The Pittman hit / Kazee suspended

[chad72]

Something tells me Mike Mitchell's deep love for the Steelers that he played for, led him to a momentary lapse of reasoning, and it probably won't sit well with the Colts coaches. Let him go to the Steelers and coach their secondary then.

 

Steelers and Ravens have been franchises, celebrated for such gladiator like hitting, and no, asking for player safety is not too much whatsoever. If 15 yard penalties can be had for a late hit to the chest plate of a QB, the punishment definitely fits the crime with Kazee. 

[1959Colts]

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Rich Eisen reacts to the penalty. Said he saw it from a mile away coming. Said he though Pittman was seriously injured and there would be a ambulance come on the field.

 

 

[FanFromtheWasteland]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

 

If Mike Mitchell is talking about the hit on Pittman, I don't want him coaching for the Colts anymore.

Yeah that was a dumb arrogant statement by him and the higher ups in the Colts organization need to evaluate that

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, FanFromtheWasteland said:

Yeah that was a dumb arrogant statement by him and the higher ups in the Colts organization need to evaluate that

He also said this after the tweet.

 

[FanFromtheWasteland]

5 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

He also said this after the tweet.

 

Well he knows he screwed up and is trying to do damage control.

 

First responses are usually the truthful ones

[Superman]

13 minutes ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

 

So I don't disagree with the idea that this was a bad throw that hung Pittman out to dry. I just think this particular analysis would be more appropriate if offered on another day. This makes it seem like Brady thinks the penalty call was wrong.

[Happy2BeHere]

4 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So I don't disagree with the idea that this was a bad throw that hung Pittman out to dry. I just think this particular analysis would be more appropriate if offered on another day. This makes it seem like Brady thinks the penalty call was wrong.

We definitely see QB's throwing balls to WR's whom are somewhat in a "vulnerable" state, but at the same time you could see the defender was targeting Pittman well before the ball arrived IMO. He had already well started a full on run at Pittman when the ball was in the air. This is where I feel the penalty was well justified and furthermore his suspension given his history. Defenders need the opportunity to make a play and rightfully so...but there really is a pretty clear window (IMO) on what is deemed reasonable.

 

Brady also seems to really be harking on the league since he retired...and he seems to be in favor of defenses than offenses yet I tell you what when he got hit and sometimes it was "ticky-tack" boy he would cry and throw a fit about it on the field.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Speaking for myself, I never watched football to see players get obliterated like this. And now that we have a better understanding of how dangerous these plays are -- immediately, and in the long term -- I react very differently to them.

 

I'm not a racing fan, but I've never heard anyone say they watch for the wrecks. Is that really a thing??

Not only is it really a thing, I think NFL Films used to sell a video of the biggest and best hits for each season.   
 

Of course it’s politically incorrect these days so they haven’t sold it in years, but they once did.  

[stitches]

13 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So I don't disagree with the idea that this was a bad throw that hung Pittman out to dry. I just think this particular analysis would be more appropriate if offered on another day. This makes it seem like Brady thinks the penalty call was wrong.

I hate that reasoning... "Oh the QB threw a bad ball? Well I guess you can do whatever to the receiver then... might as well kill him on the spot... cuz you know... the QB should know better". 

 

I swear this incident has awakened some of the worst takes I've heard recently. 

[Superman]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

Not only is it really a thing, I think NFL Films used to sell a video of the biggest and best hits for each season.   
 

Of course it’s politically incorrect these days so they haven’t sold it in years, but they once did.  

 

We might be talking about different things. No question that these kind of hits used to be celebrated, and a lot of people thought they were exciting and fun.

 

My question to the other poster was specifically about watching racing for the wrecks. 

[Superman]

4 minutes ago, stitches said:

I hate that reasoning... "Oh the QB threw a bad ball? Well I guess you can do whatever to the receiver then... might as well kill him on the spot... cuz you know... the QB should know better". 

 

I swear this incident has awakened some of the worst takes I've heard recently. 

 

Yeah, just because you think the QB shouldn't have thrown this pass doesn't mean the rules protecting defenseless players are nullified. 

 

But I do think QBs need to take responsibility for some of these throws. That's a big ask, though, given the present state of QBing in the NFL.

[Hawkeyecolt]

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

If Mike Mitchell is talking about the hit on Pittman, I don't want him coaching for the Colts anymore.

So my next question is if a WR launches/dives to catch the ball and the defender has to keep two feet on the ground, aren’t you just telling the defender he has to take the brunt of the hit unless you just let him catch the ball? 

 

I see similar calls when a receiver goes high to catch a ball.  The NFL is asking the DB to stay on the ground when you hit him even though the WR has elevated to catch the ball. So it’s let him catch it or take his knees out. 
 

I get where Mitchell is coming from. I wonder how Bob Sanders would do in today’s NFL.  Probably ok since he was usually the low man but his impact would be neutralized to a certain degree.  
 

See what your hitting. In this case the safety turned his shoulder to light him up and break up the pass. He no longer saw where he was hitting Pittman.  That’s what made it a bad hit.  Its a tough position to play these days because a player’s natural instincts is break up that pass. The two guys are both moving at a very fast speed. It’s really a split second decision. 

 

 

[jskinnz]

2 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Speaking for myself, I never watched football to see players get obliterated like this. And now that we have a better understanding of how dangerous these plays are -- immediately, and in the long term -- I react very differently to them.

 

I'm not a racing fan, but I've never heard anyone say they watch for the wrecks. Is that really a thing??

I am a racing fan with a very long history at the Indy 500 and for the real fans of the sport, that is 100% not a thing. 
 

I was in the stadium when Austin Collie got lit up against the Jags and it was scary as hell. I was not there Saturday to see the Pittman hit and glad to have missed it. 

[GoColts8818]

2 hours ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

And if someone had done that to one of his guys he’d be calling for a lifetime ban for them.  Just another reason to hate Tom Brady.

[ArmchairQB]

4 hours ago, stitches said:

The more I'm thinking about it, the more * off I get at Mike Mitchell... what an absolutely horrible thing to say the day after your own WR1 got taken out by one of the dirtiest hits of the season. 

For what it’s worth Mitchell was known as a dirty player.  I’m actually a bit surprised the Colts hired him as a DB coach.  He doesn’t fit the mold.

[csmopar]

3 hours ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

Screw that, Brady was the biggest cry baby I ever saw play. 

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

So my next question is if a WR launches/dives to catch the ball and the defender has to keep two feet on the ground, aren’t you just telling the defender he has to take the brunt of the hit unless you just let him catch the ball? 

 

I see similar calls when a receiver goes high to catch a ball.  The NFL is asking the DB to stay on the ground when you hit him even though the WR has elevated to catch the ball. So it’s let him catch it or take his knees out. 
 

I get where Mitchell is coming from. I wonder how Bob Sanders would do in today’s NFL.  Probably ok since he was usually the low man but his impact would be neutralized to a certain degree.  
 

See what your hitting. In this case the safety turned his shoulder to light him up and break up the pass. He no longer saw where he was hitting Pittman.  That’s what made it a bad hit.  Its a tough position to play these days because a player’s natural instincts is break up that pass. The two guys are both moving at a very fast speed. It’s really a split second decision. 

 

From your first sentence, I wonder if you saw the play. Kazee wasn't in any danger. He tracked the ball and the player to the spot, and created the contact. 

 

Let me ask you this. If a receiver lays out to make a diving catch, do you think he should be protected from forcible contact to the head and neck area?

[Bum]

It is really simple, if a defender attempts to wrap up when they tackle this kind of hit doesn't happen 99% of the time.  Brady and Mitchell's comments miss the mark.

[King Colt]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Speaking for myself, I never watched football to see players get obliterated like this. And now that we have a better understanding of how dangerous these plays are -- immediately, and in the long term -- I react very differently to them.

 

I'm not a racing fan, but I've never heard anyone say they watch for the wrecks. Is that really a thing??

Ever hear of demolition derbies? Why are wrecks featured in every news video? Because people like them. There are fewer injuries in auto racing than playing football.

[Dingus McGirt]

49 minutes ago, ArmchairQB said:

For what it’s worth Mitchell was known as a dirty player.  I’m actually a bit surprised the Colts hired him as a DB coach.  He doesn’t fit the mold.

Well, he’s a member of Colt’s management.  So, he represents the team when he opens his trap.  IMO, he should be disciplined by the team.

[Superman]

5 minutes ago, King Colt said:

Ever hear of demolition derbies? Why are wrecks featured in every news video? Because people like them. There are fewer injuries in auto racing than playing football.

 

So a demolition derby is when a few normal street cars drive around in the mud at 20 MPH and ram into each other. I think that's much different than a person in a super powered vehicle slamming into a wall or another car at 200 MPH. 

[GoColts8818]

8 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So a demolition derby is when a few normal street cars drive around in the mud at 20 MPH and ram into each other. I think that's much different than a person in a super powered vehicle slamming into a wall or another car at 200 MPH. 

Yeah huge difference.  It’s like saying well they hit each other in boxing so it’s fine in football.

19 minutes ago, King Colt said:

Ever hear of demolition derbies? Why are wrecks featured in every news video? Because people like them. There are fewer injuries in auto racing than playing football.

That’s not racing.  It’s a different sport.

[jimmy g]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

 

 

My question to the other poster was specifically about watching racing for the wrecks. 

In Open Wheel Racing, wrecks can kill people.  But in NASCAR, whenever certain drivers are in the top 3-6 for the last lap, every NASCAR fan knows a 15 car pileup is about to happen. And that those certain drivers will do whatever it takes to get the win.  I don’t like it. But almost every NASCAR fan I know loves ‘Rubbin is Racin!’

[ColtStrong2013]

4 hours ago, Superman said:

 

So I don't disagree with the idea that this was a bad throw that hung Pittman out to dry. I just think this particular analysis would be more appropriate if offered on another day. This makes it seem like Brady thinks the penalty call was wrong.

Brady has been creating this narrative that the league is poorly coached and has poor play as opposed to his career, for obvious propping himself up reasons. I don’t necessarily disagree, but he consistently uses the rules being soft as a reason for his point. As if he wasn’t a huge reason for the league making some of those rules…

 

Yes Tom, you played against some hard hitting dudes in a different era… and in the modern era, you also cried for a blow to the head penalty every time someone slapped your shoulder in the pocket. 

[ColtStrong2013]

5 minutes ago, ColtStrong2013 said:

Brady has been creating this narrative that the league is poorly coached and has poor play as opposed to his career, for obvious propping himself up reasons. I don’t necessarily disagree, but he consistently uses the rules being soft as a reason for his point. As if he wasn’t a huge reason for the league making some of those rules…

 

Yes Tom, you played against some hard hitting dudes in a different era… and in the modern era, you also cried for a blow to the head penalty every time someone slapped your shoulder in the pocket. 

and to touch on this a tad further… Tom says “QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits.”

 

also, Tom Brady in the afc championship forcing his 6 foot 7 tight end (with a history of concussions) to high point the ball with a safety closing in… 

https://youtu.be/-7fBWVh_R9I

 

[Hawkeyecolt]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

From your first sentence, I wonder if you saw the play. Kazee wasn't in any danger. He tracked the ball and the player to the spot, and created the contact. 

 

Let me ask you this. If a receiver lays out to make a diving catch, do you think he should be protected from forcible contact to the head and neck area?

I’m not saying he was in danger.  Nor am I talking only about that play specifically.  Sorry I wasn’t very clear.  There are times the NFL now expects the defensive player to be steam rolled.  
 

I think a player should be protected from purposeful contact to the head and neck area to answer your question. 

[Superman]

7 minutes ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

I think a player should be protected from purposeful contact to the head and neck area to answer your question. 

 

Okay, I think that's the key. If you want to try to defend a play where the receiver is defenseless, you aren't allowed to make forcible contact to the head/neck area, even if that's the only way you can prevent him from making the catch. In that case, you got beat, and you just need to make a safe tackle attempt. 

 

I think there are some defenseless player penalties that are borderline, in my opinion. That's a larger conversation. Still, by rule, the defender is responsible for not making forcible contact to the head/neck area.

 

And taking it a step further, even though it's been a part of the game for a long time, I don't think the act of dislodging the ball with violent hits is what the game is supposed to be about. 

[ReMeDy]

6 hours ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

 

It's comical how the Pats finds new ways to trash the Colts even after several of their vets retired. I just read an article 6 days ago about Gronkowski still mad at deflate-gate here. Now we have Tom Brady taking jabs at Gardner Minshew. I'm so grateful the Patriots suck now and hope this will be Bill's final season. Screw the Pats.

[King Colt]

5 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Yeah huge difference.  It’s like saying well they hit each other in boxing so it’s fine in football.

That’s not racing.  It’s a different sport.

It is not a sport. It is entertainment and the bottom line is my point people like to see crashes and violence. Look at the MMA following versus Judo which has no following. People liked Mike Tyson because of his knockout power.

[Solid84]

9 hours ago, 1959Colts said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/tom-brady-criticizes-damontae-kazee-suspension-faults-gardner-minshew

 

Tom Brady criticizes Damontae Kazee suspension, faults Gardner Minshew

 

...QBs should not be throwing the ball in areas where they are exposing their own teammates to these types of hits. Coaches need to coach better, QBs needs to read coverages and throw the ball to the right places and defenders should aim for the right hitting areas. To put the blame on the defense player all the time is just flat out wrong. Need better QB play!! 

A guy on X had a hilarious respons to that:

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

10 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Not only is it really a thing, I think NFL Films used to sell a video of the biggest and best hits for each season.   
 

Of course it’s politically incorrect these days so they haven’t sold it in years, but they once did.  

Yep. Back in the day when I hung around a lot of people watching games,  they always wanted to see big hits. This is racing country here, and there are still many that want to see wrecks in Nascar. Like in Hockey, they want to see fights. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

There are actually some trying to blame Minshew for this. That is the most ridiculous, dumbest thing I think I have ever heard in my football days. Every game, QBs try to make plays, they are pressured and have to watch getting hit themselves. QBs make throws like this at least a few times a game. Tom Brady has even done it. This hit is 100% on Kazee. He made the hit. 

[jskinnz]

10 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Not only is it really a thing, I think NFL Films used to sell a video of the biggest and best hits for each season.   
 

Of course it’s politically incorrect these days so they haven’t sold it in years, but they once did.  

The NFL is a bit on the hypocritical side when they were promoting the hits that are now outlawed. 
 

Along the same lines but on a much smaller scale - I think it was to promote last week’s games, they used Pittman’s touchdown against the Browns when he flashed the peace sign. He was penalized and fined for it and yet they use it in their promos?  Seems a mixed message at best. 
 

[NewColtsFan]

4 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

The NFL is a bit on the hypocritical side when they were promoting the hits that are now outlawed. 
 

Along the same lines but on a much smaller scale - I think it was to promote last week’s games, they used Pittman’s touchdown against the Browns when he flashed the peace sign. He was penalized and fined for it and yet they use it in their promos?  Seems a mixed message at best. 
 

Yeah….  The NFL likes to have it both ways whenever they can because, well, they’re the NFL and few (short of Congress) can stop them.   
 

 

[Chrisaaron1023]

2 hours ago, Solid84 said:

A guy on X had a hilarious respons to that:

 

It's the music that got me 😂.. but this is true.. Gronk was forced into retirement from the hits this dude took

[2006Coltsbestever]

28 minutes ago, Chrisaaron1023 said:

It's the music that got me 😂.. but this is true.. Gronk was forced into retirement from the hits this dude took

Yeah, all QBs make throws like the 1 Minshew made. Football is such a fast game and QBs have 2 or 3 seconds on many plays to make a play. Brady talking doo doo and he made many throws leaving Gronk and Edelman in danger. If you here Edelman talk, it sounds like he has been concussed a bunch. Almost sounds like Boxer that has been hit way too many times.

[indyagent17]

On 12/17/2023 at 3:03 AM, Hawkeyecolt said:

What should have the defender done? Just let him catch the ball?  He turned and tried to lead with his shoulder. Unfortunately, that also leads to him not seeing his target. Considering Pittman was diving it was inevitable the hit was going to be high. Without playing touch football or banning the WR from diving that hit is going to happen unless the defender pulls up and lets him catch the ball. Frankly, that hit was Minshew’s fault. The game is not played in slow motion.  I hate seeing Pitt take that hit but I honestly ask what is the safety is supposed to do there? 

Have you watched the NFL before? He launched himself at Pittman and led with his helmet.

[Superman]

5 hours ago, jskinnz said:

The NFL is a bit on the hypocritical side when they were promoting the hits that are now outlawed. 
 

Along the same lines but on a much smaller scale - I think it was to promote last week’s games, they used Pittman’s touchdown against the Browns when he flashed the peace sign. He was penalized and fined for it and yet they use it in their promos?  Seems a mixed message at best. 

 

Meh. I think it's counterproductive to focus on perceived hypocrisy when the goal is to make progress. The NFL and their media partners used to promote hits that are now illegal, but they don't anymore because the understanding around those hits has changed. And I think that kind of progress should be encouraged, not treated with cynicism.

 

But promoting a celebration that you penalized is a different story, and I think the league should tighten that up, one way or the other. I don't think the media department is running every one of those promos by the management council, but they should probably do better to make sure they aren't playing both sides. Of course, if CBS puts together a promo, that's different from NFL Network putting together a promo. Either way, it doesn't look good.

[RollerColt]

17 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

I've been a racing fan since birth.   My dad and i were at carb day,  qualifications and the race every year.   No,  we don't love the wrecks.  

I'm still haunted by Dan Wheldon's death to this day...