Andrew Luck is a Top 5 Quarterback, Top 7 at the worst.

[Horseshoe]

Per Adam Schefter

During this summer of quarterback talk, the most interesting and thought-provoking statement came from a Colts executive who declared that he believed Luck already is "one of the top five quarterbacks in football."

Think about that. Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tom Brady, Eli Manning, Peyton Manning, Matthew Stafford, Cam Newton, Ben Roethlisberger. And yet this Colts executive believes Luck is better than at least two of those quarterbacks. And he was not alone.

One NFL coach who watched Luck play this summer said he also would include Luck in a list of the game's top five quarterbacks. Another NFL executive said Luck is the most well-prepared quarterback to enter the NFL. Ever. Three men, three glowing opinions.

It all seems like so much, so soon. Yet rookie quarterbacks seem to be making plenty possible these days.

Told about the statements of those NFL men, that Luck already is among the top five quarterbacks in the game and the most prepared quarterback ever to enter the league, ESPN analyst (and former Colts president) Bill Polian scoffed. "Let's see him win a game or two first," Polian said.

. Polian sounds bitter..... Also I'd like top point out, Adam has Colts being major surprise of the year and making the playoffs. He has been saying this for a while now.

[Warhawk]

FWIW, I swear, if I hear Polian talk about how bad Luck's supporting cast is one more time, I'm going to walk to Bristol (it's not far, I'm from Connecticut) and smack him in the back of the head for being stupid. Not because I think the Colts are the best thing since sliced bread this year, but because any serious deficiencies are his own darn fault.

[USAFHoosier]

My brother and I talked about this last night. His thoughts are Luck is at least in the top 10.

[USAFHoosier]

FWIW, I swear, if I hear Polian talk about how bad Luck's supporting cast is one more time, I'm going to walk to Bristol (it's not far, I'm from Connecticut) and smack him in the back of the head for being stupid. Not because I think the Colts are the best thing since sliced bread this year, but because any serious deficiencies are his own darn fault.

Agreed. Grigson made a ton of moves to make this team better with the little cap room we had. Polian is the one who left the team the way it was.

[Gavin]

wheres the article?

[SiestaKeyColt]

Love hearing this from the NFL execs. Although, I tend to agree with Polian.

[Smonroe]

Per Adam Schefter

. Polian sounds bitter..... Also I'd like top point out, Adam has Colts being major surprise of the year and making the playoffs. He has been saying this for a while now.

I think Polian is sounding realistic. Everyone (I'm sure including him) sees the potential of Andrew being a great one. But come one, the kid hasn't played one snap in the regular season. You can't rank him anywhere until he throws a pass in a real game.

But I'm betting he is going to be one of the top 5 in the league, very soon. I took him as my #1 QB in my fantasy league. We're a keeper league, so I'm hoping to have him for another 15 years.

As far as his supporting cast - I think he already has a better one that Peyton had two years ago. Maybe not as much experience though.

[JoKeR]

FWIW, I swear, if I hear Polian talk about how bad Luck's supporting cast is one more time, I'm going to walk to Bristol (it's not far, I'm from Connecticut) and smack him in the back of the head for being stupid. Not because I think the Colts are the best thing since sliced bread this year, but because any serious deficiencies are his own darn fault.

I'd like to ask Polian what's wrong with Lucks supporting cast other than being young?

And add that Peyton was never well known for having a great supporting cast ( we know different ) I guess my point is this supporting casts seems to have enough talent to be as good as any group Peyton played with ( except at RB maybe )

I'm not big on bashing Polian but thats very hypocritical of him if he's saying that.

[WSO]

Too early to tell

[drew22087]

I dont know about top 5 yet. Give it a year or two and I think he will be.

[AlaskaColtsFan]

I will wait until he at least plays a full NFL game.

[ericnan]

...as far as Polian is concerned, my thoughts are this. BUFFALO 0-4! We were lucky Peyton was as good as he is to carry the team as much as he did. It was obvious that without him, the team could not win. So on that note, although I did support Polian when he was here, I always had BUFFALO 0-4 ringing in the back of my head. I believe Peyton did Polian more of a favor that Polian did for Peyton. I'm not trying to degrade Polian, but our team had the same glass jaw that Buffalo did. I'm anxious to see some hard nosed football back on our team. I'm not certain, but I think our run game may end up being better than expected. In the preaseason, I kept seeing some 3rd and shorts that we ran the ball on and pushed some d-lines back. In the Peyton era, 3rd and short seemed like a passing down. Again, I can't predict what will happen, but I am VERY excited at how our team has restructured itself. One more thing, I believe Irsay is a good owner, who is continually looking for ways to improve his franchise. I'm sure making the moves he has made has been difficult, but I definitely like them.

:coltslogo: !!!!!!

[Balzer40]

FWIW, I swear, if I hear Polian talk about how bad Luck's supporting cast is one more time, I'm going to walk to Bristol (it's not far, I'm from Connecticut) and smack him in the back of the head for being stupid. Not because I think the Colts are the best thing since sliced bread this year, but because any serious deficiencies are his own darn fault.

I agree. Every time Polian says something about how bad the "supporting cast" is, it is nothing more than an indictment on himself. He filled this team with mediocre to flat out terrible players for yrs.. Of course he had some good players on the team, but he built the trenches with castoffs and players that had no business in the NFL to begin with. He done this because he handed out bad contracts to players that weren't deserving. I know there is a few Polian lovers still around that will take issue with this, but it is my opinion and I'll stick by it.

[Warhawk]

Oddly, one of the things I've seen a lot is comparisons to the 1998 team, except that they're comparing the entire careers of the players on that team to this year's players.

For example, a lot of people have pointed out that Luck is at a disadvantage compared to Manning because Manning had an elite, pro bowl left tackle in Tarik Glenn, and Luck has a second year pro in Castonzo, with a line that wasn't great last year.

Well, the line last year was MUCH better than the line in 1997 (seriously, look it up, the 2011 Colts were sacked 35 times, compared with 62 times for the 1997 Colts, even though they had better QBs (read: Harbaugh) in 1997. AND, the 2011 Colts had a better yards per carry than the 1997 Colts (mostly thanks to Donald Brown), even though the 1997 Colts had Marshall freakin' Faulk. PLUS, what was Glenn in 1998? Right, a second year pro. So was Meadows, FWIW.

Which ultimately means that the Glenn-Castonzo comparison is people comparing a second-year first-round left tackle on a line that gave up 62 sacks the year before with another second-year first-round left tackle on a line that gave up 35 sacks the year before, and ruling it "no contest" in favor of the former.

Now, I'm not saying Castonzo will necessarily be as good as Glenn, but in comparing the 2011 and 1998 teams (which Polian has done, saying the 1998 team was MUCH better), you have to remove hindsight bias. And when people bring up players like Jerome Pathon, Ken Dilger, Jason Belser, and Jeff Burris - all of whom, granted, I very much liked - as reasons why Manning had an all-star supporting cast in 1998 (which I have seen people do), you're kinda reaching there.

[Mameluc]

i wonder if that exec means someone like jim irsay or someone like telesco/grigson

[oldunclemark]

I will wait until he at least plays a full NFL game.

You are the voice of reason..T-wolf

[Jackie Daytona]

Lets See.....

Glenn = Castonzo at this point in their careers..... ok

Wayne = Harrison at this point, nah..... edge Reggie, ( at this point ) more experienced

Jerome Pathon = Austin Collie, not even close.... even considering Collie's health issues

Ken Dilger/Marcus Pollard = Coby Fleener/Dwayne Allen...... edge to Dilger and Pollard, purely based on experience....Fleener/Allen has a bit more potential IMO

Jason Belser = Antoine Bethea nope. I loved Belser, but Bethea is just better and more consistently high level

Jeff Burris = Jerraud Powers pretty even in my mind.

Cornelius Bennett = Pat Angerer, nah Angerer is a MLB I know, but he's better than Bennet at this point.... was Herrod still here then? He was on the downside if so

Marshall Faulk = Donald Brown..... edge Faulk, hands down

Chad Cota = Tom Zbikowski.... ok, even I guess. Cota was hurt a lot and never really good, butZbikowski has been a career backup to this point..... he should be average at least

Not even mentioning Freeney/Mathis/V. Davis are nore talented than C. Bratzke/ rest of that Defense from 98

Thats not even mentioning the Oline's sack/ypc numbers were much better last year than 1998

Also, I'm not sure or E.G. Green or whoever else was at WR could hold hilton/brazzil/Avery's jock as a 3rd WR option

Not so sure this team isn't more talented right before the season starts, than the 98 team was at the same point. What positions does the 98 team have an edge in right before that 3-13 season? QB? even, RB, 98, TE? 98 WR 12, DB? pretty even, LB? 12, Dline? pretty even..... Oline? 12, Kicking game? 12........ yeah seems clear cut, this team right now has more established talent than the 98 team did at the same point of the season.

[indy1888]

FWIW, I swear, if I hear Polian talk about how bad Luck's supporting cast is one more time, I'm going to walk to Bristol (it's not far, I'm from Connecticut) and smack him in the back of the head for being stupid. Not because I think the Colts are the best thing since sliced bread this year, but because any serious deficiencies are his own darn fault.

I agree. Just curious, when he talks about this does he ever admit that it was the fault of he and his son?

Polian is a bitter old man. The only thing i wish Irsay had done differently was fire both of those clowns years earlier, when it was apparent there drafting and other roster decisions were tanking this team. But they still had Manning, and so that covered a lot of it up unfortunately. IMHO, the Colts would have been a 3-4 win team at most without Manning for several years, not just last year.

[Indyfan4life]

I always like what Adam Schefter has to say. Dude is definitely one of the smartest minds when it comes to football, and football knowledge.

[NewColtsFan]

No one is a bigger Andrew Luck fan here than I am. And no, Andrew Luck is **NOT** a top-5 QB now. He will be, and pretty soon, but he's not now. And whichever Colts executive said that should know much better than to say something like that to a member of the media -- especially the National Media. A comment like that helps no one.

Is Andrew the most well prepared -- ever? Probably. There's certainly a very good argument for that. Fine. But that doesn't make him top-5. You know what does? Winning. (Hello Charlie Sheen!) Winning is everything in the NFL. Bill Polian doesn't sound bitter, he sounds realistic. Smart executives want to see it on the field before proclaiming someone to be a God before he's even played a single game. It's silly and embarrassing.

Now, if someone wants to argue that if you were starting a franchise now and building for a future which QB would you want, then I think Luck is easily in the discussion for top-5 . But that's a different argument completely.

This morning Peter King called Luck "3rd-year ready"... and said he's got enough weapons that he wouldn't be shocked if the Colts made the playoffs. Understand he's NOT predicting Indy into the playoffs, he's just saying he wouldn't be shocked. Big difference. By the way, I'd be shocked, but that's another story for another thread.

Look..... quarterback is THE hardest position to play in all of sports. Not all of football, all of sports -- period. NFL executives have seen plenty of college stars come into the NFL hailed as the next great franchise quarterback.... only to fall flat on their face. The NFL can do that to you in a hurry.

Let's have Andrew win some games and have a great rookie season before proclaiming instant greatness. Hailing him as top-5 may make fans feel better, but it won't make Luck's job any easier.

It's all going to happen for him. It's just going to take a little time....

[Mouthfire]

Yeah, I'm actually with Polian on this one. Luck may end up being a top 5 at the end of the year, but he actually needs to do something meaningful first.

[krunk]

Oddly, one of the things I've seen a lot is comparisons to the 1998 team, except that they're comparing the entire careers of the players on that team to this year's players.

For example, a lot of people have pointed out that Luck is at a disadvantage compared to Manning because Manning had an elite, pro bowl left tackle in Tarik Glenn, and Luck has a second year pro in Castonzo, with a line that wasn't great last year.

Well, the line last year was MUCH better than the line in 1997 (seriously, look it up, the 2011 Colts were sacked 35 times, compared with 62 times for the 1997 Colts, even though they had better QBs (read: Harbaugh) in 1997. AND, the 2011 Colts had a better yards per carry than the 1997 Colts (mostly thanks to Donald Brown), even though the 1997 Colts had Marshall freakin' Faulk. PLUS, what was Glenn in 1998? Right, a second year pro. So was Meadows, FWIW.

Which ultimately means that the Glenn-Castonzo comparison is people comparing a second-year first-round left tackle on a line that gave up 62 sacks the year before with another second-year first-round left tackle on a line that gave up 35 sacks the year before, and ruling it "no contest" in favor of the former.

Now, I'm not saying Castonzo will necessarily be as good as Glenn, but in comparing the 2011 and 1998 teams (which Polian has done, saying the 1998 team was MUCH better), you have to remove hindsight bias. And when people bring up players like Jerome Pathon, Ken Dilger, Jason Belser, and Jeff Burris - all of whom, granted, I very much liked - as reasons why Manning had an all-star supporting cast in 1998 (which I have seen people do), you're kinda reaching there.

Geesh I didn't know they gave up 62 sacks! That is ugly

[krunk]

All I know is for this Chicago game I think we are going to be A okay on offense. I reaffirm that every time I go back and look at the film of Luck playing against the NFL designed Monte and Lane Kiffin coached USC Cover 2 defense. They had pressure on Luck the entire game, Stanford had zero running game, but yet and still Luck put up darn near 50 points on those boys.

That was the exact same defense that we are going to see Sunday pretty much ad verbatim. Even the D coordinator they have now is a former Tampa Bay coach. I'm not saying he will put up 50, but I am saying I'm not worried even if we don't have a running game. It's all going to come down to if we can play stout enough defense and limit big plays on special teams against Devin Hester and Eric Weems.

[BayAreaBronco]

No one is a bigger Andrew Luck fan here than I am. And no, Andrew Luck is **NOT** a top-5 QB now. He will be, and pretty soon, but he's not now. And whichever Colts executive said that should know much better than to say something like that to a member of the media -- especially the National Media. A comment like that helps no one.

Is Andrew the most well prepared -- ever? Probably. There's certainly a very good argument for that. Fine. But that doesn't make him top-5. You know what does? Winning. (Hello Charlie Sheen!) Winning is everything in the NFL. Bill Polian doesn't sound bitter, he sounds realistic. Smart executives want to see it on the field before proclaiming someone to be a God before he's even played a single game. It's silly and embarrassing.

Now, if someone wants to argue that if you were starting a franchise now and building for a future which QB would you want, then I think Luck is easily in the discussion for top-5 . But that's a different argument completely.

This morning Peter King called Luck "3rd-year ready"... and said he's got enough weapons that he wouldn't be shocked if the Colts made the playoffs. Understand he's NOT predicting Indy into the playoffs, he's just saying he wouldn't be shocked. Big difference. By the way, I'd be shocked, but that's another story for another thread.

Look..... quarterback is THE hardest position to play in all of sports. Not all of football, all of sports -- period. NFL executives have seen plenty of college stars come into the NFL hailed as the next great franchise quarterback.... only to fall flat on their face. The NFL can do that to you in a hurry.

Let's have Andrew win some games and have a great rookie season before proclaiming instant greatness. Hailing him as top-5 may make fans feel better, but it won't make Luck's job any easier.

It's all going to happen for him. It's just going to take a little time....

Agree everything you said, including no one is a bigger fan of Andrew than you are. I conced that to you

[John Waylon]

Maybe Polian would have drafted RG3 instead... (Kidding)

[Thewholefnshow28]

Luck better come out and have a great game or this message board is going to explode because the minds will not be able to handle the idea of Luck being a mere mortal rookie QB.

Crowning him top five all ready is a bit much? He is probably the best QB prospect in years, but lets see him do it in games that matter and not meaningless preseason games.

Bill does not sound bitter he sounds smart. Lets see him actually play a real NFL game before crowning him.

[Balzer40]

Luck better come out and have a great game or this message board is going to explode because the minds will not be able to handle the idea of Luck being a mere mortal rookie QB.

Crowning him top five all ready is a bit much? He is probably the best QB prospect in years, but lets see him do it in games that matter and not meaningless preseason games.

Bill does not sound bitter he sounds smart. Lets see him actually play a real NFL game before crowning him.

I think the point of people saying Polian sounds bitter is because of him saying the Colts have a bad supporting cast. Not the fact that he wants to see Luck do something in the regular season. I agree with him on that part, before proclaiming Luck a top 5 QB, he does need to show it in the regular season and he needs to show it all season long before such a claim can be made.

Polian don't have a leg to stand on though IMO, when talking about Luck's bad supporting cast. He is the reason why the supporting cast is where it's at. I think Grigson has done a good job at upgrading the talent around Luck. If he would have kept Polian's guy's here, we would be in a lot worse shape than were in right now.

[hawkeyes]

LOL, he hasnt played a snap in a real game yet they say hes top 5? Give me a break! Sure he might have the "potential" to be a top 5 QB, but until he actually demonstrates it on the field over a length of time give of the meaningless banter a rest.

[coltsfanatic24]

i think andrew luck will finish in the top 10 of qb rating with 93.

[TKnight24]

Within the next 5 years, Peyton & Brady will probably Retire.

So that leaves Brees, Rodgers, Eli,.................

[Smitto]

Its way too early to tell... ill wait till Luck plays about 10 games, he hasnt really faced or played a full game yet. But im pretty certain he's gonna be in the top 5 after this season.

[MAC]

I'm not trying to degrade Polian

Really? That appears to be the entire purpose of your post.

The Colts roster got old and injured. It happens to every team after a period of success. I wouldn't trade these past 14 years for ANY period in the teams history.

And depicting Buffalo's unprecedented run of success as a sign of failure is simply absurd.

[ericnan]

Really? That appears to be the entire purpose of your post.

The Colts roster got old and injured. It happens to every team after a period of success. I wouldn't trade these past 14 years for ANY period in the teams history.

And depicting Buffalo's unprecedented run of success as a sign of failure is simply absurd.

...and your comments are helpful in what way? Just to stir up some trouble? I thought Polian did a good job for us, but we had a team that was primarily successful due to Peyton and his ability. I didn't say anything about trading the past 14 years. I've enjoyed the wins. I'm a Colt fan, same as you, why is it that you feel the need to be snippy? You are entitled to your opinion, but our team played defense and ran the ball before Peyton got there. I've enjoyed the wins too, but have sat on the edge of my seat going OH NO several times worrying that our ability to win could have been wiped out with one injury......and it did. My point about the Buffalo is not absurd, our team was built in a similar way, in my modest opinion. We were very successful in the regular season, but struggled against some of the same teams in the playoffs. Why is that? Because we had a one way to play kind of team. We had one year where everything lined up and we won the Superbowl. The NO game showed our inability again. I would prefer a team that can knock the slobber outta someone and TAKE a win from them. I supported Polian the whole time he was in Indy, I am just saying I always had the concern that if Peyton was injured, we wouldn't have a team......and we didn't.

[MAC]

...and your comments are helpful in what way? Just to stir up some trouble? I thought Polian did a good job for us, but we had a team that was primarily successful due to Peyton and his ability. I didn't say anything about trading the past 14 years. I've enjoyed the wins. I'm a Colt fan, same as you, why is it that you feel the need to be snippy? You are entitled to your opinion, but our team played defense and ran the ball before Peyton got there. I've enjoyed the wins too, but have sat on the edge of my seat going OH NO several times worrying that our ability to win could have been wiped out with one injury......and it did. My point about the Buffalo is not absurd, our team was built in a similar way, in my modest opinion. We were very successful in the regular season, but struggled against some of the same teams in the playoffs. Why is that? Because we had a one way to play kind of team. We had one year where everything lined up and we won the Superbowl. The NO game showed our inability again. I would prefer a team that can knock the slobber outta someone and TAKE a win from them. I supported Polian the whole time he was in Indy, I am just saying I always had the concern that if Peyton was injured, we wouldn't have a team......and we didn't.

Oh please - I have no more intention of "stirring up trouble" than you. Your comments are one side of an endless argument that goes on in thread after thread here. Virtually the same thing gets posted all the time and I find it offensive every time. To paint him as "the problem", when most of us would be hard pressed to even remember the names of any other Colts GMs is just silly. Would you rather have the befuddled Ernie Accorsi, the incompetent Jim Irsay, the psychotic Joe Thomas? Whatever Polian's short-comings, he was arguably the best GM we ever had, and we were lucky to have him. Instead of being relieved that he's gone, you'd better grab onto something solid and pray that Grigson has 1/2 his talent.

[ColtStrong]

I always like what Adam Schefter has to say. Dude is definitely one of the smartest minds when it comes to football, and football knowledge.

Would you feel that way about him if he predicted the colts to win 2 games?

[Indyfan4life]

Would you feel that way about him if he predicted the colts to win 2 games?

Actually I would. He's one of the few people in the league that are usually right.

[WSO]

Geesh I didn't know they gave up 62 sacks! That is ugly

Yeah I'm really hoping that number is far lower this year lol

[cbear]

IMO, Polian is absolutely correct. These pronouncements by the punditry about someone (anyone) who hasn't even played one game in the NFL is beyond hilarious.

[NewColtsFan]

I think the point of people saying Polian sounds bitter is because of him saying the Colts have a bad supporting cast. Not the fact that he wants to see Luck do something in the regular season. I agree with him on that part, before proclaiming Luck a top 5 QB, he does need to show it in the regular season and he needs to show it all season long before such a claim can be made.

Polian don't have a leg to stand on though IMO, when talking about Luck's bad supporting cast. He is the reason why the supporting cast is where it's at. I think Grigson has done a good job at upgrading the talent around Luck. If he would have kept Polian's guy's here, we would be in a lot worse shape than were in right now.

A very, very rare disagreement with Balzar40 for me.....

Polian wanted to keep the 10+win seasons going. He signed players to long-term deals to keep things going. I think it's highly doubtful that during those great times someone here was thinking..... "but some of those players are getting old and are going to get hurt and we could have a couple of bad seasons...."

Hey, that's the price of greatness. The Colts had a great run. Polian was trying to keep it going. So, players got signed to long-term deals and couldn't quite play at a high level all the way through it. That happens everywhere. If you're complaining about last year and this year -- fine -- but then you've got to recognize all the great years you had. And it was more than just Peyton Manning.

Just another view from the outside looking in....

[indy1888]

A very, very rare disagreement with Balzar40 for me.....

Polian wanted to keep the 10+win seasons going. He signed players to long-term deals to keep things going. I think it's highly doubtful that during those great times someone here was thinking..... "but some of those players are getting old and are going to get hurt and we could have a couple of bad seasons...."

Hey, that's the price of greatness. The Colts had a great run. Polian was trying to keep it going. So, players got signed to long-term deals and couldn't quite play at a high level all the way through it. That happens everywhere. If you're complaining about last year and this year -- fine -- but then you've got to recognize all the great years you had. And it was more than just Peyton Manning.

Just another view from the outside looking in....

I don't know about that. I know there were people on this forum and others that were starting to voice concerns over the job Polian was doing several years ago even when we were winning. I know i was one of them. There is nothing wrong with trying to keep a winning team together, but you have to be smart about how you do it. He had a tendency to greatly overvalue his draft picks and pay them ridiculous contracts. Kelvin Hayden comes to mind immediately. But i don't even think that was the biggest problem, i think the major problem was there drafting. They were not able to replace some of those aging and injured players with draft picks because they busted on too many of them. That forced their hand, forced them to keep some of these aging and injured players out of necessity. Melvin Bullet last year was kept simply because we had nobody else. We signed him late, same day that Eric Weddle re-signed in SD. He was an injury riddled safety who had to have a steel rod in his shoulder the year before. Not surprising, he hurt the same shoulder 2 games into the season and was done. Those missed picks also caused them to waste future picks on the same position because they struck out in trying the first time (Ugoh). That's really how we got in the mess in the first place. Manning was covering for a ton of problems on this team and some of us had been saying it for years. I always predicted 3 wins without Peyton, i was wrong, we could only manage 2.