No comments from Irsay yet [Merge]

[John Waylon]

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

[DougDew]

4 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

Because some people simply don't like his personality, which I don't get either.

[ColtsBlueFL]

44 minutes ago, corgi said:

You're not wrong at all but, you would most likely look at my entire body of work for your company. Trends, habits, etc...and figure out if that contract was a mistake and if maybe 2015 was an anomaly. If Irsay chooses to to fire Pagano at least he will have enough data to look at. I guess he assumed the 2015 season was an anomaly and that his previous work warranted the extension. So maybe he views 2016 as an anomaly too. Now I don't know what to think. I'm happy I don't own a team.

 

Yeah, Jim is on record there too.  Irsay has went so far as to compare the first four seasons with Luck and the first four years of the Peyton Manning and Bill Polian era from 1998-2001. Back then, the Colts were 32-32 with two trips to the postseason and an 0-2 playoff record.

 

In the first four years of the Pagano/Grigson era, the Colts are 44-26 overall with three playoff appearances, including a trip to the AFC Championship game

 

“Bill Polian has gone into the Hall of Fame,’’ Irsay said. “Ryan has outdone him.’’

 

So yeah, maybe he views 2016 as an anomaly, as you say.  But if we go 8-8 next year, an anomaly looks more like a trend, yes? I'll bet Irsay will make some noise at that point.

[krunk]

8 minutes ago, csmopar said:

yep

 

though I still think we're gonna see a change..... whether thats coaching/front officer or one of the many cordinators,trainers and assistants.  Something will change, just a gut feeling

It's already on StampedeBlue that it's like for some assistants to be fired.

[Vinatieri4]

Definitely need to upgrade something with our strength and conditioning coach. Not sure how long our current one has been with the team, but it seems like our team has always had "bad luck" with injuries. 

[corgi]

3 hours ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

I think the major issue people are having is that the Colts went 8-8 with Hasselbeck, Freeman, Whitehurst, and Ryan Lindley in 2015 and Pagano and Co. argued they would've been better had Luck not gotten injured. Luck missed 1 game in 2016 and the Colts went 8-8, beat 1 playoff team, lost to 5 playoff teams, and only defeated 2 teams with an above .500 record.

[JMichael557]

15 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

He signed Allen to a Hugh contract which should not have been done.

He brought in Patrick Robinson who underperformed.

He spent a 2nd Round pick on a player that to date cannot play.

He let our best linebacker walk while keeping two linebackers as starters who were then cut.

Dorsett continues to disappoint as a 1st round pick.

 

So in evaluating it is easy to say that Grigson has not improved and continues to make the same mistakes.

It appears as if he just continued with his old habits.

[Fisticuffs111]

8 minutes ago, Vinatieri4 said:

Definitely need to upgrade something with our strength and conditioning coach. Not sure how long our current one has been with the team, but it seems like our team has always had "bad luck" with injuries. 

Pretty sure they just got hired last season.

A little off topic, but I don't know about all this Pagano firing assistants talk. Some people say they don't want to fire Pagano and end up going through coaches like the Browns and Jags, but that's pretty much the same thing that would be happening if Pagano continues to go through coaches like mad. Also, if he did do a whole coaching turnover again then I think that'd be a bad look on him.

[OffensivelyPC]

24 minutes ago, csmopar said:

yep..... can't wait for the reactions whenever something finally does break, gonna be epic

It does get fun laughing at some who fit the millennial stereotype.  

[Vinatieri4]

Just now, Fisticuffs111 said:

Pretty sure they just got hired last season.

A little off topic, but I don't know about all this Pagano firing assistants talk. Some people say they don't want to fire Pagano and end up going through coaches like the Browns and Jags, but that's pretty much what would be happening if Pagano keeps going through coaches.

 

 

Agreed, I would like to keep some guys in place. Talent is an issue. Coaching needs to improve, but hasn't been why we are 8-8.

[OffensivelyPC]

21 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

Because people's feelings are hurt....and that's the time to rise up and all at once, together in a single voice that cannot be ignored...cry about it.

[Zach Boyd]

19 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

I think of the two Grigson has grown a little bit which show the ability to become better as a GM.  Chuck has not he has regressed his teams just are not prepared to win the big games I'm fine with letting him go and keeping Grigson 

[Barry Sears]

Have other teams who are keeping their GM and HC from this year to next made an announcement stating that fact?  Just curious.  But, the fact that Irsay isn't talking and is actually avoiding the press is interesting to me.  I feel like Irsay will keep both or fire both, and will let everyone know when he feels like it.  To me, the bottom line is that the players are ultimately responsible for what happens on the field, and we had a lot of injuries this year without a deep roster to compensate.

 

If Luck throws an interception, is that on the coach and GM?  If Gore fumbles on a game winning drive, is it Pagano's fault?  There have been lots of successful coaches who have gone to different teams and those teams still stunk (Jeff Fisher, Rex Ryan, etc.)  Conversely, Bill Belichick is with the hapless Browns and then goes to New England, and we all know that story.

 

Coaches can only do so much, then it's on the players.  GM's can draft blue chip prospects and those prospects never pan out, so it's the GM's fault?

 

I don't think we change just for the sake of change.  Granted, two 8-8 season's in a row aren't great, but there's a lot of teams who would like to have had 8 wins the past two years to build on.  Many of those teams are a revolving door for coaches to come in and "fix" the team.  We have been spoiled by our past success.  The induction of Bill Polian to the HOF and Ring of Honor really made me appreciate how difficult it is to be successful over a long period of time...it's a very rare thing in professional sports.

 

I'm fine if Pagano and Grigson are given another year to right the ship.  If we have another draft like the past one, can sign some FA and stay healthier, then with the schedule we have next season, I can see us winning 10+ games and making the playoffs.

[corgi]

3 hours ago, OffensivelyPC said:

It does get fun laughing at some who fit the millennial stereotype.  

I'm still upset that I get shoehorned into that generation. I was born in 1986 I little to nothing in common with kids born in the mid to late 90's to present day.

[Fisticuffs111]

Just now, Vinatieri4 said:

 

 

Agreed, I would like to keep some guys in place. Talent is an issue. Coaching needs to improve, but hasn't been why we are 8-8.

I don't think the roster is super talented but I do think with better coaching we would be better than 8-8.

My original point was just that if any coach needs to answer for what's happening, it's Pagano.

[corgi]

2 hours ago, Barry Sears said:

Have other teams who are keeping their GM and HC from this year to next made an announcement stating that fact?  Just curious.  But, the fact that Irsay isn't talking and is actually avoiding the press is interesting to me.  I feel like Irsay will keep both or fire both, and will let everyone know when he feels like it.  To me, the bottom line is that the players are ultimately responsible for what happens on the field, and we had a lot of injuries this year without a deep roster to compensate.

 

If Luck throws an interception, is that on the coach and GM?  If Gore fumbles on a game winning drive, is it Pagano's fault?  There have been lots of successful coaches who have gone to different teams and those teams still stunk (Jeff Fisher, Rex Ryan, etc.)  Conversely, Bill Belichick is with the hapless Browns and then goes to New England, and we all know that story.

 

Coaches can only do so much, then it's on the players.  GM's can draft blue chip prospects and those prospects never pan out, so it's the GM's fault?

 

I don't think we change just for the sake of change.  Granted, two 8-8 season's in a row aren't great, but there's a lot of teams who would like to have had 8 wins the past two years to build on.  Many of those teams are a revolving door for coaches to come in and "fix" the team.  We have been spoiled by our past success.  The induction of Bill Polian to the HOF and Ring of Honor really made me appreciate how difficult it is to be successful over a long period of time...it's a very rare thing in professional sports.

 

I'm fine if Pagano and Grigson are given another year to right the ship.  If we have another draft like the past one, can sign some FA and stay healthier, then with the schedule we have next season, I can see us winning 10+ games and making the playoffs.

The Lions have, yes. When players on the team say they do not feel like they're held accountable for mistakes then that is on the coaching staff. I could be mistaken but I think the 2013 draft was the draft that was an absolute disaster, you can miss on a few guys but to miss on an entire draft class is a bit troubling.

[OffensivelyPC]

2 minutes ago, corgi said:

I'm still upset that I get shoehorned into that generation. I was born in 1986 I little to nothing in common with kids born in the mid to late 90's to present day.

Yeah, I was born in 84 - I'm technically included as well.  But I hardly fit the stereotype.  The only time I whine and cry like that is when my PS4 breaks down or I have to call the cable company for the 3rd gd time because their cable box hasn't updated, I have exchanged it for a 2nd time already, and their ish still doesn't work and I'm not paying $50 for some jerk to come out and tell me that I need to go to the store and exchange for a new cable box.  Also, I pouted a bit when the Colts lost the superbowl.  

[krunk]

Fan base doesn't know how to deal with adversity.  So used to playoffs every year and the good life.  Now people are damn near about to jump off bridges at the mere sight of trouble!

[Coltfreak]

1 minute ago, JMichael557 said:

He signed Allen to a Hugh contract which should not have been done.

He brought in Patrick Robinson who underperformed.

He spent a 2nd Round pick on a player that to date cannot play.

He let our best linebacker walk while keeping two linebackers as starters who were then cut.

Dorsett continues to disappoint as a 1st round pick.

 

So in evaluating it is easy to say that Grigson has not improved and continues to make the same mistakes.

It appears as if he just continued with his old habits.

Allen was a mistake but most everyone on this board thought he was great...  I thought it was a terrible idea to resign him 

 

Robinson??  Again 99% of everyone on this board thought he would be a superstar with the DB whisperer.  I was in the other 1%

 

that second round player was one that Pagano pounded on the table wanting him

 

"Our best LB" took a lesser deal with the Bears because he was * about. It getting an extension the yr before 

 

those two LBers were Paganos guys

 

Dorsett is not being used properly.  Unless Chud thinks his value is best used to clear space by taking a defender deep every play

 

since the meeting and extension. Grigs has held up his end of the deal of not spending money on aging FA and fixing the Oline (draft/Philbin).  

 

pagano still can't coach and is a horrible game manager and his choice for OC and D.C. IS REALLY REALLY BAD!!

[corgi]

3 hours ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Yeah, I was born in 84 - I'm technically included as well.  But I hardly fit the stereotype.  The only time I whine and cry like that is when my PS4 breaks down or I have to call the cable company for the 3rd gd time because their cable box hasn't updated, I have exchanged it for a 2nd time already, and their ish still doesn't work and I'm not paying $50 for some jerk to come out and tell me that I need to go to the store and exchange for a new cable box.  Also, I pouted a bit when the Colts lost the superbowl.  

I have a degree in video production and media technology, I don't know why I need to have a dude from DirecTV come to my house and "install" and receiver/dvr, I could've done that when I was 5.

[corgi]

3 hours ago, krunk said:

Fan base doesn't know how to deal with adversity.  So used to playoffs every year and the good life.  Now people are damn near about to jump off bridges at the mere sight of trouble!

Don't assume the loudest voices speak for the masses.

[TDewar1987]

5 minutes ago, Barry Sears said:

Have other teams who are keeping their GM and HC from this year to next made an announcement stating that fact? 

 

Not every coach or GM in the NFL is on the chopping block though. And the ones that are (Ryan, Kelly, Bradley, Fisher etc.) have all been fired.  

[Bravo]

I will say this, one thing Grigson has going for him is he is young and he is still learning. The past couple of years have been valuable experience for him.

 

I do think he came in and wanted to be extremely aggressive and it didn't work out for him. He made bad picks with "potential" ans took to much control over the coach. 

 

Im not a huge fan by any means and don't excuse any of his terrible decisions, I do however think Grigson has way more upside than Pagano at this point.

 

 

[Vinatieri4]

7 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I don't think the roster is super talented but I do think with better coaching we would be better than 8-8.

My original point was just that if any coach needs to answer for what's happening, it's Pagano.

 

I would agree with  you. I think our roster is bottom half of the league. That falls on Grigson, but it's Chucks job to lift them up to the playoffs. 

 

I would say we wait and see how this off season goes, 2017 is a big year for Chuck and Grigson for sure. 

[Vinatieri4]

1 minute ago, bravo4460 said:

I will say this, one thing Grigson has going for him is he is young and he is still learning. The past couple of years have been valuable experience for him.

 

I do think he came in and wanted to be extremely aggressive and it didn't work out for him. He made bad picks with "potential" ans took to much control over the coach. 

 

Im not a huge fan by any means and don't excuse any of his terrible decisions, I do however think Grigson has way more upside than Pagano at this point.

 

 

 

I agree Grigson has made some amazing moves and some questionable ones. 

 

Hopefully they can both turn in a solid offseason for 2017. 

[OffensivelyPC]

7 minutes ago, corgi said:

I have a degree in video production and media technology, I don't know why I need to have a dude from DirecTV come to my house and "install" and receiver/dvr, I could've done that when I was 5.

I could probably do most of the installation, including all the drilling and wiring in the drywall (I couldn't then, I was a stupid 24 year old).  But when it comes to IT, while I can do the mechanical portion of it, I don't understand code and programming though.  That was the problem I was having - it was some software update that failed and the update would never work.  Ever.  So I'd have to take it in, exchange boxes, and I'd go home, try it, and they gave me another faulty cable box.  Sometimes I'd go through 3 boxes before I got one that worked.  The place is like 30 minutes away and I'd wait in line forever too.  It * me off so much.

[jvan1973]

6 minutes ago, TDewar1987 said:

 

Not every coach or GM in the NFL is on the chopping block though. And the ones that are (Ryan, Kelly, Bradley, Fisher etc.) have all been fired.  

Those 4 coaches combined for 16 wins this season

[corgi]

3 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Those 4 coaches combined for 16 wins this season

none of them had a (near) elite QB either.

[jvan1973]

4 minutes ago, corgi said:

none of them had a (near) elite QB either.

The Saints do,  they had 7 wins in back to back seasons

[deedub75]

He doesn't have to say anything but with all of the speculation and news crews camping out on W 56th Street, I think he at least owes it to the fan base to end the speculation. I'm a season ticket owner so I kinda feel like a shareholder even though I have no say. LOL!

[OffensivelyPC]

14 minutes ago, TDewar1987 said:

 

Not every coach or GM in the NFL is on the chopping block though. And the ones that are (Ryan, Kelly, Bradley, Fisher etc.) have all been fired.  

Well, I mean, Brad Wells - or any other media head - might tell you whether Pagano or Grigson are on the chopping block, but he's not the one making the decision.  Their 2 cents are really unimportant.  You can take what you want from what guys like that say.  Some of it's useful.  Most of it's not.  The most useful stuff is direct quotes, for instance,  Irsay said he's not on the chopping block.  Until he says something else, you really shouldn't expect him to be fired, regardless of what the media says.

[corgi]

2 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

The Saints do,  they had 5 wins 

Fire them all too, not really, unless they want to. The only argument I have is that Payton won an SB but, that was many moons ago.

[chad72]

17 minutes ago, corgi said:

The Lions have, yes. When players on the team say they do not feel like they're held accountable for mistakes then that is on the coaching staff. I could be mistaken but I think the 2013 draft was the draft that was an absolute disaster, you can miss on a few guys but to miss on an entire draft class is a bit troubling.

 

The Jets did as well, making it known Bowles will be back.

[Defjamz26]

32 minutes ago, John Waylon said:

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

I think people are suggesting he go because how it bodes for the future. He's done nothing to inspire confidence that he can build a championship team going forward. While we may get new starters on the OL from the draft, still no GAME CHANGERS/FRANCHISE PLAYERS. He's had 5 years and all he's delivered is T.Y. Hilton. Maybe it's too early to grade but can you point to anyone drafted on the Colts outside of Hilton (Luck never counts) who you can say is Amazing? Not good, solid, or had tremendous potential but a player who is like really good and any team would kill to have ? And he's had 5 years to do it.

 

Theres a difference between making mistakes and wasting 5 years. Plus some of his most recent moves look like they won't pan out:

 

-Dorsett is a bust. If you think it's as simple as him not being used properly you're saying that a whole bunch of coaches with decades of experience between them are just inept, which is hard to believe. I get the gripes with Pagano and Chud but you're saying that no one on that staff knows what to do with him? That a bunch of guys are just twiddling their thumbs over a guy who could easily be great? I don't think so

 

-TJ Green. A guy drafted for the same reason Dorsett was; measurables. He's just a box safety and has 0 coverage skill. But lemme guess. "He's only been a safety for a short while since switching at Clemson"? I get that but there's nothing to suggest that he's just going to learn how to cover and then ball out. The signs aren't there.

 

-Patrick Robinson hasn't done anything. This is pretty undeniable unless we wanna use the injury excuse like we do with most of our underperforming players.

 

-He overpaid Allen who got outplayed by a UDFA (who Grigs deserves praise for finding). All the blocking debate is nonsense. You don't pay a guy that much to just block well. Another guy who gets a million excuses made for him.

 

-Parry is better than Chapman but he's literally the perfect example of a Grigson player. Not explosive or twitchy. Not trash but also not great either. Floats between middle of the pack and mediocre. Probably not a starter on any other team

 

-They handed Morrison the keys after D'Qwells suspension but he's just another slow LB who can't cover. Probably not a starter on another team.

 

And like I said you always have to look at the future. Which way is the arrow trending? It's was to look at the Kelly, Haeg, Clark, and Ridgeway and say 2016 was a great draft but we still didn't get enough. And his track record is bad. Most of his draft picks and project players aren't even in the league anymore. Is it really smart to let this guy get another draft and offseason just because he found a center and some O-lineman who may turn out to be decent?

[chad72]

8 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

The Saints do,  they had 7 wins in back to back seasons

 

A SB buys equity, fair or not. Plus, cap hell caused by Saints GM had a lot to do with it too.

 

If Dungy had 2 back to back seasons of 7 wins after a SB win, he'd get leeway too, IMO.

 

That's why Coughlin was let go, after having 4 years of not making the playoffs from 2012-2015, I think.

 

Saints are just more wishful than the Giants. However, they didn't have the winning culture like the Giants or Colts when Payton and Brees took over. That probably reminds them not to abandon the first duo that brought them a winning culture.

[OffensivelyPC]

8 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

I think people are suggesting he go because how it bodes for the future. He's done nothing to inspire confidence that he can build a championship team going forward. While we may get new starters on the OL from the draft, still no GAME CHANGERS/FRANCHISE PLAYERS. He's had 5 years and all he's delivered is T.Y. Hilton. Maybe it's too early to grade but can you point to anyone drafted on the Colts outside of Hilton (Luck never counts) who you can say is Amazing? Not good, solid, or had tremendous potential but a player who is like really good and any team would kill to have ? And he's had 5 years to do it.

 

Theres a difference between making mistakes and wasting 5 years. Plus some of his most recent moves look like they won't pan out:

 

-Dorsett is a bust. If you think it's as simple as him not being used properly you're saying that a whole bunch of coaches with decades of experience between them are just inept, which is hard to believe. I get the gripes with Pagano and Chud but you're saying that no one on that staff knows what to do with him? That a bunch of guys are just twiddling their thumbs over a guy who could easily be great? I don't think so

 

-TJ Green. A guy drafted for the same reason Dorsett was; measurables. He's just a box safety and has 0 coverage skill. But lemme guess. "He's only been a safety for a short while since switching at Clemson"? I get that but there's nothing to suggest that he's just going to learn how to cover and then ball out. The signs aren't there.

 

-Patrick Robinson hasn't done anything. This is pretty undeniable unless we wanna use the injury excuse like we do with most of our underperforming players.

 

-He overpaid Allen who got outplayed by a UDFA (who Grigs deserves praise for finding). All the blocking debate is nonsense. You don't pay a guy that much to just block well. Another guy who gets a million excuses made for him.

 

-Parry is better than Chapman but he's literally the perfect example of a Grigson player. Not explosive or twitchy. Not trash but also not great either. Floats between middle of the pack and mediocre. Probably not a starter on any other team

 

-They handed Morrison the keys after D'Qwells suspension but he's just another slow LB who can't cover. Probably not a starter on another team.

 

And like I said you always have to look at the future. Which way is the arrow trending? It's was to look at the Kelly, Haeg, Clark, and Ridgeway and say 2016 was a great draft but we still didn't get enough. And his track record is bad. Most of his draft picks and project players aren't even in the league anymore. Is it really smart to let this guy get another draft and offseason just because he found a center and some O-lineman who may turn out to be decent?

To me, you don't necessarily wipe the slate clean starting in 2016, but I think you do have view Grigson and Pagano with under a different microscope starting with the end of the 2015 season.  What happened pre-2016 matters and it always will.  But whatever happened behind closed doors between Irsay, Grigson, and Pagano was to clear the dust in the air.  What happens going forward will be the new measure by which these guys should be judged and they're both on a short leash.  I think Pagano did not do very well in 2016, Grigson did better.  His 2015 draft will need to pan out and Grigson will have to show he can make strides with his game planning for either to stick around beyond 2017.  The stuff you mention that's post-2015 season is fair, thus far, but premature.

 

But while we can still hold those guys accountable for pre-2016 decisions, it's clear, at least at this moment in time, that Irsay isn't going to punish them twice for the same crime.  That's actually incredibly fair and I doubt that either of these guys get a second chance at HC or GM after they leave the Colts if they are fired after the 2017 season - at least not after spending some time demoted to some lesser role than they currently have.  People here won't like it, and I don't really care about that so much as I say all this just to explain, perhaps, the logic behind what Irsay is thinking.  I can see what he's doing, and itm akes sense to me, even if the cost of being wrong is 2, maybe even 3 or 4 years of Lucks prime gambled and lost on.

[ColtsBlueFL]

24 minutes ago, corgi said:

I'm still upset that I get shoehorned into that generation. I was born in 1986 I little to nothing in common with kids born in the mid to late 90's to present day.

 

Unfortunately, 1986 is smack dab in the middle of the Gen  Y (Millennial) generation- 1977-1995. 

OTOH, not all Millennial's create/confirm the Millennial Stereotype

 

iGen (Centennials, or Gen Z) folks were 1996 - and beyond.

 

Gen X folks were born from 1965 - 1976

 

Baby Boomers from 1946 - 1964

 

The Silent Gen (Traditionalists) were born before 1946

[John Waylon]

I really don't understand the expectations of termination for grigson other than it being residual. Yeah, overall he hasn't done a fantastic job, but since he was last evaluated a year ago he hasn't done anything to warrant being fired. He had what seems to be a really solid draft, probably his best since coming here. He didn't make any huge FA signings that didn't pan out, or any trades that blew up in our face.

Since getting his extension exactly one year ago to the day he has had arguably his best year as our GM.

People are praising our rookies and calling for grigson's job all in the same breath. It doesn't make sense.

And for the record, I wouldn't be upset if he was fired in the slightest. I'm not a grigson supporter by any means, but it's kind of foolish to discount his performance over the last 365 days.

*

He signed Allen to a Hugh contract which should not have been done.

He brought in Patrick Robinson who underperformed.

He spent a 2nd Round pick on a player that to date cannot play.

He let our best linebacker walk while keeping two linebackers as starters who were then cut.

Dorsett continues to disappoint as a 1st round pick.

 

So in evaluating it is easy to say that Grigson has not improved and continues to make the same mistakes.

It appears as if he just continued with his old habits.

It's still a little early to claim the Allen deal as a wash. Yes he had a disappointing season, but there's no reason he can't bounce back.

Did Robinson underperform? He was injured too much this year to have even the slightest clue. Maybe next you can tell me all about how his injuries are grigson's fault as well.

You mean to tell us that TJ Green can't play? Go back and try that one again.

Freeman walking wasn't done for no reason. Grigson wasn't sitting in his office too busy playing candy crush to deal with him. Whatever that reason was we don't know, but we did better without Freeman than the Bears did with him so let's not call that one a wash, either.

Dorsett showed off his playmaking ability on multiple occasions this season. The coaching staff just isn't making the most of him. And let's use some common sense here. One year ago today Irsay accepted the fate of whatever drafting Dorsett was going to bring be it good, bad, or indifferent. Why would he punish grigson now for something he accepted a year ago, that was already beyond grigson's control all along?

Go back and look at this draft class and tell me grigson did a bad job. Get your hate blinders off, bud. He earned a high passing grade in the last year.

*

[ColtsBlueFL]

1 hour ago, csmopar said:

how many new threads discussing this issue do we really need?  could this post not have gone in one of the hundreds of others?  

 

1 hour ago, OffensivelyPC said:

Everyone needs to be consoled in their own thread, apparently...

 

Yeah, why not let them roam a spell.  Then when the urge to Mega-Merge hits, they can all start their own many separate threads on how their posts disappeared and they cant follow the conversations in a meg-merge dump-heap.  ;-)

[OffensivelyPC]

9 minutes ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

 

Yeah, why not let them roam a spell.  Then when the urge to Mega-Merge hits, they can all start their own many separate threads on how their posts disappeared and they cant follow the conversations in a meg-merge dump-heap.  ;-)

lol everytime someone's thread gets merged, there's always this little part inside of me that wants to point and laugh.  .  Like, it's not even that big of a deal, but it I feel vindicated when it happens - particularly when the subject matter of the thread was poor to begin with.  

 

Not when it's news, though that's a little funny in its own right because I feel sometimes people just want to be the first to post the thread on big news.  Just when people post complaint threads about the same topics over and over about the HC or GM - like, they're pinned at the top already!  

 

So yeah, I find a little humor in that.  I'd be so liberal merging threads into those pinned threads if I were a mod and be like "Mwwaaaahhahahahaha!  Take that sucka!"