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Colts Trade for Wentz (details in first post)


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10 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

I think Philly did just fine too. Unless Wentz is injured or plays horribly , he's pretty much a cinch to play 75% of the plays. That is If he plays just decently and is healthy . The Colts would need to sit him the last 4 games in order to keep next year's compensation at a 2nd rounder. Colts should have a roster good enough to be in contention after game 12 even with unspectacular QB play. So IMO , it's pretty much a 2021 3rd and 2022 first unless he get's hurt or benched for Eason. 

 

Most likely.

Just now, PrincetonTiger said:

Lane Johnson for one

 

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I am never playing poker with Ballard. My god that's a steal.

Long time Eagles fan, here is my rundown on Carson Wentz. I'll start with Wentz the person/teammate. Through 2018 he was widely considered a great guy, great teammate, hard worker. Then out of t

From Adam Schefter: Philadelphia has agreed to trade Carson Wentz to the Indianapolis Colts in exchange for a 2021 third-round pick and a conditional 2022 second-round pick that could turn into a firs

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10 minutes ago, Chloe6124 said:

 

People are going to read that and think his teammates hated him and were excited to get him out of there. They have a way of spinning things to see a negative 

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2 minutes ago, PrincetonTiger said:

Jeff Skervsky from WPVI 6ABC talked to him 

  LJ said he is so happy for CW to rejoin FR

 

Former Eagles players... I missed that. I read it as current Eagles players glad he's gone.

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9 minutes ago, Colts1324 said:

I think Wentz is an upgrade over Rivers, even if he does throw a few more INT's.
 

Rivers played great, but he also caused a lot of vanilla play-calling. The PA ability Wentz possesses is a huge upgrade. Rivers' handoffs are also extremely slow and obvious. Wentz should allow Reich to open up the playbook.

 

I'm not sure how you can say so confidently that Wentz is an upgrade over Rivers after the respective seasons that they each just had. 

 

Wentz has the potential to be better than Rivers, but also has the potential to be much, much worse. 

 

I think 5ish years of a Rivers level QB with functional athleticism is worth a 1st and a 3rd 100 times out of 100. It's possible we'll get that, but it's also very much possible that we won't.

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You have to love Ballard to stick to his guns. He did not give up too much for Wentz. Worst case is a first round pick in 2022 IF Wentz plays well or leads us to the playoffs. I get a feeling Ballard will trade back in the draft to get another 3rd round pick for next year.  Now if we go OT there are several solid players so I could see us trading back and still get one of those. I think we now have the potential of franchise QB assuming he can stay healthy. He has all the physical tools to be great he just needs to free up space between his ears.

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Just now, Mackrel829 said:

 

I'm not sure how you can say so confidently that Wentz is an upgrade over Rivers after the respective seasons that they each just had. 

 

Wentz has the potential to be better than Rivers, but also has the potential to be much, much worse. 

 

I think 5ish years of a Rivers level QB with functional athleticism is worth a 1st and a 3rd 100 times out of 100. It's possible we'll get that, but it's also very much possible that we won't.

That's a fair assumption. I 100% agree that it could go either way. But, I do believe that there is a small chance he plays as bad as last year. This scheme fits him well, and he will arguably have the best offense around him that he has ever had.

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I'll give Carson a pass for 2020 for the dumpster fire that were the Eagles. It's not like Wentz is coming in to play hero ball, but my expectations for this team is higher then with Rivers.

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3 minutes ago, Mackrel829 said:

 

I'm not sure how you can say so confidently that Wentz is an upgrade over Rivers after the respective seasons that they each just had. 

 

Wentz has the potential to be better than Rivers, but also has the potential to be much, much worse. 

 

I think 5ish years of a Rivers level QB with functional athleticism is worth a 1st and a 3rd 100 times out of 100. It's possible we'll get that, but it's also very much possible that we won't.

 

I agree.  I wouldn't say he's an upgrade for Rivers when it comes to getting us into the right play, or short pass accuracy.

 

I HOPE he's an upgrade in long ball accuracy.  And I'm pretty sure he's a lot more mobile (he better be).

 

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1 hour ago, relkins said:

Hope his number is double zero because that's what we got.

No we got a franchise QB who had one bad year .  His last three years he put up top ten numbers . Eagles have a bad team look how Mahomes looked in the super bowl running for his life the whole game even with elite wr help. Wentz was running for his life all season with a bad wr core and coaching staff that went down hill . Wentz had elite talent and will be a top ten guy next year 

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3 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

No we got a franchise QB who had one bad year .  His last three years he put up top ten numbers . Eagles have a bad team look how Mahomes looked in the super bowl running for his life the whole game even with elite wr help. Wentz was running for his life all season with a bad wr core and coaching staff that went down hill . Wentz had elite talent and will be a top ten guy next year 

eh 1 bad? try 3 bad. 18 was meh, ok, 19 sucked, 2020 fell completely off the tracks. He's had one good year, 2017.  and he didn't even finish it cause of injury. 

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3 minutes ago, RNGDShobby said:

Does anyone have an idea of the strength of the 2022 draft class? From most I've read/seen, it's weak. Especially at QB. So could be a reason he was okay to add those conditions.

 

How could anyone really know, after this year's college season? Lot of teams and players didn't even play.

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Sorry am late to the party.  Sometimes you, you know, have to work and stuff.

 

I love this deal.

 

Benefits:

Wentz has gone to the pro bowl, and the playoffs.

Wentz already has a relationship with Reich and his offensive schemes, so if we have another COVID training camp, he's already got a head start.

We kept this year's 1st and 2nd out of the deal.

The terms are basically about whether or not he gets hurt, not about whether he sucks.  If he doesn't play the required number of snaps, it's a 2nd round.  If he does (which means he was healthy), then it's a 1st round.

Dangers:

There is still a risk that he may suck.  He didn't play that well recently, and that could continue.  We could have given up a 1st and a 3rd for a quarterback that isn't any good anymore.

We still take a significant cap hit with him.  Which will truncate our ability to sign/resign other players.

 

It's a calculated risk, but one I agree we should take.  Good job, CB.

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5 minutes ago, RNGDShobby said:

Does anyone have an idea of the strength of the 2022 draft class? From most I've read/seen, it's weak. Especially at QB. So could be a reason he was okay to add those conditions.

impossible to say, i really dont think this years class is fully known.  There's a bunch of players overhyped that are likely to go high and bust out.

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3 minutes ago, csmopar said:

eh 1 bad? try 3 bad. 18 was meh, ok, 19 sucked, 2020 fell completely off the tracks. He's had one good year, 2017.  and he didn't even finish it cause of injury. 

2019 28 touchdowns to 7 picks 4 thousand yards plus 243 rushing yards . That is better then rivers this year if that sucked then rivers year was horrible . 2018 he only played 11 games 21 touchdowns to 7 picks he was on pace for over 30 touchdowns 4 thousand yards.  Even his 2020 stats were around the same as rivers the year before the colts got him .    Plus the eagles have a bad  offensive line and a bad team that had been on a fast decline after 2017 . 

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8 minutes ago, csmopar said:

eh 1 bad? try 3 bad. 18 was meh, ok, 19 sucked, 2020 fell completely off the tracks. He's had one good year, 2017.  and he didn't even finish it cause of injury. 

I don’t think your view is widely shared.   

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2 hours ago, Rackeen305 said:

Wait a min. You thought the Colts played well last year? And you dont have your expectation of Superbowl every year?

 

You know what you are right. Because if the Colts only made it to 2 Superbowls with arguably the GOAT Peyton Manning, then I guess we shouldnt expect a superbowl anytime soon, if we go by your method/example...

 

But hey, KC Chiefs, Buffalo, Ravens even the Browns will be looking toward the Superbowl every year.

 

Enjoy your AFC South Divisional Banner "IF" you actually win that.

 

with numbers like: 

 

2020: 3-8-1 record | 57% comp | 16 TD | 15 INT | 49.6 QBR (Wentz)

 

I wouldn't expect the Superbowl Either. By the way, please dont get those numbers confused, as they were produced not by JB but Wentz. Hurray JB!

I think we're all hoping that Frank can "fix" Wentz

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1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t think your view is widely shared.   

 

3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I don’t think your view is widely shared.   

more than you think but probably not as well as I'd like. But lets be real, I hope he returns to the 2017 level, but if we get more of the 2020 Wentz, well at least we'll get to keep our 2022 #1. 

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8 minutes ago, csmopar said:

impossible to say, i really dont think this years class is fully known.  There's a bunch of players overhyped that are likely to go high and bust out.

I been living 30 mins away from the eagles stadium since 2012 I listen to eagles radio and watch a lot of eagles games . Wentz has elite talent very mobile can throw on the run and is very talented .  Give him the colts offense line and coaching he will be over 35 touchdowns this year watch I will come back . All my friends are eagles fans and are so mad they traded wentz 

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12 minutes ago, csmopar said:

 

more than you think but probably not as well as I'd like. But lets be real, I hope he returns to the 2017 level, but if we get more of the 2020 Wentz, well at least we'll get to keep our 2022 #1. 

For what it’s worth.... 
 

My comment was based on an ESPN story out this morning.   It pretty much called the deal a tie.   The opinions were expressed by writers who cover the NFL.   They were mostly very complimentary of Wentz and gave good reviews on his play in more than one year.   I’d post it, but I can’t,   It’s premium material behind a pay wall. 

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Our local The Athletic guys will be doing an emergency pod regarding the trade. They're my favorite Eagles guys we have in the city. They're objective, they call the Eagles out when they need to be called out, and think with nuance. If you're interested in takes on the trade from the other perspective, that will be a good one to listen to. I'll post a link when it's available.

 

Right now, this is Adam Caplan and Geoff Mosher discussing the trade. They said in their next episode they'll dive in more from the Colts perspective. They don't get too deep here, just initial reactions and thoughts.

 

 

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33 minutes ago, csmopar said:

eh 1 bad? try 3 bad. 18 was meh, ok, 19 sucked, 2020 fell completely off the tracks. He's had one good year, 2017.  and he didn't even finish it cause of injury. 

look how many times he was sacked over those years

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@csmopar

 

This was your post from the other thread:

Quote

 

My reasons and the reasons I have seen most people on here say they don't want Wentz is as followed:

 

1: He's broken, beat up, physically and mentally.

2: His contract is stupid expensive and really should be getting him PLUS a pick just to take on that salary.

3: He was benched and still the Eagles think he's worth a 1 or more. Heck no

4: His play, has never really been all that great consistently. He had one good year, in 2017, an ok year in 2018 and the wheels got loose in 2019 and then fell off completely last year.

 

 

I crossed out 2 and 3 because I don't think they're still relevant. Now that we did the trade and we know the cost, what would it take for you to think he's good enough for the Colts to contend with him?

 

And do you think the Colts can get that kind of performance out of him?

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10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

For what it’s worth.... 
 

My comment was based on an ESPN story out this morning.   It pretty much called the deal a tie.   The opinions were expressed by writers who cover the NFL.   They were mostly very complimentary of Wentz and gave good reviews on his play in more than one year.   I’d post it, but I can’t,   It’s premium material behind a pay wall. 

this is why i say what i say.

 

 

 

2017- Stud ranked 5th overall https://www.pff.com/news/final-nfl-qb-rankings-by-pff-player-grades-2017

2018- Meh, fell to number 13- https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2018/passing.htm (for what its worth, Rivers was 14th and Luck was number 2)

2019- Did a bit better than i thought, ranked 11th (Rivers was 17th) https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2019/passing.htm

2020- 34th out of the 59 signal callers (rivers was 19th). https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2020/passing.htm

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