Johnathan Abram talks about his meeting with the Colts

[stitches]

 

 

Interesting.. 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Just saw a mock with us grabbing him at 26, and I'd be good with it. The rankings fluctuate so much based on how guys workout, and people get kind of lost, I think. The on-field product is pretty far in the rearview at this point, and people are leaning on how well a guy can workout without pads on, but IIRC Deionte Thompson was at the top of the S rankings following the CFB season, and his stock has dropped to like the 4th best safety somehow? I'd be more than happy to steal him in the 2nd, or maybe 3rd. Just don't buy the workout warriors, and look at game tape as the real indicator.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I think it is possible. All depends on who is there at 26. Will he last until 34?

[NewColtsFan]

10 minutes ago, stitches said:

 

 

Interesting.. 

 

I'm hoping we're talking for Pick 34, and not pick 26.

 

I'd hate to think that in Ballard's 3 years of draftig we took Safety's in the first round in 2 of the 3 years.   That doesn't strike me as a Ballard-like thing to do.

 

[stitches]

8 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm hoping we're talking for Pick 34, and not pick 26.

 

I'd hate to think that in Ballard's 3 years of draftig we took Safety's in the first round in 2 of the 3 years.   That doesn't strike me as a Ballard-like thing to do.

 

Depends on how much you trust him that he drafts BPA. If you do, it makes sense. Hooker was obvious BPA. Abram is not as obvious but I can see how he would feel like a perfect fit with what we do and need from our SS, it's very reasonable that Ballard might have him ranked pretty high. 

[Four2itus]

5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm hoping we're talking for Pick 34, and not pick 26.

 

This is my opinion on this subject. There is a huge difference between #8 and #16. Not a huge difference between 26 and 34. It is my guess that CB and his staff, have groups....tier 1, tier 2 and so on. I would also guess that #26 and #34 picks could come out of the same group of prospects on his board. 

[GoColtsGo5150]

I like Abrams, he's my 2nd rated safety in this draft. I personally would like Taylor Rapp myself but I'd be very happy if we got Abrams 

[Superman]

I haven't watched Abram yet. I guess I should.

[Boiler_Colt]

I've been a huge fan of Abram all offseason and would love to have him on the Colts. I would rather get him at 34 but I don't think he'd make it that far. I knew I wasn't crazy when I thought I saw Ballard eyeing him at the combine.

[jskinnz]

14 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm hoping we're talking for Pick 34, and not pick 26.

 

I'd hate to think that in Ballard's 3 years of draftig we took Safety's in the first round in 2 of the 3 years.   That doesn't strike me as a Ballard-like thing to do.

 

 

If he's the best player on the board then it strikes me as something Ballard would definitely do.

[PeterBowman]

unless there's a higher rated player on their board available,  I"m all for it. 

[NewColtsFan]

26 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

If he's the best player on the board then it strikes me as something Ballard would definitely do.

 

Another way of putting it.....

 

I don't think Ballard's board will be set-up to have Abrams as the BPA when we pick.

 

[NewColtsFan]

36 minutes ago, Four2itus said:

This is my opinion on this subject. There is a huge difference between #8 and #16. Not a huge difference between 26 and 34. It is my guess that CB and his staff, have groups....tier 1, tier 2 and so on. I would also guess that #26 and #34 picks could come out of the same group of prospects on his board. 

 

I think it's possible,  but a complete unknown.    And likely always will be unknown.

 

As I said to another poster,  I'm doubting that Ballard's board will be set-up to have Abram as the BPA when we pick at 26.

 

Could I be wrong?     Absolutely!

 

[NewColtsFan]

41 minutes ago, stitches said:

Depends on how much you trust him that he drafts BPA. If you do, it makes sense. Hooker was obvious BPA. Abram is not as obvious but I can see how he would feel like a perfect fit with what we do and need from our SS, it's very reasonable that Ballard might have him ranked pretty high. 

 

Ballard might have him ranked pretty high.     I consider pick 34 pretty high.

 

I don't see Ballard having Abram ranked high enough to be selected at pick 26.

 

It's possible.   But I don't think it's likely.

 

Just my opinion.

 

[EastStreet]

hard pass at 26 and 34

[stitches]

7 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Ballard might have him ranked pretty high.     I consider pick 34 pretty high.

 

I don't see Ballard having Abram ranked high enough to be selected at pick 26.

 

It's possible.   But I don't think it's likely.

 

Just my opinion.

 

Why though? He fits the exact mold of players Ballard usually rates higher than most... athletic freaks + great fit with the system(Leonard, Braden Smith, Lewis, Kemoko... you can argue all of them were not expected to go as high as they did in last year's draft and Ballard still picked them this high and all of them were very athletic for their position and great fits with the system we are running)... Ballard loves traits-y guys and if he thinks in addition to having the desired traits they fit the culture and system of the Colts, he's shown that he doesn't care if people would raise an eyebrow for the selection.  

[Fisticuffs111]

I've only watched one game of his but I liked what I saw. Lots of times he just straight up looked like a LB'er out there. Understand the coverage concerns though, and I understand why people wouldn't want him at #26. Not sure I would either but I do like him.

[BProland85]

I think he'd be available with the 34th pick. I'd rather address pass rush and DL with the 1st rounder. Would love Brian Burns if we can get him!

[krunk]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

I haven't watched Abram yet. I guess I should.

I thought you had him going in Round 1 of one of your Mock Drafts a few weeks back?

[Superman]

15 minutes ago, krunk said:

I thought you had him going in Round 1 of one of your Mock Drafts a few weeks back?

 

Thompson, not Abram.

[NewColtsFan]

36 minutes ago, stitches said:

Why though? He fits the exact mold of players Ballard usually rates higher than most... athletic freaks + great fit with the system(Leonard, Braden Smith, Lewis, Kemoko... you can argue all of them were not expected to go as high as they did in last year's draft and Ballard still picked them this high and all of them were very athletic for their position and great fits with the system we are running)... Ballard loves traits-y guys and if he thinks in addition to having the desired traits they fit the culture and system of the Colts, he's shown that he doesn't care if people would raise an eyebrow for the selection.  

Because he plays a position that Ballatd doesn’t value as much as others.

 

Ballard has said the key to the defense if the front-7.    Hooker was the exception to the rule because he’s a ball hawk and Balkard heavily values forcing turnovers. 

 

So in a yeR with a historically great front four class we’re supposed to go strong safety?   That doesn’t add up to me.

 

Now Ballard might have Abrams ranked 27-34.   And would be a good pick at the top if round two.   Still a very high ranking but not high enough for pick 26.

 

[Coltsman1788]

55 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I've only watched one game of his but I liked what I saw. Lots of times he just straight up looked like a LB'er out there. Understand the coverage concerns though, and I understand why people wouldn't want him at #26. Not sure I would either but I do like him.

He makes a lot of tackles but he is not really striker.  More of an arms and drag down tackler.  Solid though. 

[richard pallo]

Ballard said he had Hooker high on his board and couldn't pass up taking him when he fell.  I don't think Abram would fit the same circumstance.  

[Defjamz26]

There’s no coverage concerns with Abram. They put him one on one with Jerry Judy on a few plays and he locked him up. Also gave Irv Smith all he could handle. Abram plays like Quenton Nelson but on defense. He’s a physical tone setter.

[Defjamz26]

4 hours ago, Four2itus said:

This is my opinion on this subject. There is a huge difference between #8 and #16. Not a huge difference between 26 and 34. It is my guess that CB and his staff, have groups....tier 1, tier 2 and so on. I would also guess that #26 and #34 picks could come out of the same group of prospects on his board. 

Agreed. I hear that sentiment a lot on the forum. “I wouldn’t take this player at 26, but I’d take him at 34”. The difference between those picks is 8 spots... Generally speaking there isn’t going to be much difference in grades for the players drafted in the bottom of the first and top of the second round. A late 1st=an early second.

[MikeCurtis]

3 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Another way of putting it.....

 

I don't think Ballard's board will be set-up to have Abrams as the BPA when we pick.

 

Maybe..... I agree, we dont touch a SS at 26........  34..... I think it MAY happen..... I think Gardner is a better cover SS, that also hits

 

Abrams is the best hitter but is said to be a little less than others at coverage

[MikeCurtis]

39 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

There’s no coverage concerns with Abram. They put him one on one with Jerry Judy on a few plays and he locked him up. Also gave Irv Smith all he could handle. Abram plays like Quenton Nelson but on defense. He’s a physical tone setter.

 

From his profile

Blunt force-striker with the measurables and play demeanor teams look for from a down safety with nickel linebacker qualities. Abrams did an admirable job in coverage in Mississippi State's scheme but might not have the anticipation and ball skills to hold up in extended coverage

 

There were some other evaluators that had concerns about his coverage as well

 

I like Abrams, but not at 26

 

I do like Chauncy Garner a bit more

[#12.]

In free agency, who did they show the most interest in?  Collins and Mosley.  It's how they view the defense - rally to the ball and good things will happen.  I could see either Abrams or Rapp early, and no, it's pretty clear Ballard doesn't care where players are mocked or projected.  Might nab someone like Omenihu much higher than projected as well.

[BluHorzhu]

From a strategic perspective, if Abrams and Rapp are both still there at 26, it's a pretty safe bet that one one of them would still be there at 34.  That being the case, review that situation again there.

[Hoose]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

Agreed. I hear that sentiment a lot on the forum. “I wouldn’t take this player at 26, but I’d take him at 34”. The difference between those picks is 8 spots... Generally speaking there isn’t going to be much difference in grades for the players drafted in the bottom of the first and top of the second round. A late 1st=an early second.

But you may have suddenly run thin on the DLine talent at 26, with several safeties you really like still likely available at 34. If the dlineman is equal in value to the safety, you take him. 

[MikeCurtis]

9 hours ago, Defjamz26 said:

 A late 1st=an early second.

I get what you are saying, but there IS some difference........

 

To the often quoted value chart...... the difference in value from the two picks is actually a round 3, 2nd pick.  That pick will be important in this draft.

 

If the guys I want arent there, and my picks that I need seem to fall 8 picks later.... I'M TRADING my pick (Maybe I get a 2 next year and an early 2  this year)........  if I can find a deal

 

This will be an interesting draft

 

There appears to be SO much value sitting in round 2

 

It should be stuffed with excellent S, G, WR, CBs.

 

Not many needed DL, but round two should be good for other needed spots 

 

 

[lollygagger8]

Here's a "highlight" reel on youtube: 

 

 

Maybe it's a poor representation of how good he is, but I'm not necessarily impressed. 

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

17 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I'm hoping we're talking for Pick 34, and not pick 26.

 

I'd hate to think that in Ballard's 3 years of draftig we took Safety's in the first round in 2 of the 3 years.   That doesn't strike me as a Ballard-like thing to do.

 

 

From a pro scout/consultant, he's graded right in between these...

 

17 hours ago, stitches said:

Depends on how much you trust him that he drafts BPA. If you do, it makes sense. Hooker was obvious BPA. Abram is not as obvious but I can see how he would feel like a perfect fit with what we do and need from our SS, it's very reasonable that Ballard might have him ranked pretty high. 

 

Chris Landry has him graded very early second round at #28 overall.  There were only 23 true round 1 graded players on his list.

 

17 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Another way of putting it.....

 

I don't think Ballard's board will be set-up to have Abrams as the BPA when we pick.

 

 

I think safety is higher priority than a CB, especially for big nickel alignments.

[ColtsBlueFL]

13 hours ago, MikeCurtis said:

 

From his profile

Blunt force-striker with the measurables and play demeanor teams look for from a down safety with nickel linebacker qualities. Abrams did an admirable job in coverage in Mississippi State's scheme but might not have the anticipation and ball skills to hold up in extended coverage

 

There were some other evaluators that had concerns about his coverage as well

 

I like Abrams, but not at 26

 

I do like Chauncy Garner a bit more

 

Nothing wrong with that.  Can you elaborate on what skills he does have that fits Eberflus scheme better over Rapp or Abram?  When players are raw talent close in grade, fit is everything, and what usually causes coaches to pound the table for 1 guy over another guy.

 

12 hours ago, #12. said:

In free agency, who did they show the most interest in?  Collins and Mosley.  It's how they view the defense - rally to the ball and good things will happen.  I could see either Abrams or Rapp early, and no, it's pretty clear Ballard doesn't care where players are mocked or projected.  Might nab someone like Omenihu much higher than projected as well.

 

These are close ranking, despite the ranking number in front of their name-

 

28. JOHNATHAN ABRAM–S–MISSISSIPPI STATE
44. TAYLOR RAPP–S–WASHINGTON
62. CHAUNCEY GARDNER-JOHNSON–S–FLORIDA

 

Chris Landry has 59 players (starting at pick #24) graded as early or late second round talent.  But they get there because of different skills etc.  Those specific skills differentiate one player from another as far as the DC sees it.  That is why a coach can fall in love with a (supposedly) lower graded player.  The skills of 'his guy' match the priorities of the position in 'his scheme'.  So its a skills/scheme match, not raw talent grade that gets a better placement on a draft board.

 

These players have to be coached, and coaches know what mold (skills) of clay they can work/coach them up with.

 

11 hours ago, BluHorzhu said:

From a strategic perspective, if Abrams and Rapp are both still there at 26, it's a pretty safe bet that one one of them would still be there at 34.  That being the case, review that situation again there.

 

You would think at least 2 of the 3 listed above (if not all) would be.  But the draft is crazy weird at times.

[B~Town]

The more I see these player and coach interviews the more I wonder how many players are taken off the board because they are not a locker room fit .

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, B~Town said:

The more I see these player and coach interviews the more I wonder how many players are taken off the board because they are not a locker room fit .

 

I can imagine quite a few.

 

This kid sounds like a smart and intelligent  kid. Funny he knew all that history. If he can play multiple positions he could be really valuable.

 

[throwing BBZ]

 

 Why not Abrams?

If CB builds the front seven to his liking, coverage skills of the back end becomes the priority. 

 Give me the CB/S combo type.  

[MikeCurtis]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Nothing wrong with that.  Can you elaborate on what skills he does have that fits Eberflus scheme better over Rapp or Abram?  When players are raw talent close in grade, fit is everything, and what usually causes coaches to pound the table for 1 guy over another guy.

 

 

I have watched a great deal of game tape on Rapp and Gardner, to a lesser extent, Abram

I have seen the coverage concerns for Abrams on a few reports, so I didnt spends as much time.

 

We have so much problems with TEs, we need a hitter that can also cover.

 

Gardner was a former CB, and he seems to have that coverage ability which is needed on defense. He also wallops the RB and WR when he tackles....... he seems to have a burst that Rapp doesnt have.  

 

Rapp is safer, and his coverage skills are better, but I think that Gardner is more of a

complete package

 

 

[MikeCurtis]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

I think safety is higher priority than a CB, especially for big nickel alignments.

ABSOLUTELY!

 

We played with THREE Safeties in some alignments last year

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

From a pro scout/consultant, he's graded right in between these...

 

 

Chris Landry has him graded very early second round at #28 overall.  There were only 23 true round 1 graded players on his list.

 

 

I think safety is higher priority than a CB, especially for big nickel alignments.

 

I’d agree that Ballard is more likely to draft a safety before a corner...  

 

Thanks for the Landry info.