You have to love Big Q

[Coffeedrinker]

22 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

Do i have to keep reminding the fan base over and over.  He wasn't worth  the #6 overall pick in the draft.  No guard is worth picking that high; the position is not with it.  It's not a game changing position.  Geez u people.  Sarcasm hahah

To be fair, that group that spouted (and still spouts that) was a pretty small but very vocal (or type heavy) group.  Most fans on this forum thought Nelson was a great pick at the time.

[Coffeedrinker]

15 hours ago, DougDew said:

It was actually Haeg who led the way on that play.  But it won't be posted because Nelson was irrelevant, which doesn't fit the thread.

That is not entirely true.  Haeg, AC and (I believe) Allie-Cox all did an excellent job forming that wall on the run play.

 

Nelson fell down and yes that is why it's not in the highlight vid.

[Mel Kiper's Hair]

Big Q is nasty! I just love watching those clips! 

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, Coffeedrinker said:

That is not entirely true.  Haeg, AC and (I believe) Allie-Cox all did an excellent job forming that wall on the run play.

 

Nelson fell down and yes that is why it's not in the highlight vid.

I know.  I said led, which implies that a group was involved.  I didn't say by himself.  But yes, Nelson didn't do anything and yet the Colts were still able to power the ball into the endzone on the left side.  Which I wouldn't think would be remotely possible unless Nelson was involved, if I only got information from this forum.

 

You can pick a nit as to which of the three blocked his man the best.  IMO, it was Haeg.

 

BTW, isn't a pancake like a dunk in basketball?  Both of them are equally pointless.  All you need to do is block the man, or score two points.  Why go through all of that wasteful energy expense for no more points?  Its fun to watch for sure, but they are both otherwise a waste of motion and an injury risk.  

[Coffeedrinker]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I know.  I said led, which implies that a group was involved.  I didn't say by himself.  But yes, Nelson didn't do anything and yet the Colts were still able to power the ball into the endzone on the left side.  Which I wouldn't think would be remotely possible unless Nelson was involved, if I only got information from this forum.

 

You can pick a nit as to which of the three blocked his man the best.  IMO, it was Haeg.

Lead block implies a group?  Ok.

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

 

BTW, isn't a pancake like a dunk in basketball?  Both of them are equally pointless.  All you need to do is block the man, or score two points.  Why go through all of that wasteful energy expense for no more points?  Its fun to watch for sure, but they are both otherwise a waste of motion and an injury risk.  

No, a pancake is not like a dunk in basketball nor is it pointless.  A dunk in basketball does take a physical toll on the other players... a pancake block does.  Not only having a 330lb guy landing on top of the you but then having to pick yourself up after each time... that wears down on a player both physically and mentally and it helps with things like the running back being able to run the ball 5 times for 47 yards to close out the game.

[DougDew]

3 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

No, a pancake is not like a dunk in basketball nor is it pointless.  A dunk in basketball does take a physical toll on the other players... a pancake block does.  Not only having a 330lb guy landing on top of the you but then having to pick yourself up after each time... that wears down on a player both physically and mentally and it helps with things like the running back being able to run the ball 5 times for 47 yards to close out the game.

Sure, I get that.  My concern is that it might take a toll on his wrist when he falls funny, as many of his pancakes occur when he is falling forward being engaged with the defender. 

 

I hope he doesn't pancake a defender early in the KC game, hurt his wrist or something, then has to sit out the rest of the game.  Bummer. 

 

There was one play where he completely blocked his man through the whistle as he took his man down field, but stayed on his feet.  Much better than a pancake and I hope he does that much more. 

 

I like football players who can block well without falling over. 

[aaron11]

we could probably be ok with average guard play, but nelson has been elite and a difference maker

 

 

[Coffeedrinker]

3 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Sure, I get that.  My concern is that it might take a toll on his wrist when he falls funny, as many of his pancakes occur when he is falling forward being engaged with the defender. 

 

I hope he doesn't pancake a defender early in the KC game, hurt his wrist or something, then has to sit out the rest of the game.  Bummer. 

 

There was one play where he completely blocked his man through the whistle as he took his man down field, but stayed on his feet.  Much better than a pancake and I hope he does that much more. 

 

I like football players who can block well without falling over. 

Most people who know about football don't consider a pancake block "falling over" but I realize you like be contrarian on most posts.

 

I will also say I have not heard of a lineman on any level hurting his wrist on a pancake block.  Not saying it hasn't happened just that it is so rare as to be practically unheard.  Now on the flip side I have seen and heard many lineman driving a guy at the line or down field get their leg rolled up on and suffering a sever injury.  So you claim to be worried about injury but the block you want him to do more of leads to more injuries than pancake blocks.

[Dingus McGirt]

Nelson blocks as he does for much more than the immediate impact on the play, IMO.  He crushes the opponent to, over time, exhaust them and lessen their will.  You can call him Big Q, QHOP or any other nickname.  He is a football version of Conan the Barbarian, IMO.

[DougDew]

9 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Most people who know about football don't consider a pancake block "falling over" but I realize you like be contrarian on most posts.

 

I will also say I have not heard of a lineman on any level hurting his wrist on a pancake block.  Not saying it hasn't happened just that it is so rare as to be practically unheard.  Now on the flip side I have seen and heard many lineman driving a guy at the line or down field get their leg rolled up on and suffering a sever injury.  So you claim to be worried about injury but the block you want him to do more of leads to more injuries than pancake blocks.

To me, it looks like he has the proper technique of grabbing the defender by the jersey under the pads and takes him out of the play.  Great.  He does that really well and deserves all recognition he can get.

 

But then, IMO, he engages too long to where the defender falls over and he ends up getting taken down with him.  At least some of his pancakes seem accidental in that regard.  I'd rather see him stop engaging after he successfully blocked the defender instead of carrying it to a point to where he ends up on the ground. 

 

Not contrarian.  Just seeing things without rose colored glasses.

[chad hugo]

 

[Narcosys]

7 minutes ago, DougDew said:

To me, it looks like he has the proper technique of grabbing the defender by the jersey under the pads and takes him out of the play.  Great.  He does that really well and deserves all recognition he can get.

 

But then, IMO, he engages too long to where the defender falls over and he ends up getting taken down with him.  At least some of his pancakes seem accidental in that regard.  I'd rather see him stop engaging after he successfully blocked the defender instead of carrying it to a point to where he ends up on the ground. 

 

Not contrarian.  Just seeing things without rose colored glasses.

what takes a player out longer, getting pushed out and then released, or having a 330lb person land on you over and over, crushing the wind out of you?

[chad72]

2 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

what takes a player out longer, getting pushed out and then released, or having a 330lb person land on you over and over, crushing the wind out of you?

 

Not to mention the fact that if it is a play where your QB needs more time, the player you release could hustle back and make a play like they are taught to do. If your assignment is to engage and assist before you get to the next level, you release. If not, you engage till you hear the ref whistle. 

[DougDew]

1 minute ago, Narcosys said:

what takes a player out longer, getting pushed out and then released, or having a 330lb person land on you over and over, crushing the wind out of you?

The latter.  But the former is often plenty good.  I hope Nelson's next pancaked defender doesn't roll up on ACs ankle.

 

But I'm more of the precision type guy, which is why I am also never impressed with those big receivers who can make contested catches that so many want the Colts to have.  Nicks, DA, AJ, etc.  So I see excessive physicality as unnecessary and an injury risk, but others see it differently.

[Cynjin]

25 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Most people who know about football don't consider a pancake block "falling over" but I realize you like be contrarian on most posts.

 

I will also say I have not heard of a lineman on any level hurting his wrist on a pancake block.  Not saying it hasn't happened just that it is so rare as to be practically unheard.  Now on the flip side I have seen and heard many lineman driving a guy at the line or down field get their leg rolled up on and suffering a sever injury.  So you claim to be worried about injury but the block you want him to do more of leads to more injuries than pancake blocks.

 

I wish you luck in trying to explain anything to that poster.  Pancake blocks are now a negative,  smh.

[DougDew]

6 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

Not to mention the fact that if it is a play where your QB needs more time, the player you release could hustle back and make a play like they are taught to do. If your assignment is to engage and assist before you get to the next level, you release. If not, you engage till you hear the ref whistle. 

I mentioned a play where Nelson takes his man out of the picture ala the Blind Side.  The defender is not getting back into the play under those circumstances.  That's more impressive to me than falling over and onto the defender, even though that results in the defender being out of the play too.

 

If Luck gets rid of the ball when he is supposed to, and the receivers get open when they are supposed to, the defender should be out of the play pretty quickly if blocked.

 

I get the demoralization aspect of being pancaked, but a defender who is consistently just moved out of the way at will gets demoralized too.

[lollygagger8]

Live footage has leaked of the Texans D-Line after the game.......

 

[chad72]

9 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

 

I wish you luck in trying to explain anything to that poster.  Pancake blocks are now a negative,  smh.

 

By now, you should know that poster's pride is far more important than acknowledgement of the fact that they are nitpicking one out of several plays that didn't go right or wasn't done like he would have wished it were done (they can talk to coach Guge). Yawwwnnn is all I have to say for that , I am not engaging!!!

[Coffeedrinker]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I mentioned a play where Nelson takes his man out of the picture ala the Blind Side.  The defender is not getting back into the play under those circumstances.  That's more impressive to me than falling over and onto the defender, even though that results in the defender being out of the play too.

 

If Luck gets rid of the ball when he is supposed to, and the receivers get open when they are supposed to, the defender should be out of the play pretty quickly if blocked.

 

I get the demoralization aspect of being pancaked, but a defender who is consistently just moved out of the way at will gets demoralized too.

Again... contrarian.  I know you will say you are a realists or you are not looking at things through "rose colored" or "blue colored" glasses.  But you are just being contrarian.

 

That what makes Nelson such a great guard and a tremendous value as a #6 draft pick.  He is a great technician and he can destroy the defender. He's not just a guy that is strong, he's not just a guy that moves well, he's not just a technician, he is not just a hard worker that plays to the whistle, he is all of those and a team leader and someone that works to improve his game. That is why he was considered and (proving to be) a generational talent. 

 

But you want to whine about his pancake blocks... the reason is, once again a moving target.  At first you didn't like pancakes because he may hurt his wrist, then it was because it's a waste of energy and then it may be because he rolls up AC's leg and then it's because you are more a "precision guy". 

 

My word, quit whining and enjoy the Colts.  If you must, point out actual flaws.  Instead you try to make a negative from something every football lineman and line coach at every level considers a positive all because you want to be a contrarian.

[Coffeedrinker]

10 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

By now, you should know that poster's pride is far more important than acknowledgement of the fact that they are nitpicking one out of several plays that didn't go right or wasn't done like he would have wished it were done (they can talk to coach Guge). Yawwwnnn is all I have to say for that , I am not engaging!!!

You are a wise man Chad72.  And I am being sincere.

[DougDew]

Just now, Coffeedrinker said:

Again... contrarian.  I know you will say you are a realists or you are not looking at things through "rose colored" or "blue colored" glasses.  But you are just being contrarian.

 

That what makes Nelson such a great guard and a tremendous value as a #6 draft pick.  He is a great technician and he can destroy the defender. He's not just a guy that is strong, he's not just a guy that moves well, he's not just a technician, he is not just a hard worker that plays to the whistle, he is all of those and a team leader and someone that works to improve his game. That is why he was considered and (proving to be) a generational talent. 

 

But you want to whine about his pancake blocks... the reason is, once again a moving target.  At first you didn't like pancakes because he may hurt his wrist, then it was because it's a waste of energy and then it may be because he rolls up AC's leg and then it's because you are more a "precision guy". 

 

My word, quit whining and enjoy the Colts.  If you must, point out actual flaws.  Instead you try to make a negative from something every football lineman and line coach at every level considers a positive all because you want to be a contrarian.

I'm not whining about his pancake blocks.  I wouldn't bring it up unless others were commending him for it.  There are always trade offs and alternative scenarios, like what if another olineman fails his assignment but Q can't help out because he chose to lay on his man?

 

I'm simply saying that over time it seems to me the smart play is to stay on your feet as much as possible.

[Coffeedrinker]

3 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I'm not whining about his pancake blocks.  I wouldn't bring it up unless others were commending him for it.  There are always trade offs and alternative scenarios, like what if another olineman fails his assignment but Q can't help out because he chose to lay on his man?

 

I'm simply saying that over time it seems to me the smart play is to stay on your feet as much as possible.

Well, I guess you have as much right to be completely wrong as anyone else.... you are just much more emphatic and verbose about proving how wrong you can be.

[chrisfarley]

44 minutes ago, chad hugo said:

 

How does a guy of that size have feet and hands that quick.  He's like a boa constrictor.  No mercy.

[chad72]

15 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

You are a wise man Chad72.  And I am being sincere.

 

It sounded like my nitpicking mother-in-law (who is actually my wife's stepmom). Whether it is good or bad food served by us at Christmas when we host, she always has something to say, I also "had" friends like that.

 

Over time (it did not happen overnight), I have learnt not to react and engage, and let it go through from one ear to another. In the past, I would engage over and over again and it would lead to arguments, not worth it.  

 

 

[dodsworth]

32 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I'm not whining about his pancake blocks.  I wouldn't bring it up unless others were commending him for it.  There are always trade offs and alternative scenarios, like what if another olineman fails his assignment but Q can't help out because he chose to lay on his man?

 

I'm simply saying that over time it seems to me the smart play is to stay on your feet as much as possible.

You do realize when QHOP pancakes his guy, the play is almost over at the time. You have to claim dominance if you are a smash mouth team and 

pancaking your guy to submissiveness is the best way.

 

Last week Watt looked confused and mentally broken because he

couldn't get into our backfield as he is used to. Thus the tone of the 

game has been set, their will was broken and the game was in the books

early in the game. 

 

SMH because I am highly confused a Colts fan would complain about

QHOP being physical. 

 

[Blueblazes]

25 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

It sounded like my nitpicking mother-in-law (who is actually my wife's stepmom). Whether it is good or bad food served by us at Christmas when we host, she always has something to say, I also "had" friends like that.

 

Over time (it did not happen overnight), I have learnt not to react and engage, and let it go through from one ear to another. In the past, I would engage over and over again and it would lead to arguments, not worth it.  

 

 

Totally get this Chad. Good job. I have often thought that some on here would argue if you said on a clear day the sky appears blue (appears). Good going.

[DougDew]

2 minutes ago, dodsworth said:

You do realize when QHOP pancakes his guy, the play is almost over at the time. You have to claim dominance if you are a smash mouth team and 

pancaking your guy to submissiveness is the best way.

 

Last week Watt looked confused and mentally broken because he

couldn't get into our backfield as he is used to. Thus the tone of the 

game has been set, their will was broken and the game was in the books

early in the game. 

 

SMH because I am highly confused a Colts fan would complain about

QHOP being physical. 

 

I think you just made my point about it being a waste of time if its true that the play is almost over when Q pancakes his man.    He did his job very well....then fell over.

 

And not getting to the QB is what would demoralize a pass rusher.  Being blocked does that.  They stop running forward so fast.

[dodsworth]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

I think you just made my point about it being a waste of time if its true that the play is almost over when Q pancakes his man.    He did his job very well....then fell over.

 

And not getting to the QB is what would demoralize a pass rusher.  Being blocked does that.  They stop running forward so fast.

Obviously you miss the days of the Colts being soft as butter

in the trenches. Again I can't wrap my head around your 

position on this topic.

[dodsworth]

4 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I think you just made my point about it being a waste of time if its true that the play is almost over when Q pancakes his man.    He did his job very well....then fell over.

 

And not getting to the QB is what would demoralize a pass rusher.  Being blocked does that.  They stop running forward so fast.

There is a difference in blocking your man and breaking his will.

This is why you pancake your opponent......

[BullsColtsFan1]

Big Q is a beast!  I loved when he put Clowney on the ground a few times!

[DougDew]

2 minutes ago, dodsworth said:

There is a difference in blocking your man and breaking his will.

This is why you pancake your opponent......

I get that, but a defender doesn't have to be on the ground for that to happen.  Simply getting consistently blocked also does that.  I simply assume that several to many other olineman in the NFL can pancake also if they stayed engaged until the play is almost over.  I see many of them do their job then disengage and stay on their feet, so I assume most seasoned professionals see value in approaching it that way.   Again, Q certainly is a great blocker.

[BProland85]

I LOVE this video. Skip to 3:40 and simply watch him DOMINATE Clowney who is an athletic freak. I'll admit I have watched it over and over. Can't get enough of Big Q. I have never watched OL play as much as this season and I'm loving it!

 

 

[gspdx]

10 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I get that, but a defender doesn't have to be on the ground for that to happen.  Simply getting consistently blocked also does that.  I simply assume that several to many other olineman in the NFL can pancake also if they stayed engaged until the play is almost over.  I see many of them do their job then disengage and stay on their feet, so I assume most seasoned professionals see value in approaching it that way.   Again, Q certainly is a great blocker.

 

Be careful when you assume!

[Goatface Killah]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

To me, it looks like he has the proper technique of grabbing the defender by the jersey under the pads and takes him out of the play.  Great.  He does that really well and deserves all recognition he can get.

 

But then, IMO, he engages too long to where the defender falls over and he ends up getting taken down with him.  At least some of his pancakes seem accidental in that regard.  I'd rather see him stop engaging after he successfully blocked the defender instead of carrying it to a point to where he ends up on the ground. 

 

Not contrarian.  Just seeing things without rose colored glasses.

By far the most ridiculous thing Ive ever read on here.

 

You want him to let his man go, instead of driving him into the ground?

 

The kid just made first team all pro and hes getting pointers from Doug Dew lol

[dodsworth]

6 minutes ago, DougDew said:

I get that, but a defender doesn't have to be on the ground for that to happen.  Simply getting consistently blocked also does that.  I simply assume that several to many other olineman in the NFL can pancake also if they stayed engaged until the play is almost over.  I see many of them do their job then disengage and stay on their feet, so I assume most seasoned professionals see value in approaching it that way.   Again, Q certainly is a great blocker.

I understand your viewpoint, but being a lineman is a thankless job.

These guys are having a ball splattering the opposition in the trenches,

the comrodery these guys have is partly by having fun being physical.

 

Being physical is in QHOP's DNA, he is who he is.

[DougDew]

1 hour ago, dodsworth said:

I understand your viewpoint, but being a lineman is a thankless job.

These guys are having a ball splattering the opposition in the trenches,

the comrodery these guys have is partly by having fun being physical.

 

Being physical is in QHOP's DNA, he is who he is.

Its a lot of fun.  I'm certainly not criticizing what he does, but I'm also short of praising it.  I think more seasoned pros probably backed off that stuff a bit the first time they missed a game or had to play gimpy because of that excessive physicality.  He's a great blocker and I want him to be 100% for every snap.

[Lucky Colts Fan]

10 hours ago, DougDew said:

but I'm also short of praising it.

 

You're the only one.

 

Literally everyone else, from our owner, GM, coaches, teammates, to analysts, and every single fan except you, absolutely loves it.

 

But I'm sure Watt, Clowney and every other DLineman that's not on the Colts would agree with you that Nelson should stop being so mean and quit pancaking those poor boys. 

[Coltscrazy]

A poster had a pic of Blue Nasty in a boat where it showed that he was ripped as well as huge.  If I had a magic lamp and three wishes, one would be to have a body like that.  There are big Q and five other guys, and then everyone else on earth is one of those little guys.  As a former OL, pancakes are a very good thing.  Believe it or not, OL is one of the few places in professional football or basketball where you are still allowed to be physical and destroy people.  I get that there are wall off players, and schemes where it is okay to just get in the way, but if you want to honest to goodness run block, you need to be able to let a physically gifted lineman destroy the man across from him, and maybe a few others along the way.

[Dark Superman]

Dude has the strength of a Grizzly Bear. I know he's a big guy but watching him run through some of the NFL's best defensive linemen is downright nasty!

[KelownaColtsFan]

That play where he just absolutely beasts Clowney is my favorite. It's as good or better than Mack's stiff arm on Clowney last year.