Calling all old aged forum-go'ers: Was that the dumbest SB playcall ever in SB history?

[The Old Crow]

They coudl have run it at least twice...they still had a time out. I suppose if any colts fans every question pagano or pep, we can just point to this play. Neither of those guys have made a call that bad. I thought losing an onside kick by the packers couldn't be topped..I think I might be wrong.

I would have been fine with that. If one of the best power backs on the league can't get half a yard in two plays , than hats off to the Patriots. It just boggles the mind. Glad I'm not a Seahawks fan !!

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

what are you talking about... Where the heck was he supposed to throw that? I understand everyone has opinions but try using your eyes sometimes.

Calm down Kid. Maybe throw it to the receiver's chest instead of infront of him at the defender.

[OffensivelyPC]

I would have been fine with that. If one of the best power backs on the league can't get half a yard in two plays , than hats off to the Patriots. It just boggles the mind. Glad I'm not a Seahawks fan !!

Yup.  It really was just that horrible a call.  Unbelievable.  I mean, it has nothing to do with  the opponent.  You got a yard or less and one of the best backs, if not the best running back in the league..it makes no sense.

[The Old Crow]

Yeah probably not great calls by any means. Happy to get both as you have to take those when you get them. But I really thought Butler's play was money. He is a rookie.

I do think Pete will have to answer for that play the rest of his career. Wilson too.

Butlers play was similar to Jimmy Smith's defense/ hold of Crabtree, but what were those two coaches thinking ? At least SF wasn't on the half yard line, but the Ravens defense was old, tired, and beaten towards the end. Kaepernick probably could have waltzed in at the end, had they tried running, and not thrown. If you caught the break, it's great, but you still have to chalk it down as a dumb move by the other coach. Carroll will never live this one down, count on it.

[amfootball]

Butlers play was similar to Jimmy Smith's defense/ hold of Crabtree, but what were those two coaches thinking ? At least SF wasn't on the half yard line, but the Ravens defense was old, tired, and beaten towards the end. Kaepernick probably could have waltzed in at the end, had they tried running, and not thrown. If you caught the break, it's great, but you still have to chalk it down as a dumb move by the other coach. Carroll will never live this one down, count on it.

I have no issue having Carroll take the fall. Believe me.   I was never a fan of his but he has done a nice job in Seattle. Interested to see how they respond next season. A loss like that can really haunt you.

[NFLfan]

That was an unbelievably bad call. And many past and present NFL players have taken to Twitter to criticize the call.

Sheldon Richardson wrote that the Seattle OC should be the game MVP.

Emmitt Smith: "That was the worst play call I've seen in the history of football"

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=nflnation&id=160678

[The Old Crow]

I have no issue having Carroll take the fall. Believe me. I was never a fan of his but he has done a nice job in Seattle. Interested to see how they respond next season. A loss like that can really haunt you.

I have no issue with the job Carroll's done out there, just that last call in this game. . It's almost like the scripts you have about whether you should go for a PAT, it 2 point conversion during a game situationally. I can't see any scenario that would call for a tight pass over the middle in that situation over a run. Maybe, if you had one of the worst short yardage running games like the Ravens did two years ago, maybe, but they had Marshawn Lynch ! That's like not running Larry Czonka.

[-JJ-]

Let me put my walker down.    Just kidding, not quite there yet

It was a bad call all the way down from the OC to Pete to Wilson.

 

However hindsight is always easy. He makes the pass play for a TD and no one is talking.

 

I thought I heard Lynch is 1-5 in goal line TDs, Running from 5 yards out for his type of RB is different than a goal line which is all line play.

 

I'll take it for karma because that circus catch was a freak.

 

Lastly Butler did make a good play.

 

In the end you want to lose with your best and that would be Lynch so.............

[amfootball]

I have no issue with the job Carroll's done out there, just that last call in this game. . It's almost like the scripts you have about whether you should go for a PAT, it 2 point conversion during a game situationally. I can't see any scenario that would call for a tight pass over the middle in that situation over a run. Maybe, if you had one of the worst short yardage running games like the Ravens did two years ago, maybe, but they had Marshawn Lynch ! That's like not running Larry Czonka.

Yeah, the scuttle is the players in the locker room are really mad that Lynch did not get the ball. Sometimes you out think yourself. I wonder if Pete was expecting Bill to call a time out there and when he didn't he kind of hurried the ball to a pass knowing he wanted to save time for a run on third if needed.

[-JJ-]

Yeah, the scuttle is the players in the locker room are really mad that Lynch did not get the ball. Sometimes you out think yourself. I wonder if Pete was expecting Bill to call a time out there and when he didn't he kind of hurried the ball to a pass knowing he wanted to save time for a run on third if needed.

Get outta here- you're not old enough :-)

[Luck_Is_Skilled]

Pete Carroll's explanation was dumb. Even if you dont think running Lynch was the right call, that was the perfect time to fake it to Lynch and have Wilson walk into the endzone. Carroll got cute and it bit him in the butt.

[The Old Crow]

Yeah, the scuttle is the players in the locker room are really mad that Lynch did not get the ball. Sometimes you out think yourself. I wonder if Pete was expecting Bill to call a time out there and when he didn't he kind of hurried the ball to a pass knowing he wanted to save time for a run on third if needed.

When you win a game like that, you don't really care how you won it, but you are just glad your coach didn't make a stupid call like that one. It's part of football , but when you're on the butt side of a call like that as a fan, you never get over it. You have to wonder if Lynch will stay quiet about the call ?

[amfootball]

When you win a game like that, you don't really care how you won it, but you are just glad your coach didn't make a stupid call like that one. It's part of football , but when you're on the butt side of a call like that as a fan, you never get over it. You have to wonder if Lynch will stay quiet about the call ?

Lynch did not talk to the media. I doubt he will say anything but I bet the other more vocal guys will.

 

BTW, there is a report out there that Sherman may need Tommy John surgery on his elbow. Has torn ligaments.

[The Old Crow]

Lynch did not talk to the media. I doubt he will say anything but I bet the other more vocal guys will.

BTW, there is a report out there that Sherman may need Tommy John surgery on his elbow. Has torn ligaments.

If you can stay quiet after that call, he's a better man than me. One half yard from two in a row, wow.

[dw49]

They coudl have run it at least twice...they still had a time out.  I suppose if any colts fans every question pagano or pep, we can just point to this play.  Neither of those guys have made a call that bad.  I thought losing an onside kick by the packers couldn't be topped..I think I might be wrong.

 

What Carroll was trying to say was they didn't have time enough to run it 3 times. So there and to be 1 pass mixed in. Throw on 2nd run on 3rd and do whatever you want on 4th . He's really 100% right if you look at it that way and you also would think NE would be selling out on the run on 2nd down. The only problem I have is you could turn it over like they did or you could get a holding call . It's kind of a dangerous play as it could have been deflected at the line or bounced off a player and then the int. So I think the problem was the possibility of a penalty  turning it over on a deflection and not the fact that you needed to feed Lynch as most were saying. Other words you only had time to run Lynch twice and the pass if incomplete still allowed for that.

[-JJ-]

What Carroll was trying to say was they didn't have time enough to run it 3 times. So there and to be 1 pass mixed in. Throw on 2nd run on 3rd and do whatever you want on 4th . He's really 100% right if you look at it that way and you also would think NE would be selling out on the run on 2nd down. The only problem I have is you could turn it over like they did or you could get a holding call . It's kind of a dangerous play as it could have been deflected at the line or bounced off a player and then the int. So I think the problem was the possibility of a penalty  turning it over on a deflection and not the fact that you needed to feed Lynch as most were saying. Other words you only had time to run Lynch twice and the pass if incomplete still allowed for that.

I didn't think of that-good point.

 

Bottom line is there is  still 591/2 other minutes in football.

[ponyboy]

What Carroll was trying to say was they didn't have time enough to run it 3 times. So there and to be 1 pass mixed in. Throw on 2nd run on 3rd and do whatever you want on 4th . He's really 100% right if you look at it that way and you also would think NE would be selling out on the run on 2nd down. The only problem I have is you could turn it over like they did or you could get a holding call . It's kind of a dangerous play as it could have been deflected at the line or bounced off a player and then the int. So I think the problem was the possibility of a penalty  turning it over on a deflection and not the fact that you needed to feed Lynch as most were saying. Other words you only had time to run Lynch twice and the pass if incomplete still allowed for that.

 

It is true that it would have been very rushed if they tried to run three time with only one time out.  Which brings up a couple of notable points..

 

#1: BB not calling timeout to preserve time after 1st down play was a pretty big deal.  It created the situation where the Seahawks felt they would need to pass.

#2:  The blown timeout to by the Seahawks at the two minute warning would have changed that situation at the end of the game.  Recall the Seahawks had to take a timeout with the clock already stopped to avoid a delay of game.

[BOTT]

what are you talking about... Where the heck was he supposed to throw that? I understand everyone has opinions but try using your eyes sometimes.

Where? Closer to the other shoulder. Dumb call, but the pass didn't help

[The Old Crow]

I'm still haunted by Super Bowl 3 , 45 years after it happened. I can't even imagine being a Seahawks fan. The game was right there for the taking at the half yard line, and you make that call ! This wasn't even like the Titans loss to the Rams, because you could have ran the ball twice against a tired defense, at the end of the game.

I can take solace in the Ravens being at the 35 yard like getting intercepted, but the half yard line ! We were dumb for not going for one first down at 2nd and five, because even if we scored , Brady would have had 1:30, and 2 timeouts. With the Seahawks, Brady was standing over there with two quarters in his eyes replaying the Tyree catch, when Carroll handed them the Super Bowl with the biggest blunder in SB history. I give Belichick full credit for not calling a timeout. There is a reason Pete Carroll and Rich Kotite were once on the front page of the New York Post as , Dumb and Dumber, during the NY Jets days.

[Yehoodi]

What Carroll was trying to say was they didn't have time enough to run it 3 times. So there and to be 1 pass mixed in. Throw on 2nd run on 3rd and do whatever you want on 4th . He's really 100% right if you look at it that way and you also would think NE would be selling out on the run on 2nd down. The only problem I have is you could turn it over like they did or you could get a holding call . It's kind of a dangerous play as it could have been deflected at the line or bounced off a player and then the int. So I think the problem was the possibility of a penalty  turning it over on a deflection and not the fact that you needed to feed Lynch as most were saying. Other words you only had time to run Lynch twice and the pass if incomplete still allowed for that.

 

This is basically at the heart of the matter and what is sadly missed by so many in the media and internet world.  It would be really nice if someone who is big in the media that people will listen to would get this point out to the masses. 

 

Bottom line with only 20 seconds and one time out the Seahawks had only two options, with 3 downs to go.

 

Option 1: two run plays with a timeout call in between the two.   One would not be able to line up for a 4th down play with the clock running as likely the 3rd down play would of started with like 14 seconds to go after a failed run on 2nd down and a timeout

 

Option 2: the same two runs plays plus a pass play.  With this option you really needed to run the pass play on second down and also have it a bang bang play so as to not waste much time.  But just as important its a play that Wilson could not afford to get sack as he would have to use the timeout and it would be 3rd and goal at the point he was sacked, say the 5 yard line, now its 3rd and goal from the 5 yard line with say 14 seconds, at that point you only have one more play. 

 

If one were to try to do a run play, then a time out then pass play on 3rd down, it would work if is incomplete as the clock would stop and still have fourth down, however with the pass play on 3rd down after a 2nd down run and timeout, a sack ends the game

 

So yes dw49, I agree with you 100% and just hope that someone in the media will go through this analysis.

 

but in the end when everyone sits back and looks at this play calling they will realize that the Seahawks only had two options, one with just two run plays and the other being a quick pass play (to avoid sack) and then two run plays.

 

And I can certainly understand a coach choosing the option with a quick avoid a sack pass play and two runs plays as opposed to just two run plays.  You don't want to leave a down on the board when the game clock runs out.

[akcolt]

You put the ball in the best players hands when the money is on the line anyone think the Hawks did that?

[peytonmanning18]

Stupid play call and a horrible throw.

[Gramz]

I have said it before, on a different thread on here,  Dumbest play EVER.  

 

You have the Best RB in the league, you're on 2nd and goal, and you throw the ball?  They deserved to lose.  Period.

 

And the the fight that broke out after that...    what a "fitting" end to this year's NFL Season.  

[OffensivelyPC]

What Carroll was trying to say was they didn't have time enough to run it 3 times. So there and to be 1 pass mixed in. Throw on 2nd run on 3rd and do whatever you want on 4th . He's really 100% right if you look at it that way and you also would think NE would be selling out on the run on 2nd down. The only problem I have is you could turn it over like they did or you could get a holding call . It's kind of a dangerous play as it could have been deflected at the line or bounced off a player and then the int. So I think the problem was the possibility of a penalty turning it over on a deflection and not the fact that you needed to feed Lynch as most were saying. Other words you only had time to run Lynch twice and the pass if incomplete still allowed for that.

I think you give it to lynch because he had been ripping the pats apart all night. You only need one yard, they hadn't really stopped him all night, even when Seattle telegraphs the run.

[dw49]

It is true that it would have been very rushed if they tried to run three time with only one time out.  Which brings up a couple of notable points..

 

#1: BB not calling timeout to preserve time after 1st down play was a pretty big deal.  It created the situation where the Seahawks felt they would need to pass.

#2:  The blown timeout to by the Seahawks at the two minute warning would have changed that situation at the end of the game.  Recall the Seahawks had to take a timeout with the clock already stopped to avoid a delay of game.

 

I thought about that one too.

[dw49]

This is basically at the heart of the matter and what is sadly missed by so many in the media and internet world.  It would be really nice if someone who is big in the media that people will listen to would get this point out to the masses. 

 

Bottom line with only 20 seconds and one time out the Seahawks had only two options, with 3 downs to go.

 

Option 1: two run plays with a timeout call in between the two.   One would not be able to line up for a 4th down play with the clock running as likely the 3rd down play would of started with like 14 seconds to go after a failed run on 2nd down and a timeout

 

Option 2: the same two runs plays plus a pass play.  With this option you really needed to run the pass play on second down and also have it a bang bang play so as to not waste much time.  But just as important its a play that Wilson could not afford to get sack as he would have to use the timeout and it would be 3rd and goal at the point he was sacked, say the 5 yard line, now its 3rd and goal from the 5 yard line with say 14 seconds, at that point you only have one more play. 

 

If one were to try to do a run play, then a time out then pass play on 3rd down, it would work if is incomplete as the clock would stop and still have fourth down, however with the pass play on 3rd down after a 2nd down run and timeout, a sack ends the game

 

So yes dw49, I agree with you 100% and just hope that someone in the media will go through this analysis.

 

but in the end when everyone sits back and looks at this play calling they will realize that the Seahawks only had two options, one with just two run plays and the other being a quick pass play (to avoid sack) and then two run plays.

 

And I can certainly understand a coach choosing the option with a quick avoid a sack pass play and two runs plays as opposed to just two run plays.  You don't want to leave a down on the board when the game clock runs out.

 

 

Yeah.. I agree . I think the only point is sometimes those kinds of pass plays result in a deflected ball and a possible turn over. Maybe a little different pass play with RW rolling out ?

[Cynjin]

Forgive my ignorant 29-yr old age, but take me back to Superbowl I. Yes, 1967. You have the entire Superbowl history to draw from. Was that final Seahawks playcall the dumbest ever? If not, where does it rank for you, and can you think of one that comes close?

I don't know if it was the dumbest call in SuperBowl history but it has to be in the top two or three.

[dw49]

I think you give it to lynch because he had been ripping the pats apart all night. You only need one yard, they hadn't really stopped him all night, even when Seattle telegraphs the run.

 

 

You cab certainly make a point for giving it to Lynch but my point is calling a pass play did give them 3 plays vs 2 and maybe 2nd down was down should have been a good spot. I watched a little of ESPN and Cris Carter was going crazy on how bad a job the two receivers did on that play.The WR that was suppose to pick Bultler let himself get jammed and the receiver didn't turn his shoulders to the ball which would have made an int impossible. He also blamed RW a bit for bad ball placement considering how the play had developed. Carter thought just horrendous execution of a football play.

[Blue Horseshoe]

I think they should have lined up heavy, pointed to a hole like Babe Ruth pointing to the center field fence, and run over them through that hole.  That would have been one of the greatest plays in Super Bowl history.

[pacolts56]

But....but...but...I thought it was a "passing league" now?

Haaaaaaaaahhhh!!!!!

[bababooey]

I don't know if it was the dumbest call in SuperBowl history but it has to be in the top two or three.

The win is 1 yard away with the best runningback in the NFL in your backfield on 2nd down after gaining 4 yards the last play and a timeout remaining to win the SUPERBOWL. This was the worst play call on any level in the history of the sport, and I saw my brother's hs QB spike the ball on 4th down to lose them the game.

[OffensivelyPC]

You cab certainly make a point for giving it to Lynch but my point is calling a pass play did give them 3 plays vs 2 and maybe 2nd down was down should have been a good spot. I watched a little of ESPN and Cris Carter was going crazy on how bad a job the two receivers did on that play.The WR that was suppose to pick Bultler let himself get jammed and the receiver didn't turn his shoulders to the ball which would have made an int impossible. He also blamed RW a bit for bad ball placement considering how the play had developed. Carter thought just horrendous execution of a football play.

Yeah, I was too up in arms about the interception to do a breakdown of the play during all the replays.  I know hindsight is 20/20, but to me, I would have at least run lynch and if he didn't get in, call time out.  Then you can throw the ball on 3rd if you want to preserve the clock.  It might have been more obvious at that point, but the Seahawks can be obvious about the run.  My only point was, the Patriots hadn't really stopped the run pretty much after the first quarter.  Marshawn's always good for a yard, ya know?  But it is what it is.  Congrats to Pats. 

[OffensivelyPC]

I don't know if it was the dumbest call in SuperBowl history but it has to be in the top two or three.

It reminded me of the 49ers against the Seahawks last year in the NFCCG.  Harbaugh tried to get cute and went outside what had worked for them all game long, or at least didn't go with their strongest playmaker.. 

[dw49]

Yeah, I was too up in arms about the interception to do a breakdown of the play during all the replays.  I know hindsight is 20/20, but to me, I would have at least run lynch and if he didn't get in, call time out.  Then you can throw the ball on 3rd if you want to preserve the clock.  It might have been more obvious at that point, but the Seahawks can be obvious about the run.  My only point was, the Patriots hadn't really stopped the run pretty much after the first quarter.  Marshawn's always good for a yard, ya know?  But it is what it is.  Congrats to Pats. 

 

 

I agree with you for the reasons you have and also for the fact that you give Lynch a chance before you try a pass play which is the riskier play. I was just trying to present the case that it wasn't completely brain dead to call a pass play there. 

[Gavin]

It was a good call given the defenses alignment with only 1 Linebacker to get behind after the slant, The Patriots were all lined up to play the run, It was not a real good throw by Wilson but Lockette should have caught it, Poor execution cost them not the play call, Bavell and Caroll made the RIGHT call

[PeterBowman]

if they were going to pass it, at least have Lynch in there and play action out of it. The Pats were sold out against the run.

[Cynjin]

The win is 1 yard away with the best runningback in the NFL in your backfield on 2nd down after gaining 4 yards the last play and a timeout remaining to win the SUPERBOWL. This was the worst play call on any level in the history of the sport, and I saw my brother's hs QB spike the ball on 4th down to lose them the game.

It was definitely bad, I know I was shaking my head when I saw it. Pete's rationale after the game was strange too.

[Cynjin]

It reminded me of the 49ers against the Seahawks last year in the NFCCG.  Harbaugh tried to get cute and went outside what had worked for them all game long, or at least didn't go with their strongest playmaker..

I agree, Lynch as hard as he runs hardly ever loses yards. I know it happens sometimes but go with what gives you the best chance to win, which in that situation is to give the ball to Lynch or at least run a read option if it's not open Wilson can throw the ball into the seats.

[OffensivelyPC]

I agree, Lynch as hard as he runs hardly ever loses yards. I know it happens sometimes but go with what gives you the best chance to win, which in that situation is to give the ball to Lynch or at least run a read option if it's not open Wilson can throw the ball into the seats.

Yup. And even if you're hell bent on a non-play action pass don't throw it in the middle of traffic.  Throw a corner fade or crossing route at the back of the endzone in a spot where only your guy can get to it.  If he doesn't, it goes out of bounds, problem solved.  But Carroll's explanation was just nonsense.  He said that they did it to waste the play.  If you're going to waste a play, spike it.  If you're going for the endzone, throw a safer route.  Plain and simple.

[ColtsBlueFL]

I only heard the call on Westwood One radio network as I was traveling.  I then saw it after I reached hotel room.  I Give the credit to Bill Belichick.  As soon as Beast mode made it to the one, he sent in his bigs.  Seahawks trotted out 3 WR, maybe hoping to spread them out, or create a bad mismatch.  BB counters  by sending out the bigs, out except pull a couple back to send out 3 corners instead.  They line up to stop goal line running play.  Uh Oh, Pete. To top it off,  ESPN stats mentioned Marshawn Lynch had 5 previous rushing attempts to score from the 1 yard line this year, even with a proper set/group to block.  He was successful on only 1 of those 5.

 

So what does Carroll do now?  I would have had Wilson sneak it, based upon that D alignment.  They went to a b&b pass play (like Manning to Wayne that Porter stepped in front of 4 a pick 6) and a D guy recognizes the play from film study and BB situational football practice sessions, and jumps it.  How often do you see a guy get picked on a quick slant at the goal line?

 

I'm not so sure if that was incomplete that Carroll wouldn't do some read option trickery with Lynch and Wilson instead of going mano a mano vs Pats goal line bigs...

 

Anyway, everyone acts like a TD was guaranteed.  It wasn't, just like getting picked wasn't guaranteed either.  But yes, either could indeed happen; and one did.  Unfortunately for the Seahawks.