It Makes No Sense To Keep Freeney Now

[BlueShoe]

I know I will get a lot of hate replies over this, but think about it. Freeney is a zone DE and he does that job well. Could you really see him playing well on the Ravens defense? I can't.

I love Freeney but this may be the end for him.

If it is then Thank You Dwight for all of the GREAT Memories!

We can't afford to pay him that much money.

[Superman]

We don't know what kind of defense Pagano wants to run. I'm excited to see who he hires as defensive coordinator. But don't kick Freeney out the door just yet. The Ravens do a lot of different things on defense, and those wrinkles would make our end combination even better.

[BlueShoe]

We don't know what kind of defense Pagano wants to run. I'm excited to see who he hires as defensive coordinator. But don't kick Freeney out the door just yet. The Ravens do a lot of different things on defense, and those wrinkles would make our end combination even better.

I am just preparing myself for this cause there is a very good chance I am right here.

I am just not seeing where Freeney fits into this picture.

We run like 99% zone and probably 40-50% of it isTampa2. Perfect for Freeney, but I think those days are long gone.

[LaughingAtIrsay]

Why don't people think he can play DE in a 3-4 Defense? If he has a good NT I don't see a problem with him at DE with his hand in the ground. What I don't see is him standing up trying to be a LB. That's not going to work or happen.

[Coffeedrinker]

We don't know what kind of defense Pagano wants to run. I'm excited to see who he hires as defensive coordinator. But don't kick Freeney out the door just yet. The Ravens do a lot of different things on defense, and those wrinkles would make our end combination even better.

That's crazy talk Superman. He comes from being a DC of the Ravens for one year... he is going to run a 3-4 defense. Never mind that he is more a disciple of Butch Davis who ran a 4-3 defense in Miami and with his time as DC for the Cowboys.

[Superman]

I am just preparing myself for this cause there is a very good chance I am right here.

I am just not seeing where Freeney fits into this picture.

We run like 99% zone and probably 40-50% of it isTampa2. Perfect for Freeney, but I think those days are long gone.

The only bearing the coverage behind him has on his ability to rush the passer is in how long it takes for receivers to come open. As a matter of fact, soft zone coverage makes Freeney (and any pass rush, really) completely ineffective. The zone coverage is not an issue. Also, the Ravens play a fair amount of zone coverage. This has very little to do with Freeney.

[BlueShoe]

Why don't people think he can play DE in a 3-4 Defense? If he has a good NT I don't see a problem with him at DE with his hand in the ground. What I don't see is him standing up trying to be a LB. That's not going to work or happen.

Well, I am not shooting at you here - promise, but I don't see any way in the world where Freeney could play DE in a 3-4.

In my opinion, we are going to get bigger at DE. Moala and Nevis will likely be our DE's if we move to a 3-4.

I don't think we are moving to a 3-4 overnight, even if do move to a 3-4 period. But we are going to get bigger. I really believe that. It's just playing out that way in my head. It is what makes the most sense.

[tfunky14]

It would free up some cap room

[MSColtsFan]

Why don't people think he can play DE in a 3-4 Defense? If he has a good NT I don't see a problem with him at DE with his hand in the ground. What I don't see is him standing up trying to be a LB. That's not going to work or happen.

Because he would have to hold the edge alone, allowing the MLB and OLB free to tackle. He is too small to do that. He doesn't do that well now, with DT help next to him. The 3-4 DE must be strong at the point of attack first. The Colts run D for years has been horrid, and it is in part due to the small, fast QB rush first DEs.

[Superman]

Why don't people think he can play DE in a 3-4 Defense? If he has a good NT I don't see a problem with him at DE with his hand in the ground. What I don't see is him standing up trying to be a LB. That's not going to work or happen.

It's a different position entirely. Freeney is an edge rusher. You can't line up in the 9 or even the 7 as a 3-4 end, because you're leaving a wide open space for the offense to run the ball off tackle. The configuration and defensive line principles change dramatically in a 3-4 defense. Even Wade Phillips 3-4, which is really a one-gap 5-2, uses it's ends closer to the middle of the line of scrimmage, not out wide.

And look up some of the things Warren Sapp said about playing in a 3-4 defense when he first went to Oakland. He called it the worst year of his career. That defensive end position is completely different from what pass rushers are used to doing. Sapp was, of course, a tackle, but the point is that it's completely foreign, especially for a 30+ year old guy who excels at doing something else. It would be a complete waste of Freeney's talent.

Of course, again, there's no indication that Pagano is going to switch us to a 3-4. Matter of fact, he's more of a 4-3 guy anyways, as CD brought out.

[hawkeyes]

For starters the Colts defense is NOT the Ravens defense, and I doubt very much that Pags will be bringing the Ravens defense to Indy!

[tonychen]

A good DC should be able to run different schemes. I don't know what his background is, but anything happens will not get our D any worse.

[BProland85]

I know I will get a lot of hate replies over this, but think about it. Freeney is a zone DE and he does that job well. Could you really see him playing well on the Ravens defense? I can't.

I love Freeney but this may be the end for him.

If it is then Thank You Dwight for all of the GREAT Memories!

We can't afford to pay him that much money.

As much as I hate to say it, you are right. We need to part ways with Freeney by trying to trade him for draft picks if possible. He is going to cost this team WAY too much money this year, and we could bring in at least 2 impact players through FA with the money saved. Mathis at OLB, Hughes at OLB, and Wheeler at OLB can all get to the QB under Pagano's defense.

[JoKeR]

Forget what kind of defense will be used and look at Freeney's low production and how his salary jumps next year.

I hate it but I think he's in the twilight of his career and is basically done.

I really hope im wrong.

[JoKeR]

As much as I hate to say it, you are right. We need to part ways with Freeney by trying to trade him for draft picks if possible. He is going to cost this team WAY too much money this year, and we could bring in at least 2 impact players through FA with the money saved. Mathis at OLB, Hughes at OLB, and Wheeler at OLB can all get to the QB under Pagano's defense.

No ones gonna touch that contract. It would be a release

[ViriLudant]

Why don't people think he can play DE in a 3-4 Defense? If he has a good NT I don't see a problem with him at DE with his hand in the ground. What I don't see is him standing up trying to be a LB. That's not going to work or happen.

Because he's far, far, far too small to be a 3-4 DE.

[presto123]

This team is going to look TOTALLY different two years from now. The new era is upon us.

[Quantum88]

This team is going to look TOTALLY different two years from now. The new era is upon us.

Absolutely! I posted in another thread that I believe that on March 8th the team announces that Manning has failed his physical and choose not to pick up his option. That reduces the cap hit dramatically. They then don't sign Wayne and Garcon, Saturday retires, and I think they release Brackett, Clark and maybe Freeney (I don't think any other team is willing to pay him as his current contract requires). We then will rebuild from the ground up.

I am not sold on free agents as a signifcant source of new talent (see Philadelphia, Washington). The best teams build through the draft with only using free agents to fill a small number of holes. Examples are New England, Pittsburgh, Colts.

I see where next years could be another 3-13 to 5-11 year, Followed by 9-7 to 10-6 and then in 2014 we are back on top,

[Malakai432]

I don't neccesarily expect us to be the Ravens defense. I could see the guy utilizing the available talent around and picking what would be the best fit for them. Who knows what that would be.

[CCF]

Forget what kind of defense will be used and look at Freeney's low production and how his salary jumps next year.

Exactly, he makes way too much money for what he is, a 2nd and 3rd down pass rush specialist. I mean we may as well just have 1 less player on the field on running plays since he spins 6 yards deep every play. For him the biggest problem is the 3 other teams in our division are running teams.

[coltfaninnewyork]

I know I will get a lot of hate replies over this, but think about it. Freeney is a zone DE and he does that job well. Could you really see him playing well on the Ravens defense? I can't.

I love Freeney but this may be the end for him.

If it is then Thank You Dwight for all of the GREAT Memories!

We can't afford to pay him that much money.

You could be right,if you subscribe to the theory that we will likely be 3 years away from being a real good team.Why not trade him for picks because dwight will likely be on the downside in 3 years.

[19colt]

Man so many people are jumping to conclusions!

Freeney isn't going anywhere. You don't hire a defensive minded coach then release your best defensive player. I bet the new HC is pumped up to utilize Dwight and Mathis.

[Smitto]

I know I will get a lot of hate replies over this, but think about it. Freeney is a zone DE and he does that job well. Could you really see him playing well on the Ravens defense? I can't.

I love Freeney but this may be the end for him.

If it is then Thank You Dwight for all of the GREAT Memories!

We can't afford to pay him that much money.

this is blasphemy... you dont take a possible hall of famer and just show him the door just because you dont think he fits the 3-4.. freeney could very well be a beast in the 3-4.. he's one of if not the fastest RE in football.

[coltsblue1844]

honestly, i think that Pagano is a good enough/smart enough defensive mind that he can adapt to the players he has to work with...that being said, i do expect him to want to start building towards an all around BIGGER defense, but that too wont happen over night...but i would expect us to draft/sign bigger guys going forward from this point in time

[MAC]

Forget what kind of defense will be used and look at Freeney's low production and how his salary jumps next year.

I hate it but I think he's in the twilight of his career and is basically done.

I really hope im wrong.

He may be released because his contract was clearly designed to be renegotiated at this point - and if the team is truly rebuilding they may not want to commit a lot of money or years to someone his age - but what low production are you talking about? Just counting sacks? Drop a great defensive backfield behind him and he could have led the league in sacks this year. The man was an absolute beast in every game.

[21isSuperman]

So a defensive guy like Pagano won't be able to fit one of the best DEs in the league into his system? I don't buy it. It's like if you run a pass-first offense, but then get Adrian Peterson. You will fit him into your offense

[Blackhawk4]

So a defensive guy like Pagano won't be able to fit one of the best DEs in the league into his system? I don't buy it. It's like if you run a pass-first offense, but then get Adrian Peterson. You will fit him into your offense

Exactly. There are players in the NFL when you get you either make them fit or you adapt to them. I'm sure Pagano can easily adapt to Freeney to have him fit, because he's smart enough to realize having one of the best pass rushing tandems in the NFL is important.

[willysp]

Agreed - Dwight did us well, but is not worth nearly as much money as contract calls for. Bye - Dwight.

[BOTT]

He may be released because his contract was clearly designed to be renegotiated at this point - and if the team is truly rebuilding they may not want to commit a lot of money or years to someone his age - but what low production are you talking about? Just counting sacks? Drop a great defensive backfield behind him and he could have led the league in sacks this year. The man was an absolute beast in every game.

come on.....jerad allen got 22 sacks and a lot more tackles without a great def backfield. everybody makes excuses for freeney's dwindling numbers

[MAC]

come on.....jerad allen got 22 sacks and a lot more tackles without a great def backfield. everybody makes excuses for freeney's dwindling numbers

I'm not making excuses, I've just watched every snap of his career. He is impacting the offense every moment he is out there. When the QB doesn't pass the ball in .124 seconds as they did most of the year, Freeney makes him move. I see no difference from earlier in his career other than him being rested more often. If that is a function of age, it needs to be taken into account, but to suggest that he is no longer effective is just ridiculous.

[Coltswarriors]

Why? We get someone who knows defense and we get rid of our best piece? No thank you, hoping for Dwight to be back next season.

[GoColts8818]

I'm not making excuses, I've just watched every snap of his career. He is impacting the offense every moment he is out there. When the QB doesn't pass the ball in .124 seconds as they did most of the year, Freeney makes him move. I see no difference from earlier in his career other than him being rested more often. If that is a function of age, it needs to be taken into account, but to suggest that he is no longer effective is just ridiculous.

It's also a function of the fact we brought Brayton and Anderson in to play on run downs to help rest Freeney.

Like you said every team we play adjusts their whole offense because of Freeney and Mathis when they play us. That's why you see teams put so much focus on the ball coming out quick.

I agree with those who say we need to wait and see what direction we go in with the defense. We don't really have the peaces for a 3-4 defense right now and if we keep Peyton Manning it's going to be extremely hard to get all those peaces in one off-season. In order for a 3-4 defense to really work you must have a big huge DT and those guys don't grow on trees. Our DTs are litle for a 4-3 defense. Till we bring in some bigger guys it's not going to work.

With that said I am not ruling it out. Personally I am just waiting and seeing what's going to happen with a couple of other moves before i say what i think is going to happen one way or antoher about Freeney and the defense.

[04DarkShadowGT]

The ends on a 3-4 arent really there to sack the QB anyway. Freeney and Mathis would not be good at all in a 3-4 D line position. Maybe OLB, maybe.

[GoColts8818]

The ends on a 3-4 arent really there to sack the QB anyway. Freeney and Mathis would not be good at all in a 3-4 D line position. Maybe OLB, maybe.

Exactly the would move to the outside linebacker spot which is exactly what you would ask OLB's to do in a 3-4 rush the passer. Who knows moving to a 3-4 might work out really well for Freeney and Mathis.

[JWF]

Hard to tell what happens with Freeney. We're not even sure Pagano will install the 3-4 or not.

I think Freeney's cap hit has alot more to do with whether or not he'll be a colt.

[BlueShoe]

this is blasphemy... you dont take a possible hall of famer and just show him the door just because you dont think he fits the 3-4.. freeney could very well be a beast in the 3-4.. he's one of if not the fastest RE in football.

It is blasphemy. Do you think I want to see Dwight's career be over in Indy? I can still remember watching him in his first training camp and just how much raw potential was there in him. I have seen every NFL play he has ever been involved in. I don't want this to be the end.

HOWEVER; when you look at his 19 MILLION dollar cap number then it is clear what is about to happen here. We can't afford to pay him and it won't make sense to redo his contract when there is a great chance he won't fit in the defense we install anyway. We are not going to be running 99% zone with 40-50% Tampa2 anymore. That is very clear to see here.

So while it sucks; it is what it is. There is no sense in blaming me for pointing out the obvious.

[John Dee]

The only bearing the coverage behind him has on his ability to rush the passer is in how long it takes for receivers to come open. As a matter of fact, soft zone coverage makes Freeney (and any pass rush, really) completely ineffective. The zone coverage is not an issue. Also, the Ravens play a fair amount of zone coverage. This has very little to do with Freeney.

19m has everything to do with DFree....

[LightninMax]

Yes it does, but the GM does need to discuss with him a restructuring of his contract to help keep Mathis.

[BlueShoe]

Exactly the would move to the outside linebacker spot which is exactly what you would ask OLB's to do in a 3-4 rush the passer. Who knows moving to a 3-4 might work out really well for Freeney and Mathis.

It would be tough, IN MY OPINION, for Freeney to convert to a 3-4 OLB. His job has been to rush the quarterback for how many years now? That's all he does, play after play. His weakness against the run is well known by Colts fans. Can we really pay a guy (19 million dollar cap hit) who probably can't play in this new defense? It doesn't add up.

Even if we stay with a 4-3 base, it would be very hard to imagine staying with the DL we currently have.

Ravens:

DT - H Ngata 350

NT - T Cody 349

DE - C Redding/A Jones 292/313

Rush - T Suggs 260

Nevis and Moala will likely become DE's in our new front seven. We will need to get at least one very large NT/DT such as Dontari Poe.

I don't see anyone currently on the team who can play the RUSH LB, as the RUSH LB will also need to be able to fall back into coverage. Without that ability, the defense will be too predictable.

[BlueShoe]

19m has everything to do with DFree....

It is actually a combination of the two. He costs a lot of money and he doesn't fit.