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NFL/Patriots Deflategate compromise UPDATE: Pats will not appeal


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It's perfectly possible that Tom did not know that the balls were being deflated after the official check. As I said before, there is nothing wrong with Tom telling his equipment guys to under inflate the balls. The issue only arises if he knew they were doing it AFTER the officials had examined the balls....and that assumption is where there is a lack of proof.

If he didn't know that McNally was doing this after the official check, then he wasn't lying when he said this was the first he heard about it the day after the AFCCG.

You're still saying its ok for him to try and slip one past the refs. It's still cheating!!
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You're still saying its ok for him to try and slip one past the refs. It's still cheating!!

You might be the only one that thinks so. If a ball comes to the refs for clearance and it is a bit below but they don't adjust it, that is on them.

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Neither one of those things is even close to as suspect as the fact that the science doesn't clearly support that any ball tampering happened at all.

1) The Pats claim they didn't tamper with the balls

2) Anderson remembers using the logo gauge to measure the balls

3) The balls measured on that gauge at halftime were within the range that the ideal gas law would predict given the conditions

That anybody would claim that a text from May of 2014 when a guy referred to himself as a suspicious sounding name is enough to outweigh this glaring set of facts pretty much tells you that this is all about "screw the evidence - we hate that these guys win so BURN THE WITCH!".

"screw the evidence - we hate that these guys win so BURN THE WITCH!."

Bad Morty, you couldn't be any further from the truth with this statement. First of all, I do not _hate_ the New England Patriots. Before the Wells report came out, I can't tell you how many times on this forum that I've stated emulating Patriot schematic football was ingenious and what I called, "The New Era of Systematic (Schematic) NFL Football". And, used the New England Patriots as a blueprint for it. I stated on numerous occasions how much and how long the Patriots and Bill Belichick have performed these tactics undaunted by any other team in the NFL. Their scheming and understanding of the game's intricate parts of the game concerning speedy substitutions, versatility, correct positioning of players, coaching, game plans, et.al was/ is /will be a continued force to be reckoned with.

I spoke very highly of your organization on a fair & simple based conclusion of these aspects. For you to come to the Colts forum and start spewing illogical/tainted/one-sidedness to certain individuals is not only ludicrous, but borders on your own hate ... Not Ours!

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Neither one of those things is even close to as suspect as the fact that the science doesn't clearly support that any ball tampering happened at all.

 

1) The Pats claim they didn't tamper with the balls

2) Anderson remembers using the logo gauge to measure the balls

3) The balls measured on that gauge at halftime were within the range that the ideal gas law would predict given the conditions

 

That anybody would claim that a text from May of 2014 when a guy referred to himself as a suspicious sounding name is enough to outweigh this glaring set of facts pretty much tells you that this is all about "screw the evidence - we hate that these guys win so BURN THE WITCH!".

Now that my anger has been kindled from my first reply to you, let's take this opportunity to dice up the 3 above mentioned claims :

"1) The Pats claim they didn't tamper with balls"

So, let's all believe them at their word. Besides, it's only _3_ individuals we're talking about. Brady, McNally, and Jastremski. I'm sure all of those texts back and forth was " just joking around", as Teddy Bruschi puts it. Yeah, right. And the Pope's not Catholic.

"2) Anderson remembers using the logo gauge to measure the balls"

Yeah. Do you remember when, where, and how that occurred? Before the bathroom break or after? Or was it during? Or was it?

"3) The balls measured on that gauge at halftime were within the range that the ideal gas law would predict given the conditions"

The ideal gas law measures at _halftime_? Again, the bathroom break. You know, where the bag of footballs & needle surgery took place with no urinals.

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I think it's simple...the rest of the league has been criticizing Goodell since day 1 for being "Kraft's puppet" and for the unfounded notion that the Patriots are allowed to get away with things other teams get punished for (with no actual proof of this). Goodell has been looking for an opportunity to "prove" that he's not owned by Kraft and the Patriots...hence, an unsubstantiated claim that balls were tampered with to produce a miniscule amount of deflation becomes cause to hand out the harshest penalty in league history to this owner, even though the very report the league paid for made it clear that Kraft and Belichick were completely innocent.

 

Jesus... 

 

!) I've NEVER , EVER heard anyone say or even infer that Goodall let the Pats get away with "things" other teams would be punished for. You totally made that pile of nonsense up.

 

2) The report did say there was zero evidence that Bellichick and Kraft were involved. That doesn't mean that the punishment would be limited to Brady and not the team. He and the equipment men are part of the team and the NE Patriots are responsible for their actions.

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Warning...parody

 

Wanted: Fans for an NFL franchise.

 

The NE Patriots seeks fans who fit our mold. We need you to believe in winning at all costs. No matter what we do, as a fan you need to defend us, even in the face of embarrassing actions that we may be connected with. As we use these illegal behaviors to build a dynasty over time, we want you to make names on sports forums that display our dominance in the league, and make sure to make a signature that lists all those championships we won with our cheating style. But the most important thing is, you need to be blind to the truth, ignore facts, and go out into the sporting world and spread your arrogance amongst the other teams fans. It's not enough that you enjoy our winning at all costs, you need to stick it in the face of all fans you can irritate with it. In the end, it will be worth it, because you can always say ringssss! Don't worry, when it all falls apart, just disappear.

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I agree with 99% of your post, except the "You can't STING and HONEST, INNOCENT person" line.  John DeLorean was a friend of mine and he was the victim of a sting based on mob-like threats against his family.  And he was approached first to do the transaction, he wasn't seeking to do it.  You can sting an honest person, but this wasn't a sting in any way shape or form.  

Sorry, but regardless of the merit of your statement it is so completely inapplicable to this topic it almost seems like a trolling of the point.   You're talking corruption and unless you feel the NFL or organized crime forced Brady to deflate the ball, then it simply isn't comparable.  If someone DID do that, it would be a much much bigger story and would likely end his career more than just the cheating did.  But no organized crime was inferred here.  As for Delorean, if what you say is true, then he wasn't stung, he was unlawfully blackmailed, which is entirely different.  

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That's fine...but just remember exactly what we are talking about here: the pressure in a football. If you want to attach an asterisk to each banner up there, that's you're right. But lets be a little realistic here, too. Are all successes tainted for a team that had a player suspended for using PED's? Are all the championships earned by teams in the past that had players that used stick-em tainted?

Hate the team all you want, call em scumbags if you need to...but just remember what this is all actually about. And judging by the way the league reacted to the initial complaint in the first place and by the way they did nothing but 'warn' other teams that were found to be committing similar offenses and...well...I think maybe some people are overreacting a bit.

It's not about me adding astericks, it's the whole football world outside of NE. Sure it will say you are Champs, but you will never get the respect that the Steelers, 49'ers, or Packers got for their Championships. To most, the Patriot Championships will be like the Barry Bonds home run record. It sits there, but no one thinks it's legitimate.

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Now that my anger has been kindled from my first reply to you, let's take this opportunity to dice up the 3 above mentioned claims :

"1) The Pats claim they didn't tamper with balls"

So, let's all believe them at their word. Besides, it's only _3_ individuals we're talking about. Brady, McNally, and Jastremski. I'm sure all of those texts back and forth was " just joking around", as Teddy Bruschi puts it. Yeah, right. And the Pope's not Catholic.

"2) Anderson remembers using the logo gauge to measure the balls"

Yeah. Do you remember when, where, and how that occurred? Before the bathroom break or after? Or was it during? Or was it?

"3) The balls measured on that gauge at halftime were within the range that the ideal gas law would predict given the conditions"

The ideal gas law measures at _halftime_? Again, the bathroom break. You know, where the bag of footballs & needle surgery took place with no urinals.

It is not worth the time, energy and aggravation to try to reason with the unreasonable. Even if Brady admitted to cheating, some Pats fans would still not believe it or say it really did not make a difference. That is what happened after Lance Armstrong finally fessed up.

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Warning...parody

 

Wanted: Fans for an NFL franchise.

 

The NE Patriots seeks fans who fit our mold. We need you to believe in winning at all costs. No matter what we do, as a fan you need to defend us, even in the face of embarrassing actions that we may be connected with. As we use these illegal behaviors to build a dynasty over time, we want you to make names on sports forums that display our dominance in the league, and make sure to make a signature that lists all those championships we won with our cheating style. But the most important thing is, you need to be blind to the truth, ignore facts, and go out into the sporting world and spread your arrogance amongst the other teams fans. It's not enough that you enjoy our winning at all costs, you need to stick it in the face of all fans you can irritate with it. In the end, it will be worth it, because you can always say ringssss! Don't worry, when it all falls apart, just disappear.

I liked this, then unliked it, just so I could like it again.

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It's not about me adding astericks, it's the whole football world outside of NE. Sure it will say you are Champs, but you will never get the respect that the Steelers, 49'ers, or Packers got for their Championships. To most, the Patriot Championships will be like the Barry Bonds home run record. It sits there, but no one thinks it's legitimate.

 

There probably will be some of that, yes....but people will get over their anger about how the Patriots handled the situation...and as soon as everyone moves on from it and the season starts and things get back to normal, it will fade just like Spygate did. 

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There probably will be some of that, yes....but people will get over their anger about how the Patriots handled the situation...and as soon as everyone moves on from it and the season starts and things get back to normal, it will fade just like Spygate did. 

Until the next time.

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Not to mention Brady was involved in the rule change so that home teams could prepare footballs to their liking.  He clearly has an interest in the composition of the football during games as did the 20 some QBs who signed the petition.  So it was odd to hear in his interview that he wasn't aware of Rule 2 or the minimum inflation levels until 8 years later.   That alone is enough to me that the two ball boys wouldn't have done anything to the footballs without Brady's knowledge.  At the very least, it's more believable that Tom knew what was going on than it is that the two ball boys did this of their own accord without anyone knowing about it.  To me, if they got yelled at for overinflating, they would have gotten yelled at for underinflating it below 12.5 unless that's how Tom wanted it.

You mean to say that 2+2=5? It don't take a rocket scientist to figure out the equipment men do exactly as instructed to do. That is their job. Both had been on the job long enough so they had a routine that they followed. IMO they have been doing it long enough that it was automatic and didn't take long to do. I keep thinking about the huge percentage of not fumbling compared to other teams. I could understand if the numbers were in favor for the Patriots but not to the extent. The graph I seen was astounding in the difference. The backs that were handling the footballs that went to other teams then all of a sudden started being average? :scratch:

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I think it's simple...the rest of the league has been criticizing Goodell since day 1 for being "Kraft's puppet" and for the unfounded notion that the Patriots are allowed to get away with things other teams get punished for (with no actual proof of this). Goodell has been looking for an opportunity to "prove" that he's not owned by Kraft and the Patriots...hence, an unsubstantiated claim that balls were tampered with to produce a miniscule amount of deflation becomes cause to hand out the harshest penalty in league history to this owner, even though the very report the league paid for made it clear that Kraft and Belichick were completely innocent.

Was Kraft innocent of not cooperating with the investigation? Did Kraft have control of his team? I seem to recall a coach getting a 1 year suspension for something his defensive coordinator did without his knowledge. You say the Patriots are penalized much harder than other teams. Check with Payton on that. If I was a Patriot fan I would be relieved that Belichick wasn't suspended for 1 year the same as Payton was. Payton ask why am I being held responsible when I had no clue this was going on. The NFL response was you are responsible for what your team does on your watch. So quit with the belly aching and take your dose of reality.

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You might be the only one that thinks so. If a ball comes to the refs for clearance and it is a bit below but they don't adjust it, that is on them.

But it's the intent of why they got to the refs under inflated is the point. If you knowingly send it under/over inflated in hopes the refs miss it. It's still cheating.

Your thought process isn't just grey, it's wrong. Let me commit a crime and if they don't catch me, it's their fault not mine... are you serious?

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But it's the intent of why they got to the refs under inflated is the point. If you knowingly send it under/over inflated in hopes the refs miss it. It's still cheating.

Your thought process isn't just grey, it's wrong. Let me commit a crime and if they don't catch me, it's their fault not mine... are you serious?

 

Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

 

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

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There probably will be some of that, yes....but people will get over their anger about how the Patriots handled the situation...and as soon as everyone moves on from it and the season starts and things get back to normal, it will fade just like Spygate did. 

Spygate has never faded away. And no, people will not forget that the Patriots didn't cooperate with the NFL. A 1 million dollar fine, 2 drafts pick taken away and a 4 game suspension does not just go away.

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Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

 

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

Why? Because it's your team? It's not a crime? Yes it is in the NFL. A crime is when someone breaks the law. The laws in the NFL are made up of rules and regulations. Break those rules and regulations and do the time and pay the fines.

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Spygate has never faded away. And no, people will not forget that the Patriots didn't cooperate with the NFL. A 1 million dollar fine, 2 drafts pick taken away and a 4 game suspension does not just go away.

 

Sure it has. Even some of the harshest Patriots critics here have said they believed it wasn't the biggest deal in the world and that isn't why they won those championships...this will in time be looked at the same way. Let people 'remember' the Patriots lack of cooperation...the action of football manipulation itself is what the real issue was here and down the line people will know that and it will fade. 15 years from now when the NFL Network is running their 'America's Game' marathon, you think people are gonna sit there during the 2014 episode and say 'hmm yeah they were good but they were arrogant and didn't cooperate'. Heck no. It just wont matter.

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Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

How is out impossible for you to understand that the covert way they went about it and the cover up is the problem.?

They cheated, they lied and then tried to cover it up.

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Sure it has. Even some of the harshest Patriots critics here have said they believed it wasn't the biggest deal in the world and that isn't why they won those championships...this will in time be looked at the same way. Let people 'remember' the Patriots lack of cooperation...the action of football manipulation itself is what the real issue was here and down the line people will know that and it will fade. 15 years from now when the NFL Network is running their 'America's Game' marathon, you think people are gonna sit there during the 2014 episode and say 'hmm yeah they were good but they were arrogant and didn't cooperate'. Heck no. It just wont matter.

Fade like the Bonds homerun record asterisk?

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Why? Because it's your team? It's not a crime? Yes it is in the NFL. A crime is when someone breaks the law. The laws in the NFL are made up of rules and regulations. Break those rules and regulations and do the time and pay the fines.

 

And they will do the time and pay the fines. But where is the consistency of how angry people are being? I mean, It's such a huge 'integrity of the game' issue, right? One guy tried to under inflate balls, one guy likes to over inflate balls...but, and to use your terminology, because 'it's this team'...is that why it's a bigger deal here but not elsewhere?

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15 years from now when the NFL Network is running their 'America's Game' marathon, you think people are gonna sit there during the 2014 episode and say 'hmm yeah they were good but they were arrogant and didn't cooperate.

Yes, although you left out the whole part about them being cheaters, repeat offenders too.

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Sure it has. Even some of the harshest Patriots critics here have said they believed it wasn't the biggest deal in the world and that isn't why they won those championships...this will in time be looked at the same way. Let people 'remember' the Patriots lack of cooperation...the action of football manipulation itself is what the real issue was here and down the line people will know that and it will fade. 15 years from now when the NFL Network is running their 'America's Game' marathon, you think people are gonna sit there during the 2014 episode and say 'hmm yeah they were good but they were arrogant and didn't cooperate'. Heck no. It just wont matter.

 

You can say that but when ESPN makes a documentary on the Patriots run, they will inevitably mention Spygate and Deflategate. Any time they bring up discussions on the major networks about Brady being one of the greats, they will always mention how he was suspended for Deflategate. The sun doesn't cease to exist because you don't want to see it.

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How is out impossible for you to understand that the covert way they went about it and the cover up is the problem.?

They cheated, they lied and then tried to cover it up.

 

And how is it impossible for any of you to understand that I'm focusing on the action itself, not the response of the team in the fallout? The action itself of deflating footballs SHOULD be what people are all upset about, especially when they continually trot out there and talk about the integrity of the game and how trying to get an unfair advantage may compromise that. 

 

Every one of you is focusing on the team lying...but if it's truly about the integrity of the game, then people should be outraged every time the rules are broken intentionally, people should be outraged every time there is in action to gain an unfair advantage...not just this one time because the Patriots tried to hide it. Again...the integrity of the people is NOT the same thing as the integrity of the game...so either be honest about what is actually bothering you guys about all this, or stop using the integrity of the game excuse.

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You can say that but when ESPN makes a documentary on the Patriots run, they will inevitably mention Spygate and Deflategate. Any time they bring up discussions on the major networks about Brady being one of the greats, they will always mention how he was suspended for Deflategate. The sun doesn't cease to exist because you don't want to see it.

 

Yeah it will be mentioned but not dwelled on...that's what I was talking about when I said Spygate has faded away. Sure it's still mentioned, but nobody really cares. It's almost like they throw the line in just to say it and then move on to what they were talking about. 

 

When they have a Top 10 list of quarterbacks, Brady will still be there at the top. They'll trot in one guy that says 'well we had the whole deflating balls thing, but he still won 4 Superbowls' and that will be the end of it. This won't influence the Patriots place in history as much as you all want it to. A bunch of fans will cling to it, but these lists, these records, their place in history...all that will be based on what they accomplished on the field, much like how past scandals don't influence other team's accomplishments either.

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Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

 

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

 

Because he was open about it and admitted to it while on the other hand someone else made a glib joke about a terrorist organisation and bare faced lied in his presser. Yeah I wonder why there's outrage for one and not the other.

 

For the sake of fairness though Rodgers should really be investigated in the same manner. 

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Sure it has. Even some of the harshest Patriots critics here have said they believed it wasn't the biggest deal in the world and that isn't why they won those championships...this will in time be looked at the same way. Let people 'remember' the Patriots lack of cooperation...the action of football manipulation itself is what the real issue was here and down the line people will know that and it will fade. 15 years from now when the NFL Network is running their 'America's Game' marathon, you think people are gonna sit there during the 2014 episode and say 'hmm yeah they were good but they were arrogant and didn't cooperate'. Heck no. It just wont matter.

You are correct. They wont sit there and say 'hmm yeah they were good but were arrogant and didn't cooperate". They will be sitting there saying "they cheated" instead.

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And they will do the time and pay the fines. But where is the consistency of how angry people are being? I mean, It's such a huge 'integrity of the game' issue, right? One guy tried to under inflate balls, one guy likes to over inflate balls...but, and to use your terminology, because 'it's this team'...is that why it's a bigger deal here but not elsewhere?

Repeat offenders is what makes "it's this team".

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Because he was open about it and admitted to it while on the other hand someone else made a glib joke about a terrorist organisation and bare faced lied in his presser. Yeah I wonder why there's outrage for one and not the other.

 

For the sake of fairness though Rodgers should really be investigated in the same manner. 

 

I understand everyone's comments about because the Patriots didn't admit anything and went on this charade that's why it blew up, but like your last sentence, my only question is why, if it truly truly truly is about the integrity of the game, is there little to no concern over Rodgers comments about what he does with the balls?

 

There just seems to be this disconnect about whether or not people really are upset about the integrity of the game being compromised, or if that is just a talking point because the anger is legit coming just from the way the situation was handled by the Patriots..because the lack of consistency between how the league and therefor the fans look at situations that any reasonable person would agree also compromise the integrity of the game is a bit odd to me and I find it a bit disingenuous.

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I understand everyone's comments about because the Patriots didn't admit anything and went on this charade that's why it blew up, but like your last sentence, my only question is why, if it truly truly truly is about the integrity of the game, is there little to no concern over Rodgers comments about what he does with the balls?

 

There just seems to be this disconnect about whether or not people really are upset about the integrity of the game being compromised, or if that is just a talking point because the anger is legit coming just from the way the situation was handled by the Patriots..because the lack of consistency between how the league and therefor the fans look at situations that any reasonable person would agree also compromise the integrity of the game is a bit odd to me and I find it a bit disingenuous.

Once again you bring up what another team and or player did. I have a question for you. When and where in your life has everything been fair? Life is not fair and if you keep using that as an excuse to rectify your teams wrong doing in your mind then maybe you need a dose of reality.

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There probably will be some of that, yes....but people will get over their anger about how the Patriots handled the situation...and as soon as everyone moves on from it and the season starts and things get back to normal, it will fade just like Spygate did.

Spygate and Deflategate will not fade any more than the Black Sox scandal almost 100 years ago. As a matter of fact , they are working on a new movie about the Patriots called, " Field of Schemes." !

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I understand everyone's comments about because the Patriots didn't admit anything and went on this charade that's why it blew up, but like your last sentence, my only question is why, if it truly truly truly is about the integrity of the game, is there little to no concern over Rodgers comments about what he does with the balls?

 

There just seems to be this disconnect about whether or not people really are upset about the integrity of the game being compromised, or if that is just a talking point because the anger is legit coming just from the way the situation was handled by the Patriots..because the lack of consistency between how the league and therefor the fans look at situations that any reasonable person would agree also compromise the integrity of the game is a bit odd to me and I find it a bit disingenuous.

 

While I understand your point.. one wrong doesn't justify another. 

 

Forget what everyone else is doing, take responsibility for your own actions. I'm not even talking just the Pats organisation here, I'm talking the fans too. I'm amazed at how many are now turning against Kraft for not appealing... When you see people saying "I'm done with this team" because Kraft (finally) has tried to bring some sanity to these proceedings you really have to just sit quietly in sheer amazement in the spoilt attitude some people show. 

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Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

"The over reaction to this is just crazy."

How do you overreact against cheating and lying, exactly? Oh yeah, you go onto other NFL forums and spew mud. After all, it's the Patriotic thing to do, isn't it ?

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Well then Aaron Rodgers cheated too. Where's that outrage?

 

We aren't talking about committing a crime...jesus...put it into the sports context that it actually is. Players in every sport try to get every advantage they can...its always been that way and always will be. The over reaction to this is just crazy.

Oh he did?  I must have missed that.  Was he fined?  suspended?  Did he take balls into the bathroom too?

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Once again you bring up what another team and or player did. I have a question for you. When and where in your life has everything been fair? Life is not fair and if you keep using that as an excuse to rectify your teams wrong doing in your mind then maybe you need a dose of reality.

 

I AM NOT USING WHAT ANOTHER TEAM DID AS AN EXCUSE TO JUSTIFY WHAT MY TEAM DID. GET THAT THROUGH YOUR HEAD. I AM SIMPLY WONDERING WHERE THE CONSISTENCY IS IN TERMS OF HOW THE NFL AND THE FANS VIEW WHAT COMPROMISES THE INTEGRITY OF THE GAME. 

 

That's a perfectly reasonable thing to question. I am not calling for an investigation of anyone else, I am not asking the league to punish anyone else, I am only asking why the NFL seems only sometimes concerned with the integrity of the game, when that terminology has been hammered over our heads as the center point to any discussion about this situation. 

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Every one of you is focusing on the team lying...but if it's truly about the integrity of the game, then people should be outraged every time the rules are broken intentionally, 

They had to act in a fraudulent and covert manner to get the balls to below the threshold, now didn't they?  You're trying to draw a line between the lie and the air pressure and it's just not possible.

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Spygate and Deflategate will not fade any more than the Black Sox scandal almost 100 years ago. As a matter of fact , they are working on a new movie about the Patriots called, " Field of Schemes." !

 

Clever...but very different situations. I believe it is your HOPE that it will be compared to the Black Sox scandal...but nobody here conspired to fix games, nobody here has been banned from football for life...it just doesn't have the same sticking power that the black sox scandal had.

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It's not about me adding astericks, it's the whole football world outside of NE. Sure it will say you are Champs, but you will never get the respect that the Steelers, 49'ers, or Packers got for their Championships. To most, the Patriot Championships will be like the Barry Bonds home run record. It sits there, but no one thinks it's legitimate.

 

I'm sure it feels good to think this given your team's struggles against the Patriots...but you are simply not correct about it. Belichick will be a first ballot hall of famer. Brady will be a first ballot hall of famer, and 20 years from now, the NFL network will be running tribute videos of the "Great Patriots Dynasty" just like they run them now for their past great champions. Sure - a few angry shut-ins may still be shaking their fist at the tv and incoherently screaming "Bu-bu- SPYGATE!! DEFLATEGATE!!!!!"....but that's the extent of it.

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    • I'm good with picking up the option. I kind of agree a little with Ballard that there is more upside to Paye on passing downs. He is a good athlete and he has improved each season. Important that he says healthy, he was quite a raw prospect coming out of college and was then injured alot in his first 2 seasons in the NFL. So I can see why Ballard would like him around for another 2 years to see how much they can improve him. He's also an excellent run defender, which is important to note, especially in that LDE role.
    • Doug….   I’ve just read your latest two posts.   And as has been the recent trend, I don’t understand your logic.   So I’ve got a long post to respond to your long post.    So let me ask you an important question:     Have you noticed in the last month or so that I am responding to your posts very slowly?   I’m taking 8, 10, even 12 hours to respond.    I’m doing it deliberately.  I don’t want us to be going back and forth and back and forth while we’re both awake.  I’m trying to slow the pace of communication so things don’t get heated.  So I’m not trying to pick a fight,  I’m trying to AVOID a fight.   As to your two posts….   I think your memory is playing tricks with you.  Ballard said “let’s take the wide receiver” this draft for Mitchell.  His quote in 2022 after the Colts had no pick in the first round was this…. “Tomorrow,  wide receiver, tight end, tackle, and safety or corner.”   What did Ballard do?   He took those 4 positions in that order.  But not until he had traded DOWN from 35 to 53 for Pierce.   That was Reich’s personal pick.  Ballard was confident the players would be there and they were.   Not possible if everyone has same info as you assert.    Do you remember the 2019 draft when Ballard took Rock, Benagu, Campbell, and Okereke on Day 2,  that was the first year of the popular video series and the most memorable sound was Frank going around the war room high fiving everyone yelling “Four for Four!  Four for Four!”   Those were the guys Frank wanted, those were the guys Ballard got him.   Not possible if every team sees things the same.    The story of the 21 draft was the Colts picking 21.  And Ballard telling the scouts he had a good feeling that Paye, who the Colts ranked 10th on their board, would fall to the Colts.   And he did.   Ballard thought Dayo would fall to pick 54, and he said he likely would’ve taken Dayo at 21 if Paye had been taken.  Ballard was right again.   And again, not possible if everyone sees things the same.    Historically speaking…. In 2012, Seattle had Russell Wilson ranked THIRD on their board.  But they waited to draft him at pick 75 because they thought at 5’10” and 5/8ths,  RW would still be there.  And he was.   That wouldn’t be possible if everyone had mostly similar rankings as you believe.  As for Reimann:  picked 77.  You talk about his value as a left tackle.  Yet he lasted to pick 77.   Any other team could’ve taken him before the Colts did.   They didn’t.  Yet you think it has nothing to do with his age.  I don’t understand the logic you use to reject the age argument.   I don’t see an alternative view that makes sense.    All of these are examples of teams seeing the same thing differently.  They value things differently.  When asked recently, Steichen said he valued quickness in a wide receiver.  For other teams they might value speed, or precision route running.   Every team has its own identity based on what they value.    GMs are different.  Head coaches are different.  Scouts are different.   They are NOT working with the same information.  Every team has their own Big Board and the differences are big, not small.  32 teams, 32 very very different looking boards.     I’m 67.  I have literally studied the draft for more than 50 years.   The draft has always been a passion of mine, even before I became a TV sports producer at age 23.   I’m not making this up.     This post could be longer, but I think it’s gone long enough.  There was much to talk about.   Thanks for reading.               
    • Next year imagine the Colts will be looking at 2 QBs.  My top dual threat/mobile pocket passers are Jalen Milroe, Grayson McCall, and KJ Jefferson.   For offensive lineman got to love LT Kelvin Banks Jr who managed to hold his own versus Will Anderson a few years ago and LG Donovan Jackson.  Jackson has generated all-conference honors the past two seasons; Nelson's contract expires at the end of 2026 where he will be 30 years old.   So far for running backs I like Treveyon Henderson, DJ Giddens, and Kyle Monangai.  Each back knows how to secure the rock.  Last I checked both Dalvin Cook and Damien Harris are still free agents that would improve our roster.   Not sure if we need a top talented wide receiver early but am interested in Tre Harris and Ricky White.  While De'Corian Clark been compared to Alec Pierce and made Bruce Feldman's Freak list.  Still need to see where his high school numbers would have ranked compared to this year's draft class.     Plenty of defensive lineman to like in the next draft and probably one of the best groups coming out.   Edge Princely Umanmielen - one I feel is a fit for the Colts Edge Jack Sawyer is another stud that I want to pair with Latu and Paye Edge James Pearce Jr. DT 3-tech Tyleik Williams Edge/DL Mykel Willaims - as a freshman led all FBS true freshman edge defenders LDT Kenneth Grant NT/DT Walter Nolan Edge Dani Dennis-Sutton Edge Landon Jackson Edge Patrick Payton Edge Tyler Baron DL Shermar Turner - been one of the more disruptive DTs in the SEC.  Has a quick first step and body control to shoot the gaps. NT/DT Tonka Hemingway Edge Jasheen Davis NT/DT Alfred Collins. Linebackers got an interesting group of prospects to keep an eye on from the following: WLB Jack Kiser WLB Danny Stutsman LB Dasan McCullough MLB/OLB Jay Higgins LB/Edge Collin Oliver LB Eugene Asante SLB/Edge Khordae Sydnor LB Keaten Wade LB/Edge Steve Linton WLB Eric Gentry Read where some say this is a very weak safety class but got a few that seem to have potential.  This draft class I noticed more excel in press/man more than zone but still very capable of playing both.  Some of the defensive backs I like so far are: LCB Will Johnson CB Benjamin Morrison CB Ricardo Hallman SS Kevin Winston Jr - Blackmon signed a 1-year deal but only a 2% missed tackle rate and ranked 2nd among all safeties in 2023. SS Xavier Nwankpa - 4.39s-forty speed reminds me of Nick Cross FS Rod Moore - excellent 4.40s-forty speed FS Hunter Wohler - slower 4.52s-forty speed, if can improve his speed might be better than Rod Moore CB Tacario Davis CB Maxwell Hairston FS Jahdae Barron CB Jacobee Bryant CB Jordan Hancock CB Denver Harris SS Keon Sabb CB Malik Spencer CB Aydan White CB Tommi Hill - In 2023 had an outstanding QB rating when targeted of 38.6.  With another solid year Hill could move up the draft boards. Still on the lookout of those players not listed on the primary draft boards that the Colts always seem to find hidden gems to draft.
    • This is the list of Retired Colts Numbers. Peyton Manning — No. 18 Johnny Unitas — No. 19 Buddy Young — No. 22 Lenny Moore — No. 24 Art Donovan — No. 70 Jim Parker — No. 77 Raymond Berry — No. 82 Gino Marchetti — No. 89
    • a lot of the recent super bowl winners had game changing tight ends bowers would have been a nice addition but i like who we got, imo an a plus draft  
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