Per Michael Lombardi Malik Hooker available for trade

[shasta519]

40 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

A few things might come into play, though.

 

First, I don't buy the rumor. I wouldn't be surprised to see it happen, but the timing of this coming out is odd, and this is lying season.

 

Second, there are some changes to the comp pick formula. I'm not sure what they are or when they'll go into effect, but those changes might make some GMs be a little more proactive in getting value for players they don't intend to sign long term. And the Colts could get better value, sooner, by trading Hooker, than by letting him walk for a comp pick.

 

Third, it seems like safety is one of the strengths of this draft, especially in the 25-50ish pick range. 

 

Fourth, there seems to be a refocus on players who stay on the field. Hooker has not been that kind of player so far, and it's probably not likely that he becomes that kind of player.

 

So, all this together makes me think that IF the Colts trade Hooker, it will be about maximizing value for a player that they don't want to make a long term commitment to and that they feel they can replace to a reasonable degree this offseason.

 

It certainly does seem like teams are more willing than ever to trade players for picks...and conversely.

[MPStack]

That 2017 draft is slowly, losing it’s luster. Down to Mack, Grover and Walker. 

[Superman]

16 minutes ago, boo2202 said:

Then I’d have to question Ballard for using a high pick on a player that you dump 3 years later for a 4th round pick or so. It doesn’t make any sense. Malik hasn’t been great but has shown flashes. Don’t feel like restarting at another position when we already need playmakers on offense. 

 

He didn't have his staff in place, and was drafting for a different coach/defense. I still think Hooker can play in Eberflus' defense, and he's still a big time playmaker when healthy, but it doesn't make sense to hold that pick over the staff's head given all the changes that have taken place since then.

[GoColts8818]

58 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

A few things might come into play, though.

 

First, I don't buy the rumor. I wouldn't be surprised to see it happen, but the timing of this coming out is odd, and this is lying season.

 

Second, there are some changes to the comp pick formula. I'm not sure what they are or when they'll go into effect, but those changes might make some GMs be a little more proactive in getting value for players they don't intend to sign long term. And the Colts could get better value, sooner, by trading Hooker, than by letting him walk for a comp pick.

 

Third, it seems like safety is one of the strengths of this draft, especially in the 25-50ish pick range. 

 

Fourth, there seems to be a refocus on players who stay on the field. Hooker has not been that kind of player so far, and it's probably not likely that he becomes that kind of player.

 

So, all this together makes me think that IF the Colts trade Hooker, it will be about maximizing value for a player that they don't want to make a long term commitment to and that they feel they can replace to a reasonable degree this offseason.

Right I am just working off the assumption the rumor is true for sake of argument.  Clearly it could not be.

[Dogg63]

Local media talking heads are all reporting the rumor is somewhat true. The Colts have NOT shopped Hooker, but they have had other teams inquire about his availability.

 

In addition, only 2 of the 1st round draftees from 2017 have had their 5th year option picked up thus far. The deadline to do that is May 4, so obviously most teams are waiting. 

 

As to keeping him, he's only a ~4 million cap hit this year and the 5th year option would be in the ~6.5-7 million range. Not expensive at all.

 

I think we keep him and see what happens with 1) him getting healed up (and hopefully staying healthy for a change), 2) another year of experience under his belt, and 3) some pressure from Buckner affecting the entire defense in good ways.

[ukcolt12]

They finally have an interior pash rush (Buckner) and improving exterior pass rush which plays into Hooker's core strengths. Yet they look to get rid? 

Makes no sense to me. He wasn't great last season but frankly none of the DB's were. 

He has the skillset to take away the ball which outside of Moore, no other DB possesses 

[jameszeigler834]

3 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

Wouldn’t be too shocking. I don’t dislike Malik, enjoyed his improved tackling this year, but I understand why Ballard may be trying to field offers.

 

Of course, kinda weird that this leaks and nothing about the Buckner trade leaked even though it was months in the making.

Coverage wise he was awful last year.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Is Wilson counting down his days.

 

 

[Four2itus]

In my best Ballard voice...

 

"Look....I know yall' go a job to do, but let's be honest....a good share of any NFL team is technically trade-able, but they're not realistically trade-able. That can be for lots of reasons... most often, because we like them and don't want to let them get out of the building....but did I get a call inquiring about Malik, is he was available? Yes I did, but that doesn't mean the Malik is being shopped around the league. We like Malik, and we're looking forward to seeing this season with the improvements we feel have been made in the up front"

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

14 minutes ago, ukcolt12 said:

They finally have an interior pash rush (Buckner) and improving exterior pass rush which plays into Hooker's core strengths. Yet they look to get rid? 

Makes no sense to me. He wasn't great last season but frankly none of the DB's were. 

He has the skillset to take away the ball which outside of Moore, no other DB possesses 

It looks like teams are the one contacting the colts and the colts aren’t shopping him. Who knows maybe a team will give them something that is to good to pass up.

[DougDew]

19 minutes ago, jameszeigler834 said:

Coverage wise he was awful last year.

Buckner and an improved pass rush could make Odum and/or Tell more effective than they other wise would be.  It helps all safeties and DBs, not just one.

 

I would wager that everybody involved believes that Hooker could benefit from being in another defense.  Ballard, other GMs, and maybe even Hooker himself.  Since everybody sees it, maybe that's why Ballard is getting phone calls. 

 

As someone has said, its a matter of thinking if he is a core player or not.  If not, then its comes down to what the value would be in terms of a pick this year compared to a comp pick two years from now if he signs elsewhere after next season or three years from now if he signs elsewhere after his 5th season.   If I've got my timeline correct.  

 

[Hoose]

2 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I could see Hooker for Howard straight up or Hooker and next years 1st for Adams.  Both work for me. 

Yes on the first idea. No on the second. 

Howard for Hooker.......is intriguing. The Colts could avoid having to use a pick on TE this year and wait for a better year to grab one. Plus Howard has serious talent. They could use the TE pick for a FS. I like it. 

[NewColtsFan]

For a team like the Colts with a long demonstrated history of NOT leaking,  I find this leak....   curious at best.   That’s not yo 100 percent say the leak is false. 
 

But sometimes a team will leak to send a message to the player.    They may not want to trade you, but they will if they get an offer they like.   And if they don’t get that offer, maybe that should tell you what the rest of the league thinks of you?    Perhaps it’s time for Malik to get that message?

 

Im guessing the odds are more likely than not that Hooker remains with the team for another year.  

[BluHorzhu]

IMO this is just due diligence and Ballard being prepared as possible for draft day.

 

Malik Hooker is a good player who's also good at taking the ball away.  I said good there twice because at no time has he truly lived up to the original billing.  Maybe it's scheme, maybe it's something else.  Either way, he's probably more valuable as a high-potential trade option at this point.  There will be a few teams out there who think he's a great fit and that's all it takes.

 

I've done over 100 OTC mocks and one thing I consistently see is Safety talent available particularly at the top of the 2nd round and through the 3rd.  There's plenty of talent right in our 2nd round wheelhouse and it would be very easy to take a guy like McKinney, Winfield, or Chinn as the BPA.  Chinn is more of a box safety, which would not affect Hooker... but that's beside the point.  

 

I think at this point you may be more likely to get better draft capital than better play from Malik... and this would be the draft to do it.  One of the posters here made a good point about uncertainty with the 2020 College FB season.  Right now every GM knows what they've got coming out of the college ranks.  Smoke 'em if ya got 'em.  

 

[Colts_Fan12]

1 hour ago, stitches said:

Depends on the price but I don't like the idea of this...

me either the guy is ultra talented we just refuse to use him the right damn way for some dumb reason 

[Colts_Fan12]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

He didn't have his staff in place, and was drafting for a different coach/defense. I still think Hooker can play in Eberflus' defense, and he's still a big time playmaker when healthy, but it doesn't make sense to hold that pick over the staff's head given all the changes that have taken place since then.

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

Ballard probably knew what scheme he was going to switch to but when you don’t even have coaches in place it’s kind of hard. I totally get why that 2017 draft might end up being a dud. 

[richard pallo]

47 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Is Wilson counting down his days.

 

 

Oh yea.  He knows. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I saw a tweet by Jim Ayello. Khari  Willis has played more football games in college and the pros the hooker. That is pretty amazing.

[boo2202]

3 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

 

Exactly... eberflus was already hired. Ballard knew that pags wasn’t the man for the job. I don’t like the idea of trading away hooker, we don’t have any depth behind him. We basically still got him for two years on the cheap. The other big issue is he wouldn’t return much. If CB is wanting draft capital this badly, he should’ve just kept pick 13 and traded down from there. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

35 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

For a team like the Colts with a long demonstrated history of NOT leaking,  I find this leak....   curious at best.   That’s not yo 100 percent say the leak is false. 
 

But sometimes a team will leak to send a message to the player.    They may not want to trade you, but they will if they get an offer they like.   And if they don’t get that offer, maybe that should tell you what the rest of the league thinks of you?    Perhaps it’s time for Malik to get that message?

 

Im guessing the odds are more likely than not that Hooker remains with the team for another year.  

I doubt the colts leaked anything. IF teams have contacted the colts maybe it was them or a agent.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, boo2202 said:

 

Exactly... eberflus was already hired. Ballard knew that pags wasn’t the man for the job. I don’t like the idea of trading away hooker, we don’t have any depth behind him. We basically still got him for two years on the cheap. The other big issue is he wouldn’t return much. If CB is wanting draft capital this badly, he should’ve just kept pick 13 and traded down from there. 

Eberflus wasn’t hired.

[boo2202]

6 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Ballard probably knew what scheme he was going to switch to but when you don’t even have coaches in place it’s kind of hard. I totally get why that 2017 draft might end up being a dud. 

Calling it a dud is being very generous. We keep drafting db’s, DL, about time some start to stick around. 

[NewColtsFan]

2 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I doubt the colts leaked anything. IF teams have contacted the colts maybe it was them or a agent.

Maybe.    It’s not like I didn’t think of that.

 

But that hasn’t happened much since Ballard took over.   Other teams and agents haven’t leaked much about the Colts either.   Our ship is typically closed up pretty tight.  
 

So for me...,    This is curious....

[boo2202]

5 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

Eberflus wasn’t hired.

 True

[ukcolt12]

17 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

100% agree. 

[Superman]

16 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

 

You already know where my disagreements are going to be here.

 

1) He didn't know he was going to fire Pagano. If Luck plays that year and we win the division and a playoff game, Pagano would have been kept.

 

2) He was working with Grigson's scouts and staff, for the most part, and working off of his own info from scouting for KC, while working closely with Pagano's staff. 

 

3) I don't think you understand what the staff wants to do with the defense. That's based on you calling it an outdated Tampa 2.

 

4) I still think Hooker is a good fit for the defense I believe they want to run. Safety is crucial, especially if you have a ball hawk.

 

5) Even still, it stands to reason that their idea of how to spend the 15th pick in the draft is different now than it was three years ago.

 

6) Biggest factor -- if they are considering moving Hooker -- is likely his inability to stay on the field, which makes them uninterested in making a long term commitment to him. Better to get something of value for him than to let him walk and get a 5th round comp pick three years from now.

 

And I'll say again, I'm highly skeptical of these rumors, and I don't want them to trade Hooker. 

[DougDew]

26 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

I don't know that Ballard knew that he was going to fire Pagano.  To me it was about letting him show what he could do.  I think Ballard expected that Pagano would fail, but I don't know that Ballard knew that he was going to hire Elberflus or any other 43 DC when he drafted Hooker 4 weeks after he was hired.

[Colts_Fan12]

2 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

You already know where my disagreements are going to be here.

 

1) He didn't know he was going to fire Pagano. If Luck plays that year and we win the division and a playoff game, Pagano would have been kept.

 

2) He was working with Grigson's scouts and staff, for the most part, and working off of his own info from scouting for KC, while working closely with Pagano's staff. 

 

3) I don't think you understand what the staff wants to do with the defense. That's based on you calling it an outdated Tampa 2.

 

4) I still think Hooker is a good fit for the defense I believe they want to run. Safety is crucial, especially if you have a ball hawk.

 

5) Even still, it stands to reason that their idea of how to spend the 15th pick in the draft is different now than it was three years ago.

 

6) Biggest factor -- if they are considering moving Hooker -- is likely his inability to stay on the field, which makes them uninterested in making a long term commitment to him. Better to get something of value for him than to let him walk and get a 5th round comp pick three years from now.

 

And I'll say again, I'm highly skeptical of these rumors, and I don't want them to trade Hooker. 

I honestly don't believe they are true rumors either and I hope they aren't but unless we get our head out of our butt and play him the right way he will be gone either by being cut traded or he will just leave to go somewhere he will be utilized better and I wouldn't blame him one bit either 

[ukcolt12]

19 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

I saw a tweet by Jim Ayello. Khari  Willis has played more football games in college and the pros the hooker. That is pretty amazing.

But Hooker missed like 10 games or so with a torn acl? 

[Dr. T]

Hooker was Ballard's first draft pick and he was just following his board. If you all remember, Malik unexpectedly fell about 10 spots and Ballard could not believe he was still available. Maybe the other teams knew something that we didn't. Remember that CB was hamstrung working with Grigson's old crew.

[BProland85]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2887746-colts-malik-hooker-reportedly-drawing-trade-interest-ahead-of-2020-nfl-draft

 

Hopefully this is an indication they would get good compensation for him if he were to be dealt. Having multiple teams interested in Hooker is never a bad thing in regards to leverage for Ballard.

[shasta519]

2 hours ago, Superfly said:

That 2017 draft is slowly, losing it’s luster. Down to Mack, Grover and Walker. 

 

Objectively...I agree. But I also don't think it was a particularly good draft for the vast majority of the NFL. Only a few teams did really well...so getting 2-3 useful players isn't bad.

[shasta519]

1 hour ago, Hoose said:

Yes on the first idea. No on the second. 

Howard for Hooker.......is intriguing. The Colts could avoid having to use a pick on TE this year and wait for a better year to grab one. Plus Howard has serious talent. They could use the TE pick for a FS. I like it. 

 

I agree...if you don't have any long-term plans for Hooker...and teams are being stingy with draft picks...getting back a talented TE is pretty good. And with their young starting S coming off an Achilles tear...I bet TB would be interested.

[ThinBlueLineColts]

39 minutes ago, ukcolt12 said:

But Hooker missed like 10 games or so with a torn acl? 

That’s the point. Hooker hasn’t been healthy in the NFL. May have an impact on the decision to keep him long term or not. 

[krunk]

1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

he knew when he drafted Hooker he was gonna can Pagano so I don't get this at all. if you weren't planning on playing a scheme to benefit Hooker why the heck did he waste the guys time should have drafted someone to better fit his outdated Tampa 2.

Ohio State plays the same defense the Colts play.  He knew what scheme he was drafting Hooker for.  If they have any interest in trading him I think it's more or less injury related along with him not being all that physical and combined with the fact that he's not really multi-faceted when it comes to being able to flip flop safety positions.   And finally he's more less average in man coverage. They may be looking for more of a Darnell Savage type guy back there.  A guy who can play man or zone coverages, play at the line of scrimmage and picks balls off also.

[indyagent17]

1 hour ago, Chloe6124 said:

Is Wilson counting down his days.

 

 

Looks like it, very deep thoughts about his current status as a Colts. 

[Colts_Fan12]

4 minutes ago, krunk said:

Ohio State plays the same defense the Colts play.  He knew what scheme he was drafting Hooker for.  If they have any interest in trading him I think it's more or less injury related along with him not being all that physical and combined with the fact that he's not really multi-faceted when it comes to being able to flip flop safety positions.   And finally he's more less average in man coverage. They may be looking for more of a Darnell Savage type guy back there.  A guy who can play man or zone coverages, play at the line of scrimmage and picks balls off also.

we should just trade him to Seattle and let Pete Carroll turn him into the next Earl Thomas 

[CamMo]

4 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

Looks like it, very deep thoughts about his current status as a Colts. 

 

As soon as he scrubbed all his social media accounts from anything Colts related, he was already gone in my mind.  

[krunk]

1 minute ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

we should just trade him to Seattle and let Pete Carroll turn him into the next Earl Thomas 

I like Hooker but it probably wouldn't happen that way for the reasons I listed.  Earl Thomas can do all the things that I mentioned Hooker isn't good at or hasn't shown thus far to be good at.