Damning Reports on the Colts Organizational Moves!

[NewColtsFan]

8 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

“Frank doesn’t fire anyone.”  “That’s not how he operates.”  Ummm.  It sounds like Frank would never fire anyone unless he was for forced to.  Not a great characteristic you would want in a head coach imo.  

Not a great characteristic in an owner either.    You forgot to mention that. 

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, philba101 said:

Here are the highlights or more accurately the lowlights of new articles from Jason La Canfora of the Washington Post and Jeff Howe of the Athletic. The articles detail the reactions from around the league and from within the Colts locker room on the firing of Frank Reich and the hiring of Jeff Saturday.  The reactions are not good. Some quotes are long but worth the read.

 

1. The determination made by some NFL general managers, executives and player agents this week, many of whom reached out to me before I could even solicit their thoughts on the Colts’ owner. Irsay’s decision to fire coach Frank Reich — a man with a winning record (40-33-1) despite perpetual mismanagement of the quarterback position by the front office and a new opening day starter all five years on the job — and replace him with former center Jeff Saturday — who has no coaching experience above the high school level (even those results were spotty) and no real ambition to coach in the NFL (by his own admission) — was bizarre, stupefying and largely without precedent. (La Canfora)

 

2. NFL execs bewildered by Colts’ hiring of Jeff Saturday: ‘Crazy,’ ‘Never seen anything like it, will never see anything like it again’-(Howe). 

 

2. “Frank never wanted to change QBs, and if he was forced to do it and it was up to him, he would have gone to [veteran Nick] Foles,” said a longtime confidant of Reich’s who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to reveal their private conversation. Reich “knew Ehlinger wasn’t ready to play. He would never fire Marcus Brady like that. Frank doesn’t fire anyone. That’s not how he operates. This is all Irsay. Frank will take the high road, and he won’t say anything about it. But that’s how it went down.”(La Canfora)

 

3. One NFL general manager with ties to several key members of the Colts’ staff said in the immediate aftermath of Reich’s firing Monday — but before Saturday had been named the replacement — that the moves were “all premeditated. The owner is already on to next year. It’s already about next year. He’s tanking for a QB. It was obvious when he benched a $30 million guy for a guy who can’t play. That’s what this is about.” (La Canfora)

 

4. Ryan and other veteran players were irate when informed of the decision by General Manager Chris Ballard, who told them this came directly from the owner, according to multiple individuals who discussed this with Colts players but were not authorized to speak for them. Several players said privately they did not want to play there anymore; Irsay waited until after the trade deadline to pull this trick. (La Canfora)

 

5. “I’ve talked to coaches there, and they are all like, ‘What the f--- just happened?” said an individual who has worked with members of the Colts’ staff and remains in close contact with them but who spoke on the condition of anonymity when discussing private conversations. Irsay “had three guys he could have promoted who could have done the job, and he hires a guy off his couch from ESPN? Trust me, inside that building they know this is an absolute waterfall of s---. The coaches and players know this is a total tank job. That’s what they’re all talking about.”(La Canfora) 

 

5. Not surprisingly, Saturday had great difficulty finding anyone willing to take over as offensive coordinator and call plays Sunday against the Las Vegas Raiders. His top pick, quarterbacks coach Scott Milanovich (like Reich, a former University of Maryland standout), turned it down, according to individuals with knowledge of the situation. The newbie finally settled on another novice to give it a shot: Parks Frazier, the Colts’ 30-year-old assistant quarterbacks coach, who has no history running an offense. (La Canfora)

 

6. “Jeff has a huge problem with that staff already,” said one longtime agent who has discussed the matter with Colts players and coaches. “The owner just threw that staff completely under the bus. He could have helped Jeff if he handled it the right way, but Irsay completely butchered this. Everything he said was a smack in the face to the coaching profession in many ways. His comments were atrocious to the coaching fraternity, and now Jeff is supposed to be their boss. I don’t see how that’s supposed to work.” (La Canfora).

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2022/11/09/jim-irsay-jeff-saturday-colts/

https://theathletic.com/3773792/2022/11/08/colts-jeff-saturday-jim-irsay-frank-reich/

 

 

 

 

Jason La Canfora of the Washington Post and Jeff Howe of the Athletic...

lol.. nah...

And WAPO and The Athletic... nah...

 

Irsay has goofed many times in the past, including the last two years... but those two guys ignored his previous goofs... 

Now they are begging for clicks... with "sources"... 

 

 

[jchandler7]

4 minutes ago, buccolts said:

I have few doubts there's at least some truth to these stories, but it's 2 - 3 days in, so there's also a lot of raw and over reaction, much like this board.

 

Sunday's game, the body language, the effort, will be telling.

I agree, Sunday's game against the Raiders will be very telling. I have not seen any life/excitement out of this team on the sidelines or the field all season. 

Nobody initially likes big changes/shakeups no matter what profession. I have 0 doubt there are some upset players & coaches. But, with sports, winning cures all.

Win a few games this season, hire a head coach, draft a franchise QB, sign/draft couple OL and boom all is well again. 

 

[aReggie7]

La Canfora certainly isn't known to be reliable with information. 

 

However, I don't think we need his "reporting" or "sources" to know that the reaction to the way this week went down has been negative. Who didn't go wth when it was announced that Saturday was hired? 

 

IMO there is no way this week was a positive for the Colts in terms of outside perception of the franchise and Jim Irsay. There is also no way there are not some coaches and players ticked off by what Irsay has done. Ever hear of quiet quitting? There will be some of that on West 56th street the next two months. I've worked in a place where someone gets placed in a high level position who doesn't have the resume to back it up. It's an uphill battle that Jeff now has to climb. 

 

With that said the sky isn't falling either. Jim Irsay has meddled heavily because things have gone bad. Forget the record this team has looked AWFUL (specifically offense) for most of the season. When things go sideways that's when Irsay gets hands on. That isn't to justify every decision he has made or how he has made them but to say if the Colts get back on track (basically get the QB position right) then the negativity that Irsay caused this week will not matter much in the long-term.

 

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

Jason La Canfora of the Washington Post and Jeff Howe of the Athletic...

lol.. nah...

And WAPO and The Athletic... nah...

 

Irsay has goofed many times in the past, including the last two years... but those two guys ignored his previous goofs... 

Now they are begging for clicks... with "sources"... 

 

 

Thank you. Coming from a well respected poster in here. That has been my point all along. Continue please.

[richard pallo]

6 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Not a great characteristic in an owner either.    You forgot to mention that. 

Last I looked no one forces the owner to fire anyone.  He only gets involved if you fail to do your job.  And if you sit on your hands and force him to do your job you won't be around either as Reich found out the hard way. 

[EastStreet]

2 minutes ago, aReggie7 said:

La Canfora certainly isn't known to be reliable with information. 

 

However, I don't think we need his "reporting" or "sources" to know that the reaction to the way this week went down has been negative. Who didn't go wth when it was announced that Saturday was hired? 

 

IMO there is no way this week was a positive for the Colts in terms of outside perception of the franchise and Jim Irsay. There is also no way there are not some coaches and players ticked off by what Irsay has done. Ever hear of quiet quitting? There will be some of that on West 56th street the next two months. I've worked in a place where someone gets placed in a high level position who doesn't have the resume to back it up. It's an uphill battle that Jeff now has to climb. 

 

With that said the sky isn't falling either. Jim Irsay has meddled heavily because things have gone bad. Forget the record this team has looked AWFUL (specifically offense) for most of the season. When things go sideways that's when Irsay gets hands on. That isn't to justify every decision he has made or how he has made them but to say if the Colts get back on track (basically get the QB position right) then the negativity that Irsay caused this week will not matter much in the long-term.

 

 

 

La Canfora likes politics more than sports lol... but his sport reporting has been bad... 

 

And Howe is weak. IIRC, he used to be a Pats beat dude... And NE fans even hated him. No clue what he does now. 

 

I don't click either one lol... And normally don't click WAPO or The Athletic.

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

La Canfora likes politics more than sports lol... but his sport reporting has been bad... 

 

And Howe is weak. IIRC, he used to be a Pats beat dude... And NE fans even hated him. No clue what he does now. 

 

I don't click either one lol... And normally don't click WAPO or The Athletic.

- yep.

[NewColtsFan]

36 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I just know how La Canfora and guys like Doyle are, it isn't all media but those guys like to stir things up and stretch things.

What’s to stir up?    What is happening is unprecedented.   It would be shocking if there weren’t lots of unhappy people.  
 

This story shouldn’t be surprising to anyone. 
 

Remember, you might have been the last poster to come around that the team was struggling badly.    And now you’re defending in the indefensible moves Irsay has made.   History is repeating itself.  Total denial.   Again. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

@NewColtsFan, not all media is bad. I know you were in the media. There are a lot of good people in the media but La Canfora and guys like Doyle are crap stirrers. 

[DougDew]

A few thoughts: 

 

I did notice that when Marcus Brady was fired, we were notified by an Irsay tweet saying "We have.....".  It came from Irsay, not a Reich announcement.  Maybe that's how the Colts announce things, via Irsay tweet being the fastest way, but it does corroborate the idea that Irsay fired Brady and not Frank.   Irsay has been meddling with the QBs, no reason to think he would not have fired the OC too.

 

Nice pickup on the timing of this....after the trade deadline.  The players could not request to be traded.  Interesting.

 

And the more this settles in, the more likely it is that Irsay wants and evaluation of all of the players, notably the expensive players on the oline and maybe DBuck and maybe even Leonard (if he's still hurt).  He's got gobs of money under contract to 4 players who are under performing (Q, RK, Smith (doing better), Leonard) and Buckner who has a contract coming due soon.  He's got to know where he stands with paying these guys.

 

Even though the players are discouraged, they can't mail it in.  They have to play hard.  Other teams will have tape on their work product.

 

[GoColts8818]

If I recall La Confora likes the stir the pot with Irsay.  Also, without reading the article just reading what the OP provided it sounds like La Confora is throwing a lot of his opinions in there around somethings he’s been told.  I have no doubt people are questioning what’s going on and if Irsay misses on this badly on whatever his plan is it could haunt the team.  Someone to watch to see how true this is is Ballard.  If he doesn’t resign at the end of the year then I don’t think things are as bleak as they are being painted.  No one would put up with this in Ballard’s position if it’s as bad as La Confora says it is.  

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

What’s to stir up?    What is happening is unprecedented.   It would be shocking if there weren’t lots of unhappy people.  
 

This story shouldn’t be surprising to anyone. 
 

Remember, you might have been the last poster to come around that the team was struggling badly.    And now you’re defending in the indefensible moves Irsay has made.   History is repeating itself.  Total denial.   Again. 

I am not supporting all of Irsay's moves, I am just accepting them and realizing we are a mess right now. I would still play Matt Ryan so I disagree with some things that are going on. I never once said that I think the Jeff hiring was great. I am just rolling with it and I like Jeff and we have nothing to lose with the hiring. If Jeff flops, we get a top 5 pick.

[NewColtsFan]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

@NewColtsFan, not all media is bad. I know you were in the media. There are a lot of good people in the media but La Canfora and guys like Doyle are crap stirrers. 

You don’t like the message so you shoot the messenger.    You’re not the first person around here to do that.   

[DougDew]

11 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

And normally don't click WAPO or The Athletic.

Here, here!

[Dr. T]

1 hour ago, Solid84 said:

Morale has to be at an all time low in the building.

You have no personal knowledge of this.

[philba101]

4 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

If I recall La Confora likes the stir the pot with Irsay.  Also, without reading the article just reading the OP provided it sounds like La Confora is throwing a lot of his opinions in there around somethings he’s been told.  I have no doubt people are questioning what’s going on and if Irsay misses on this badly on whatever his plan is it could haunt the team.  Someone to watch to see how true this is is Ballard.  If he doesn’t resign at the end of the year then I don’t think things are as bleak as they are being painted.  No one would put up with this in Ballard’s position if it’s as bad as La Confora says it is.  

It will be interesting to see how Ballard reacts at the end of the season. He has been pretty quiet throughout all this chaos.

[NFLUp]

1 hour ago, jemack said:

Another WP hit job.  

They're not saying anything that hasn't been posted on this board. After surviving the Colts 80's and half of the 90's my football storm shelter is fortified. Colts newby fans will be hit hardest by the "crazy" moves and negative media. To me? It's kind of nostalgic... 

The accusations of tanking are far louder and definitive than even during the “Suck for Luck” campaign.

[NFLUp]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

4. "Ryan and other veteran players were irate" - really? I haven't seen it anywhere or heard it anywhere. Interesting. If I talked to Matt Ryan today I doubt he would say he was irate. He never complains.

You have conversations with Matt Ryan?

Clearly some have; his name wouldn’t have specifically been mentioned otherwise. 

[EastStreet]

5 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Here, here!

yup...

[Semicolt]

Irsay is the total issue for the destruction of this team. I am sure he told Ballard to get rid of Wentz, Brady , bench Ryan and play Sam. I agree that Frank needed to go but don’t agree with the timing. Irsay was undermining both Frank and Chris by having conversations with Saturday without getting them involved. I see Chris wanting to get out of there at the end of the season because Irsay is going around him making him a lame duck! 

[NFLUp]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

You just made my point. He wouldn't say it and has been a class act. 

If Ryan didn’t say anything, he would respond to such a claim.

I think that we all know that he said something.  He was benched and then his coach was fired after the trade deadline.  
And apparently Irsay called Saturday during the game. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, NFLUp said:

You have conversations with Matt Ryan?

Clearly some have; his name wouldn’t have specifically been mentioned otherwise. 

Have you seen or heard Matt Ryan say anything negative at all. I have seen him say he will still help the team and help Sam out in anyway possible while being out. Facts go over peoples heads in here.

[teganslaw]

I can understand the skepticism, but some of these are just hit pieces. Jeff Saturday is not going to be the regular coach; I think that right now he is more of a consultant to look at the overall picture and decide what steps to take going forward. 

 

No one seems to give the team benefit of a doubt, watching to see how everything plays out before judging. If this doesn't work, then criticize, but don't start bashing the team before they even try with the new coaching staff. Go on with some skepticism, but also try to have an open mind and see what happens. 

[philba101]

2 minutes ago, NFLUp said:

You have conversations with Matt Ryan?

Clearly some have; his name wouldn’t have specifically been mentioned otherwise. 

I thought it was interesting that his name was pointed out in particular as well. This makes me wonder if his reaction was worse than others for him to be named.

[NFLUp]

26 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

La Canfora likes politics more than sports lol... but his sport reporting has been bad... 

 

And Howe is weak. IIRC, he used to be a Pats beat dude... And NE fans even hated him. No clue what he does now. 

 

I don't click either one lol... And normally don't click WAPO or The Athletic.

Yeah, you don’t know Jeff Howe.  He’s one of the more respected writers in the league. 

[NewColtsFan]

1 minute ago, NFLUp said:

If Ryan didn’t say anything, he would respond to such a claim.

I think that we all know that he said something.  He was benched and then his coach was fired after the trade deadline.  
And apparently Irsay called Saturday during the game. 

Irsay DID call Saturday during the game.   Saturday said so in his meeting with the media.  Saturday has been working with Strausser about the Oline and Irsay called to say “what has happened to our offensive line?!?”    
 

Irsay did NOT offer him Reich’s job in that call.   It was only about the game.  
 

If I have the timing right, the offer of the job came late Sunday night and became official Monday morning right before Frank got fired. 

[Dr. T]

7 minutes ago, Semicolt said:

 I am sure he told Ballard to get rid of Wentz, Brady , bench Ryan and play Sam. 

Again, I would bet that you have no personal knowledge supporting this statement. You are presenting conjecture as fact.

[NFLUp]

19 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

@NewColtsFan, not all media is bad. I know you were in the media. There are a lot of good people in the media but La Canfora and guys like Doyle are crap stirrers. 

Howe isn’t, though.  Howe is universally regarded as one of the best NFL writers.  

[NewColtsFan]

5 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Have you seen or heard Matt Ryan say anything negative at all. I have seen him say he will still help the team and help Sam out in anyway possible while being out. Facts go over peoples heads in here.

Dear God, you talking about facts going over people’s heads ranks up there with you bragging that you were right about the Colts this year.   You were right and everyone else was wrong.   Remember?

 

Just because Ryan hasn’t said anything negative publicly doesn’t mean he’s fine with everything and isn’t angry with how this played out.   What people say publicly and privately are two different things.   Why is this hard to grasp?  

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

Dear God, you talking about facts going over people’s heads ranks up there with you bragging that you were right about the Colts this year.   You were right and everyone else was wrong.   Remember?

 

Just because Ryan hasn’t said anything negative publicly doesn’t mean he’s fine with everything and isn’t angry with how this played out.   What people say publicly and privately are two different things.   Why is this hard to grasp?  

"you were right and everyone else was wrong"?? Funny because 90% of the forum had us winning the South, go back and look at the posts and polls but you single me out because I am the so called head cheerleader of being positive. SMH. You might as well tag 100 other posters that said we were winning the division if you single me out - That Rhodes character does the same thing, he acts like I am the only one that picked the Colts to win the division and have a good season. 

[EastStreet]

3 minutes ago, NFLUp said:

Yeah, you don’t know Jeff Howe.  He’s one of the more respected writers in the league. 

 

Disagree... he wouldn't be stuck at the Athletic if he was a "more respected writers in the league"... And the Athletic has been thinning itself, and attempting to separate from politics, because they are losing $$$... 

 

I remember when someone (some radio host) called Howe a "whiny / beetchy beat reporter" or something like that... 

[Nadine]

this sounds like gossip to me. I mean Who calls a reporter to tell them how upset they are when they are not even on the team?

 

If they are not employed by the colts but are associated with another team then what is their motivation for bad mouthing the Colts?

 

If they are employed by the colts, I don't get it either.  Did they think that a good season was ruined by this move? Do they think that bad mouthing the owner will make it better?

 

The only motivation I get is the reporter

 

I understand this move.  Lots of things have been tried, I'm fine with finding out what Jeff Saturday thinks.

 

Honestly, I'd take this more seriously if I heard these anonymous NFL execs comment on actual issues with other owners.

 

They don't though so, why this?

[rock8591]

This is why the media has such a had rep.

 

More misinformation and fabricated guesswork on their part.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, Nadine said:

this sounds like gossip to me. I mean Who calls a reporter to tell them how upset they are when they are not even on the team?

 

If they are not employed by the colts but are associated with another team then what is their motivation for bad mouthing the Colts?

 

If they are employed by the colts, I don't get it either.  Did they think that a good season was ruined by this move? Do they think that bad mouthing the owner will make it better?

 

The only motivation I get is the reporter

 

I understand this move.  Lots of things have been tried, I'm fine with finding out what Jeff Saturday thinks.

 

Honestly, I'd take this more seriously if I heard these anonymous NFL execs comment on actual issues with other owners.

 

They don't though so, why this?

Preach, I agree 100%

[Mr. Irrelevant]

1 hour ago, buccolts said:

Sunday's game, the body language, the effort, will be telling.

Exactly, I believe we will get the answers we need after that game.

 

I still assume that this is Irsay’s way of making sure that the team will indeed tank while being able to evaluate the OL. Next off-season is all about getting a proper QB and fixing the OL, nothing else matters.

[strt182]

Frank couldn't fix the problems thats all it boils down to. I think some of these things are nonsense. We will all find out soon enough 

[azcolt]

So the coaches responsible for this totally unprepared bunch are upset that none of them was promoted to acting HC? They will be even more upset when their sorry arses are unemployed in two months.

[EastStreet]

2 minutes ago, rock8591 said:

This is why the media has such a had rep.

 

More misinformation and fabricated guesswork on their part.

 

Don't you love "sources" when they give non-detailed information... just a bunch wishy/washy opinion... 

And some of the criticism about ignoring the Rooney Rule, which isn't relevant for interim coaches... 

 

Everyone is looking for clicks.. 

[Superman]

This thread is hilarious. 

 

Jeff Saturday said in his presser that the news about Parks Frazier leaked right after he had the conversation with the staff. The team's announcement came a couple hours later. How do you think the media got that info?

 

How do you think the media found out Reich had been fired, and Saturday hired, hours before any team announcement? What about Nyheim Hines being traded, and then later on when it was reported that he requested a trade (which he later confirmed)?

 

Sources exist, and are real. It's stubborn and arrogant to downplay and discredit "sources" on the basis of your own personal feelings. People at WaPo and The Athletic have sources, most of them cultivated over the course of many years, even pre-dating their connection to whatever media outlet they work for now. 

 

Nothing in this reporting is unreasonable. It makes sense for people with the team to be shocked, because what this team has just done has never happened before. It makes sense for players to be upset, because this season, and the last month in particular, has been the most turbulent time period in recent Colts history. This is more dramatic than Luck retiring, or McDaniels backing out. It's astonishing. The idea that people in the building would be upset, confused, frustrated, etc., is kind of predictable. I do think this reporting is one-sided and a bit antagonistic, because it's not likely that everyone in the building feels the same way. Still, it's not hard to believe anything that's being reported here. 

 

Shooting the messenger, and/or being in denial is absurd in this situation. Personally, I'm not that worried about the optics. I'm looking forward to January and beyond. But the stories write themselves in this case.