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[Rapoport] The Colts & All-Pro LB Darius Leonard agree to terms on a blockbuster 5-year, $99.25M contract extension to make him the highest paid ILB


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6 hours ago, Nickster said:

Dude he’s a good player but Brooks is likely the best coverage LB NFL history.  He’s the reason Tampa 2 works because he was essentially a pro bowl type of safety in coverage.  And brooks was totally calm.  
 

Pretty much a completely different player.

Leonard is already showing he is better at stopping the run and is a better tackler so I can go that route. The most combined tackles in a season Brooks had in his career was 158, Leonard had 163 in his rookie season lmao .

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3 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not really a voice of reason and I called it last night saying there is 2 people in here that will bash this deal. You 2 are the only 2 that thinks Leonard doesn't deserve this money. His primary position is about tackling and stopping the run, he plays a different position compared to Warner or what Brooks played for example who focuses on pass coverage more. This whole he stinks in Pass Coverage is bogus anyway, he had 5 INT's in 2019. Bashing Leonard would be like bashing Ray Lewis because he rarely sacked the QB, that wasn't Ray's duty. You will never get it so I am done with this, go on and bash away MooseBallard.

You must not have read this thread if you think there are only 2 on here that think this is an overpay.

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3 hours ago, Nickster said:

You must not have read this thread if you think there are only 2 on here that think this is an overpay.

ok there are 10 or so out of 100, you got me lmao but you and Moose stand out because you guys have been talking about this for months. It's your guys opinions so I shouldn't bash it but if you took a poll in here and ask everyone that posts in here was Leonard's contract fair and worth it, you would have around 90 yes's and around 10 no's. Go ahead and post a poll if you think I am wrong, proof would be right there. Luckily in here you can't even cheat and vote no like 20 times, it only allows you to vote once.

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7 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not really a voice of reason and I called it last night saying there is 2 people in here that will bash this deal. You 2 are the only 2 that thinks Leonard doesn't deserve this money. His primary position is about tackling and stopping the run, he plays a different position compared to Warner or what Brooks played for example who focuses on pass coverage more. This whole he stinks in Pass Coverage is bogus anyway, he had 5 INT's in 2019. Bashing Leonard would be like bashing Ray Lewis because he rarely sacked the QB, that wasn't Ray's duty. You will never get it so I am done with this, go on and bash away MooseBallard.

 

But it wasn't really bogus in 2020. He was just bad last year. Much different from 2019. 

 

And I would argue, that as a WILL in basically a 4-2-5, pass coverage is definitely one of his duties. He already gets targeted at least 5x per game. Could easily see that number go up if teams think they can take advantage.

 

But perhaps 2020 was just an outlier...hopefully that is the case. I just think the regression in pass coverage we saw last year was notable.

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17 hours ago, stitches said:

 

Figured there would be a big signing bonus with Leonard. We now get to see Ballard actually manage a cap with high-paid players, so I expect we will see more creative structures going forward.

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11 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

ok there are 10 or so out of 100, you got me lmao but you and Moose stand out because you guys have been talking about this for months. It's your guys opinions so I shouldn't bash it but if you took a poll in here and ask everyone that posts in here was Leonard's contract fair and worth it, you would have around 90 yes's and around 10 no's. Go ahead and post a poll if you think I am wrong, proof would be right there. Luckily in here you can't even cheat and vote no like 20 times, it only allows you to vote once.

 

  Fair as in that is what top 5 $$ is now set at, so ok. 
  Is he worth it?  Of course not. The position is a stat stuffer, and he plays it well. Some bonu$ for being a Maniac/Leader. A couple more Mil for a couple extra turnovers above norm.  $12M would be rich for the position so $15M is outlandish but Ok. 
 For his $$$ i would take Pacal, Hines, and Speed. We will see what good players we can't keep next off season. Some will think about the Value of his position as we wave goodbye. 

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13 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Figured there would be a big signing bonus with Leonard. We now get to see Ballard actually manage a cap with high-paid players, so I expect we will see more creative structures going forward.

 

  Gotta keep those CAP #'s down as much as possible the next couple years so we can re-sign as many of OUR best contributors as possible.
 Some Dead Cap hits down the road are part of it when you are holding it together for a SB run. Good Luck!

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13 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

I agree,   but Brooks wasn't All Pro till his 3rd season.   Darius is a 3 time all pro in 3 seasons.   We will see how his career plays out

 

Leonard did get AP at age 23, which is incredibly impressive. That was a year younger than Brooks. 

 

Can't really compare their age 25 seasons because some stats weren't recorded then.

 

Leonard is getting ready to enter his age 26 season. Here are Brooks' averages for his age 26-27 seasons (when they finally started counting TFL and PD):

 

Games - 16

AV - 18

INT - 2.5

PD - 12

FF - 3.5

SACKS - 1.5

TKL - 149.5

SOLO TKL - 121

TFL - 13.5

 

Those are incredible numbers. We will see if Leonard can match it.

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22 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

 

 

 

 

Haha...was wondering why I was getting notifications from this thread. Smith was a solid prospect, but I didn't like drafting a G at #37 after drafting Nelson at #6. But I wish I had a crystal ball that showed him making a seamless transition to RT when Ballard said he drafted him to play RG. That was awesome. Sort of like drafting Tyquan Lewis to be a pass-rushing DT and then having him turn into a Montez Sweat level ER.

 

But in the spirit of digging up thread, someone should dig up the JB extension thread. Plenty of wrong people there as well. 

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In matters such as this, it is my belief that Chris Ballard is fully aware of the team situation and needs. Darius is a great player and Chris is a great GM. I have no reservations about the contract. Congrats to both.

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3 hours ago, shasta519 said:

 

Haha...was wondering why I was getting notifications from this thread. Smith was a solid prospect, but I didn't like drafting a G at #37 after drafting Nelson at #6. But I wish I had a crystal ball that showed him making a seamless transition to RT when Ballard said he drafted him to play RG. That was awesome. Sort of like drafting Tyquan Lewis to be a pass-rushing DT and then having him turn into a Montez Sweat level ER.

 

But in the spirit of digging up thread, someone should dig up the JB extension thread. Plenty of wrong people there as well. 

 

Haha I was providing a service and I was bored.

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7 hours ago, JediXMan said:

Well deserved.

I have posted those stats over and over and all the people who hate this contract want to do is say he stinks in pass coverage so I give up with that debate saying he deserved his contract. He had an off year last year regarding pass coverage but career wise the stats show he has been good in pass coverage and great at everything else. See the bolded.

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I think he has earned every penny of his contract. However, I don’t think it will work out bc of injuries.  I don’t see him finishing this contract and will start to miss 4-5 games a year.  I have nothing to back this up but a gut feeling so it merely my opinion. You can’t predict injuries so you have to pay the man.  Who doesn’t resign their 26yr old All Pro LB to a huge contract?   He has been one of the best in the game and is a leader on the team.  Glad we have him locked up. 

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For whatever it's worth, my position is that we are overpaying Leonard and I have serious questions about whether paying off-the-ball linebacker is the best way to spend 10% of the cap... BUT... ultimately it comes down to whether he plays well or not. If he keeps playing at a pro-bowl/all-pro level, even if there is overpay due to positional value, it won't be catastrophic for the team. The biggest mistakes teams make are paying big money to players that are not great, not slightly overpaying players that are actually great. Noone would care that he makes 20M a year if he strings 3-4 more all-pro seasons for the duration of that contract. 

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44 minutes ago, stitches said:

For whatever it's worth, my position is that we are overpaying Leonard and I have serious questions about whether paying off-the-ball linebacker is the best way to spend 10% of the cap... BUT... ultimately it comes down to whether he plays well or not. If he keeps playing at a pro-bowl/all-pro level, even if there is overpay due to positional value, it won't be catastrophic for the team. The biggest mistakes teams make are paying big money to players that are not great, not slightly overpaying players that are actually great. Noone would care that he makes 20M a year if he strings 3-4 more all-pro seasons for the duration of that contract. 

Agreed. It also makes you wonder if Ballard gamble a bit on the cap going substantially up the next couple of years, making Leonard’s and Braden Smith’s contracts look like good value in two years time.

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Just to compare Leonard's stats to other well known Off-Linebackers in this defensive system over the years:

 

DERRICK BROOKS (WOLB) - 14 years, 224 Games, 11 Pro Bowls, 5x 1st Team All Pro, Hall Of Fame

1,713 combined tackles, 1,300 solo, 68 TFL, 25 INT's, 24 FF's, 13.5 Sacks

BRIAN URLACHER (MLB) - 13 years, 182 Games, 8 Pro Bowls, 4x 1st Team All Pro, Hall Of Fame

1,361 combined tackles, 1,040 solo, 138 TFL, 22 INT's, 11 FF's, 41.5 Sacks

LEVANTE DAVID (WOLB) - 9 years, 134 Games, 1 Pro Bowl, 1x 1st Team All Pro

1,125 combined tackles, 806 solo, 128 TFL, 12 INT's, 24 FF's, 24.0 Sacks

DARIUS LEONARD (WOLB) - 3 years, 42 Games, 2 Pro Bowls, 2x 1st Team All Pro

416 combined tackles, 268 solo, 26 TFL, 7 INT's, 9 FF's, 15.0 Sacks

CATO JUNE (WOLB) - 7 years, 89 Games, 1 Pro Bowl

504 combined tackles, 354 solo, 20 TFL, 12 INT's, 2 FF's, 1.0 Sacks

 

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29 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Just to compare Leonard's stats to other well known Off-Linebackers in this defensive system over the years:

 

DERRICK BROOKS (WOLB) - 14 years, 224 Games, 11 Pro Bowls, 5x 1st Team All Pro, Hall Of Fame

1,713 combined tackles, 1,300 solo, 68 TFL, 25 INT's, 24 FF's, 13.5 Sacks

BRIAN URLACHER (MLB) - 13 years, 182 Games, 8 Pro Bowls, 4x 1st Team All Pro, Hall Of Fame

1,361 combined tackles, 1,040 solo, 138 TFL, 22 INT's, 11 FF's, 41.5 Sacks

LEVANTE DAVID (WOLB) - 9 years, 134 Games, 1 Pro Bowl, 1x 1st Team All Pro

1,125 combined tackles, 806 solo, 128 TFL, 12 INT's, 24 FF's, 24.0 Sacks

DARIUS LEONARD (WOLB) - 3 years, 42 Games, 2 Pro Bowls, 2x 1st Team All Pro

416 combined tackles, 268 solo, 26 TFL, 7 INT's, 9 FF's, 15.0 Sacks

CATO JUNE (WOLB) - 7 years, 89 Games, 1 Pro Bowl

504 combined tackles, 354 solo, 20 TFL, 12 INT's, 2 FF's, 1.0 Sacks

 

 

 I just don't know how much 4-2 David plays, but these other guys played very little of it. That said, Darius has stats most like Brooks so just keep it coming because that is the kind of play that helps Lead a team to the Mountaintop.
I know i want on our side of the ball a brilliant, the crazed dog type like Lawrence Taylor, Ray Lewis making big plays and holding teammates up to the standard. Yippee!

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On 8/8/2021 at 11:50 PM, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not really a voice of reason and I called it last night saying there is 2 people in here that will bash this deal. You 2 are the only 2 that thinks Leonard doesn't deserve this money. His primary position is about tackling and stopping the run, he plays a different position compared to Warner or what Brooks played for example who focuses on pass coverage more. This whole he stinks in Pass Coverage is bogus anyway, he had 5 INT's in 2019. Bashing Leonard would be like bashing Ray Lewis because he rarely sacked the QB, that wasn't Ray's duty. You will never get it so I am done with this, go on and bash away MooseBallard.

5 ints. So are we to assume a DE who gets double digits sacks is a great DE? Stats don't always tell the story. I have gone on record that Leonard is more of a great play maker than a great player. A better player moving forward than back wards. I just think that when u pay a line backer 20 million in this D, he better be an elite pass coverage linebacker. He is not. I almost compare linebackers to running backs. I think more than not, teams regret the contracts a year or two down the line. I think the Colts will. I would have franchised him.

 

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56 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

5 ints. So are we to assume a DE who gets double digits sacks is a great DE? Stats don't always tell the story. I have gone on record that Leonard is more of a great play maker than a great player. A better player moving forward than back wards. I just think that when u pay a line backer 20 million in this D, he better be an elite pass coverage linebacker. He is not. I almost compare linebackers to running backs. I think more than not, teams regret the contracts a year or two down the line. I think the Colts will. I would have franchised him.

 

Luckily those that do this for a living disagree with you.     

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4 hours ago, Moosejawcolt said:

I would have franchised him.

Lol. 

Defensive rookie of the year

2 time NFL top 100

2 time All pro

2 probowls

3 time player of the week.

 

I am guessing that exactly zero G.M's would franchise a drafted player with those accomplishments as they earn their first post draft contract. 

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33 minutes ago, Four2itus said:

Lol. 

Defensive rookie of the year

2 time NFL top 100

2 time All pro

2 probowls

3 time player of the week.

 

I am guessing that exactly zero G.M's would franchise a drafted player with those accomplishments as they earn their first post draft contract. 

Great post but you actually shortchanged him lmao . He is 3 time All-Pro, 1st team in 2018 and 2020 but was 2nd team in 2019. Go figure he was 2nd team All-Pro the year he had the 5 INT's.

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5 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Fans after free agency:  the Colts are too cheap to spend money on players!  
 

Fans after the team spends money on someone:  that’s too much money what are they doing?!

Believe it or not I believe a few people in here would've rather signed old man Julio Jones to a big 2 or 3 year contract because he plays WR and let Leonard walk because he is a LB. I can tell by the way some post in here. There is speculation Jones is already injured as he fell awkwardly after dropping a contested pass in the endzone during a practice on August 2nd. Per the Tennessean

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1 hour ago, Four2itus said:

Lol. 

Defensive rookie of the year

2 time NFL top 100

2 time All pro

2 probowls

3 time player of the week.

 

I am guessing that exactly zero G.M's would franchise a drafted player with those accomplishments as they earn their first post draft contract. 

It's the position I don't put a real high value on . 20 million is a lot for a line backer. I think I will be proven right

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4 minutes ago, Moosejawcolt said:

It's the position I don't put a real high value on . 20 million is a lot for a line backer. I think I will be proven right

I don't put high value on the LB position either unless it is an outlier. It is amazing how you and some others only see value as wrong or right and can't see outliers. You need to think outside the box, all GM's do. Leonard is an outlier like Nelson is at OG. I don't value OG's highly either but Nelson is an outlier. As much as I like @stitchesand he is good and seeing talent when it comes to the draft, he doesn't see outliers either. There are always a few in every draft and every era. Where would value Ray Lewis for example? Because of the way you think you would've never drafted a guy like that in my opinion. I can only go by how you post. A better example would be, where would you value Urlacher? Who is a Hall of Famer and I think Leonard can be just as great as he was.

 

Regarding Leonard, I am not sure why there is any doubt in anyone's mind he won't make All-Pro again next year. He has made it every year. He is not the type to get the money and sit around and eat a bag of Doritos and drink a 6 pack beer every day because he got paid. He loves playing football and always wants to improve and he is a leader.

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