Roster moves

[John Hammonds]

41 minutes ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Can you name a few?

Yes, I'll name 5th-7th rounders that we've been trying to rely on

(Granted, some have actually panned out.  Others, not so much)

2017 round 5 - LB Anthony Walker

2018 round 7 - LB Zaire Franklin

2019 round 5 - LB E J Speed

2019 round 5 - DB Marvell Tell

2020 round 5 - OL Danny Pinter

2020 round 6 - CB Isaiah Rodgers

2020 round 6 - WR Dezmon Patmon

2021 round 7 - OL Will Fries

2022 round 6 - TE Andrew Ogletree

2022 round 7 - DB Rodney Thomas

2023 round 7 - CB Jaylon Jones

[cdgacoltsfan]

5 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Yes, I'll name 5th-7th rounders that we've been trying to rely on

(Granted, some have actually panned out.  Others, not so much)

2017 round 5 - LB Anthony Walker

2018 round 7 - LB Zaire Franklin

2019 round 5 - LB E J Speed

2019 round 5 - DB Marvell Tell

2020 round 5 - OL Danny Pinter

2020 round 6 - CB Isaiah Rodgers

2020 round 6 - WR Dezmon Patmon

2021 round 7 - OL Will Fries

2022 round 6 - TE Andrew Ogletree

2022 round 7 - DB Rodney Thomas

2023 round 7 - CB Jaylon Jones

So..Tell and Patmon were wiffs. The others are good players. Youre not proving your point.

[John Hammonds]

1 minute ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

So..Tell and Patmon were wiffs. The others are good players. Youre not proving your point.

I think the other poster's point was, in effect, why are we relying on 5th-7th rounders when we really ought to be relying on 1st-3rd rounders.

[Defjamz26]

4 hours ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Remember when Ballard went out and got Rodney McLeod because cross was a rookie. He ended up being the starter. We need more of that.

He does that. He goes out and gets vets that outplay his draft picks (as they should) and then inexplicably gets rid of them. Not only did he do that with McLeod, but he did it with Gilmore. He was great for his and then he traded him to Dallas and said it was basically because of his age, which was nonsense. He’s still playing now and we don’t have any corners as good as him.

 

TBH I’m starting to think it’s an ego thing with Ballard. It’s like aside from Buckner, he wants to win with only his “guys”. Players that he drafted or signed as UDFA’s and developed. Remember he hit with Autry and then let him walk and FA and rolled with Paye, Banogu, Turray and Dayo (who was injured)? 
 

If you look at our 53 man roster before week 1, the only players on the time that weren’t drafted/signed as UDFAs by us were Buckner, Raekwon Davis, Taven Bryan, Matt Gaye, Ebukam, and Samuel Womack.

 

It seems like he wants to be the smartest guy in the room by trying to show he can re-invent the wheel by just having a team full of drafted and developed players where his FA spending is just him going out and re-signing his own guys. I honestly think his long term goal is to have an entire 53 man roster of just Colts drafted and signed players. Thats why he’s hesitant to bring anyone in and keeps just hyping up the young players.

[lester]

7 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

I think the other poster's point was, in effect, why are we relying on 5th-7th rounders when we really ought to be relying on 1st-3rd rounders.

 

Didn't we also draft 1st and 3rd rounders in those drafts?

 

I think we did and they are generally people we all like, too.

[cdgacoltsfan]

8 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

I think the other poster's point was, in effect, why are we relying on 5th-7th rounders when we really ought to be relying on 1st-3rd rounders.

How many teams have exclusively 1-3 rounders as starters?

[GoColts8818]

10 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

I think the other poster's point was, in effect, why are we relying on 5th-7th rounders when we really ought to be relying on 1st-3rd rounders.

Because the whole roster can’t be 1st-3rd rounders.  You have to find hidden gems.  

[John Hammonds]

1 minute ago, GoColts8818 said:

Because the whole roster can’t be 1st-3rd rounders.  You have to find hidden gems.  

Ok, I'm backing out of this one.  This was @jbaron04's point that he was making.  All I did was answer the question "Name me one" 5th-7th round player we were attempting to rely on.  I'll let him make his own arguments.

[GoColts8818]

4 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Ok, I'm backing out of this one.  This was @jbaron04's point that he was making.  All I did was answer the question "Name me one" 5th-7th round player we were attempting to rely on.  I'll let him make his own arguments.

It’s fine those are all names but when most of them have gone on to be good players it doesn’t exactly help the point.  I’d also say it was different if Ballard had drafted nothing but busts in rounds 1-3 but he hasn’t.  Yes he’s had misses, every GM does, but he’s had some massive hits too.  I think Ballard flaw is that pretty much avoids free agency like the plague.  Even Polian, the ultimate build through the draft guy, used off-season free agency more than Ballard does.

[cdgacoltsfan]

2 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Ok, I'm backing out of this one.  This was @jbaron04's point that he was making.  All I did was answer the question "Name me one" 5th-7th round player we were attempting to rely on.  I'll let him make his own arguments.

Actually, the Colts starting O is comprised of 1-3 round draft picks other than RG and TE

[Zoltan]

So they made room for 2 spots on the active roster, with Fries to IR and waiving Flowers. Who is going to take those spots will they elevate from practice squad or bring someone in from FA.

[GoColts8818]

1 minute ago, Zoltan said:

So they made room for 2 spots on the active roster, with Fries to IR and waiving Flowers. Who is going to take those spots will they elevate from practice squad or bring someone in from FA.

Unsure yet.  If Kelly can play Sunday they might need an end more than another olineman.  So they could be waiting to see how injuries shake out or Ballard could be working on something else.

[Solid84]

43 minutes ago, John Hammonds said:

Yes, I'll name 5th-7th rounders that we've been trying to rely on

(Granted, some have actually panned out.  Others, not so much)

2017 round 5 - LB Anthony Walker

2018 round 7 - LB Zaire Franklin

2019 round 5 - LB E J Speed

2019 round 5 - DB Marvell Tell

2020 round 5 - OL Danny Pinter

2020 round 6 - CB Isaiah Rodgers

2020 round 6 - WR Dezmon Patmon

2021 round 7 - OL Will Fries

2022 round 6 - TE Andrew Ogletree

2022 round 7 - DB Rodney Thomas

2023 round 7 - CB Jaylon Jones

Only "good" player there is Fries, the rest are average or worse.

[AustexColt]

We lost but that does not bother me because we scored 34 points. We do have an offense. Game was competitive. Steichen is learning as well.

 

Defense is the weak link and that is not new for the Colts fan. Maybe Steichen has awaken to replacing Gus Bradley as DC. At this stage Jim Irsay will NEVER see another Super Bowl ring. 

 

 

[OLD FAN MAN]

4 hours ago, tweezy32 said:

our whole secondary is dookie. Not surprised in the slightest. Wonder why everyone was bashing Ballard for not signing free agent secondary in the offseason..

looks like the so called forum gms were right about the corners

[dw49]

3 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

looks like the so called forum gms were right about the corners

 

We did lose our #1 CB....

[OLD FAN MAN]

33 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Because the whole roster can’t be 1st-3rd rounders.  You have to find hidden gems.  

the elite teams dont just rely on the draft

[holeymoley99]

Hate that I was right on Flowers injury, have a nice debate during the summer saying he would not start over Jones and if his speed was compromised he wouldnt have a job as a returner. Then we signed Womack who is a better player then Long who is a much better and experienced player. Many of us had call for some vet additions at corner and we got them in Womack and Long (Not who we wanted when talking names but good solid players). I hope Dallis gets back to ps and hope his speed returns but not sure it will.

[holeymoley99]

27 minutes ago, Zoltan said:

So they made room for 2 spots on the active roster, with Fries to IR and waiving Flowers. Who is going to take those spots will they elevate from practice squad or bring someone in from FA.

Buckner and Lewis eventually for this week David Long (He will be on squad rest of season barring injury) and maybe Mafi.

[Defjamz26]

11 minutes ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

looks like the so called forum gms were right about the corners

It’s the whole secondary. Cross has played well but it’s not like he’s Derwin James out there. Also Blackmon hasn’t played well, but I’m not surprised. But this is the issue with the secondary:

 

JuJu Brents-2nd round pick

Jaylon Jones- 7th round pick

Nick Cross-3rd round pick

Julian Blackmon-3rd round pick

Rodney Thomas- 7the round pick

Womack-5th round pick

Chris Lammons- UDFA

Trevor Denbow- UDFA

 

 

[BeanDiasucci]

27 minutes ago, dw49 said:

 

We did lose our #1 CB....

Who the "forum gms" said was injury prone and needed real competition or a good backup.

[chad72]

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

It’s the whole secondary. Cross has played well but it’s not like he’s Derwin James out there. Also Blackmon hasn’t played well, but I’m not surprised. But this is the issue with the secondary:

 

JuJu Brents-2nd round pick

Jaylon Jones- 7th round pick

Nick Cross-3rd round pick

Julian Blackmon-3rd round pick

Rodney Thomas- 7the round pick

Womack-5th round pick

Chris Lammons- UDFA

Trevor Denbow- UDFA

 

 

It’s definitely coaching, IMO. Otherwise how did the Chiefs develop Sneed to be an All Pro as a 4th rounder, and outside McDuffie that’s a 1st rounder, their CBs and safeties in Bryan Cook, Chamarri Conner, Joshua Williams and Jaylen Watson all drafted Round 2 or later with

 

In fact Cook is the ONLY 2nd rounder from the above list and the rest Rounds 4 or later. They have Jaden Hicks waiting in the wings as a 4th rounder for safety.

[Happy2BeHere]

We can’t fill the roster spots until flowers signs with another team so that Ballard can trade a 6th round pick to re-acquire him and say he fleeced the other team.  

[tdblue17]

Whatever happened to Darrell Baker Jr? He was the one CB during the preseason and training camp that stood out but surprisingly did not make final cuts. I believe Venturi was very high on him. Makes you question the evaluation process. Ballards CB draft picks have a horrible history. That’s where the lack of using free agency to fix misses has cost the Colts. 

[holeymoley99]

1 hour ago, tdblue17 said:

Whatever happened to Darrell Baker Jr? He was the one CB during the preseason and training camp that stood out but surprisingly did not make final cuts. I believe Venturi was very high on him. Makes you question the evaluation process. Ballards CB draft picks have a horrible history. That’s where the lack of using free agency to fix misses has cost the Colts. 

Baker was bad last year and think that left a bad taste that was hard to cleanse, signed with Tenn and we may see him a bit this week but he has only played 25 snaps for them on D, though 65 on st.

[Defjamz26]

3 hours ago, chad72 said:

It’s definitely coaching, IMO. Otherwise how did the Chiefs develop Sneed to be an All Pro as a 4th rounder, and outside McDuffie that’s a 1st rounder, their CBs and safeties in Bryan Cook, Chamarri Conner, Joshua Williams and Jaylen Watson all drafted Round 2 or later with

 

In fact Cook is the ONLY 2nd rounder from the above list and the rest Rounds 4 or later. They have Jaden Hicks waiting in the wings as a 4th rounder for safety.

Coaching is awful and the actual talent we have is awful. Both of these things can be simultaneously true.

Sneed is an exception to the rule, not the rule. The other top corners in the league are Surtain, Ramsey, Sauce, A.J. Terell, Jaire Alexander, Humphrey, and Marshon Lattimore. All are 1st round draft picks.

[rockywoj]

7 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

Very Interesting. Matt Gay was limping on the sidelines and very few of us trust Gay to make big kicks 

 

Man, even most of his extra point La this past week looked dangerously close to being missed.  How hard is it to split the uprights down the middle from such close range.  Kind of sucks that even for short kicks become hold your breath plays. lol

[ColtStrong2013]

6 hours ago, AustexColt said:

At this stage Jim Irsay will NEVER see another Super Bowl ring

bro… at this stage Jim might not see this year’s Super Bowl… cmon

[NewColtsFan]

11 hours ago, RollerColt said:

Yep. In typical fashion people leave the Colts and then proceed to do better elsewhere. 
 

Hell even Grigson is thriving as an executive of player personnel in Minnesota. Go figure. 

Who are we talking about?    
 

Off the top of my head and the only two I can think of are Autry and Houston.  And that was due to the first year if Covid and the salary cap didn’t go up as scheduled — it went down.   I think roughly $18-20 mill.  
 

Who else?   I’m curious who you think.  

[RollerColt]

5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Who are we talking about?    
 

Off the top of my head and the only two I can think of are Autry and Houston.  And that was due to the first year if Covid and the salary cap didn’t go up as scheduled — it went down.   I think roughly $18-20 mill.  
 

Who else?   I’m curious who you think.  

Disclaimer for the good of the court:

 

My comment was not a slight on the Colts, nor the GM or even the players. In fact my observation was more of a thought of how we are generally good at finding talented players and people. Just for whatever reason things don’t work out in the macro sense for the team overall (winning the division, making the playoffs etc). 

 

I was also thinking Okereke and Adams who are both with the Giants more recently. Rock-Ya-Sin has had a nice career. 
 

Historically Faulk left and was able to win a ring. Steve Wright was able to have success after leaving. John Williams went to the Rams. Tim Jennings went to the Bears.
 

Even Peyton was able to play some of his best while in Denver (2 Super Bowl runs in 4 years). 
 

There’s more. If I have some extra time I’ll do some research.

[jbaron04]

15 hours ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Can you name a few?

Name a few players ? It’s easy to do in hindsight. But what I mean is trade some picks to move up and take a swing to get guys. Like 6-7 round picks ain’t gonna bring us a superbowl . Hitting on top picks is what will and smart use of FA 

[Archer]

12 hours ago, tdblue17 said:

Whatever happened to Darrell Baker Jr? He was the one CB during the preseason and training camp that stood out but surprisingly did not make final cuts. I believe Venturi was very high on him. Makes you question the evaluation process. Ballards CB draft picks have a horrible history. That’s where the lack of using free agency to fix misses has cost the Colts. 

Yeah, that was the biggest mistake of the cutdown to 53.  Baker was ten times as deserving of a roster spot than Flowers based on this year’s TC and PS.  CB musta thought Flowers would get his explosion back as the year went on…

[Defjamz26]

29 minutes ago, Archer said:

Yeah, that was the biggest mistake of the cutdown to 53.  Baker was ten times as deserving of a roster spot than Flowers based on this year’s TC and PS.  CB musta thought Flowers would get his explosion back as the year went on…

I think all of our corners are bad with Jones being the best out of that bad group, but I would agree that Baker was better than Flowers and Lammons. But even still, we’re splitting hairs when we say “better”. I mean maybe Baker doesn’t give up the TD to Thomas, but he took his lumps last season too. Idk the secondary was just a big “you know what” show in general. Bunch of replacement level players all competing against each other in camp, with no real veterans to challenge anyone.

[ProblChld32]

On 10/7/2024 at 3:09 PM, richard pallo said:

I think the defense can be improved significantly by letting Womack and Jones play more press coverage.  They are both very good at it.  Womack said press is where he is strongest.  Jones has shown he is good at it.  Moore can play it too.  No more playing off the majority of the time.  We have the corners who can play it.  Make the switch Gus.  Let the players play to their strengths.  I think it would make a difference.

Before the season started I mentioned that press was a strong suit of Jones and I said that Gus needs to allow him to get into the WR face at the LOS. I don’t know why he isn’t playing to these players strengths. Too many free releases and cushion coverages.

[holeymoley99]

On 10/7/2024 at 7:05 PM, holeymoley99 said:

Buckner and Lewis eventually for this week David Long (He will be on squad rest of season barring injury) and maybe Mafi.

And Long was elevated today to the 53.....

[Dobbinblitz]

On 10/7/2024 at 7:10 PM, Defjamz26 said:

It’s the whole secondary. Cross has played well but it’s not like he’s Derwin James out there. Also Blackmon hasn’t played well, but I’m not surprised. But this is the issue with the secondary:

 

JuJu Brents-2nd round pick

Jaylon Jones- 7th round pick

Nick Cross-3rd round pick

Julian Blackmon-3rd round pick

Rodney Thomas- 7the round pick

Womack-5th round pick

Chris Lammons- UDFA

Trevor Denbow- UDFA

 

 

A scenario like this is where I believe Ballard should have signed some veteran help and let the young players grow and develop into starters. These players are not first round caliber plug and play starters in most cases.

 

it also creates a situation where the team has significant depth issues when a “starter” goes down. The result is you are left with giving significant playing time to guys like Baker and Flowers to the detriment of the team.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

3 minutes ago, Dobbinblitz said:

A scenario like this is where I believe Ballard should have signed some veteran help and let the young players grow and develop into starters. These players are not first round caliber plug and play starters in most cases.

 

it also creates a situation where the team has significant depth issues when a “starter” goes down. The result is you are left with giving significant playing time to guys like Baker and Flowers to the detriment of the team.

This is 100% correct. He has done if with the line  backing group.

 

Cross is a different story because he is in year 3 and he is just now starting.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Kevin Bowen said it well. For every rookie there should be a vet.

[csmopar]

On 10/7/2024 at 6:00 PM, John Hammonds said:

Yes, I'll name 5th-7th rounders that we've been trying to rely on

(Granted, some have actually panned out.  Others, not so much)

2017 round 5 - LB Anthony Walker

2018 round 7 - LB Zaire Franklin

2019 round 5 - LB E J Speed

2019 round 5 - DB Marvell Tell

2020 round 5 - OL Danny Pinter

2020 round 6 - CB Isaiah Rodgers

2020 round 6 - WR Dezmon Patmon

2021 round 7 - OL Will Fries

2022 round 6 - TE Andrew Ogletree

2022 round 7 - DB Rodney Thomas

2023 round 7 - CB Jaylon Jones

Well i count only 3 on that list that haven’t turned into at least serviceable starters. Which is pretty good for 5-7 rounders

[CS Coltsfan]

Why don't they bring back Micah Abrahams who they liked during Training Camp... said he was a ballhawk... can't get anyworse than what we have??