ILB Need -- Run stopper or coverage backer?

[Superman]

Not all, I actually think the Colts LBers are pretty good.  I just think they have been asked to do things that are not their strength since Toler went down. I think Angerer is a good every down back.  He is good at stopping the run and he is good in coverage but he's not great at either.   I think if the Colts get back to playing more man with the CBs than Freeman is a great LBer for the D, he will make plays in the running game from hash mark to hash mark (doesn't quite of the top end speed to be a sideline to sideline type player, but that is what Walden is for... to prevent it from getting to the sideline).

 

Conner is a good run stopper but again he is limited in his range... more of a between the tackles type.

 

I don't know enough about the other back-ups like Studebaker to really know how they'd fit.

 

Studebaker has been playing more OLB from what I've seen. Actually hasn't looked that bad, aside from a poor contain against the Titans.

 

McNary has only just begun to play, and has mostly been used as a Joker rusher. He seems to have speed and range, but that doesn't mean he can cover. He also seems like a technical tackler, but he might be more of a dragdown guy like Angerer. Again, I haven't seen nearly enough of him yet to know.

 

So if we get back to primarily playing man on the outside, and get better nickel coverage, then you're happy with Freeman as the every down backer. And in that event, you'd prefer to pair him with a thumper, someone like Conner, but hopefully better. Did I get that right?

 

I'm thinking that would be best for the overall performance of the defense. Get back to more physical and aggressive man coverage, which helps the pass rush. 

[Superman]

Yes but Angerer could be upgraded. I don't think he's terrible either. Freeman is a good example of what I'd want if I couldn't have someone like Peterson.

 

Peterson?

[JoKeR]

I believe he stated that obviously it would be better to have an ILB good at both. But those type of players are pretty rare.

There's plenty of LBers that are good at both but not many are excellent.

[Superman]

No there's players like Patrick Peterson and then there Patrick Peterson lite. There's plenty of LBers that are good at both but not many are excellent at both.

 

Patrick Peterson is a corner (a really good one). Who are you thinking about?

[GoColtsGo5150]

What are the chances Skov lasts until the end of the second round? I think slim to none. If anything, I see him moving up into the first round. He's one of the more complete ILB prospects in the draft, and he can play strongside backer in a 4-3 defense, so plenty of teams will have their eye on him.

As for Arthur Jones, I think we're okay at DE/DT. Redding has another year on his deal, and Hughes has looked good lately. RJF has done just fine, despite the protests from fans. I'd rather have Jones than Redding, but I don't think we should get rid of Redding to make room for Jones.

I think Skov does have the potential of falling a bit ( maybe injury past etc) but he is ( like you said) one of the more complete ILBs in the draft.

As for Jones, I'd like to point out I do like Redding and RJF, but I think Jones could rotate with eith on pass rushing situations and when Redding retires, Jones can take over.

[JoKeR]

Peterson?

Patrick Willis, sorry, I just can't think of names right now. ILBs that are excellent at both are very rare but there's plenty that decent at both.

[JoKeR]

Sorry about the confusion, I'm a bit distracted

[throwing BBZ]

Let me ask you this: Do you think we have any every down linebackers right now? 

 

Noooo. We have no ILB worthy of playing 3rd and long. Hopefully McNary has the speed.

Figuring a roster of 4 ILB`s with no 3 down ones.

2 good run stoppers and 2 that can cover

[Superman]

Patrick Willis, sorry, I just can't think of names right now. ILBs that are excellent at both are very rare but there's plenty that decent at both.

 

LOL

 

I was starting to get angry. My next post would have been "WHO ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!?"

 

Yeah, Willis is the standard. Too bad most backers fall short of that standard. His buddy Bowman fits as well. 

[Dustin]

Did Angerer get benched on Sunday? He only played 22 snaps. 

[Superman]

Did Angerer get benched on Sunday? He only played 22 snaps. 

 

We were in nickel a lot. And McNary and Sheppard played a lot. I don't think he got benched, but he was off the field a bit.

[OLD FAN MAN]

In a perfect world, we'd find or have an inside linebacker who is a monster against the run and great in coverage. Actually, we'd have two of them, like the Niners with Willis and Bowman. The world is NOT perfect, and after looking at a lot of the free agents and draft prospects at ILB, I think we'd be better off getting a guy who can do one or the other really well, rather than one who is average at both.

 

So if you had to choose between an inside backer who was excellent against the run, but struggled in coverage, vs one who isn't that good against the run but covers really well, which would you choose? Which do you think would complement our current defensive personnel the best? Which would make the most difference to our defense?

I would want a big aggressive lb who could stop the run behind the line and also on pass plays break through the line and put pressure on the qb, then have the safety cover the pass if the qb dosent get sacked, attack instead of covering a pass and then tackle for a gain

[Mameluc]

id say coverage because they are harder to get, and because the trent is TE who exploits LB and you can probably get a role ILB whose sole role is to deffend vs the run like cheap. 

[OLD FAN MAN]

In a perfect world, we'd find or have an inside linebacker who is a monster against the run and great in coverage. Actually, we'd have two of them, like the Niners with Willis and Bowman. The world is NOT perfect, and after looking at a lot of the free agents and draft prospects at ILB, I think we'd be better off getting a guy who can do one or the other really well, rather than one who is average at both.

 

So if you had to choose between an inside backer who was excellent against the run, but struggled in coverage, vs one who isn't that good against the run but covers really well, which would you choose? Which do you think would complement our current defensive personnel the best? Which would make the most difference to our defense?

I like all of the front 7 to bring enough heat to disrupt the run and the pass, let the cbs and safetys cover man to man, I want a big mean ilb who can tackle behind the line before the play can develop, pass coverage most times results in a gain

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

We desperately need an inside thumper to impose his will on the other team a guy with size preferably a guy between 245 to 260

[coltsfanatic24]

Were in a era where Qb's are breaking passing records and throwing between 4,500-5,000 yards a year, i would much rather have an athletic ILB that can cover. The last thing we need is a big slow ILB like Spikes that can't cover.

 

We have been good against the run up the middle the problem has been on the edges. Mathis has given up a ton of big runs because he's over pursuing on every play which is great for sacks, but it's really hurting the run defense. Walden has been below average as well. Mathis should be only used on 3rd downs need another 260 OLB opposite Werner.

 

The biggest problem with this team is the OLB's. Both Mathis and Walden are undersized and both rank bottom in the league vs the run and in coverage. Werner has the size to be good vs the run and the more he improves the better the defense will be. If we can draft an athletic ILB like Yawin Smallwood or Denzel Perryman and pair one with Freeman teams won't be able to just beat us with crossing routes, that's how we loss vs Chargers and Rams.

[chad72]

I ran into Pat Angerer at Lowes in Brownsburg last Thursday night. I talked about the Cincy weather for the game and he told me he will be freezing his b**** off in Cincy. I told him "at least he is a defender and can make it hurt more". I shook his hands and wished him luck. I felt like he was surprised someone recognized him in plain man clothes.

 

I guess he did not see the field as much, huh?

[SOMDColtsfan]

I want a "put the fear of God" type ILB. A hurts every time they tackle. I believe that always spills over to pass coverage and gets in a WR or TE`s head. Cato June for example was a good pass coverage type LB but would get run over by a bigger RB. Am sick and tired of that type Colts defender. We gonna call it a "monster" then be a "monster"!

Edited December 11, 2013 by Superman
formatting

[jbaron04]

I believe he stated that obviously it would be better to have an ILB good at both.  But those type of players are pretty rare.

what we need is , to get rid of bethea and pat , get a saftey we playing making skills like bryd and a ILB that can run 

[Superman]

I'm starting to think we need to replace Freeman also. For someone who isn't all that great against the run, he's not that good in coverage either. He can blitz very well, and he's not a bad tackler, but he's not going to get off of or redirect blocks. He tries to use his speed to get around blockers, and takes himself out of position.

[Franklin County]

I'm starting to think we need to replace Freeman also. For someone who isn't all that great against the run, he's not that good in coverage either. He can blitz very well, and he's not a bad tackler, but he's not going to get off of or redirect blocks. He tries to use his speed to get around blockers, and takes himself out of position.

Noticed that in the Bengals game. He was always on the wrong side of the blocker to make a play on the ball. I remember wondering what was wrong with him in that game. Then noticed he was blocked out of the plays and tried to run the ball down from behind.

 

 Still like to see more of McNary play.

[TKnight24]

I vote for CJ Mosley

[SkyBane]

A coverage guy, imo. The Tight End has become a huge passing weapon in the NFL, and corners really cant cover those guys most of ths time. You need a linebacker whos fast enough and good enough in coverage not to let those guys muscle yards over the middle.

[The Peytonator]

How do you guys think Wesley Woodyard or Jon Beason would look in our D?

 

 

Who would be your preference; Woodyard, Beason, Spikes, or Karlos Dansby?

[Gavin]

Dansby can do a little of everything......he is 32 though so not a long term solution...which is the downside

[Coffeedrinker]

what we need is , to get rid of bethea and pat , get a saftey we playing making skills like bryd and a ILB that can run 

Ok, if you say so.

 

Not just your post but a lot of the responses to this thread and others make me so happy that fans do not make decisions for the team.  So many do not understand what they are seeing or what makes a player look bad as opposed to being bad.

[Coffeedrinker]

Did Angerer get benched on Sunday? He only played 22 snaps. 

He got injured a sat for a bit as well.

[JoKeR]

I'm not so sure size/skill set is the problem, but fundamentals. The LBers have been pressing and over persuiting, resulting being out of position.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

Were in a era where Qb's are breaking passing records and throwing between 4,500-5,000 yards a year, i would much rather have an athletic ILB that can cover. The last thing we need is a big slow ILB like Spikes that can't cover.

 

We have been good against the run up the middle the problem has been on the edges. Mathis has given up a ton of big runs because he's over pursuing on every play which is great for sacks, but it's really hurting the run defense. Walden has been below average as well. Mathis should be only used on 3rd downs need another 260 OLB opposite Werner.

 

The biggest problem with this team is the OLB's. Both Mathis and Walden are undersized and both rank bottom in the league vs the run and in coverage. Werner has the size to be good vs the run and the more he improves the better the defense will be. If we can draft an athletic ILB like Yawin Smallwood or Denzel Perryman and pair one with Freeman teams won't be able to just beat us with crossing routes, that's how we loss vs Chargers and Rams.

We get gashed up the middle all the time! and the edge too. Usually Walden's side.

[jbaron04]

Ok, if you say so.

Not just your post but a lot of the responses to this thread and others make me so happy that fans do not make decisions for the team. So many do not understand what they are seeing or what makes a player look bad as opposed to being bad.

so when the ball huts bethea in his hand and he drops the ball time an time again, instead of turn over the team goes uo and scores. ....

[dudeski]

Did Angerer get benched on Sunday? He only played 22 snaps.

he has been losing snaps to Shepard lately

[achcolts]

conner seriously needs to play. its ridiculous. ive never seen him have a bad game when he played/started.

[GOCOLTS_ROLLTIDE]

How do you guys think Wesley Woodyard or Jon Beason would look in our D?

Who would be your preference; Woodyard, Beason, Spikes, or Karlos Dansby?

SPIKES!!

[krunk]

I like the potential of Mcnary. I think he may be the one to over take Angerer.  I think (although I don't have a whole lot of proof) he's got

the ability to do a little bit of everything well.

[backshoulderfade]

It's a sad state of affairs when players are described as "less of a liability".

[Hammer]

Sounds like you're over the entire linebacking corps. Do you think anyone we have right now is adequate as an every down backer?

 

  Yes we do. Angerer should sit every down.

[TKnight24]

It's a sad state of affairs when players are described as "less of a liability".

Makes you wish we had depth like the Seahawks & 49ers doesn't it?

[Superman]

  Yes we do. Angerer should sit every down.