Freeman Taunting Call

[Nesjan3]

yeah we tried McNary when Freeman was hurt this year he was far worse. Again just because you want someone better doesn't mean you have someone better just waiting for a chance. So if the Colts benched Freemsn who do you want them to play?

Im not saying anyone on the bench is better than freeman, but him not being benched for that play shows and proves the lack of integrity in our coaching staff.

[GoColts8818]

Im not saying anyone on the bench is better than freeman, but him not being benched for that play shows and proves the lack of integrity in our coaching staff.

no it doesn't it is flat out dumb to bench a player who has been a good starter for you because he commits one bad penality on the first series of the game. You are then playing without your best talent for the rest of the game which puts you at a disadvantage. If Freeman had a history of this then maybe you have a case but he doesn't or if he kept making the same mistake but he didn't. You handle it behind closed doors by talking to him and bringing it up in film study and using this as a chance to address to the whole team you have to play smarter because it's these mistakes that kill you. If you really need to you fine him for it. We have no way of knowing if these things have happened or not so we can't assume either way. What you don't do is put your team at a compative disadvantage because your mad that's just dumb coaching.

[Nesjan3]

no it doesn't it is flat out dumb to bench a player who has been a good starter for you because he commits one bad penality on the first series of the game. You are then playing without your best talent for the rest of the game which puts you at a disadvantage. If Freeman had a history of this then maybe you have a case but he doesn't or if he kept making the same mistake but he didn't. You handle it behind closed doors by talking to him and bringing it up in film study and using this as a chance to address to the whole team you have to play smarter because it's these mistakes that kill you. If you really need to you fine him for it. We have no way of knowing if these things have happened or not so we can't assume either way. What you don't do is put your team at a compative disadvantage because your mad that's just dumb coaching.

you have obviously have no idea how coaching works im done talking

[Superman]

Im not saying anyone on the bench is better than freeman, but him not being benched for that play shows and proves the lack of integrity in our coaching staff.

 

No it doesn't. That's hogwash.

[Nesjan3]

No it doesn't. That's hogwash.

typical answer for someone not willing to accept the facts

[GoColts8818]

typical answer for someone not willing to accept the facts

fact: Your opinion is not fact just because you say it is.

[Superman]

typical answer for someone not willing to accept the facts

 

Hogwash.

 

Attack me all you want, doesn't change the fact that what you're saying isn't sensible.

[dw49]

or makes you think he's gone as far as an undrafted free agent player can go. There is a reason he went undrafted in the first place.

 

Yeah.. who knows. But he was small.... 6' and a little on the light side. Plus he never had played LB at Navy. Then he had the 2 year military service commitment. Also he wasn't really going to even be available for the 2013 training  camp. So teams were looking at a lot of negatives but I don't think there was a lack of talent. 

[yankeeclipper]

I watched Rewind on NFL Network. I thought that was a nonsense call.

[amfootball]

Cause I don't like Gronk

This is why you are my favorite poster.   :luv:   You never pull any punches.  

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

Kinda strange that I knew what was coming. I literally typed "OMG" while watching him do that, because he did it so long and I knew what was next.

http://forums.colts.com/topic/33925-colts-cowboys-game-day-thread/?p=973982

Dunno what examples you've seen of players doing what he did and getting away with it, but the NFL isn't allowing that trash anymore, and I'm glad for it.

I'm sorry but the refs? Allowing trash? I'm sorry but they themselves are trash. They don't care about the fairness of the game we see this week in and week out.

[MR. Blueblood]

I'm actually not sure who was worse....

 

The refs, or the commentators. 

 

It's hard to drink when you already have a mouth full of Romo juice.

 

If that was a taunting penalty, then what was this?:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-england-patriots/0ap3000000443346/Tom-Brady-busts-a-move

Is there some rule that says Tom Brady can taunt and others can't?

Apples to Oranges.  This play is nothing close to what Freeman did.

 

That being said the NFL did create a whole new roughing the passer rule after their golden boy missed a whole season.  And this is another example of a call that the refs aren't consistent with.  I see forceable contact below the knee a lot, and if you're not an upper tier QB you won't get this flag nearly as much as the Bradys of the NFL get.

[Cynjin]

I'm actually not sure who was worse....

 

The refs, or the commentators. 

 

 

I have to go with the commentators, Simms, like many color commentators doesn't know when keep quiet.  Too many times the color analysts believe they have to say something/anything no matter how nonsensical it is.

[Cynjin]

Apples to Oranges.  This play is nothing close to what Freeman did.

 

That being said the NFL did create a whole new roughing the passer rule after their golden boy missed a whole season.  And this is another example of a call that the refs aren't consistent with.  I see forceable contact below the knee a lot, and if you're not an upper tier QB you won't get this flag nearly as much as the Bradys of the NFL get.

 

I agree that what occurred with Brady was different than what Freeman did, however according to the rule what Brady did is still taunting.  Which is why they should either call all of it or none of it, not this oh this player was standing over another player vs they were face to face.  Taunting is taunting, it should not matter what positions their respective bodies were in, either allow it or don't.

[rko_kero]

I saw Jeremy Hill do the same thing yesterday when he ran over a bronco....stood over him and started saying something. Why didn't he get a penalty?

 

EVERY play has someone taunting, and if you're going to enforce it, don't pick and choose.

[jimmy g]

It's football.. Players talk, it's a part of the game. You don't kill a teams momentum by what should of been a 4th and 14 to a 1st and 10. The call killed the entire momentum of the game for us.

agreed. Huge momentum swing.

[dw49]

This is why you are my favorite poster.   :luv:   You never pull any punches.  

 

 

Would like him very much and , even his chirping , if he had a horseshoe on his helmet.

[pgt_rob]

I saw Jeremy Hill do the same thing yesterday when he ran over a bronco....stood over him and started saying something. Why didn't he get a penalty?

 

EVERY play has someone taunting, and if you're going to enforce it, don't pick and choose.

 

Refs were cold and wet and wanted to go home. Didn't want to drag the game on further.

[jimmy g]

I know I'm an old fogey, but I think All Taunting/Celebrating should be taboo. Nothing like posing in a flex for making one play, then being thumped by 35 to make my point...

[Jason_]

you have obviously have no idea how coaching works im done talking

 

thanks for that observation Mr. Kettle

[Jason_]

Im not saying anyone on the bench is better than freeman, but him not being benched for that play shows and proves the lack of integrity in our coaching staff.

 

again, can you provide even one specific example of a time when a coach benched a player and forced him to dress down to street clothes after committing a single taunting penalty?

[ColtsBlueFL]

There is no way you can justify that flag. And I'm not just saying that because Freeman is on the Colts. There are too many soft people on here talking talking that ying yang. Back to my point, the taunting penalty should be taken out of the game completely. These guys are playing a full contact sport, and you want them to act like mutes. They are just taking away every emotional reaction out of the game. Trash talking comes with the territory, and anyone that has played football knows that. Then you got the damn shiesty refs picking and choosing who they want to flag. The NFL is turning into a joke with these dumb * rule changes.

 

I fear it will only get worse for you. The league is actively moving the opposite direction of your desires.  Here's the scoop from the commissioner and the head of the competition committee-

 

"With more success comes more responsibility for all of us to step up and lead,” Goodell said to the owners, general managers, and coaches at the start of the meetings. “Respect for our game and those that came before us. Respect for each other — teams, opponents, and game officials. Respect for our fans, our lifeblood. Respect in our workplaces for the diversity that makes us stronger. Respect for our communities and the important role we play in those communities. Let’s embrace the opportunity to make a difference. We’re expected to do that.”

 

“It’s a behavior change, and we feel it starts with leadership and that’s leadership with the head coach, the owner or the general manager, but also leadership on your football team,” Rams coach Jeff Fisher said.

 

Fisher, speaking on behalf of the Competition Committee, said the culture on the field needs to be cleaned up, as well. He cited a surge in the number of taunting penalties — from nine in 2012 to 34 last season — as proof that there is a lack of respect among the players.

“We had some very lengthy discussions with respect to sportsmanship,” Fisher said. “We agreed that we have an issue on the field. We’ve got to bring the element of respect in its highest level back to our game.”

 

“We may not have flagged them all, but we are going to raise the standard,” Fisher said. “In the past, taunting and sportsmanship is in the back of the book under points of emphasis. It is now a front-of-the-book issue.”

 

The whole article is here-

 

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/03/29/roger-goodell-stresses-more-respect-nfl-for/fHxi0ckrKPHAgrDc6lrEaL/story.html

 

As I type this here's Brandon Marshall going off on Dominic Raiola stepping on a teammate-

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/chi-brandon-marshall-dominic-raiola-20141222-story.html

[lollygagger8]

You can't stand over a guy a talk %, and no that doesn't happen all the time. Freeman is an * and that penalty was definitely deserved.

 

 

LOL, since you must not actually watch football......talking crap happens ALL the time. 

 

You are trying to say Freemna is some sort of bad seed here, and you have no idea what you are talking about. He had a great stop, and talked crap and got the flag from those refs that made whack calls all night.

[lollygagger8]

Also, yes the penalty on Freeman hurt....

 

But the momentum killing drive was the perfect throw by McAfee that WhackDonald flat out dropped. That took the wind out of the sails. 

 

 

I was actually a fan of the call since Patty Mac can actually throw it. I believe he's our 19th string QB lol. 

[jimmy g]

I fear it will only get worse for you. The league is actively moving the opposite direction of your desires. Here's the scoop from the commissioner and the head of the competition committee-

"With more success comes more responsibility for all of us to step up and lead,” Goodell said to the owners, general managers, and coaches at the start of the meetings. “Respect for our game and those that came before us. Respect for each other — teams, opponents, and game officials. Respect for our fans, our lifeblood. Respect in our workplaces for the diversity that makes us stronger. Respect for our communities and the important role we play in those communities. Let’s embrace the opportunity to make a difference. We’re expected to do that.”

“It’s a behavior change, and we feel it starts with leadership and that’s leadership with the head coach, the owner or the general manager, but also leadership on your football team,” Rams coach Jeff Fisher said.

Fisher, speaking on behalf of the Competition Committee, said the culture on the field needs to be cleaned up, as well. He cited a surge in the number of taunting penalties — from nine in 2012 to 34 last season — as proof that there is a lack of respect among the players.

“We had some very lengthy discussions with respect to sportsmanship,” Fisher said. “We agreed that we have an issue on the field. We’ve got to bring the element of respect in its highest level back to our game.”

“We may not have flagged them all, but we are going to raise the standard,” Fisher said. “In the past, taunting and sportsmanship is in the back of the book under points of emphasis. It is now a front-of-the-book issue.”

The whole article is here-

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/03/29/roger-goodell-stresses-more-respect-nfl-for/fHxi0ckrKPHAgrDc6lrEaL/story.html

As I type this here's Brandon Marshall going off on Dominic Raiola stepping on a teammate-

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/chi-brandon-marshall-dominic-raiola-20141222-story.html

what the pros do, high school kids emulate. Which leads to screwed up lives, as only 3% go on to be pro atheletes, and this behavior isn't allowed in the real life business world. It must be stopped, or it spreads as thuggishness.

[UKColt13]

Im really torn on this rule.

 

It seems like when quieter players such as Freeman, who doesn't jaw very much, do something like that they get called, but if Gronk or Richard Sherman or Phil Rivers does then its "just how they play the game".

 

The inconsistency really bugs me.

 

Either call everyone on it, or just let the guys play football. You make a big play, you want to celebrate a little. I get that and I've never played a down of football in my life. 

 

If the other guy doesn't like being jawed at then they need to cowboy up, go back to the huddle and do better the next play.

[ColtsBlueFL]

what the pros do, high school kids emulate. Which leads to screwed up lives, as only 3% go on to be pro atheletes, and this behavior isn't allowed in the real life business world. It must be stopped, or it spreads as thuggishness.

 

The NCAA itself has asked the NFL to crackdown on the unsportsmanlike behavior.  College athletes are emulating them and it is becoming a problem there as well.

 

**  The problem is so acute, according to Fisher, the NCAA asked the NFL to work on curtailing it because so many college players were emulating their pro counterparts.  The crackdown will include the use of the N-word, which means a 15-yard penalty if officials can clearly identify who used it.

 

“We’re going to clean the game up on the field between the players,” Fisher said. “The in-your-face taunting, the language — it’s all in the [rule] book,” Fisher said. “It’s all under unsportsmanlike conduct. There’s no change in our rule. We’re going to enforce the current rule.

 

The league realizes a need for celebration and even a little smack, but they are drawing a line in the sand on what is acceptable celebration and unacceptable celebration.  Just like the increase in illegal contact and defensive holding penalty calls, the players need to learn fast where the line is to avoid the foul.  The NFL is going to take every step to clean up it's image, especially these days with all that has happened recently in the NFL (from Incognito to Rice, to Peterson, etc..)

 

http://nypost.com/2014/03/26/nfl-pledges-crackdown-on-taunting/

[Dark Superman]

agreed. Huge momentum swing.

I don't see why other people don't see that. After that call, and the dropped fake punt, we weren't the same team.

[throwing BBZ]

Don't get me wrong. I think we get beat badly with or without this call. But what the heck was that ? I see Gronk do similar to that on about 70% of his catches. Just curious to how some of you saw it.

 

 Homer

[peytonmanning18]

LOL, since you must not actually watch football......talking crap happens ALL the time.

You are trying to say Freemna is some sort of bad seed here, and you have no idea what you are talking about. He had a great stop, and talked crap and got the flag from those refs that made whack calls all night.

You can't stand over a guy and look down at him talking %

[Superman]

Im really torn on this rule.

 

It seems like when quieter players such as Freeman, who doesn't jaw very much, do something like that they get called, but if Gronk or Richard Sherman or Phil Rivers does then its "just how they play the game".

 

The inconsistency really bugs me.

 

Either call everyone on it, or just let the guys play football. You make a big play, you want to celebrate a little. I get that and I've never played a down of football in my life. 

 

If the other guy doesn't like being jawed at then they need to cowboy up, go back to the huddle and do better the next play.

 

It's a judgment call. There's gonna be inconsistency. We got the short end on this one, unfortunately.

 

After rewatching the game and the play in question, I think it was rather petty. I think the refs thought about picking the flag up, also. But Freeman did the deed, so it's hard to really complain about it.

 

Also, up to that point on that drive, he had shed a couple of blockers to get in on some run stops (including throwing a guard aside to square up Murray), he was chasing receivers around, and then he made the big stop. He was playing well, and was fired up, and got a little carried away. It's not that drastic of a problem, and I really don't even think it's an issue of discipline. Just a really costly mistake (yes, I said and meant mistake).

[indyagent17]

Pagano needs to crack down on players that cant control themselves.

 

Freeman cost us 7pts and one never knows what tangent the game may have taken after they punted

 

Clear and simply Freeman costs us a great deal on Sunday

[csmopar]

ugh..,..so you want a player sent to the lockerroom after making a mistake? Are we going to send offensive linemen to the lockerroom after whiffing on a block or blowing an assignment? WRs and TEs to the lockerroom after dropping a pass?

I'm not condoning what Freeman did, but I think saying that Pagano didn't have the stones to send Freeman to the lockerroom is a ridiculous overreaction. Especially considering that was very out of character for him. Same with Davis...neither have ever, to my knowledge, been penalized for taunting since they've become Colts, but they each do it one time and now our team has no discipline and the coaches aren't holding players accountable? How about the fact that Davis hasn't done anything like that since and I bet Freeman won't either?

I got to disagree here. There's a difference between a performance mistake and taunting. Now before anyone says anything, I have to admit I myself was hit for taunting after I pinned a top 10 ranked wrestler during a meet. I jaw jacked and not only did the ref take away the 6 points I scored for the team but 2 additional ones for unsportsmanlike conduct. Guess what, my coach sent me to sit in the locker room for the remainder of the day. I missed 3 more matches and sat there for about 5 hrs. I had never done anything close to that before but it sent a message. Especially being my senior year and late in the season. So yeah, for taunting and indimidation penalties that are blatantly obvious such as that, yeah benching a player for a quarter or two or the game would send a message.

[dw49]

 Homer

 

 

Simpson ?

[Superman]

I got to disagree here. There's a difference between a performance mistake and taunting. Now before anyone says anything, I have to admit I myself was hit for taunting after I pinned a top 10 ranked wrestler during a meet. I jaw jacked and not only did the ref take away the 6 points I scored for the team but 2 additional ones for unsportsmanlike conduct. Guess what, my coach sent me to sit in the locker room for the remainder of the day. I missed 3 more matches and sat there for about 5 hrs. I had never done anything close to that before but it sent a message. Especially being my senior year and late in the season. So yeah, for taunting and indimidation penalties that are blatantly obvious such as that, yeah benching a player for a quarter or two or the game would send a message.

 

Not to be condescending, but this is not your high school wrestling team.

 

I understand the perceived benefit of benching a guy in this situation, but it pretty much never happens in the NFL.

[dw49]

It's a judgment call. There's gonna be inconsistency. We got the short end on this one, unfortunately.

 

After rewatching the game and the play in question, I think it was rather petty. I think the refs thought about picking the flag up, also. But Freeman did the deed, so it's hard to really complain about it.

 

Also, up to that point on that drive, he had shed a couple of blockers to get in on some run stops (including throwing a guard aside to square up Murray), he was chasing receivers around, and then he made the big stop. He was playing well, and was fired up, and got a little carried away. It's not that drastic of a problem, and I really don't even think it's an issue of discipline. Just a really costly mistake (yes, I said and meant mistake).

 

 

 

That was my point in the thread. I thought was petty and very questionable. I love the post with the different frames. Too bad the time doesn't show on the first and last. It was probably a couple seconds all told. Then on top of all that , they eat the flag on the PI on Fleener. That was probably the most critical drive in the game for the Colts. Hey ... we were just beat to a bloody pulp but you can't help be annoyed with the officiating up to the 28-0 point. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

It's a judgment call. There's gonna be inconsistency. We got the short end on this one, unfortunately.

 

After rewatching the game and the play in question, I think it was rather petty. I think the refs thought about picking the flag up, also. But Freeman did the deed, so it's hard to really complain about it.

 

Also, up to that point on that drive, he had shed a couple of blockers to get in on some run stops (including throwing a guard aside to square up Murray), he was chasing receivers around, and then he made the big stop. He was playing well, and was fired up, and got a little carried away. It's not that drastic of a problem, and I really don't even think it's an issue of discipline. Just a really costly mistake (yes, I said and meant mistake).

 

It was a mental mistake, for sure.  I really think if Redding had trotted over a little quicker, there would have been no flag. I think the swinging of his (Freeman) right arm to finish the gesture was the final straw, and Redding would have pushed him away before that move if he was a second faster. Also, if words were said but the ref couldn't hear, likely no flag.  If the ref got close enough to hear prohibited speech, that will get a flag. It will also be sent in a report to the league and a future fine most likely to happen.

 

I think large groups of fans are in for a rude awakening as the League is clear they are going to increase enforcement of this type of 'mistake', no remove these rules.  They're going to call them even more often.  But Fishers says many players want a more professional environment at 'work', not just owners and some front office people.

[Superman]

That was my point in the thread. I thought was petty and very questionable. I love the post with the different frames. Too bad the time doesn't show on the first and last. It was probably a couple seconds all told. Then on top of all that , they eat the flag on the PI on Fleener. That was probably the most critical drive in the game for the Colts. Hey ... we were just beat to a bloody pulp but you can't help be annoyed with the officiating up to the 28-0 point. 

 

I think if you put a serious counter on the actual taunt, it comes in at less than two seconds. I think it's been blown out of proportion. I'm not complaining about the call; it's a judgment call, and Freeman could have just jogged off the field happy with himself, and the flag never comes. But I don't think he should have been sent to the showers over it. That's too much.

 

IMO

[Superman]

It was a mental mistake, for sure.  I really think if Redding had trotted over a little quicker, there would have been no flag. I think the swinging of his (Freeman) right arm to finish the gesture was the final straw, and Redding would have pushed him away before that move if he was a second faster. Also, if words were said but the ref couldn't hear, likely no flag.  If the ref got close enough to hear prohibited speech, that will get a flag. It will also be sent in a report to the league and a future fine most likely to happen.

 

I think large groups of fans are in for a rude awakening as the League is clear they are going to increase enforcement of this type of 'mistake', no remove these rules.  They're going to call them even more often.  But Fishers says many players want a more professional environment at 'work', not just owners and some front office people.

 

Yeah, there are a lot of racial slurs and other slurs that get thrown around on the playing field (any playing field). I can understand how that would start to irritate some people. The politics and whatnot can be prickly, at the very least, especially after the Riley Cooper / Richie Incognito stuff.

[dw49]

I fear it will only get worse for you. The league is actively moving the opposite direction of your desires.  Here's the scoop from the commissioner and the head of the competition committee-

 

"With more success comes more responsibility for all of us to step up and lead,” Goodell said to the owners, general managers, and coaches at the start of the meetings. “Respect for our game and those that came before us. Respect for each other — teams, opponents, and game officials. Respect for our fans, our lifeblood. Respect in our workplaces for the diversity that makes us stronger. Respect for our communities and the important role we play in those communities. Let’s embrace the opportunity to make a difference. We’re expected to do that.”

 

“It’s a behavior change, and we feel it starts with leadership and that’s leadership with the head coach, the owner or the general manager, but also leadership on your football team,” Rams coach Jeff Fisher said.

 

Fisher, speaking on behalf of the Competition Committee, said the culture on the field needs to be cleaned up, as well. He cited a surge in the number of taunting penalties — from nine in 2012 to 34 last season — as proof that there is a lack of respect among the players.

“We had some very lengthy discussions with respect to sportsmanship,” Fisher said. “We agreed that we have an issue on the field. We’ve got to bring the element of respect in its highest level back to our game.”

 

“We may not have flagged them all, but we are going to raise the standard,” Fisher said. “In the past, taunting and sportsmanship is in the back of the book under points of emphasis. It is now a front-of-the-book issue.”

 

The whole article is here-

 

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2014/03/29/roger-goodell-stresses-more-respect-nfl-for/fHxi0ckrKPHAgrDc6lrEaL/story.html

 

As I type this here's Brandon Marshall going off on Dominic Raiola stepping on a teammate-

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/chi-brandon-marshall-dominic-raiola-20141222-story.html

 

 

I'm not saying you post isn't legit and have a good point but I find it hysterical that Jeff Fisher is involved in anything that is rule related. His teams have always been among the dirtiest in the league .