Week 8 Reich Grievance MEGA THREAD (merge)

[WoolMagnet]

8 hours ago, Les Poulains said:

Look, irrespective of bizarre play calling and game management, Wentz melted down like Mickelson at Winged Foot. He was innacurate and both interceptions were brutal. A smarter QB throws that admittedly stupid screen pass call into the dirt and he finds Taylor wide open on the check down in OT.

 

If Reich was doing Tom Brady dirty with nonsense play calling it would be one thing, but Wentz unfortunately doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt on his decision making. Which is where Reich needs to come in and not let him throw it 50 times.

 

To answer the question, I don't get the point of getting Carson Wentz and then not letting his guy call plays for him. It has to get worse before you're making that change. Because isn't that Reich's deal, that he's a play caller? If you take that away, that's a bad signal to Reich. May as well can him.

Any relation to Les Paul?

[Shadow_Creek]

14 hours ago, AustexColt said:

Reich' coaching and being a HC has dropped a notch. He is overwhelmed with media, player injuries, Carson Wentz, Covid, game plan and play calling. It is just too much for him to handle this year. You can see it on video.  He looks tired, worried and exhausted. Ballard and Irsay is letting him drown. The last person to recognize this will be Frank himself. It is just human nature. It is time for the owner to take control of this downslide and develop a plan of action. Irsay should call on Polian, Marv Levi and Tony Dungy who swore that Frank was the "man" to help him. I ask Ballard to start doing some serious listening to his players and coaches. The problem is US and we better fix it fast to salvage this season. 

 

 

[EastStreet]

7 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Here’s your answer.

 

spoiler most won’t like it

 

 

 

Pretty predictable. Both that he was asked. And his response.

 

The fact he's getting asked now publicly is a pretty poignant step though.

It's not something that easily is put back inside the box.

[lollygagger8]

7 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Here’s your answer.

 

spoiler most won’t like it

 

 

 

 

[EastStreet]

On 10/31/2021 at 6:05 PM, Wentzszn said:

What was ten times worse on that drive was all the deep passes. Your up 14 and Dont run the ball.

I don't mind a few deep shots. I do mind abandoning the run like we did when we were running very very well. 

[Defjamz26]

11 hours ago, WarGhost21 said:

Historically, a mid-season change in play-calling from a head coach to an offensive coordinator hasn't yielded much in terms of results because, when it boils down to it, the two are on the same mindset the vast majority of the time and the players and coaches are all on the same playbook. Trying to install a new playbook from an OC who has been using the HC's playbook for half the year would be more of a detriment than a benefit. While I love Frank as a coach, I do think he should concede play-calling duties to someone else, but they should play out the season because a change to Brady would mean either the same plays will be called week by week or a whole wrench will be thrown in the offense (which has been decently successful so far) with the installation of a different playbook. That's something that would need an offseason to work out!

The plays will be the same but the offensive game planning could be vastly different. Brady may not call a screen inside his own 10, or only rush JT 16 times. It’s been said before but Reich doesn’t seem to be great at situational football, and that’s something another playcaller may be better at.

[coltsfan_canada]

7 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Here’s your answer.

 

spoiler most won’t like it

 

 

 

No it is mine

[EastStreet]

17 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Why didn't Wentz just exeucte the play or throw it out of bounds if he didn't like the coverage? How about the pick 6 that screwed us as well.

How about just running ball like like any coach typically would have done under normal circumstance.

We ran RBs under 25% of the time. That is incredibly below mins in just about any game.... 

And your best O player is Taylor, a RB.... 

How about just never throwing 51 times when you're up 14 and your running game is one of the best in the league and looking good... 

 

Like it or not, the overwhelming majority of folks/fans think Frank should give up play calling. And the media is even asking the question publicly now. Wentz had a bad game. Reich put him in a bad position. Never had to happen. Pretty simple. 

 

[Goatface Killah]

17 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Everyone wants to pile on Reich and it is embarrassing. I could care less about the play call, he didn't throw the INT. Wentz could've just threw it out of bounds. Some of you people are sounding comical about now. Yeah Frank could've ran Taylor more but any coach in the league that calls a pass play in OT and his QB throws an INT, how is that his fault. You know how dumb that sounds blaming a coach for throwing an INT. Of course Frank is going to blame himself in any pressers because he loves Wentz. What's he supposed to say Wentz blew it  .Was it Franks fault that Wentz threw a pick 6? Answer that? The play call has nothing do with someone turning it over, you can simply throw it out of bounds if the play doesn't materialize. Common sense. 

1. Frank Reich brought Carson in, despite the fact he struggled mightily last year, because he felt like he could coach him back to playing winning football.

 

At times he has, other times he hasnt. Im not writing him off by any means, but he must play better than he did Sunday at the end of the game, that is for certain. Is it Franks fault? Well partially. He is the coach after all, and is ultimately responsible for the play of his team. 

 

2. Frank Reich calls the plays, and specifically, his job is to call plays that work.

 

Anyone can call plays. However, if they dont work they will be scrutinized. Nobody is blaming Reich for Carsons 2nd pick. Reich didnt take blame for the 2nd pick. He took the blame for the first pick. And it was a stupid play call. This isnt an either/or situation. Both Frank and Carson can own that play, together. They can share blame on both plays. Ryan Kelly can own some as well for not making his block. How much blame each person deserves is irrelevent, because a team is a reflection of its coach and if it fails, so does he. 

 

Frank has tied himself to the success of Carson Wentz, like it or not. So it really doesnt matter if this team fails because of his play call, or Carsons execution of that play call, he shares responsibility either way. Because its ultimately his job to make sure Carson makes the right play.

 

3. This criticism of Frank is about far more than that particular play.

 

He has put himself out there by repeatedly taking risks that just havent worked out. He claims hes gonna be aggressive, and thats ok. But its a coaching decision that will be scrutinized. 

 

 

I like Frank, and trust me, I want him to succeed. I have no agenda here. In fact, it pains me to say these things. I try to be positive. I want to be an optimist. And the last thing I want is to feel like the Colts cant get to where we all want them to go on the current path. Because that means its likely gonna take longer than I had hoped. And thats no good. 

 

But, Frank deserves what hes getting right now. My hope isnt that they fire him at the end of the season, its that he realizes hes putting himself and his job in jeopardy, and simply do that job better. Thats all.

[OffensivelyPC]

16 hours ago, Nickster said:

yep.  all you have to do is look at who you are throwing it to.  If there is a guy in the opposite jersey next to him you spike it.  That simple.  

Wentz went full on back up JV on that one.  No ones fault but his.  

What he thought he was going to do with that ball is beyond all comprehension. 

 

The alternative was take a safety and 100% lose the game. It was a horrible play call and 100%  horrible risk.

[stitches]

I think people are misidentifying the problem. I think the play and decisionmaking of Wentz are a MUCH BIGGER issue for this team than Reich's playcalling, especially in the last few games. That's not to say Reich hasn't had some headscratchers, but that has not been the biggest culprit. In fact... while watching the game I don't think I ever through - damn, we should run the ball more. In fact, I thought we were doing relatively well moving the ball, but kept getting setbacks because of Wentz' decisions and boneheaded mistakes and him straight up not seeing open receivers and instead going into double and triple coverage(on the interception to Pittman for example). 

 

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, stitches said:

I think people are misidentifying the problem. I think the play and decisionmaking of Wentz are a MUCH BIGGER issue for this team than Reich's playcalling, especially in the last few games. That's not to say Reich hasn't had some headscratchers, but that has not been the biggest culprit. In fact... while watching the game I don't think I ever through - damn, we should run the ball more. In fact, I thought we were doing relatively well moving the ball, but kept getting setbacks because of Wentz' decisions and boneheaded mistakes and him straight up not seeing open receivers and instead going into double and triple coverage(on the interception to Pittman for example). 

 

 

Your best player on O is your RB.

We ran the ball under 24% of the time (our average is around 45ish%)....

 

To the bolded, I was thinking all game after the 1Q that we need to run the ball.......

And I was not the only one. Several were commenting in the game day thread.

 

[Defjamz26]

19 hours ago, Fluke_33 said:

Good points.  I still think it should have been run run run but i think you're right also

With our O-line and RB, we should definitely be a run first team. 51 times makes zero sense no matter who the opponent is.

[Goatface Killah]

15 minutes ago, stitches said:

I think people are misidentifying the problem. I think the play and decisionmaking of Wentz are a MUCH BIGGER issue for this team than Reich's playcalling, especially in the last few games. That's not to say Reich hasn't had some headscratchers, but that has not been the biggest culprit. In fact... while watching the game I don't think I ever through - damn, we should run the ball more. In fact, I thought we were doing relatively well moving the ball, but kept getting setbacks because of Wentz' decisions and boneheaded mistakes and him straight up not seeing open receivers and instead going into double and triple coverage(on the interception to Pittman for example). 

 

But hasnt Wentz, for the most part, made good decisions?

 

He is completing 62% of his passes and has 14TDs and 6 TOs, not all of which were his fault. I would only blame him for 4 of them.

 

If we were told thats where hed be before the year started I feel like we would take it.

 

 

[stitches]

5 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

 

Your best player on O is your RB.

We ran the ball under 24% of the time (our average is around 45ish%)....

 

To the bolded, I was thinking all game after the 1Q that we need to run the ball.......

And I was not the only one. Several were commenting in the game day thread.

 

It is on the lower end for sure. And Taylor is probably one of our better players. I just never felt like this was the problem in this game. It never felt artificially low to me. Wentz' decisions on the other hand and missing open receivers were so obvious. In fact, IMO one of the biggest critiques towards Reich should be that he actually hand picked Wentz as his QB of choice.  

[Les Poulains]

6 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

Any relation to Les Paul?

Les Poulains is "The Colts" in french. Come on homie, get cultured. 

[stitches]

4 minutes ago, GoatBeard said:

But hasnt Wentz, for the most part, made good decisions?

 

He is completing 62% of his passes and has 14TDs and 6 TOs, not all of which were his fault. I would only blame him for 4 of them.

 

If we were told thats where hed be before the year started I feel like we would take it.

 

 

Wentz has been hit and miss. He's been better than last year, for sure... but that doesn't really tell us much... it's an incredibly low bar. First few weeks he was average to good with a peak against a horrendous Texans team(I'm excluding the first Titans game, in which he was bad, because IMO he shouldn't have played in that one because of his injury). But even in those first several games he was still holding on the ball too much at times and inviting pressure. On the other hand, IMO his issues of making horrible decisions have resurfaced in full view the last two weeks. To some degree I was willing to overlook the game against the 49ers because of the weather, but then... when you think about it... a few of his horrible throws had nothing to do with the weather, he just made poor decisions that the weather actually helped mask because the defenders were not able to pick them off, he legit could have had 4 INT in that game. And this last game was another poor performance in my view - boneheaded decisions, missing open receivers, throwing into double and tripple coverage when he had other wide open options available... 

 

I'm just not that impressed with him. We didn't bring him in to be an average to below average QB and in my opinion, this is what he's been. 

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, stitches said:

It is on the lower end for sure. And Taylor is probably one of our better players. I just never felt like this was the problem in this game. It never felt artificially low to me. Wentz' decisions on the other hand and missing open receivers were so obvious. In fact, IMO one of the biggest critiques towards Reich should be that he actually hand picked Wentz as his QB of choice.  

It's not just on the lower end. It's completely off the spectrum. As of last week, the Dolphins were the team with the lowest run % in the league, with about 33ish% runs. And they are that way because #1 they are playing from behind a ton, and #2 aren't good running... 

 

We weren't playing from behind, and we are damn good at running the ball. Yet we ran at such a low %, it wasn't even close to the lowest run % in the league. And we were actually up 14, when most coaches start running.... It's completely twilight zone kind of stuff. 

 

Sorry, but seemed absolutely and artificially low to me as it happened. To many others too. A matter of fact, many on the board have discussed the lack of Taylor and RB use in the prior TN game, yet it happened again. So this is far from the first time (see also Miami game with Hoyer, it's a trend....) If you didn't realize it while it happened, not sure what to say.

[Les Poulains]

14 hours ago, Myles said:

Actually, he was fired in San Diego for poor play calling and didn't call the plays in Philly where he did good.  

He said that he didn't realize the ratio of run pass was poor.   "Didn't realize" tells me that he cannot handle it.   He should give it up and just voice to the play caller how he would like to see the game called still giving the play caller the option not to run Hines up the gut on his only carry of the game.  

Yes, but Frank is "Wentz' guy" and Wentz had problems with the play calling in Philly near the end, did he not? It doesn't feel like it's a good idea to break that up a couple games into Wentz' time here, does it?

[DougDew]

9 hours ago, TimetobringDfence! said:

Just like a screen pass on the goal line...

Well, Frank needs to put down the analytics chart and open his eyes.  I'm sure that one reason he went for it on 4th down there was that some chart told him that "Teams that go up 21-0 in the second quarter have a 78% chance of winning the ball game"

 

LOL.

 

Frank made two obvious blunders in play calls.  I don't think he calls plays that says to throw the ball into double coverage, or says to Wentz on the helmet speaker "Hey Carson, just look for Michael Pittman".

 

I think the proper time to judge the offensive and defensive brain trust, Carson included, is when the team has more than just 6 other talented players on the field.  So its been about 5 years now that we've been unable to judge the brain trust, LOL.

[Smoke317]

18 hours ago, Nickster said:

Was he?  I didn't notice which is probably good.  But he's not good at it overall.  Hines is excellent in pass pro.  

Hines mostly chips and goes out and runs a route.  Taylor is the one they use when they want the back to stay in and stonewall a blitzing linebacker.  The thing that Hines does better than Taylor is get into position & his head turned around quicker on screen plays.  Sometimes Taylor lingers a little longer selling the block or fake and the timing gets thrown off.

[stitches]

18 minutes ago, EastStreet said:

It's not just on the lower end. It's completely off the spectrum. As of last week, the Dolphins were the team with the lowest run % in the league, with about 33ish% runs. And they are that way because #1 they are playing from behind a ton, and #2 aren't good running... 

 

We weren't playing from behind, and we are damn good at running the ball. Yet we ran at such a low %, it wasn't even close to the lowest run % in the league. And we were actually up 14, when most coaches start running.... It's completely twilight zone kind of stuff. 

 

Sorry, but seemed absolutely and artificially low to me as it happened. To many others too. A matter of fact, many on the board have discussed the lack of Taylor and RB use in the prior TN game, yet it happened again. So this is far from the first time (see also Miami game with Hoyer, it's a trend....) If you didn't realize it while it happened, not sure what to say.

We were 14-0 with 7:45 to go in the first quarter. IMO this shouldn't significantly factor into your strategy. Just way too much time to go. The down. distance and what the opponent is showing you were much more important than the score at that point when it comes to playcalling. Now you can surely point to some situations when we probably should have ran, but in some of those Wentz himself chose to check out of a run, because of what he was seeing as defensive alignment in front of him.  I don't know, I am just really not all that bothered by the way Frank called that game overall with some distinctive and specific exceptions. 

[Nesjan3]

6 minutes ago, stitches said:

We were 14-0 with 7:45 to go in the first quarter. IMO this shouldn't significantly factor into your strategy. Just way too much time to go. The down. distance and what the opponent is showing you were much more important than the score at that point when it comes to playcalling. Now you can surely point to some situations when we probably should have ran, but in some of those Wentz himself chose to check out of a run, because of what he was seeing as defensive alignment in front of him.  I don't know, I am just really not all that bothered by the way Frank called that game overall with some distinctive and specific exceptions. 

You think 51 passes in a game where we never trailed by more than 4 points, and we have a top 3 running back in the league is alright? Teams that get blown out throw the ball 51 times not teams competing to win. Never have. never will. Unless your Manning, Brady, Rogers, or one of those guys. Wentz is not. 

[EastStreet]

11 minutes ago, stitches said:

We were 14-0 with 7:45 to go in the first quarter. IMO this shouldn't significantly factor into your strategy. Just way too much time to go. The down. distance and what the opponent is showing you were much more important than the score at that point when it comes to playcalling. Now you can surely point to some situations when we probably should have ran, but in some of those Wentz himself chose to check out of a run, because of what he was seeing as defensive alignment in front of him.  I don't know, I am just really not all that bothered by the way Frank called that game overall with some distinctive and specific exceptions. 

Not saying you go totally conservative up 14-0. But sure in the hell doesn't mean you go 76% passing. Actually from that point, we were probably 80-85% passing. And that's just straight up dumb.

 

And IMO, it was play calling that led to a lot of bad 3rd down, down and distances. 

 

Just not sure how you, or anyone can defend under 24% running given the situation...

• Up 14 at home.
• Our running game is doing great.
• Our best O player is a RB. 
• Their best player is obviously gimpy
• We lost TY and don't have another Z type active

 

Just not sure what on earth crept into Franks mind and said, "hey, let's throw 80+% of the time from here on out and forget about our most talented guys on O..."... And the fact he acted like he had no clue what the pass/run mix was is jaw dropping.

[twfish]

God I find it hilarious people are putting this loss on Wentz. Dude got thrown out there to play hero ball after having a pretty solid game up until then. Terrible play calling on both sides of the ball led to this loss. Letting the Titans convert every single 3rd and 4th down and just march their way down on us was awful to watch. Then when we have the ball instead of keeping it out of their hands and running it we keep passing with only 3 WR’s able to play. This was hands down a coaching loss and down right embarrassing and that’s why people are angry.

[stitches]

9 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

You think 51 passes in a game where we never trailed by more than 4 points, and we have a top 3 running back in the league is alright? Teams that get blown out throw the ball 51 times not teams competing to win. Never have. never will. Unless your Manning, Brady, Rogers, or one of those guys. Wentz is not. 

I'm just never preoccupied with the number of passes(when it's high), especially since it's working enough that you are leading the majority of the time against a really good team. In general I'm in favor of pass-heavy offense in game neutral situations, this is why it doesn't bother me. In fact I've criticized Frank in the past for running too much in game neutral situations. It would feel kind of hypocritical on my part to criticize him now that he's actually doing what I want him to do. Maybe he swung the pendulum too much in the other direction in this specific game, but I have to be honest and I am when I say - it didn't bother me in the grand scheme when he was calling the game. It bothered me much more what Wentz was doing with the ball than what was being called from the sidelines. 

[Goatface Killah]

42 minutes ago, stitches said:

Wentz has been hit and miss. He's been better than last year, for sure... but that doesn't really tell us much... it's an incredibly low bar. First few weeks he was average to good with a peak against a horrendous Texans team(I'm excluding the first Titans game, in which he was bad, because IMO he shouldn't have played in that one because of his injury). But even in those first several games he was still holding on the ball too much at times and inviting pressure. On the other hand, IMO his issues of making horrible decisions have resurfaced in full view the last two weeks. To some degree I was willing to overlook the game against the 49ers because of the weather, but then... when you think about it... a few of his horrible throws had nothing to do with the weather, he just made poor decisions that the weather actually helped mask because the defenders were not able to pick them off, he legit could have had 4 INT in that game. And this last game was another poor performance in my view - boneheaded decisions, missing open receivers, throwing into double and tripple coverage when he had other wide open options available... 

 

I'm just not that impressed with him. We didn't bring him in to be an average to below average QB and in my opinion, this is what he's been. 

I think a part of that is just his style. I think we all want QBs to be super effecient like Tom Brady or Drew Brees.....but Wentz is a high risk, high reward type of QB and is nothing like those guys.

 

I dont think its fair to say he played poorly on Sunday. I thought he played pretty good Sunday until late in the game. He certainly wasnt flawless. But he did have 3 TD passes and helped us put up 31 points. You cant criticize him for his mistakes and not give him credit for the things he did well. 

 

That was the same defense that shut down the Chiefs the week before. We scored the same amount of points on them as the Bills two weeks ago. Sometimes you have to give the opponent credit and your guy the benefit of the doubt.

 

Our offense outscored theirs. The game came down to two plays, IMO. The pick six, and I dont put that all on him. And the Tyquan Lewis double turnover, which had nothing to do with him. If those two plays never happen we win and nobody is saying Carson was horrible. People are likely saying he played very well. 1 play cant flip the script like that.

 

We have a tendency to say it was either good or bad. But its more complex than that most of the time.

 

 

[richard pallo]

2 hours ago, EastStreet said:

How about just running ball like like any coach typically would have done under normal circumstance.

We ran RBs under 25% of the time. That is incredibly below mins in just about any game.... 

And your best O player is Taylor, a RB.... 

How about just never throwing 51 times when you're up 14 and your running game is one of the best in the league and looking good... 

 

Like it or not, the overwhelming majority of folks/fans think Frank should give up play calling. And the media is even asking the question publicly now. Wentz had a bad game. Reich put him in a bad position. Never had to happen. Pretty simple. 

 

A high school coach is smart enough to do what you are suggesting.  Years ago he should have done what Rivers is currently doing.  Start your coaching career in high school.  I’m thinking he would probably have trouble with that job.

[DougDew]

38 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

You think 51 passes in a game where we never trailed by more than 4 points, and we have a top 3 running back in the league is alright? Teams that get blown out throw the ball 51 times not teams competing to win. Never have. never will. Unless your Manning, Brady, Rogers, or one of those guys. Wentz is not. 

Yes, because its the type of passes that were thrown is the issue, not the number of them. 

 

If Carson throws to JT more in the flat....even more dinks and dunks...we probably win the game.

 

Also. because that top 3 RB was getting his yards by some great individual running, not by the oline getting a lot of push, the sustainability of JTs ypc was questionable based upon what the eyes tell us about how he was getting those yards in the first place.

 

I'm all for discussing individual play calls based upon situational personnel packages on the field, for each play called, but try to avoid broad based stats that have little substance.  

 

Frank made two obvious blunders, IMO.  The screen pass call and the decision to go for it early in the game.

 

More importantly for me is, why were there only 4 WRs active (well, look at the roster and tell me who else could have surely contributed)

 

Why do we keep Mack and waive Wilkins when the only thing Mack has ever done, can only do, is to take handoffs.  He doesn't catch.  He doesn't cover on ST. (unless he did this game, which would be a first).  Why can't we have a backup RB that can do all three?  That would impact JTs work load and the types of plays called (have a bigger back run up the gut instead of Hines)

 

BTW, I think Hines ran up the gut less this game.. because he stinks at it...and I assume the trade off was more pass plays.  The number 51 needs to be looked at closer before it means anything.  

 

These and issues like these are the bigger issues that place coordinators in a box that they have to punch out of just to get on a level playing field with other playoff wannabe teams.

[CoachLite]

28 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

You think 51 passes in a game where we never trailed by more than 4 points, and we have a top 3 running back in the league is alright? Teams that get blown out throw the ball 51 times not teams competing to win. Never have. never will. Unless your Manning, Brady, Rogers, or one of those guys. Wentz is not. 

I think Wentz is going to be a great QB for the Colts. His confidence needs to heal some more, and not feel compelled to play 'hero ball'. For whatever good influence Frank has been on Wentz, I think he subconsciously undermines Wentz's confidence by playing conservative, then calling wild plays at random times. 51 passes? What did you expect?

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, richard pallo said:

A high school coach is smart enough to do what you are suggesting.  Years ago he should have done what Rivers is currently doing.  Start your coaching career in high school.  I’m thinking he would probably have trouble with that job.

Not saying folks, especially former players, need to start coaching in HS, but it's truly out of this world illogical to see what we saw on Sunday. And folks acting like it's normal are either blind Reich rans, Wentz haters, or just don't understand simple football norms. Wentz had a bad game. Players do that sometimes, and it was Wentz's first truly bad game of the year. Coaches however don't typically go so extreme that their mix is lower than the lowest, and is even more extreme given the in-game situation.

[Nesjan3]

5 minutes ago, CoachLite said:

I think Wentz is going to be a great QB for the Colts. His confidence needs to heal some more, and not feel compelled to play 'hero ball'. For whatever good influence Frank has been on Wentz, I think he subconsciously undermines Wentz's confidence by playing conservative, then calling wild plays at random times. 51 passes? What did you expect?

What did I expect, oh I dont know not 51 passes lol. Thats ridiculously high I dont know what realm of football you guys live in where thats ok. You see 51 passes from teams like the Lions when they lose 45-3. 

[Nesjan3]

9 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Yes, because its the type of passes that were thrown is the issue, not the number of them. 

 

If Carson throws to JT more in the flat....even more dinks and dunks...we probably win the game.

 

Also. because that top 3 RB was getting his yards by some great individual running, not by the oline getting a lot of push, the sustainability of JTs ypc was questionable based upon what the eyes tell us about how he was getting those yards in the first place.

 

I'm all for discussing individual play calls based upon situational personnel packages on the field, for each play called, but try to avoid broad based stats that have little substance.  

 

Frank made two obvious blunders, IMO.  The screen pass call and the decision to go for it early in the game.

 

More importantly for me is, why were there only 4 WRs active (well, look at the roster and tell me who else could have surely contributed)

 

Why do we keep Mack and waive Wilkins when the only thing Mack has ever done, can only do, is to take handoffs.  He doesn't catch.  He doesn't cover on ST. (unless he did this game, which would be a first).  Why can't we have a backup RB that can do all three?  That would impact JTs work load and the types of plays called (have a bigger back run up the gut instead of Hines)

 

These and issues like these are the bigger issues that place coordinators in a box that they have to punch out of just to get on a level playing field with other playoff wannabe teams.

Im not wanting to get into specifics. 51 is to high in a game that close. ESPECIALLY when you have such a great running back and supposedly elite oline. Sorry to say but if Wentz continues to throw 45 plus times a game, he will make mistakes. He will make bad mistakes and we will lose games.

[DougDew]

Just now, Nesjan3 said:

Im not wanting to get into specifics. 51 is to high in a game that close. ESPECIALLY when you have such a great running back and supposedly elite oline. Sorry to say but if Wentz continues to throw 45 plus times a game, he will make mistakes. He will make bad mistakes and we will lose games.

Would you rather have had 6 fewer passing plays and run Hines (our backup RB) up the gut 6 more times like in other games?

[Nesjan3]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

Would you rather have had 6 fewer passing plays and run Hines (our backup RB) up the gut 6 more times like in other games?

No id like to Frank to give the playsheet to someone who knows how to balance the play calling and get the ball into our best playmaker (Taylors) hands and limit Wentz's opportunities to make bonehead plays.

[NannyMcafee]

51 passes make sense if your run game is horrible and can't do anything else. But the run game was doing really well and we hardly used it. Where's the balance? Why can I not find calls making sense per the situation? I'm off the Frank bandwagon until he shows he can learn consistently. Or win more than 3 games in a row. 

 

He reminds me too much of Marvin Lewis. 

[Smoke317]

Frank will never throw Carson under the bus but you can tell that his own seat is starting to heat up and he can’t cover for all of Carson’s mistakes.  That’s not to say Frank hasn’t had his own mistakes but I’m starting to think that Ballard is not happy with us constantly abandoning the running game and losing vs the better teams.  And the spotlight is beaming on Frank.
 

We just don’t often play complimentary football against the better AFC teams under Frank.  Coaching decisions, QB mistakes, abandoning the run, defense getting carved up for record days, missed kicks, blown tackles, back breaking penalties, etc.  We always find ways to beat ourselves.  
 

It’s interesting that Frank was pressed this time and had to give an actual number of plays that were called runs or RPO’s (6) that Carson chose to pass on.  But that’s only a part of the issue.  Carson’s issues that resurfaced this last game were the same mistakes he was making earlier in the season.  When you blow a 3rd & 4th and short (Usually No Taylor involvement-Go figure) and turn the ball over on downs, think of how many more carries Taylor may have had if you extend that drive?  Think of how the game dynamic changes if we continue that drive and go up 17-0 or 21-0?
 

Those are the kinds of mistakes that have kept us from winning against our better competition this season.  Failures to execute on key downs (3rd, 4th, & red zone opportunities).  Imo, Frank & Rivers could never get in sync about what the identity of our offense should be.  Ballard and Frank (later in the season) realized we needed to work through Taylor & our running game.  Rivers probably being the most knowledgeable offensive mind in the room probably saw things differently and wanted to do it his own way.  So bye bye Rivers.

 

So Ballard goes and gets Frank the QB of his choice, Wentz.  One that he should be able to manage & control & get in sync with (he clearly couldn’t control HOFer Rivers).  And here we are making the same repeated mistakes from previous seasons  and just weeks prior.  Ballard has to be figuring that he could’ve traded up for Fields or Mac Jones and we could still be 3-5 but at least with hope for the future with a growing rookie instead of having a 6th year QB getting paid 25m & still making rookie mistakes.  
 

Imagine Fields & Taylor running the read option.  Imagine Jones hitting the wide open check downs or easy crossers that Frank draws up that Wentz just can’t seem to see until it’s too late and they’re lined up for a kill shot (hello Campbell).  Frank & Wentz have to get back in sync immediately & win the next 2 or it may be time to turn to Ehlinger to save the pick because what we’ve gotten out of Wentz & Frank thus far has been fool’s gold and not good enough.  
 

We’re 3-5 with no wins over good teams at the midway point.  This team is too talented to be this mediocre.  We’ve gotta change something up and stop the insanity.

[DougDew]

2 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

No id like to Frank to give the playsheet to someone who knows how to balance the play calling and get the ball into our best playmaker (Taylors) hands and limit Wentz's opportunities to make bonehead plays.

Would it have been better to throw Hines more LOS pass plays and have Wentz not throw down field so much, thereby changing the mix of the pass plays but keeping the number of them at 51?

[Nesjan3]

1 minute ago, DougDew said:

Would it have been better to throw Hines more LOS pass plays and have Wentz not throw down field so much, thereby changing the mix of the pass plays but keeping the number of them at 51?

Yea designed checkdowns are basically an extension of the run a lot of teams do that, but the reason they do it is because their running backs or run blocking is not that great. We dont have that problem. In fact we have one of the best RB stables in the NFL with one of the best run blocking Olines.

[Nickster]

1 hour ago, EastStreet said:

 

Your best player on O is your RB.

We ran the ball under 24% of the time (our average is around 45ish%)....

 

To the bolded, I was thinking all game after the 1Q that we need to run the ball.......

And I was not the only one. Several were commenting in the game day thread.

 

 

But we had scored 24 points until with 2 to go in the 3rd, so whatever we were doing was working.  After that, we lost our way IMO.  Some of quotes indicate that CW called off a bunch of the runs too.  CW went off the rails it appears.  

 

I don't love Reich, but we have been rolling offensively throwing out to JT in the flat more than sending him through the middle.  

 

I can almost guarantee you, that we will get the chance to see what a run heavy offense will produce v. the Jets with what is being said.