Pats trade for Dwayne Allen [Merge]

[Andrew Luck fan club]

14 minutes ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

I like Ballard!  But Lets not anoint him the 2nd coming here just yet. I am sure there is a plan we just don't know what that is yet. until we do the team now has an additional hole to fill!

I anointed him the 2nd coming as soon as his first presser ended

[Malakai432]

2 hours ago, BOTT said:

And Coby Fleener was going to play lights out for the saints.

 

You never heard that from me.  I've always thought Coby Fleener played like he was about 150 lbs.  Patriots aren't the Saints also. 

[BOTT]

Just now, Malakai432 said:

 

You never heard that from me.  I've always thought Coby Fleener played like he was about 150 lbs. 

True, but Allen plays like a 150 yr old man.

[Malakai432]

Just now, BOTT said:

True, but Allen plays like a 150 yr old man.

 

Hah, true well his body is made like a 150 yr old man.  He's like Mr Glass from the movie Unbreakable.  However I think he's got it just a smidge better there in NE than NO. 

[NannyMcafee]

14 minutes ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

I wanted to keep Doyle you don't get that Doyle and Allen play the same positions, but have different skill sets. I wanted both!!You HIGHLY UNDERESTIMATE Allens ability NE doesn't.

 

His ability has nothing to do with his production. In our system Allen didn't excel. 

[Malakai432]

I hope the best for DA (even though it's for the #()@ Pats), bummer it didn't work out here.  I guess he doesn't have to worry about me peeing on his dog again,  .

[Mr_486lo]

We're gonna get their 4th round pick and they will get our 6th rounder...BOOM!!!!

[chrisfarley]

we're going to need another blocking tight end.  allen was very good at this.  If we could get Roberts in the 4th or lower, it would be a major pick-up 

 

Michael Roberts, TE, Toledo 
 Height: 6-4. Weight: 261. Arm: 33.25. Hand: 11.63. 
 Projected 40 Time: 4.74. 
Projected Round (2017): 3-5. 
 2/25/17: Roberts is a blocking tight end for the NFL, yet has some receiving ability. Scouting sources said that Roberts could be the best pure Y (blocking) tight end in the 2017 NFL Draft. They say he is athletic enough to make some plays as a short option or in the red zone. Roberts had a quality week at the Senior Bowl, minus a few dropped passes. 

Roberts made 45 receptions for 533 yards with 16 touchdowns in 2016. As a junior, he had 21 catches for 234 yards with four scores. 
Read more at http://walterfootball.com/draft2017TE.php#QPFTj4CDIj2LXeyK.99

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 hours ago, NorthernBlue said:

 

 

This off season has gotten off to a much more entertaining start than last years. Last year I'm pretty sure all we had was Grigson and Pagano are staying, Colts sign Patrick Robinson and then the draft .

Other than Pat retiring every single one of these are great moves.

[TDewar1987]

Darn, they traded Stone Hands? Now he can go drop passes for BB.

[scooter4910]

Ugghhh....unless Allen had some form of communicable disease I wouldn't give/trade the Pats anything. 

[BOTT]

3 minutes ago, scooter4910 said:

Ugghhh....unless Allen had some form of communicable disease I wouldn't give/trade the Pats anything. 

The colts didn't 

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 hours ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I know Allen's ability just fine. He's a great blocker and he can catch balls in the end zone. He also has poor hands though. Blocking TE's are easier to find than receiving TE's, which is why it's easy to replace him. Allen was a huge burden and really only produced one game when scored 3 tds. More importantly, he keeps Doyle off the field, when Doyle is a huge safety valve for Luck. I wouldn't mind making Allen the 2, but if it's between Doyle and Allen, and we can get value for Allen, then you do it 100 times out of 100.

His hands are fine, BURDEN WHAT???, the Patriots like him, It was never a choice between one or other???? They complement each other!!!! We run a lot of 2 TE sets.I guess we can agree to disagree! Allen will play well for the Patriots that I can tell you.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

1 hour ago, chrisfarley said:

we're going to need another blocking tight end.  allen was very good at this.  If we could get Roberts in the 4th or lower, it would be a major pick-up 

 

Michael Roberts, TE, Toledo 
 Height: 6-4. Weight: 261. Arm: 33.25. Hand: 11.63. 
 Projected 40 Time: 4.74. 
Projected Round (2017): 3-5. 
 2/25/17: Roberts is a blocking tight end for the NFL, yet has some receiving ability. Scouting sources said that Roberts could be the best pure Y (blocking) tight end in the 2017 NFL Draft. They say he is athletic enough to make some plays as a short option or in the red zone. Roberts had a quality week at the Senior Bowl, minus a few dropped passes. 

Roberts made 45 receptions for 533 yards with 16 touchdowns in 2016. As a junior, he had 21 catches for 234 yards with four scores. 
Read more at http://walterfootball.com/draft2017TE.php#QPFTj4CDIj2LXeyK.99

seems great but not a defensive player which is what we need!

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

His ability has nothing to do with his production. In our system Allen didn't excel. 

He had to block more than he should have because our OL sucks.  In our system he scored a lot of TD's thats how you win!

[KB]

6 minutes ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

seems great but not a defensive player which is what we need!

Yeah I've heard that he would cost every single pick and not a fourth or fifth. Only player in history of the draft to be chosen under this condition. 

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 hours ago, DougDew said:

If we can seriously make this Alabama TE the slot WR in the three wide then maybe it makes sense....but we'd have to move Dorsett for some real value to get a good defensive player or a RB.  Just seems like a complicated way to justify selecting a TE at 15. 

I don't want to take a TE but if he's the best player there what do you do reach or trade down. I would rather trade down or take him than reach.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 hours ago, Majin Vegeta said:

I anointed him the 2nd coming as soon as his first presser ended

I like him too but Grigson was much loved at first too. Not by me ever. Let hopr he is as good as people say!

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

I don't want to take a TE but if he's the best player there what do you do reach or trade down. I would rather trade down or take him than reach.

I don't care what combination of 14 players go before us, OJ Howard will not be the best player available at 15. 

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

5 minutes ago, KB said:

Yeah I've heard that he would cost every single pick and not a fourth or fifth. Only player in history of the draft to be chosen under this condition. 

?

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

1 minute ago, Jared Cisneros said:

I don't care what combination of 14 players go before us, OJ Howard will not be the best player available at 15. 

really some would argue that.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

really some would argue that.

You really want to argue that he will be BPA at our pick? Ok, I'll call your bluff, start a thread, name your top 15 players, and make a case for OJ Howard to be BPA at our pick. I doubt many people will agree with you. You'll probably say our opinions don't matter and the GM's know better, well, Ballard won't take a TE either. Make a thread with your argument that Howard is a good pick for us and BPA. Lets see how it turns out. use your "sources" that would argue I'm wrong. Even if someone had him ranked in top 15, it won't be us taking him.

[AZColt11]

I'm good with it.  Allen never lived up to the hype.  We now have an extra 4th rounder and a little extra cap room.  Trade bait for the draft?

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, AZColt11 said:

I'm good with it.  Allen never lived up to the hype.  We now have an extra 4th rounder and a little extra cap room.  Trade bait for the draft?

We could definitely use it to trade up in the 2nd. Get a 1st rounder that falls potentially. No way it'll make a difference in the 1st though.

[OffensivelyPC]

Im pretty torn on this...always been a DA fan. I defended his contract and I cant say Im against the trade because it wasnt all that team friendly. Clearly the Colts have a lot of faith in Doyle and Swope (and perhaps a draftee). DA was injury prone and thats about the only way I see us "winning" this trade. We still lost a good player, even if he was a fan fave that lost some followers along the way. 

 

Anyway, i think this trade says more about swope than doyle. Just my opinion.

[NewColtsFan]

 

I don't see us taking Howard or Njoku with the 15th pick.....

 

But for anyone arguing that's he's not a top 15 player,  consider this....

 

Todd McShay has Howard ranked 8th

Lance Zierlein has Howard ranked 10th

Daniel Jeremiah has Howard ranked 13th

CBS Sports has Howard ranked 7th

 

Kiper's next Big Board comes out in a week, I think. 

Again,  I see us going defense, defense and defense with picks 1, 2, 3....    but that doesn't mean that Howard isn't worth the 15th overall pick.

 

Just saying.....

 

[Yoshinator]

3 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't see us taking Howard or Njoku with the 15th pick.....

 

But for anyone arguing that's he's not a top 15 player,  consider this....

 

Todd McShay has Howard ranked 8th

Lance Zierlein has Howard ranked 10th

Daniel Jeremiah has Howard ranked 13th

CBS Sports has Howard ranked 7th

 

Kiper's next Big Board comes out in a week, I think. 

Again,  I see us going defense, defense and defense with picks 1, 2, 3....    but that doesn't mean that Howard isn't worth the 15th overall pick.

 

Just saying.....

 

I hope he does go in the top 15. If he went before us, that would be very lucky. Hopefully some team takes a chance and a defensive player drops to us. I know he had a great combine, but a TE that early is very unusual. In any case, as you said, we won't touch him, so it's a big positive.

[TKnight24]

1 hour ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

really some would argue that.

 

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

You really want to argue that he will be BPA at our pick? Ok, I'll call your bluff, start a thread, name your top 15 players, and make a case for OJ Howard to be BPA at our pick. I doubt many people will agree with you. You'll probably say our opinions don't matter and the GM's know better, well, Ballard won't take a TE either. Make a thread with your argument that Howard is a good pick for us and BPA. Lets see how it turns out. use your "sources" that would argue I'm wrong. Even if someone had him ranked in top 15, it won't be us taking him.

BPA  & Need I can give you 2 names that may be there at 15 that should easily be taken over OJ Howard

 

Derek Barnett 

Tim Williams 

 

Even throw in Taco Charlton & Teez Tabor 

[BOTT]

1 hour ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

His hands are fine, BURDEN WHAT???, the Patriots like him, It was never a choice between one or other???? They complement each other!!!! We run a lot of 2 TE sets.I guess we can agree to disagree! Allen will play well for the Patriots that I can tell you.

Until he get a high ankle sprain 3 games in.  And his hands were poor last season....in big situations.

 

i have always liked DA, but he's gotten worse, not better.

[ColtsBlueFL]

After taking in the ramifications involved,  I then look at this in wide lens amusement...

 

At big picture level I see a player we used a round 3 draft pick on...  Give that 3rd round draft pick player and a 6th draft pick so we can have a late 4th or early 5th round pick.  A 3rd and a 6th, just to get a 5th.  And people are quite pleased.

 

Then I also see others wanting to move one of our #1 round draft picks... for maybe/hopefully a 3rd rounder?

 

Just seems like going to a car lot, buying a 45k SUV.  Then a ways down the road, you move it on to someone else for 28k, even though you still owe 35k, and yet are still somehow happy about it.

 

But that's the price you pay in disaster cleanup, I guess.

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

11 hours ago, aaron11 said:

when is the last time a 6th rounder has worked out for the colts?

 

seriously i cant remember

 

Antoine Bethea

[Lawrence Owen]

This was all about just getting rid of Allen.  We really did not get jack from this trade other than some cap room and another roster spot.

We basicly traded Allen for 45 spots up from our 6th round pick.  Could have done that with nearly every player on the roster.  Colts brass (Ballard)basicly just wanted out of Allens contract.

[AZColt11]

Yeah I don't see it as a problem really.  What Doyle's contract told me is they were probably going to release Allen at some point anyway.  May as well take what you can get for him and they got about 1 1/2 round moved up in the draft.  Hey, it beats just releasing him for nothing.  And those spots could be a big difference in the kind of player you land.

[Restored]

Look, I get people are saying that he'll go on to New England and have success but the key is that he wasn't having the success here. Whether its because of injuries, lack of focus or whatever, he simply wasn't productive here. Add in the facts that Doyle just got brought back, Swoope has flashed potential and that Allen's contract wasn't justifiable, you end up having the perfect storm for this trade.

 

Bigger however, is that it sends a message that Ballard doesn't want mediocrity on the team if he can help it. Doyle clearly outperformed Allen last year while being the #2 TE. Doyle got rewarded with a nice contract, Allen got traded.

[NewEra]

Not sad, he never bounced back to his rookie promise. 

 

Trying to read through. What did we get for him?

[Chucklez]

12 hours ago, Jules said:

The 4th and 1 in London will never leave my memory bank.

 

 

I was there..... It was gut wrenching after watching the team almost come back from the hole they shouldnt have dug themselves in the first place.

[a06cc]

I like Allen, but whatever helps the team get better I'm for it. 

[HOZER]

54 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Not sad, he never bounced back to his rookie promise. 

 

Trying to read through. What did we get for him?

Colts= 4th round comp pick

 

pats= Allen, 6th round pick.

[csmopar]

3 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

After taking in the ramifications involved,  I then look at this in wide lens amusement...

 

At big picture level I see a player we used a round 3 draft pick on...  Give that 3rd round draft pick player and a 6th draft pick so we can have a late 4th or early 5th round pick.  A 3rd and a 6th, just to get a 5th.  And people are quite pleased.

 

Then I also see others wanting to move one of our #1 round draft picks... for maybe/hopefully a 3rd rounder?

 

Just seems like going to a car lot, buying a 45k SUV.  Then a ways down the road, you move it on to someone else for 28k, even though you still owe 35k, and yet are still somehow happy about it.

 

But that's the price you pay in disaster cleanup, I guess.

 

true and a good analogy.  

 

but let's say you had tons of problems with that SUV and you get sick of paying a 5-7 hundred dollar or more a month car payment on a vehicle that spends 2/3rd of the month in multiple shops as they try to fix one thing after another, half of which aren't covered under warranty.  So you end up selling the thing, taking a small loss, and you go out and get you something half the cost, now you're back in the black within a short time.  Is it an ideal situation, absolutely not, do you initially loose money, absolutely, but in the long run, you're saving money and you may potentially get a vehicle that while not as flashy, may just end up being more reliable. Therefore, its a win over the long run.

[d9sccr]

There's definitely a lack of value in the trade IMO, but it is a deep TE class.  I'd be happy to go defense early, but think Njoku would be a great pickup in the mid rounds if he falls that far.