Colts Need To Be Buyers

[Dark Superman]

Okay, here me out.

 

For some reason, Chris Ballard seems to be leaning towards the direction of building through the draft. That's fine and all, but with the amount of talent this team lacks at the moment and with Andrew Luck entering his sixth NFL season and doesn't even have a SB appearance yet, doesn't anyone else feel like we need to build this franchise back to a SB caliber team while Luck is still relatively young?

 

Building through the draft is something that we should of did 3-4 years ago, but now I think it's time to get aggressive and if we need to go out and a spend a little money to get someone right now, let's do it.

 

Our QB is locked up for another half a decade and the salary cap will continue to rise.. so why sit around and depend on the draft? Those players are hit or miss anyways.. I hope Ballard ends up spending some cash this off-season on guys who haven't previously played in Indianapolis.

[life long]

I just hope it is not another art jones or gosder cherilus.... 

[CheezyColt]

40 minutes ago, Green_Ranger said:

Okay, here me out.

 

For some reason, Chris Ballard seems to be leaning towards the direction of building through the draft. That's fine and all, but with the amount of talent this team lacks at the moment and with Andrew Luck entering his sixth NFL season and doesn't even have a SB appearance yet, doesn't anyone else feel like we need to build this franchise back to a SB caliber team while Luck is still relatively young?

 

Building through the draft is something that we should of did 3-4 years ago, but now I think it's time to get aggressive and if we need to go out and a spend a little money to get someone right now, let's do it.

 

Our QB is locked up for another half a decade and the salary cap will continue to rise.. so why sit around and depend on the draft? Those players are hit or miss anyways.. I hope Ballard ends up spending some cash this off-season on guys who haven't previously played in Indianapolis.

We tried that after the AFC Championship game and it cost us years of progress. The draft is the only way to build a sustainable team and I'm stoked that Ballard and Irsay seem to recognize that.

[AKB]

8 minutes ago, CheezyColt said:

We tried that after the AFC Championship game and it cost us years of progress. The draft is the only way to build a sustainable team and I'm stoked that Ballard and Irsay seem to recognize that.

Spending in FA stopped us from drafting?...

 

It didn't, and it doesn't. The logic is flawed. 

 

Only thing spending in FA does is stops us from resigning the talent we ALREADY have. Outside of doyle, they can all walk imo.

[TheRustonRifle#7]

Buyer's remorse is rampant in the land of Free Agency.....that said, I hope a couple of prudent signings are made to help the defense.

[MacDee1975]

Why do people act like the NFL isn't just rife with parody?  Like it ltakes a decade to get Super Bowl talent.

 

In this day in age, would probably take 2 years for this particular team to accumulate Super Bowl talent, if that long.  I don't remember anyone saying Atlanta, coming off an 8-8 season (sound familiar?) had Super Bowl talent in August.

[chrisfarley]

How bout balance the two.  Don't spend wildly in FA, but spend... we get a salary cap increase anyway... but the draft, yes, the draft,,,that is where we have to flourish with all of our picks. Ballard seems like the right guy that will have all of the t's crossed and the i's dotted.  Two years of good to great drafting, and in '19 we could be sitting here on a Saturday night nervous for our Colts tomorrow as they face the Dallas Cowboys in Miami

Super Bowl LIV
Date: Feb. 2020
Miami, FL.

[COLTS449]

1 hour ago, CheezyColt said:

We tried that after the AFC Championship game and it cost us years of progress. The draft is the only way to build a sustainable team and I'm stoked that Ballard and Irsay seem to recognize that.

 

Big difference in spending money and going for it in free agency on talented young playmakers than on bums, on the decline like Trent Cole and Frank Gore, Dre, and whoever else. We need to go all in like the Giants did. Bring in 3 young, ascending playmakers to the D.

[COLTS449]

Ballard is gonna want to make a splash guys. I don't care what anyone says. LOL. I mean why do you think Grigson got fired? Because he was an incompetent fool who did nothing to improve the team in FA, and he was just plain dumb when it came to the draft and trades. Ballard isn't trying to make the same mistakes Grigson did. All GM's say build through the draft. But bet on it..... He'll bring in a few big names with 60 million to spend. He'll wanna turn things around overnight IMO. We can still build through the draft AND sign 3 impact free agents. If we sign say Nick Perry, AJ Bouye, and Brandon Williams, then hit big in the draft with an EDGE rusher or 2, an ILB, and a RB we wont even have to do much in FA in 2018. Then we can pretty much completely focus on building through the draft. But we have to hit big in this one and come out with at least 3 starters. I think Ballard's first signing may be a guard like Zeitler, Leary, or Lang personally. We haven't had an OL in years and with one of those 3 we would have a top 10 OL overnight. We'd be set everywhere except maybe RT, but one of Haeg or Clark should be able to hold it down after they have a year under their belts. Probably Clark. I definitely think he'll want to land one of Ingram or Perry too.  I don't see anyway one of those guys aren't a Colt by the end of the day on the NLY.

 

Nick Perry

Trumaine Johnson

Brandon Williams

TJ Lang

 

That would be a win. Then grab one of Takk, Williams, Harris in the 1st, and an ILB, RB , and another EDGE rusher in the 2nd and 3rd and 4th. In some order.

 

Also. I don't know the situation with Josh Gordon and Darryl Washington. But if both are going to be reinstated, and if they get released, traded or whatever....We should sign/trade for, both ASAP. We'd have a top 3 WR, and an elite ILB for dirt cheap if they can stay on the field. And I'm loving how Ballard seems like the kinda guy to take chances on guys. Hill, Peters, etc. And I don't remember but didn't Chris Jones do something sorta minor? Wasn't there some red flags with him? I cant remember. I know there was another DT who had issues aside from Nkemdiche, but not sure!

[#12.]

Simply put, we have free agency money because Grigson couldn't draft.  Ineptitude gave us a few extra dollars to spend... temporarily.

 

Ballard - If you know what you are doing, should you primarily build through the draft?  Yes, please.

[WoolMagnet]

4 hours ago, Green_Ranger said:

Okay, here me out.

 

For some reason, Chris Ballard seems to be leaning towards the direction of building through the draft. That's fine and all, but with the amount of talent this team lacks at the moment and with Andrew Luck entering his sixth NFL season and doesn't even have a SB appearance yet, doesn't anyone else feel like we need to build this franchise back to a SB caliber team while Luck is still relatively young?

 

Building through the draft is something that we should of did 3-4 years ago, but now I think it's time to get aggressive and if we need to go out and a spend a little money to get someone right now, let's do it.

 

Our QB is locked up for another half a decade and the salary cap will continue to rise.. so why sit around and depend on the draft? Those players are hit or miss anyways.. I hope Ballard ends up spending some cash this off-season on guys who haven't previously played in Indianapolis.

For some reason?

now that is funny.

i didn't read past that line.  Sorry.

for some reason. I almost peed my pants.

[NewColtsFan]

5 hours ago, Green_Ranger said:

Okay, here me out.

 

For some reason, Chris Ballard seems to be leaning towards the direction of building through the draft. That's fine and all, but with the amount of talent this team lacks at the moment and with Andrew Luck entering his sixth NFL season and doesn't even have a SB appearance yet, doesn't anyone else feel like we need to build this franchise back to a SB caliber team while Luck is still relatively young?

 

Building through the draft is something that we should of did 3-4 years ago, but now I think it's time to get aggressive and if we need to go out and a spend a little money to get someone right now, let's do it.

 

Our QB is locked up for another half a decade and the salary cap will continue to rise.. so why sit around and depend on the draft? Those players are hit or miss anyways.. I hope Ballard ends up spending some cash this off-season on guys who haven't previously played in Indianapolis.

 

Two points.    The Colts WILL be buyers this off-season.     We're going to have roughly $60 million in our pocket.   We're not going to keep most of that money there.      We're going to spend it.      So, I don't think you have anything to worry over.

 

Second,   the Colts will ultimately be built through the draft.    Because ALL good teams are built this way.   Free Agency is for mostly plugging holes and filling gaps.     But the foundation of the team -- any team -- is built through the draft.       It's been this way since almost forever.....

 

The trick is to do a good enough job in the draft that you don't have to try and do too much via free agency.

 

 

[Buddy Lee]

5 hours ago, #12. said:

Simply put, we have free agency money because Grigson couldn't draft.  Ineptitude gave us a few extra dollars to spend... temporarily.

 

Ballard - If you know what you are doing, should you primarily build through the draft?  Yes, please.

Excellent point. I can't think of a single player from our 2013 draft that we would want to sign to a second contract. (sarcasm)

 

I think we should focus on Ingram or Perry in FA. After that, Bouye.

[Crunked]

I would prefer if he is going the FA route its with 1 maybe 2 impact additions as opposed to Grigson's rent a D mentality. Just get a top tier FA that is available due to the players current teams cap restraint and leave it at that. Then draft like 6 LB'ers lol

[CoachLite]

My concern with FA is having the right cultural environment to attract the right kind of free agent at the right price - to be the kind of winning team that players really want to play for. How would you make a case for the Colts, other than having Andrew Luck who is trying hard to overcome his constraints? In the tech world, see Google and Facebook and compare with Baidu's harder road. Otherwise, the GM will be faced with Art Jones and Gosder Cherilus types as the best that will come aboard, and expensive.

[NannyMcafee]

Need to sign a couple oline guys. Draft defense heavily. 

[jameszeigler834]

10 hours ago, life long said:

I just hope it is not another art jones or gosder cherilus.... 

There is a lot of great players to be had colts are dumb if they don't use this cap space to their advantage.

[csmopar]

Guys..... he's going to spend at least 40 mill of it, mark my words

[LJpalmbeacher2]

Of course you need to build and sustain your talent through the draft. But if not adding talent in FA would be JUST STUPID!

Almost all new coaches & GM's say the same thing: "we will build through the draft and the trenches". Ballard is no different. I think (and hope) he will be a player in FA. I kinda have a hunch he will go after Poe.

[Smonroe]

2 hours ago, csmopar said:

Guys..... he's going to spend at least 40 mill of it, mark my words

 

There is a minimum, so he'll have to spend.  I know they can play with those numbers, they're really averaged over a few years.

 

 

[Coltfreak]

The problem with believing we cant spend in FA and build on the draft is that the past few drafts have not produced anything so there is nothing to build on right now.  Have to sign a few FA's and as we go forward build through the draft.   Our drafts from 3 years ago should be the playmakers now. But as we all know there isn't anything there.  So to start this off Ballard will need to spend.  We need to win the division in 2017.  That is make or break, the talent is not there to do it and I doubt just using the draft this yr will get us there.

 

Bouye

Lorenzo Alexander

Nich Perry

Zach Brown

Poe 

 

These would all be great players to look at 

 

 

[csmopar]

11 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

There is a minimum, so he'll have to spend.  I know they can play with those numbers, they're really averaged over a few years.

 

 

Yep. I can't recall where I seen it a few weeks back that said we pretty much have to spend 40  million to meet the minimum 

[Coltfreak]

28 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Yep. I can't recall where I seen it a few weeks back that said we pretty much have to spend 40  million to meet the minimum 

I dont think that is correct.    We have to spend 89% over the period from 2013 - 2016.   I am not sure what that number is but I doubt that even if we dont sign anyone we would be below that level.  We have a few of our own FA's that need to be addressed.   Walden, Butler, Doyle just to name 3 that I think we need to keep 

 

 

[aaron11]

When you have this much cap space you dont have much choice but to spend it

[life long]

45 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

I dont think that is correct.    We have to spend 89% over the period from 2013 - 2016.   I am not sure what that number is but I doubt that even if we dont sign anyone we would be below that level.  We have a few of our own FA's that need to be addressed.   Walden, Butler, Doyle just to name 3 that I think we need to keep 

 

 

I hope we dont keep walden!

 

Even if its cheap i want a different starter on the edge, while we have the money to make a change.

[AKB]

12 minutes ago, life long said:

I hope we dont keep walden!

 

Even if its cheap i want a different starter on the edge, while we have the money to make a change.

I appreciate the 10 sacks he had, however I think you are probably right. But I think he might get atleast another year here. Was last year a fluke? Or did he figure it out? I'm not quite sure, but do you release the only person who got any reliable pressure last year?

[Coltfreak]

21 minutes ago, life long said:

I hope we dont keep walden!

 

Even if its cheap i want a different starter on the edge, while we have the money to make a change.

I dont think you can build the defense over night.    Walden is productive. And had zero help.   His numbers compareable to Perry's.  And will be cheaper.

[Coltfreak]

51 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

When you have this much cap space you dont have much choice but to spend it

Well they have to keep money back for next yrs FA's too.  Mewhort, Vontae and Moncreif will become FA's next yr so they may have to try and work out deals for them this yr

 

 

[HarryTheCat]

11 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

For some reason?

now that is funny.

i didn't read past that line.  Sorry.

for some reason. I almost peed my pants.

 

I almost didn't make it past "here" me out...

[RockThatBlue]

We are going to have 60+ million in cap space most likely. Ballard will almost have to go into free agency. There may be only a couple of flash name signings, with probably some mid tier players signed. Thats what I think will happen. 

 

I don't think it'll be anything like Grigsons dive into free agency a few years ago however. I feel like Ballard will be smarter about it.

[Coltfreak]

12 minutes ago, RockThatBlue said:

We are going to have 60+ million in cap space most likely. Ballard will almost have to go into free agency. There may be only a couple of flash name signings, with probably some mid tier players signed. Thats what I think will happen. 

 

I don't think it'll be anything like Grigsons dive into free agency a few years ago however. I feel like Ballard will be smarter about it.

Closer to 45 million.  When you figure in practice squad etc...  if they cut Jones and Jackson we will be back up to about 55. 

[BProland85]

I think a proven pass rushing OLB and NT definitely need to be brought in via FA. I like Nick Perry and Johnathan Hankins. I wouldn't mind Poe if he didn't break the bank. 

[BProland85]

3 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

Closer to 45 million.  When you figure in practice squad etc...  if they cut Jones and Jackson we will be back up to about 55. 

I think Indy could very well have north of 60 mil due to cuts and McAfee's retirement. 

[COLTS449]

15 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

I think a proven pass rushing OLB and NT definitely need to be brought in via FA. I like Nick Perry and Johnathan Hankins. I wouldn't mind Poe if he didn't break the bank. 

 

Really I'd rather have Brandon Williams or Jonathan Hankins. Poe didn't really have a good year this season. That worries me. But don't get me wrong, he has been the most dominant NT in the NFL the last 4-5 years, but I mean maybe injuries had something to do with it I don't know, but I believe Williams and Hankins can be had cheaper than Poe and would be either almost as effective of maybe more. Brandon Williams would be my target between the 3. Like I said in another post Perry, Bouye, Williams, and Lang in FA. That's what I want. That fixes the OL and improves all 3 levels of the D overnight. A dominant NT is pretty helpful to ILB's lol. We'd have to hit big in the draft with an ILB or 2 though. If we got a big time ILB in the 2nd then we could let Edwin Jackson and Antonio Morrison battle it out for the other spot. With a NT like Williams Edwin Jackson paired with a stud next to him we'd be fine. But I'd double up on ILB's in the draft just like I would OLB's, so maybe a 5th or 6th rounder comes in and challenges E-Jax, and Morrison as well. Wish we could find a Jatavis Brown in the 5th this year.

[Jdubu]

I believe Ballard gets a big fish player and uses it like this was re-signing a premiere player from our 2013 draft since we won't be signing any of our 2013 draft picks. We can still resign Doyle as he isn't going to be a Gronk type deal but he will cost some cash. So that will make 2 players for free agent signings and then the draft. Next year, you use your cap space to sign another splash or 2 as if they were in your 2014 draft class although the team may decide that Mewhort and Moncreif are those 2 guys and have to be a bit more modest. Of course you will also have to deal with the cb spot, is Vontae still going to be in that mix or are we looking at a new draft pick that has made progress? If we have Vontae's contract off the books, there is more cap space and a void at the #1 cb spot. 

 

This is why its it's important to have that 3 year vision plan because what they do this year will dictate how they have to move forward in the next 2 seasons. I honestly believe we are one season away,  having a functional defense, from competing for a Super Bowl.  My concern is can Pagano get this team there? I have my concerns that he is that guy. 

[richard pallo]

29 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

I think a proven pass rushing OLB and NT definitely need to be brought in via FA. I like Nick Perry and Johnathan Hankins. I wouldn't mind Poe if he didn't break the bank. 

 That's my thinking too.  Those two positions are the most critical IMo to improve the defense before the draft.  The good news being a couple of solid NT's should be available giving us a great chance to acquire one.  Perry and maybe Ingram could hit the market too.  Another great opportunity to improve the defense.  If we get those two positions I think we hit a home run and are clearly back in the playoff picture before the draft takes place. 

[aaron11]

1 hour ago, Coltfreak said:

Well they have to keep money back for next yrs FA's too.  Mewhort, Vontae and Moncreif will become FA's next yr so they may have to try and work out deals for them this yr

 

 

i dont think there will be a problem getting those three signed.  moncrief hasnt even averaged 500 yards a season, teams (hopefully) wont break the bank to compete for him.  vontae has been just an average nfl corner the last two years.  he will cost some money, its hard to come up with an incentive based contract for a CB so this could get interesting

 

mewhort will do well, but hes a guard

[life long]

1 hour ago, Coltfreak said:

I dont think you can build the defense over night.    Walden is productive. And had zero help.   His numbers compareable to Perry's.  And will be cheaper.

If hes cheap and rotational, maybe. If we can do better via FA or the draft, IMO do it. I would much rather the team avoids resigning walden. 

 

He had a solid year obviously, but it was a contract year and he is no spring chicken. I just want some talent on the edges. He fits the david parry mold. Does everything he can but definetly not a game changer. If cheap i wont complain, as much.

[loudnproudcolt]

Guys, as far as the cap is concerned, I think we will have north of 50M after we extend  Mewhort, Montcrief and Doyle and a few others who will be very low cap hits. The amount over 50M depends on cuts, and there will be more than DQ and Art. That is a lot of money for FA, and I agree I only want quality, not quantity. The one thing to consider though is because of Grigson's drafting, we have cap space of 79M in 2018. So if we don't spend a decent amount of cap space this year going after a couple quality FA's, we would enter 2018 with over 100M in cap space after our carryover of cap space from 2017 goes to 2018. Now in 2018 we will have some people to extend, Vontae, etc. but we are still going to have a huge amount of cap space. Grigson's draft picks have lead to a dearth of our own draft picks to sign, thus we are going to have two years with huge cap space. Don't waste it, but you have to find starters. After 2018, we can hopefully start extending draft picks that Ballard has drafted.

 

Williams over Poe

Lang over Zeitler

A top CB, but Bouye scares me because Houston's defense helps CBs.

 

3 top signings, all start and we will still have plenty of carryover for 2018 to sign all our players we want to extend, and we also can look at where the holes still are after the 2017 draft. 2018 we will have more cap space than this year regardless of what we do this year in FA!

[loudnproudcolt]

One more thought on FA. We may not get the players we all would like for one simple reason, and it shows what bad drafting does to teams. Cleveland and SF both have excess of 100M in cap space this year alone. Players like Trumaine Johnson whose DC is now at Cleveland is going to have huge bucks thrown at him. Cleveland, SF, Jack. still have huge cap space. Players will have to choose dollars over team. Players getting their first FA contract usually pick dollars, so getting the players you want is tough. Hopefully Ballard will be able to talk to some FA's and say look at the culture and not just the dollars. In most cases though if we want someone we target, we will have to pay!

 

Regardless, Cleveland and SF are the two cautionary tales of bad drafting.