reasons that we’ve debated to death the Colts aren’t among them.   I think it would’ve been a bigger surprise if the Colts were on this list.   
 

But this doesn’t mean the Colts front office is bad or not respected.  Of course, your mileage may vary.

 

 

I don't find it surprising either. I think the poll doesn't mean that the Colts front office is bad, but it does mean that other NFL executives and coaches don't view the Colts front office as better than average. That's what I think the Colts front office is -- average, and winning should be the key measure. The team has been, on the whole, average during Ballard's tenure. It is an exactly average team so far this season, 2-2, 85 points scored, 85 points allowed. 

 

I'd like the Colts front office and the team to be considerably better than average. That seems obvious. You can talk about a wide variety of reasons that the Colts aren't among the consistent winners all you want, but it's Ballard's job to make them a consistent winner, and eight years in, he's not getting it done. 

 

Yet, we have threads like this one that are intended to bash the "Forum GMs" who are critical of the front office and the team. Apparently, because EJ Speed and some of the other Colts are at least average-ish players. WTH? Shouldn't we expect more than that? 

[dw49]

4 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

Theres no such thing as a good player who is just consistently “unlucky”. Thats why he’s a CB3/2. Nothing wrong with that since we know the Colts need a CB1.

 

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

He needs to be tougher at the catch point. Some of those plays he's getting overpowered by the receiver. I give him credit for being in position, but it doesn't matter if he can't make a play on the ball. 

 

 

It's only been 4 games and he IMO is showing excellent cover skills . That's a great start  .. if you can't cover , it's pretty tough to defend a pass or make a play on the ball. Seems like improving his ball skills is easier than improving coverage issues. My point was that he's been the victim of great throws and "just missing " on breaking up passes. Give him a little more time before tagging him a a # 3 CB.

[John Waylon]

4 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

 

Actually, if the colts miss the playoffs AGAIN, then it will be another bad year for the Ballard worshippers who look for any stat to validate their hero. 

The only relevant stat(for most)should be is Wins and enough of them to make playoffs, win division titles and  playoff runs.

Remember when the frank defenders used to do this exact same thing and point to his offensive rankings as evidence that he wasn’t in fact a bumbling mess of a head coach?

Just asking. No particular reason.