The Safeties Are an Issue

[Defjamz26]

This has nothing to do with the injuries to Geathers or Adams. But I've come to the conclusion that the Colts don't have any true SS's on the roster. Our guys are really good in coverage and can intercept passes, but they can't tackle at all. Geathers flashes the potential to be a solid tackler, but he's not there yet.

I know Pagano likes them interchangeable but you can't swap 1 guy who can't tackle for another with the same limitation. This team needs a guy who can hit and tackle in the box.

[WoolMagnet]

Blue is getting a lil long in the tooth too.

[Patagonia Chris]

I agree. I also have never understood why Colt Anderson is on the roster. He had some terrible angles of pursuit Sunday and just seems like a complete liability anytime he's on the field other than special teams. But ya know, he is a former Eagle so there's a spot for him on the Colts and a spot for him in Grigson's heart.

[ricker182]

I agree. I also have never understood why Colt Anderson is on the roster. He had some terrible angles of pursuit Sunday and just seems like a complete liability anytime he's on the field other than special teams. But ya know, he is a former Eagle so there's a spot for him on the Colts and a spot for him in Grigson's heart.

He's a fantastic special teams guy.

 

Worth the roster spot alone IMO.

[krunk]

We have not had any major issues with the run until the Saints game. We are fine with Adams, Lowery, and Geathers. Colt Anderson was terrible however and I think him playing and still being here is an indictment of Guy and Mcdonald. Main issue is with this team is penalties and turnovers which are mainly the offense. Those things also affect the defense.

[indyspeed13]

it would be nice to have another sanders back there. someone who can punish you when you try him

[MPStack]

Could have had Landon Collins who is having a good season with the Giants so far. 

[TKnight24]

Could have had Landon Collins who is having a good season with the Giants so far.

Don't do that, forum hates when you say facts about how awful the Dorsett pick was

[MPStack]

Don't do that, forum hates when you say facts about how awful the Dorsett pick was

Erick Kendricks, Stephone Anthony, Ronald Darby, Rob Havenstein and Hau Kikana drafted in between Dorsett and Smith picks. Its early but hurts looking at this. Kendricks is a future Pro bowler for years IMO. 35 tackles and 4 SACKS from the Mike so far. 

[Superman]

The safeties are fine. 

 

And Landon Collins can't cover.

[MPStack]

The safeties are fine. 

 

And Landon Collins can't cover.

42 tackles, INT and five PD on the season. He`s getting better each week. Collins would have been a better pick for the Colts than Dorsett IMO. However, I think Kendricks would have given us that defensive difference maker we needed. Dorsett is no T.Y. 

[C0lts088]

Don't do that, forum hates when you say facts about how awful the Dorsett pick was

I wouldn't say Dorsett is awful, kid has barely been used thanks to Pep. We probably won't see what he's capable off till next year.

[HungarianColtsFan]

Don't do that, forum hates when you say facts about how awful the Dorsett pick was

 

I don't think Dorsett pick was awful. We were (and still are) in biggest need at some other spots and we should have picked men to O-line or D.

[crestmount]

Anderson is there for special teams--injuries alone meant he had to play as Safety.

[crestmount]

I don't think Dorsett pick was awful. We were (and still are) in biggest need at some other spots and we should have picked men to O-line or D.

We should have addressed the O-line issues 2 yrs ago.  At least the D-line has been an improvement this season.

[HungarianColtsFan]

We should have addressed the O-line issues 2 yrs ago.  At least the D-line has been an improvement this season.

 

 

Still our D overall is ranked dead last this season. 

[zibby43]

The safeties are fine. 

 

And Landon Collins can't cover.

 

+1

 

Completely agree.  Have said that ad nauseam on here.

 

Collins is a 4-3 safety that plays in the box/near the line of scrimmage.  Very solid against the run and his lackluster coverage skills can be masked in the red zone, where the field is shrunk.  He can stay in the game in the red zone though, because of his tackling abilities.

 

He's having success with the Giants because he is the perfect fit for their scheme.  Collins was NOT a perfect fit for the Colts 3-4.

 

I don't know why people don't get that.  Actually, I do. 

[will426]

Lol Dorsett isn't trash so don't speak on him being that

[Defjamz26]

The safeties are fine.

And Landon Collins can't cover.

They're fine in coverage. Yes. But not when you ask they to tackle in open space. As great as Adams has been, he's been one of the worst tacklers on this team. Which is fine, he's a FS.

But at some point you need a guy who can tackle and hit, like Eric Reed or Deone Bucannon. That's what Landry was supposed to be but he couldn't tackle or cover. We essentially have four FS on the 53.

Plus I don't think a SS has to have top coverage ability. Chancellor is his best when he's in the box or at mid field.

[pgt_rob]

That's what Landry was supposed to be but he couldn't tackle or cover.

 

Ouch.... The person that should remain nameless around here. I still shiver on how terrible of a signing he was. Yikes.

[Exodus]

The safeties are fine. 

 

And Landon Collins can't cover.

I'd rather have a player who can't cover, than a player who never sees the field. Collins has actually produced for NY, has Dorsett for us?

[Mr.Debonair]

How can a guy who barely gets a chance to see the field produce anything? Collins is on the field all the time, Kendricks, Darby etc...

[TKnight24]

I wouldn't say Dorsett is awful, kid has barely been used thanks to Pep. We probably won't see what he's capable off till next year.

Not Dorsett, the pick. I don't mind Dorsett, I mind the pick. First round pick used on your deepest position. That's an awful decision

[Jason_]

+1

 

Completely agree.  Have said that ad nauseam on here.

 

Collins is a 4-3 safety that plays in the box/near the line of scrimmage.  Very solid against the run and his lackluster coverage skills can be masked in the red zone, where the field is shrunk.  He can stay in the game in the red zone though, because of his tackling abilities.

 

He's having success with the Giants because he is the perfect fit for their scheme.  Collins was NOT a perfect fit for the Colts 3-4.

 

I don't know why people don't get that.  Actually, I do. 

 

I don't see how the alignment of the front 7 has anything to do with whether a safety is a good fit for the colts defense or not.  BTW, Collins played at Alabama, a team that largely runs with a 3-4 front.

[chrisfarley]

This has nothing to do with the injuries to Geathers or Adams. But I've come to the conclusion that the Colts don't have any true SS's on the roster. Our guys are really good in coverage and can intercept passes, but they can't tackle at all. Geathers flashes the potential to be a solid tackler, but he's not there yet.

I know Pagano likes them interchangeable but you can't swap 1 guy who can't tackle for another with the same limitation. This team needs a guy who can hit and tackle in the box.

The key word is highlighted above

[Defjamz26]

They key word is highlighted above

I always thought that was weird as well. That he liked them interchangeable. Like, you need a true SS and a true FS. Doesn't mean the FS can't tackle or the SS can't cover or vice versa. It's just that you need one guy who enforces the middle of the field and is a force in the run game, and another guy with range who can sit back deep and stop the long ball.

Pagano's concepts are sometimes head scratchers.

[MPStack]

How can a guy who barely gets a chance to see the field produce anything? Collins is on the field all the time, Kendricks, Darby etc

So this justifies Dorsett being an okay pick and makes more sense than drafting some of the other players I mentioned? Got it!

[BullsColtsFan1]

I think Adams is fine.  I think Geathers should be playing along side of him.  Lowery had a good game against Tenn but that's it.  He can't tackle for crap imo.  I agree we have a problem with out secondary though.  Adams and Davis are fine imo, everyone else not so much.

[MPStack]

I don't see how the alignment of the front 7 has anything to do with whether a safety is a good fit for the colts defense or not.  BTW, Collins played at Alabama, a team that largely runs with a 3-4 front.

Someone did n`t do all their homework. Safety is nowhere near as a difficult change from 4-3 to 3-4 ect, as would a front seven position. Alabama runs a 3-4 defense anyways. He would have been a great addition to our league worst defense.  

[Iancolts]

I wonder if Irsay cleans house can we get anything in return for Dorsett like in a trade. Because we have too many capable WR as it is.

[Jason_]

I wonder if Irsay cleans house can we get anything in return for Dorsett like in a trade. Because we have too many capable WR as it is.

 

no..we don't. 

[aaron11]

well you are right, we dont have a strong safety and that is by design.  the team basically uses them interchangeably

and they are both free safetys

 

 

no..we don't. 

 

yeah too many people swear that we are deep at WR, but its not true at all.  if you can shut down either TY or moncrief you will beat the colts.  so enter dorsett

[ColtStronger]

This has nothing to do with the injuries to Geathers or Adams. But I've come to the conclusion that the Colts don't have any true SS's on the roster. Our guys are really good in coverage and can intercept passes, but they can't tackle at all. Geathers flashes the potential to be a solid tackler, but he's not there yet.

I know Pagano likes them interchangeable but you can't swap 1 guy who can't tackle for another with the same limitation. This team needs a guy who can hit and tackle in the box.

I'm pretty sure Lowry isn't part of that problem.  Making our safties one of our strong points on this team.  Lowry had 2 int's against the Titans, and 1 of which was a pick 6.  Geathers is a rookie, so give him more time, and he will be fine!

[PeterBowman]

Colts S are solid...when healthy and Adams should be back this week.

[Iancolts]

well you are right, we dont have a strong safety and that is by design. the team basically uses them interchangeably

and they are both free safety

yeah too many people swear that we are deep at WR, but its not true at all. if you can shut down either TY or moncrief you will beat the colts. so enter dorsett[/quote

You're right but Johnson was given 21 million for that reason not dorsett. Blame Grigson for bad signings year in and year out!! ]

[Superman]

I'd rather have a player who can't cover, than a player who never sees the field. Collins has actually produced for NY, has Dorsett for us?

 

Yes.

 

Anymore questions?

[Defjamz26]

I'm pretty sure Lowry isn't part of that problem. Making our safties one of our strong points on this team. Lowry had 2 int's against the Titans, and 1 of which was a pick 6. Geathers is a rookie, so give him more time, and he will be fine!

That's my point though. Good pass defense but poor tackling because all our guys are FS that they try and force to be SS, when that's not their game.

Interchangeable shouldn't mean forcing pure FS to play SS on some snaps. It should mean habits true strong and a true free that can swap for situational reasons. I like Geathers but he looks like he'll be a really good pure cover safety right now.

[Superman]

They're fine in coverage. Yes. But not when you ask they to tackle in open space. As great as Adams has been, he's been one of the worst tacklers on this team. Which is fine, he's a FS.

But at some point you need a guy who can tackle and hit, like Eric Reed or Deone Bucannon. That's what Landry was supposed to be but he couldn't tackle or cover. We essentially have four FS on the 53.

Plus I don't think a SS has to have top coverage ability. Chancellor is his best when he's in the box or at mid field.

 

That's ironic, considering how much Chancellor has been torched in coverage so far this season. And we ask our safeties to play more man coverage than the Seahawks do, so the comparison is moot anyways.

 

I'm all for drafting a stud safety prospect, and we still have Geathers who might be pretty good (or might not). But there's nothing wrong with the tandem we have right now.

[RockThatBlue]

I wouldn't say Dorsett is awful, kid has barely been used thanks to Pep. We probably won't see what he's capable off till next year.

Exactly. I don't get how anybody can say he's awful when Pep doesn't put him on the field til the 4th quarter. We barely get to see him play.

[Superman]

42 tackles, INT and five PD on the season. He`s getting better each week. Collins would have been a better pick for the Colts than Dorsett IMO. However, I think Kendricks would have given us that defensive difference maker we needed. Dorsett is no T.Y. 

 

Judging the Dorsett pick makes little sense after 7 games.

 

Independent from Dorsett, Collins would have been a boom or bust pick for us. No question he's a playmaker, but he can't cover, and our safeties have to cover. You can tell me about his stats all day long, but his tape tells a clear story of a player who is deficient in coverage. If you're going to change your scheme and allow him to prowl around, then great, but he isn't a fit with what this staff wants to do.

 

Kendricks was a consensus favorite. Too bad...