Hines traded to the Bills

[CR91]

2 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

They have a franchise QB Sam Ehlinger 

 

Your neck is so out on that one, you might as well be a giraffe 

[danlhart87]

Just now, CR91 said:

 

Your neck is so out on that one, you might as well be a giraffe 

Sammy gonna be MVP just watch

[dw49]

4 minutes ago, w87r said:

Hines:

2022 Dead Cap: $1.5m

2023 Dead Cap: $3m

2022 Cap Savings: $3.64m

2023 Cap Savings: $3.29m

2024 Cap Savings: $6.9m

 

It's almost $14m over 3 seasons saved.

 

I would say it was very unlikely Hines was ever going to see that 6.9 mill in 2024. In all probability , it was 7 over 2 seasons. 

[Shive]

I posted it in the other thread, but:

 

Moss is the opposite of Hines as a RB. Here's a snippet from his NFL.com Draft Profile:

Quote

Watching Moss' game tape is like watching an exercise in controlled violence on just about every carry, but his vision, balance, patience and wiggle are additional skills that help to make him a well-rounded runner. Personnel evaluators for NFL teams say there is wear and tear that could limit the length of his career. He needs to become more discerning with his physical challenges if he wants to see a second contract. He is a great fit for gap and inside, zone-heavy rushing attacks and could become an effective starter as a middle-round pick.

His player comp was Marion Barber, which I absolutely agree with.

 

Health has been his issue so far in the pros, plus he's more of a thunder vs Hines' lightning.

 

Highlight reel from last season for those interested:

 

[masterlock]

42 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

how ?  dont the colts still have to pay hines 5 million ? 

No, per DrafKings, "Hines signed a three-year, $18.6 million deal with the Colts and has two more years remaining on that extension after this season. However, the deal has no guaranteed money after this season, so the Bills could release him without any dead money repercussions. Hines has a base salary of $3.3 million this year, which jumps to $4.45 million in 2023 and $5.1 million in 2024. Each year includes $340,000 in total per-game roster bonus money.

The Colts will carry $1.5 million in dead money this year and $1.5 million in dead money in 2023."

[AustexColt]

Hines wanted out... Ballard gave him his ticket out and to a contender so there should be no reason for Hines to cry about it. Good luck Hines. Wish you well.

Ballard and Reich is extending to all the players in the locker room the same treatment because they want to have a united locker room. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Moss had only 91 yards in five games this season.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

49 minutes ago, pgt_rob said:

That seems like a pointless trade…..? Lol

ballard is trying to clean up his over paying , hines was not worth what ballard paid him

[w87r]

15 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

This feels like a salary dump to me.   
 

I don’t mean to bring more bad news, but the Colts are going to be in a very difficult place with regard to the cap next year.   
 

The 23 cap goes up $17 mill next year.   But about $12m of that has already been eaten up by Matt Ryan.   Yup. 

I don’t think we can retain Ngokoue even if he started playing better.   Too much money.   
 

Plus, the Colts have to try and sign Pittman and Taylor next off-season.   Plus Okereke is up and due for a new deal.  
 

The 23 off-season looks to be incredibly difficult.    Sorry. 

 

Definitely is a dump. Moss could be a good get though.

 

Your looking at the cap wrong.

 

Ryan actually counts for $18m against the cap next year. $12m new money.

 

Anyway, just by releasing Ryan we will get $17m in cap relief.

 

We currently set at $26.38m in cap space

Add in the $17m from Ryan

 

We will be up to $43.38m in cap space.

 

Will probably extend Buckner freeing up another $6-$8m in 2023 space.

 

Setting at $50, without to many guys to retain.

 

Can move on from Kelly and save $8m if we just flat out.release him.

 

 

It's not all doom and gloom, there is other moves that could be made to open up even more if they want to.

 

Moore - $7-$8m

Cox - $3m

Gilmore - $9m

 

That's $78m if need be, that's the extreme though.

 

[will426]

49 minutes ago, Mr.Debonair said:

Man Ballard prob was salivating over that 6th pick

I hope we grab us a rolling ball of butcher knives with that pic  

[danlhart87]

1 minute ago, w87r said:

Definitely is a dump. Moss could be a good get though.

 

Your looking at the cap wrong.

 

Ryan actually counts for $18m against the cap next year. $12m new money.

 

Anyway, just by releasing Ryan we will get $17m in cap relief.

 

We currently set at $26.38m in cap space

Add in the $17m from Ryan

 

We will be up to $43.38m in cap space.

 

Will probably extend Buckner freeing up another $6-$8m in 2023 space.

 

Setting at $50, without to many guys to retain.

 

Can move on from Kelly and save $8m if we just flat out.release him.

 

 

It's not all foom and gloom, there is other moves that could be made to open up even more if they want to.

 

Moore - $7-$8m

Cox - $3m

Gilmore - $9m

 

That's $78m if need be, that's the extreme though.

 

Ironic because 78 is Kelly jersey #

[strt182]

12 minutes ago, tvturner said:

The Colts are missing talent at the 3 most important positions in football....

 

No star DE, no franchise QB, and no LT.

 

Don't have to have a star at any of those just somebody to do their job. So many fans want STARS., flashy names, ect... Results are all that are needed. 

[Dobbinblitz]

1 minute ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Moss had only 91 yards in five games this season.

Ok, but on 17 attempts - 5.4 avg.

[NorthernColt]

Just confirmed by Shefter now. Hines requested a trade. Does make more sense now.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Joel Erickson just said that Schefter reported Hines representation asked for the trade. Not specifically Hines. But he wanted it too or he could of said no.

[Scott Pennock]

At least the complaints about how our coaches ran him up the gut too much will subside.......lol

 

 

[will426]

Just now, NorthernColt said:

Just confirmed by Shefter now. Hines requested a trade. Does make more sense now.

I would too hell he was told he was gonna be used and all we know how to do is run his 180lb self up the middle  then he practices as a slot and he doesn’t even play there Frank is *ic 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

1 minute ago, Dobbinblitz said:

Ok, but on 17 attempts - 5.4 avg.

Yeah his average is good but it’s kind of a small sample size. I know he wasn’t the main back and they throw a lot. 

[ShuteAt168]

Good time to revisit Ballard’s decision to pay Hines top-10 RB money. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Joel Erickson also said what I have said and others have said. There just wasn’t room for him anymore with Parris coming on strong and pierce playing so well. The targets just aren’t there for him.

[tvturner]

4 minutes ago, strt182 said:

Don't have to have a star at any of those just somebody to do their job. So many fans want STARS., flashy names, ect... Results are all that are needed. 

What have the results gotten us so far?

[Franklin County]

Irsay  probably wanted to trade Hines because he was sick of watching Frank run him up the gut for no gain.

[w87r]

9 minutes ago, masterlock said:

No, per DrafKings, "Hines signed a three-year, $18.6 million deal with the Colts and has two more years remaining on that extension after this season. However, the deal has no guaranteed money after this season, so the Bills could release him without any dead money repercussions. Hines has a base salary of $3.3 million this year, which jumps to $4.45 million in 2023 and $5.1 million in 2024. Each year includes $340,000 in total per-game roster bonus money.

The Colts will carry $1.5 million in dead money this year and $1.5 million in dead money in 2023."

Hines:

2022 Dead Cap: $1.5m

2023 Dead Cap: $3m

2022 Cap Savings: $3.64m

2023 Cap Savings: $3.29m

2024 Cap Savings: $6.9m

 

It's almost $14m over 3 seasons saved.

[Scott Pennock]

On the surface it seems like two teams trading our players that roles were diminished and were miscast in the offense.......

 

Here is his Draft Profile which actually sounds like he may fit better in our blocking (or attempted) schemes.....

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/zack-moss/32004d4f-5375-6406-2efb-a60ab36c4cc4

 

 

[AwesomeAustin]

Looks like a good trade to me. 

[Dobbinblitz]

3 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

At least the complaints about how our coaches ran him up the gut too much will subside.......lol

 

 

It would appear that Hines was tired of it as well.

[chad72]

1 hour ago, deedub75 said:

Moss and a 6th.

 

We got Moss'ed  

[Defjamz26]

38 minutes ago, CR91 said:

 

Run between the tackles? We can't even create holes for Taylor. You think Moss will make a difference?

Yeah you got a point there lol. I suppose when the line is actually fixed, Miss can run between the tackles.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

On the surface it seems like two teams trading our players that roles were diminished and were miscast in the offense.......

 

Here is his Draft Profile which actually sounds like he may fit better in our blocking (or attempted) schemes.....

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/zack-moss/32004d4f-5375-6406-2efb-a60ab36c4cc4

 

 

Thst was my question. Maybe we get better blocking which will help the offense.

[chad72]

@richard pallo Didn't think we'd get more than a 5th rounder but we did get Zach Moss. 

[danlhart87]

4 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Joel Erickson also said what I have said and others have said. There just wasn’t room for him anymore with Parris coming on strong and pierce playing so well. The targets just aren’t there for him.

They said it

 

 

@coming on strong

 

 

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

35 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Moss is a better RB than Hines.   Bigger and will be better as JTs backup and breather back.

better up the gut and can break tackles. hines didnt fit our system i am thinking, but may excel in the bills system

[chad72]

3 minutes ago, Scott Pennock said:

On the surface it seems like two teams trading our players that roles were diminished and were miscast in the offense.......

 

Here is his Draft Profile which actually sounds like he may fit better in our blocking (or attempted) schemes.....

 

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/zack-moss/32004d4f-5375-6406-2efb-a60ab36c4cc4

 

 

 

Maybe we bring back more zone based stretch plays with Zach Moss running, like the old Edge days???

[HungarianColtsFan]

Basicaly we sold him for glass beads.

[Dobbinblitz]

I think every Colts fan was frustrated of the inability to 1 or 2 yards on 3rd/4th down the last couple of years. They needed a violent runner in the backfield to help the cause and got one for player that wanted out. They received some CAP  relief and an extra pick in the process.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

at least someone gave something for him and we didnt just cut him, not we can draft another 6th round qb

[w87r]

Just saw it was 2024 6th rounder (conditional)

 

For those that wasn't mad enough.

[dw49]

37 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

This feels like a salary dump to me.   
 

I don’t mean to bring more bad news, but the Colts are going to be in a very difficult place with regard to the cap next year.   
 

The 23 cap goes up $17 mill next year.   But about $12m of that has already been eaten up by Matt Ryan.   Yup. 

I don’t think we can retain Ngokoue even if he started playing better.   Too much money.   
 

Plus, the Colts have to try and sign Pittman and Taylor next off-season.   Plus Okereke is up and due for a new deal.  
 

The 23 off-season looks to be incredibly difficult.    Sorry. 

 

 

 

It's not as bad a picture as you paint. The estimated cap for next year is 226m. This I believe includes around 8 m in roll over.The colts top 51 for 2023 is 197 m. Dead money is around 3m. 

 

The 2023 top 51 contracts come to just under 200m.This gives the Colts 26 m in cap space. Add to that the 23 m they save( he has a 35M cap hit for 2023) on releasing Ryan. Gives you 49 mill in cap space. Plus if Colts went with Pinter (seems a given) at C , they would save another 8m(cut Kelly) bringing us to 57m. This is after the Hines trade. 

 

Seems like we're OK to me. You talk about 2024 , but remember you have Smith to consider. He can be replaced in 2024 and save 10 m. Or if cut in 2025 , he saves a whopping 16m. So at worst keep him in 2024 and just pay a little less base to the new signs in 2024. Also it looks like we will have Sam's cheap contract for 2023 and 2024 or at worst a rookie QB salary. No way Colts bring another 30 m "gamble" in for QB. 

 

Say what you want about how bad our front office seems to be right now , but they did a very good job with contracts. 

 

IMO , they have 

[chad72]

Just now, w87r said:

Just saw it was 2024 6th rounder (conditional)

 

For those that wasn't mad enough.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

12 minutes ago, Franklin County said:

Irsay  probably wanted to trade Hines because he was sick of watching Frank run him up the gut for no gain.

now moss up the gut one half yard gain