D' Joun Smith

[coltsfeva]

I was impressed by this video. Not only because a Colts was praised (by Gruden) for being a complete CB, but also because he totally took Mel Kiper to task. If Smith can stay healthy this year, could he be the starter on the other side of Davis?  

 

On the vid. they don't start talking about Smith until Gruden brings him up near the end.

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

I think he will eventually be fine, but he needs to work on technique and fundamentals while he gets acclimated and the game speed slows down for him.  He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee.  That put him behind the eight ball immediately.  So he lost a lot of practice and development time.  I think of him as an advanced red-shirt freshman.  Let's see how much progress he makes this year in training camp. But he will have a large role for us.  Hopefully sooner rather than later.

[Smonroe]

1 hour ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I think he will eventually be fine, but he needs to work on technique and fundamentals while he gets acclimated and the game speed slows down for him.  He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee.  That put him behind the eight ball immediately.  So he lost a lot of practice and development time.  I think of him as an advanced red-shirt freshman.  Let's see how much progress he makes this year in training camp. But he will have a large role for us.  Hopefully sooner rather than later.

 

I'm guessing he was injured from day one, but I could be wrong.  And sometimes guys just don't pan out.  You can go back and read a lot of great things about Justin Gilbert prior to the 14 draft.

 

[Track Guy]

He's nice to have on the roster, but I'm glad we've got Davis and Robinson ahead of him for now. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

4 hours ago, Smonroe said:

 

I'm guessing he was injured from day one, but I could be wrong.  And sometimes guys just don't pan out.  You can go back and read a lot of great things about Justin Gilbert prior to the 14 draft.

 

 

Agree, we do/did not know his medical status in preseason prior to going on IR/DTR.  OTOH, if he is fully recovered, and now that he knows what to expect from Luck - TY, Moncrief, and Dorsett in practice, he can focus on the teachings and principles Pagano and the DB coaches relay to him.  Barring further injuries, at the end of next year, we'll know where the guy stands, good or bad.  I like his potential and hope he achieves it.

[Smonroe]

2 hours ago, Track Guy said:

He's nice to have on the roster, but I'm glad we've got Davis and Robinson ahead of him for now. 

 

Hopefully, he and Mitchell will learn from watching Davis. 

 

I'm interested in seeing how Tevin works out.  I was reading various draft profiles on him.  A lot of positives, but they all said the same thing as far as his weakness - durability. 

[Bluefire4]

This had to be posted at least 6 times last year. I watched this episode before the draft and that was the only thing I heard about Smith.

[will426]

Lol why does everyone say he had a bad preseason...I've only heard about him having a bad TRAINING CAMP he barely got in in preseason because he got hurt early and it followed him into the season  so as of now we don't have any Ingame tape to judge if he was bad..and the fact remains he was being destroyed in camp while going against our recieving corps while the Qbs were healthy everyone knows what luck can do with them sheesh I wouldn't have expected him to come in shutting down Hilton moncreif Dorsett Andre fleener nor Allen 

[indyagent17]

He was injured early and you could tell, he looked tentative when pushing off at times but he is a hard nosed player that seems to be around the ball just like Geathers is. 

 

We MAY have two very solid DB's from last years draft that should emerge this season

 

it would be a pleasant surprise 

[Goatface Killah]

People are way too quick to write somebody off. It shows little respect for how hard playing CB in the NFL really is and a severe lack of patience. He didn't have the best rookie year while battling injuries, but that means next to nothing today. Personally, I wouldn't be surprised to see him starting for us, THIS year. 

 

Anytime a guy goes to a new team and tries to fit into a new scheme, there are questions. And while I like what I saw from Robinson with the Saints, I didn't see a guy who should be handed a starting job based off reputation. He will still have to earn that spot.  

 

So with that said, D'joun has a very good chance to start for us opposite Vontae. Like Gruden said, he has a great skill set to be a starting #2 corner and chances are he was struggling more with the mental side of the game.You can learn a lot in a year and a half, which is how long he will have been a pro by the time next season rolls around. 

 

Pagano stated he is gonna take on a bigger role in coaching the secondary next year and that can only be a good thing for a kid like Smith. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

43 minutes ago, will426 said:

Lol why does everyone say he had a bad preseason...I've only heard about him having a bad TRAINING CAMP he barely got in in preseason because he got hurt early and it followed him into the season  

 

 

Maybe in other threads some have?  I mentioned both in my response above-

 

" He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee. " 

 

I don't remember bad reports coming out of training camp about Toler, Bulter, Davis, etc...  just Smith.  And his IR time really hurt in his development schedule.  He's an advanced redshirt freshman right now.  But there isn't pressure for him to start... at least it would appear for now.

[aaron11]

1 hour ago, will426 said:

Lol why does everyone say he had a bad preseason...

because its true.  yes he was hurt early on, but the tape we do have was bad

 

statistics are the reason people are quick to write him off.  third round or later rookies usually dont have long to prove they belong.

[B~Town]

2 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

because its true.  yes he was hurt early on, but the tape we do have was bad

 

statistics are the reason people are quick to write him off.  third round or later rookies usually dont have long to prove they belong.  take a look at some of our recent third round picks.  other than TY who was an absolute steal and smith i dont think we even have any third rounders.  i could be wrong on that though 

D Smith

Henry Anderson

Moncrief

Thorton

Allen

Hilton

Pretty sure there guys were all drafted in the 3rd last few years

 

[aaron11]

1 minute ago, B~Town said:

D Smith

Henry Anderson

Moncrief

Thorton

Allen

Hilton

Pretty sure there guys were all drafted in the 3rd last few years

 

beat me before my edit 

[Coltfreak]

1 hour ago, GoatBeard said:

People are way too quick to write somebody off. It shows little respect for how hard playing CB in the NFL really is and a severe lack of patience. He didn't have the best rookie year while battling injuries, but that means next to nothing today. Personally, I wouldn't be surprised to see him starting for us, THIS year. 

 

Anytime a guy goes to a new team and tries to fit into a new scheme, there are questions. And while I like what I saw from Robinson with the Saints, I didn't see a guy who should be handed a starting job based off reputation. He will still have to earn that spot.  

 

So with that said, D'joun has a very good chance to start for us opposite Vontae. Like Gruden said, he has a great skill set to be a starting #2 corner and chances are he was struggling more with the mental side of the game.You can learn a lot in a year and a half, which is how long he will have been a pro by the time next season rolls around. 

 

Pagano stated he is gonna take on a bigger role in coaching the secondary next year and that can only be a good thing for a kid like Smith. 

Agree....  too many people on here think if a guy doesnt start day one and is in the pro bowl he is a bust or needs replaced.

 

Sometimes it takes a yr to develop into a good player.  He is from a small school but has tons of talent.  He was injured.  Lets give the kid a chance.

 

Some of you would + like crazy if we traded our 4-6 draft picks away, but you may  be the same ones that dont want to give them a chance to develop, so why even draft them?

 

I agree Goat,  the kid has potential to be the starter this yr

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, aaron11 said:

because its true.  yes he was hurt early on, but the tape we do have was bad

 

statistics are the reason people are quick to write him off.  third round or later rookies usually dont have long to prove they belong.

 

What?     3rd round guys get plenty of time.   Typically if you see a 3rd round guy or later not playing out their contract,   then they either have serious off-the-field issues,  or the draft evaluation was a complete bust.

 

But as long as the kid shows something and is putting in the effort,  a 3rd or 4th round guy is going to get all the chance he needs.

 

The exception would be if the team changes coaches or GM and the new staff simply doesn't like the player.

 

[jskinnz]

7 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

I think he will eventually be fine, but he needs to work on technique and fundamentals while he gets acclimated and the game speed slows down for him.  He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee.  That put him behind the eight ball immediately.  So he lost a lot of practice and development time.  I think of him as an advanced red-shirt freshman.  Let's see how much progress he makes this year in training camp. But he will have a large role for us.  Hopefully sooner rather than later.

 

I went to the night training camp practice last year and paid particular attention to him.  To say he was awful is insulting to awful.  It was one practice in what turned out to be a very small sampling last year so clearly not near enough to say he will be a bust.  But it was not good.  If they can get something out of him, it is a huge bonus.  Davis, Robinson & Butler are not a bad trio but certainly it is a group that can be improved on.

[ColtsBlueFL]

1 hour ago, jskinnz said:

 

I went to the night training camp practice last year and paid particular attention to him.  To say he was awful is insulting to awful.  It was one practice in what turned out to be a very small sampling last year so clearly not near enough to say he will be a bust.  But it was not good.  If they can get something out of him, it is a huge bonus.  Davis, Robinson & Butler are not a bad trio but certainly it is a group that can be improved on.

 

Yes, I remember many, Media, bloggers, and forum fans reporting how bad a training camp Smith was having.  The fact he went on IR/DTR for 2 months didn't help. Once on IR, he can't show up to practices, the tape room, coaches meetings, etc... for 6 weeks, or play until 8 weeks pass.  That set him behind in development.  At least he saw 'the speed of the game' with TY, Dorsett, and Moncrief last year, so expectations of what he will face are known.  We really need to develop a decent corner out of him.  QB and corner are two spots difficult for rookies to step in and take over.  Too much to learn at the NFL level, and that takes some time.

 

I'm willing to see what Smith does as far as development this year, and then making real contributions next year. This is my hope, anyway.

[coltsfeva]

If it turns out our secondary (and D line) are fine, that leaves IMO pass rush and linebacker as out greatest needs on D. Not saying if a standout D lineman or CB/FS are there at 18 the Colts shouldn't consider it, but we need a pass-rusher desperately. Even if Mathis and Cole have good years, the clock is ticking.

[COLTS449]

None of us know what Smith will turn out to be. Hopefully he can beat out Butler and turn into one of the top nickel corners in the NFL. I just hope we don't end up saying "Man I wish we had picked PJ Williams instead" I remember wanting Williams in the 3rd when we picked Smith. Williams was a late 1st/early 2nd round talent who fell because some type of off the field incident.

[NewColtsFan]

11 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

None of us know what Smith will turn out to be. Hopefully he can beat out Butler and turn into one of the top nickel corners in the NFL. I just hope we don't end up saying "Man I wish we had picked PJ Williams instead" I remember wanting Williams in the 3rd when we picked Smith. Williams was a late 1st/early 2nd round talent who fell because some type of off the field incident.

 

Last year,  every single draft pick graded out very high in the area of.....   character.

 

ESPN.com tracks a bunch of categories and one of them is "intangibles"....   that's where they factor in character on and off the field.      It's a 1-5 scale with 1 being best and 5 being worst.

 

Every draft pick last year got a 1 or a 2.     Not a single 3 -- which is average -- and certainly no 4's or 5's.   Not a single knucklehead.      For better or worse,  Grigson's draft was very character driven.....

 

Likely that a player like PJ Williams, as good as he is,  was not on our board,  or certainly long off the board by the time the 5th round came around.....

 

[will426]

17 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Maybe in other threads some have?  I mentioned both in my response above-

 

" He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee. " 

 

I don't remember bad reports coming out of training camp about Toler, Bulter, Davis, etc...  just Smith.  And his IR time really hurt in his development schedule.  He's an advanced redshirt freshman right now.  But there isn't pressure for him to start... at least it would appear for now.

Look at the names you chose  come on lol you know they know this defense and the offense better than a rook so them getting beat in camp would be more alarming  and right there isn't any pressure but unless given a chance we can't say how good/bad he is till he gets quality snaps maybe the coaching changes will be beneficial because we usually try and develop players in practice and don't give them chances to get up to game speed in games unless there's an injury 

[Defjamz26]

Why is the bar for Smith so low just because he had a bad TC? CB is one of the hardest positions to learn. He also came from a small school.

 

Its funny how much hype people here put into guys like Carter,Delano Howell, etc.. But a guy like Smith who has good upside is treated as a long shot to be good.

[Archer]

On 4/5/2016 at 1:17 PM, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Maybe in other threads some have?  I mentioned both in my response above-

 

" He had a horrid training camp and preseason last year and his knee surgery with the IR designated to return for his knee. " 

 

I don't remember bad reports coming out of training camp about Toler, Bulter, Davis, etc...  just Smith.  And his IR time really hurt in his development schedule.  He's an advanced redshirt freshman right now.  But there isn't pressure for him to start... at least it would appear for now.

 

I remember TC reports being very silent on him.  We heard how he was climbing the depth chart a little, but I never heard about a single good play he made in camp (and we heard about just about every good play made in camp from first hand accounts).  I had to wonder to what degree any struggles came from having to play against TY, Moncrief, etc.

[Bleedin Blue]

No need to rush this kid.  If he ends up taking another full season to develop so be it. 

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

The Eraser was'nt much his first year either ..  

 

I look forward to seeing what year 2 brings Gruden has liked what he saw & that means alot the man has great football knowledge , Even Peyton Mannings first year was nothing special while  Lucks was awesome not many rookies come out & do great right off the bat ..

[SaturdayAllDay]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

Why is the bar for Smith so low just because he had a bad TC? CB is one of the hardest positions to learn. He also came from a small school.

 

Its funny how much hype people here put into guys like Carter,Delano Howell, etc.. But a guy like Smith who has good upside is treated as a long shot to be good.

Not to mention he came from a primarily zone based scheme.  even seasoned pros have trouble with the transition from zone to man schemes. 

[Goatface Killah]

On 4/5/2016 at 2:34 PM, Coltfreak said:

Agree....  too many people on here think if a guy doesnt start day one and is in the pro bowl he is a bust or needs replaced.

 

Sometimes it takes a yr to develop into a good player.  He is from a small school but has tons of talent.  He was injured.  Lets give the kid a chance.

 

Some of you would + like crazy if we traded our 4-6 draft picks away, but you may  be the same ones that dont want to give them a chance to develop, so why even draft them?

 

I agree Goat,  the kid has potential to be the starter this yr

Absolutely. I just think his injury set him back and he was playing catch up all year mentally. Some guys can look at a playbook and pick it up but some guys need the practice reps more than just the study time and other guys need the game reps as well.

 

Give the kid an off season with the experience of at least one season under his belt before you judge him. Jmo

[ColtsBlueFL]

9 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

Absolutely. I just think his injury set him back and he was playing catch up all year mentally. Some guys can look at a playbook and pick it up but some guys need the practice reps more than just the study time and other guys need the game reps as well.

 

Give the kid an off season with the experience of at least one season under his belt before you judge him. Jmo

 

^^^ This.  ^^^

The kid's injury was a major setback.  These rooks need all of the practice and reps the restrictive CBA allows.  Being IR/DTR , he lost 6 weeks, no practice etc.. so he is essentially rookie +.  But I expect his limited exposure has mentally prepared him, which will allow his physical development to go easier, I believe.

[B~Town]

I still have high hopes for this kids future I believe Pagano will work his DB magic and get the most out of his talented young DB . I hope Smith or that DB we stole can push for the number 2 spot this year because I believe Robinson and Butler are more acclimated to play the slot .I know it could be a pipe dream but really would like to see some of young players take over win the starting jobs and become good to great NFL players . 

[BProland85]

He needs to change his jersey number. 30 is tainted for me with bad memories of Landry. 

[krunk]

I think he'll be fine at the nickel. If not there my gut keeps telling me he'll make a fine safety.  That's another place I think he'd be a really good fit.

[Bluefire4]

We can look at this video all we want but we all know he had a horrible year last year. In fact, Pagano hits it right on the head.

“Smith got off to a rough start and it never got any better from the offseason,” Chuck Pagano said last month at the League Meetings. “Whether it was getting acclimated to the program, rules as far as illegal contact.

“A lot of rookie corners, it’s a tough transition for them. They get to contact all the way down the field in college and they do it for a lot of years in college, a lot of reps. He dealt with a lot of things (last year).”

 

I still expect him to grow and improve, but we can't look at the video and claim him as another great draft pick already.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

2 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

We can look at this video all we want but we all know he had a horrible year last year. In fact, Pagano hits it right on the head. I still expect him to grow and improve, but we can't look at the video and claim him as another great draft pick already.

 

“Smith got off to a rough start and it never got any better from the offseason,” Chuck Pagano said last month at the League Meetings. “Whether it was getting acclimated to the program, rules as far as illegal contact.

“A lot of rookie corners, it’s a tough transition for them. They get to contact all the way down the field in college and they do it for a lot of years in college, a lot of reps. He dealt with a lot of things (last year).”

 

At this point we can't claim anything great or bust .

 

Speaking of a bad year Pagano did'nt exactly shine either him & the rook both have something to prove Pagano has had 4 years to fix the defense as far as rough starts goes , IMO the rook gets a pass the coach has yet to prove his self & hes been here much longer , As the DB whisperer he needs to step up & prove Irsay made the right choice in resigning him , By putting a defense on the field that can actually defend consistently instead of offending  habitually ...

 

[Bluefire4]

2 hours ago, ÅÐØNϧ 1 said:

 

At this point we can't claim anything great or bust .

 

Speaking of a bad year Pagano did'nt exactly shine either him & the rook both have something to prove Pagano has had 4 years to fix the defense as far as rough starts goes , IMO the rook gets a pass the coach has yet to prove his self & hes been here much longer , As the DB whisperer he needs to step up & prove Irsay made the right choice in resigning him , By putting a defense on the field that can actually defend consistently instead of offending  habitually ...

 

This thread is not talking about whether the coach has something to prove. It is about Smith. No one is vilifying him, people just need to temper expectations and not look at what Gruden said and think he can start next year. Pagano has proven himself worthy of another shot with the record over his four years. Winning 3 playoff games, taken his team to the AFC Championship, and winning 8 games with like 5 different quarterbacks. Now it's time for Smith to show up which could happen. He was only a rookie.

[OHColtfan]

I wouldn't allow the presence of Smith on the roster to keep us from drafting a CB this year. I know he was a 3 last year, but that was last year. He is either going to compete & show he can contribute or he will fall down the depth chart or off the roster. League moves ahead really fast these days. Right now he is just a number on the roster with potential, and has no more production in the NFL than a guy coming out of college with a great skill set this year.

Besides, you can never have enough good CB's

[Coltfreak]

20 hours ago, B~Town said:

I still have high hopes for this kids future I believe Pagano will work his DB magic and get the most out of his talented young DB . I hope Smith or that DB we stole can push for the number 2 spot this year because I believe Robinson and Butler are more acclimated to play the slot .I know it could be a pipe dream but really would like to see some of young players take over win the starting jobs and become good to great NFL players . 

Pagano DB Magic????

 

i don't get it.  Outside of Davis who was pretty good when he got here Pags has done nothing for the DBs.     Otherwise Toler would be good 

 

another example of someone reading something and it spreads like gospel 

 

 

[Archer]

I think we're done (outside of undrafted FAs) at CB this year.  We have more than we've had since Pagano and Grigson got here.  Smith is the first one Grigson has drafted and I guaranty he and Pagano still expect big things from him - he will be the primary outside depth this year, without a doubt.  Butler returns to be the man in zone should D'Joun fail.  And the kicker is that Jalil, Mitchel, and Glover-Wright are probably the most promising #5 prospects we've had in a while.

[JPFolks]

On 4/5/2016 at 1:16 PM, GoatBeard said:

People are way too quick to write somebody off. It shows little respect for how hard playing CB in the NFL really is and a severe lack of patience. He didn't have the best rookie year while battling injuries, but that means next to nothing today. Personally, I wouldn't be surprised to see him starting for us, THIS year. 

 

Anytime a guy goes to a new team and tries to fit into a new scheme, there are questions. And while I like what I saw from Robinson with the Saints, I didn't see a guy who should be handed a starting job based off reputation. He will still have to earn that spot.  

 

So with that said, D'joun has a very good chance to start for us opposite Vontae. Like Gruden said, he has a great skill set to be a starting #2 corner and chances are he was struggling more with the mental side of the game.You can learn a lot in a year and a half, which is how long he will have been a pro by the time next season rolls around. 

 

Pagano stated he is gonna take on a bigger role in coaching the secondary next year and that can only be a good thing for a kid like Smith. 

So you think he'd start over Robinson?  Is that because you think he's that amazing, or that Robinson isn't that good?  I don't know much about Robinson and his stats appear underwhelming but I know you can't base it just on that as what I saw was limited I think.  I do trust Pagano to evaluate DB's and to coach them up to their potential. It's his area of expertise so we should hope to get as much out of both guys as they have to give under Pagano's system and overriding philosophies.  Also, we still have Butler as the nickel right? 

[will426]

On April 8, 2016 at 10:13 AM, Coltfreak said:

Pagano DB Magic????

 

i don't get it.  Outside of Davis who was pretty good when he got here Pags has done nothing for the DBs.     Otherwise Toler would be good 

 

another example of someone reading something and it spreads like gospel 

 

 

Butler and since Adams has come he's been to the pro owl and Davis so pretty much 3/5 of our starting dbs  have become better with him..there is no way possible to fix toler lol  and the ss position has been an open door so yeah other than that you can say he's worked his magic even though we haven't trained our own draft picks