CBS Grades for the Colts (all rounds)

[EastStreet]

Average Grade B- or C+

 

2-2

COLTS

Rock Ya-Sin, CB, Temple

Grade: B

The Colts got a great season from Pierre Desir last year, they need help on the other side. I think this pick makes all the sense in the world for the Indianapolis Colts. Good pick and they've got a lot of picks and will be very active today. 

 

2-17

COLTS

Ben Banogu, EDGE, TCU

Grade: B

This guy is a DPR (designated pass rusher). He's gonna play on third down. The Colts need to get better on third down. I like this pick. I don't love it, but here's the deal in that division now you better be able to rush the passer. 

 

2-27

COLTS

Parris Campbell, WR, Ohio State

Grade: A

GM Chris Ballard is knocking it out of the park. He is one of my favorite receivers. One of my No. 1 guys in this draft as it relates to outside guys. He can flat out fly. He was misused at Ohio State. 

 

3-25

COLTS

Bobby Okereke, LB, Stanford

Grade: C

This is a project and they hope he can develop and show some ability. Watch out for the Colts, they have a chance to be really good on defense. 

 

4-7

COLTS

Khari Willis, S, Michigan State 

Grade: C
Willis was a late-riser who takes an extra second to recognize route combinations yet gets his hands on the football often. He's rangy as a tackler but a below-average athlete for the position with good strength. 

 

5-6

COLTS

Marvell Tell III, S, USC 

Grade: B- 
Tell can look like a future All-Pro one game then a practice squad player the next. He's a tall, lanky, ridiculously explosive safety with an inconsistent motor and tackling willingness. Expect him to contribute on special teams out the gate. 

 

5-26

COLTS

EJ Speed, LB, Tarleton State 

Grade: D+
Speed is a tall, lanky linebacker with impressive athleticism who had a productive career but is a project mainly because he's making the gigantic jump from playing at Tarleton State to the NFL. Likely should have been a UDFA. 

 

6-26

COLTS

Gerri Green, DE, Mississippi State 

Grade: C
Green represents what's become normal for Mississippi State defenders. He's ultra-physical and never stops moving. He's not a great athlete for the edge rusher spot and lacks a variety of pass-rushing moves. 

 

7-26

COLTS

Jackson Barton, OT, Utah 

Grade: B+
Barton isn't a stellar athlete but he's one of the most under control tackle in this class, and he has serious NFL tackle size. Plus ability as a pass blocker. He has the profile of someone you want to gamble on in the seventh round. 

 

7-32

COLTS

Javon Patterson, G, Ole Miss 

Grade: B+
Patterson was an unspectacular yet solid guard at Ole Miss for multiple seasons. He doesn't have ideal length and must pack some weight onto his frame, but he's the type of guy that can emerge with the right coaching. 

[HectorRoberts]

I would love to look back at this in a year to see how wrong they were

[csmopar]

6 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

Average Grade B- or C+

 

2-2

COLTS

Rock Ya-Sin, CB, Temple

Grade: B

The Colts got a great season from Pierre Desir last year, they need help on the other side. I think this pick makes all the sense in the world for the Indianapolis Colts. Good pick and they've got a lot of picks and will be very active today. 

 

2-17

COLTS

Ben Banogu, EDGE, TCU

Grade: B

This guy is a DPR (designated pass rusher). He's gonna play on third down. The Colts need to get better on third down. I like this pick. I don't love it, but here's the deal in that division now you better be able to rush the passer. 

 

2-27

COLTS

Parris Campbell, WR, Ohio State

Grade: A

GM Chris Ballard is knocking it out of the park. He is one of my favorite receivers. One of my No. 1 guys in this draft as it relates to outside guys. He can flat out fly. He was misused at Ohio State. 

 

3-25

COLTS

Bobby Okereke, LB, Stanford

Grade: C

This is a project and they hope he can develop and show some ability. Watch out for the Colts, they have a chance to be really good on defense. 

 

4-7

COLTS

Khari Willis, S, Michigan State 

Grade: C
Willis was a late-riser who takes an extra second to recognize route combinations yet gets his hands on the football often. He's rangy as a tackler but a below-average athlete for the position with good strength. 

 

5-6

COLTS

Marvell Tell III, S, USC 

Grade: B- 
Tell can look like a future All-Pro one game then a practice squad player the next. He's a tall, lanky, ridiculously explosive safety with an inconsistent motor and tackling willingness. Expect him to contribute on special teams out the gate. 

 

5-26

COLTS

EJ Speed, LB, Tarleton State 

Grade: D+
Speed is a tall, lanky linebacker with impressive athleticism who had a productive career but is a project mainly because he's making the gigantic jump from playing at Tarleton State to the NFL. Likely should have been a UDFA. 

 

6-26

COLTS

Gerri Green, DE, Mississippi State 

Grade: C
Green represents what's become normal for Mississippi State defenders. He's ultra-physical and never stops moving. He's not a great athlete for the edge rusher spot and lacks a variety of pass-rushing moves. 

 

7-26

COLTS

Jackson Barton, OT, Utah 

Grade: B+
Barton isn't a stellar athlete but he's one of the most under control tackle in this class, and he has serious NFL tackle size. Plus ability as a pass blocker. He has the profile of someone you want to gamble on in the seventh round. 

 

7-32

COLTS

Javon Patterson, G, Ole Miss 

Grade: B+
Patterson was an unspectacular yet solid guard at Ole Miss for multiple seasons. He doesn't have ideal length and must pack some weight onto his frame, but he's the type of guy that can emerge with the right coaching. 

Barton is a DT I thought?

[HOF19]

From NJ media >>>>>>

By Darryl Slater | NJ Advance Media for NJ.com

Now that the 2019 NFL Draft is complete, let’s hand out our team-by-team grades......And the Colts grade ??? >>>>>>> 

• Colts (10 picks): CB Rock Ya-Sin (2), OLB Ben Banogu (2), WR Parris Campbell (2), LB Bobby Okereke (3), S Khari Willis (4), S Marvell Tell (5), LB E.J. Speed (5), OLB Gerri Green (6), OT Jackson Barton (7), C Javon Patterson (7)

Grade: A

Analysis: Terrific draft. You might not have heard of Ya-Sin and Banogu, but they’re legit picks. Campbell fell perhaps farther than expected.

[Valpo2004]

These grades are just silly, you don't know how players are going to pan out u til later.

[EastStreet]

4 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Barton is a DT I thought?

nope, ot

[#12.]

2 minutes ago, HectorRoberts said:

I would love to look back at this in a year to see how wrong they were

 

Just looked at PFF's top LBs heading into the 2018 draft.  Leonard wasn't in the top 28.  

[EastStreet]

1 minute ago, #12. said:

 

Just looked at PFF's top LBs heading into the 2018 draft.  Leonard wasn't in the top 28.  

it's just a factor of coming from a small school. 

[#12.]

6 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

it's just a factor of coming from a small school. 

 

What are you talking about?  They didn't like him as a pro. 

[EastStreet]

Just now, #12. said:

 

What are you talking about?  They didn't like him as a pro. 

He's from a small school / small conference. 

It's pretty much a given that the overwhelming majority of those from small schools are disadvantaged from the start when it comes to pre-draft ratings. They don't get TV time for their games, they don't have scouts at games during the season, they don't get invited to the combines all that often, etc..

[#12.]

8 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

He's from a small school / small conference. 

It's pretty much a given that the overwhelming majority of those from small schools are disadvantaged from the start when it comes to pre-draft ratings. They don't get TV time for their games, they don't have scouts at games during the season, they don't get invited to the combines all that often, etc..

 

Just a joke.  As a pro, with the Colts, the guys at PFF weren't too high on Leonard, until they were somewhat forced to be.  That happens, even in a more statistically based environment.  No one lives in a bubble.

 

 

[EastStreet]

8 minutes ago, #12. said:

 

Just a joke.  As a pro, with the Colts, the guys at PFF weren't too high on Leonard, until they were somewhat forced to be.  That happens, even in a more statistically based environment.  No one lives in a bubble.

 

you'd be surprised :-)

[Fisticuffs111]

I understand why writers do draft grades, I mean what else are they gonna do after the draft? But yeah, not to be taken too seriously. Saying that, I don't really think they were too harsh on grades other than Okereke and Willis. And possibly Speed too.

[Jdubu]

43 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I understand why writers do draft grades, I mean what else are they gonna do after the draft? But yeah, not to be taken too seriously. Saying that, I don't really think they were too harsh on grades other than Okereke and Willis. And possibly Speed too.

The writers and fans alike, they grade these based on what they’ve seen so far in college, their measurables, how they assume they can translate their skills into the nfl and as you said, what else do they have to write about until training camps start. 

 

What never really ally gets written about well is how a player actually should grade out inside a certain system. For instance, many QB’s get dinged for playing in a spread offense and of course now are expected to play in a pro set offense behind center. You can grade that kid based on his college skills, his measurables, his leadership qualities but adjusting for college play and what he is walking into is tough to do. Like does this new QB that ranks top of the QB list of the writers but comes in with a 32 ranked oline, bad receivers and new coaching systems. Vs a number 4 ranked QB by the same writers yet they actually have some pieces to succeed with already in place. 

 

Ive always felt too many teams pick players with these traits that are hot for the nfl but your scheme isn’t quite built for that type of player and the player fails. Sometimes it’s because he just doesn’t fit and lb’ers seem to really fit that problem. Are they a 3-4 or 4-3 guy, those tweeners just ughhh. Crazy skills and stats and athletes but just hard to fit in. 

 

So so let’s write about that. Let’s project a grade on a scheme fit guy more than the 168th pick spot of the draft. Idk 

[EastStreet]

Just saw NFL.com's draft grades. Half the teams got As, the rest mostly B or B+s and a couple C+s. What nonsense. He grades easier than the fake class profs at UNC.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

1 hour ago, #12. said:

 

Just a joke.  As a pro, with the Colts, the guys at PFF weren't too high on Leonard, until they were somewhat forced to be.  That happens, even in a more statistically based environment.  No one lives in a bubble.

 

 

 

Bubble Boy in Seinfeld episode did.

[Fisticuffs111]

1 hour ago, Jdubu said:

What never really ally gets written about well is how a player actually should grade out inside a certain system.

 

Ive always felt too many teams pick players with these traits that are hot for the nfl but your scheme isn’t quite built for that type of player and the player fails. Sometimes it’s because he just doesn’t fit and lb’ers seem to really fit that problem. Are they a 3-4 or 4-3 guy, those tweeners just ughhh. Crazy skills and stats and athletes but just hard to fit in. 

 

So so let’s write about that. Let’s project a grade on a scheme fit guy more than the 168th pick spot of the draft. Idk 

Honestly, totally agree with all that. In terms of fit, Ballard nails it. Guys I might not be super high on, like Banogu or Speed, they at the very least fit what we're going for. 

I don't expect most mainstream media, like CBS, to get that, probably because I don't expect much from most national media. But yeah, I totally get what you're saying

[EastStreet]

1 hour ago, Jdubu said:

The writers and fans alike, they grade these based on what they’ve seen so far in college, their measurables, how they assume they can translate their skills into the nfl and as you said, what else do they have to write about until training camps start. 

 

What never really ally gets written about well is how a player actually should grade out inside a certain system. For instance, many QB’s get dinged for playing in a spread offense and of course now are expected to play in a pro set offense behind center. You can grade that kid based on his college skills, his measurables, his leadership qualities but adjusting for college play and what he is walking into is tough to do. Like does this new QB that ranks top of the QB list of the writers but comes in with a 32 ranked oline, bad receivers and new coaching systems. Vs a number 4 ranked QB by the same writers yet they actually have some pieces to succeed with already in place. 

 

Ive always felt too many teams pick players with these traits that are hot for the nfl but your scheme isn’t quite built for that type of player and the player fails. Sometimes it’s because he just doesn’t fit and lb’ers seem to really fit that problem. Are they a 3-4 or 4-3 guy, those tweeners just ughhh. Crazy skills and stats and athletes but just hard to fit in. 

 

So so let’s write about that. Let’s project a grade on a scheme fit guy more than the 168th pick spot of the draft. Idk 

 

NFL.com and The Draft Network at least make an effort to talk about scheme fit pre-draft in their profiles. I'm sure the team scouts dig into that. We just don't see a lot of critical thinking or grading post draft.

 

NFL.com draft grades (post draft) for all the teams and individual players are more or less sunshine pumping and doesn't address scheme fit. Heck, I think more than half the teams got As... 

[ztboiler]

Looks like the same grades that CBS would have given Ballard’s 18 class...

[ColtsUrUs]

Guess EJ Speed, LB, Tarleton State will be a pro-bowler next season. Because every time these analysts give Ballard a negative on a player he pans out to be better.   

[EastStreet]

8 minutes ago, ztboiler said:

Looks like the same grades that CBS would have given Ballard’s 18 class...

actually, in 2018 CBS graded the Colts with a B+. Only 4 teams got higher.

[ztboiler]

6 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

actually, in 2018 CBS graded the Colts with a B+. Only 4 teams got higher.

My bad.  I was too specific in the CBS reference...I was speaking of general grades by the industry, and most if not all positive grades were attributable to Q last year.  Most experts were neutral at best about the rest of our draft...as were our fans.

[crazycolt1]

I used CBS in an earlier thread and you said they wasn't dependable and discredited them.

And now you use them?

[DerekDiggler]

4 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

Average Grade B- or C+

 

2-2

COLTS

Rock Ya-Sin, CB, Temple

Grade: B

The Colts got a great season from Pierre Desir last year, they need help on the other side. I think this pick makes all the sense in the world for the Indianapolis Colts. Good pick and they've got a lot of picks and will be very active today. 

 

2-17

COLTS

Ben Banogu, EDGE, TCU

Grade: B

This guy is a DPR (designated pass rusher). He's gonna play on third down. The Colts need to get better on third down. I like this pick. I don't love it, but here's the deal in that division now you better be able to rush the passer. 

 

2-27

COLTS

Parris Campbell, WR, Ohio State

Grade: A

GM Chris Ballard is knocking it out of the park. He is one of my favorite receivers. One of my No. 1 guys in this draft as it relates to outside guys. He can flat out fly. He was misused at Ohio State. 

 

3-25

COLTS

Bobby Okereke, LB, Stanford

Grade: C

This is a project and they hope he can develop and show some ability. Watch out for the Colts, they have a chance to be really good on defense. 

 

4-7

COLTS

Khari Willis, S, Michigan State 

Grade: C
Willis was a late-riser who takes an extra second to recognize route combinations yet gets his hands on the football often. He's rangy as a tackler but a below-average athlete for the position with good strength. 

 

5-6

COLTS

Marvell Tell III, S, USC 

Grade: B- 
Tell can look like a future All-Pro one game then a practice squad player the next. He's a tall, lanky, ridiculously explosive safety with an inconsistent motor and tackling willingness. Expect him to contribute on special teams out the gate. 

 

5-26

COLTS

EJ Speed, LB, Tarleton State 

Grade: D+
Speed is a tall, lanky linebacker with impressive athleticism who had a productive career but is a project mainly because he's making the gigantic jump from playing at Tarleton State to the NFL. Likely should have been a UDFA. 

 

6-26

COLTS

Gerri Green, DE, Mississippi State 

Grade: C
Green represents what's become normal for Mississippi State defenders. He's ultra-physical and never stops moving. He's not a great athlete for the edge rusher spot and lacks a variety of pass-rushing moves. 

 

7-26

COLTS

Jackson Barton, OT, Utah 

Grade: B+
Barton isn't a stellar athlete but he's one of the most under control tackle in this class, and he has serious NFL tackle size. Plus ability as a pass blocker. He has the profile of someone you want to gamble on in the seventh round. 

 

7-32

COLTS

Javon Patterson, G, Ole Miss 

Grade: B+
Patterson was an unspectacular yet solid guard at Ole Miss for multiple seasons. He doesn't have ideal length and must pack some weight onto his frame, but he's the type of guy that can emerge with the right coaching. 

 These are the kind of posts that might bite  you in the butt in a yr.   but kudos to you for being upfront about it 

[NDcolt]

Great draft grades = take big names from big schools which is nonsense formula.  CB and staff prepare like no other staff and spend hundreds of hrs studying film and interviews making sure they get the player that fits their scheme!!!  Everybody wins but this staff is showing the rest of the NFL including the Pats how to build a roster that FITS your scheme.  I.E, everybody wanted Greedy Williams but if you don’t tackle you don’t fit regardless if your a Deion Sanders and shut down corner.  Other picks seem like bust but in our system can be ALL PRO!  Trust the process

[Nesjan3]

whatever may as well get a monkey to assign draft grades, none of these guys have played an NFL snap how could you possible know.

[NDcolt]

3 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

whatever may as well get a monkey to assign draft grades, none of these guys have played an NFL snap how could you possible know.

If you don’t believe in this staff to this point I can’t help you believe!

[EastStreet]

13 minutes ago, ztboiler said:

My bad.  I was too specific in the CBS reference...I was speaking of general grades by the industry, and most if not all positive grades were attributable to Q last year.  Most experts were neutral at best about the rest of our draft...as were our fans.

CBS actually gave Q a B individually. They said he was a rock star, and the cleanest player in the draft, but it was simply too early in the draft to take a G. So others actually pulled it up to B+

 

Being a ND fan, I loved the draft. I thought Braden was a good pick too.

[EastStreet]

11 minutes ago, DerekDiggler said:

 These are the kind of posts that might bite  you in the butt in a yr.   but kudos to you for being upfront about it 

They are not mine. They are from CBS sports.

I'll put mine out tomorrow and let people melt down :-)

I'm not afraid to be honest. People who think every pick is amazing are pretty silly.

Sunshine pumping is for September thru January :-) when we are winning games.

[TomDiggs]

I also think most of these sites that grade our picks are grading on a few factors that will always seem to lower our grade:

 

1) They all will weigh in what their perceived value of a guy is. If they had him as a 3rd rounder and we took him in the 2nd round then we get dinged. They don't factor in that Ballard might want to make sure he gets his guy so he takes him a bit higher. Nor do they factor in that maybe we don't pick till the end of a round. So they grade him as a 3rd and we don't pick until the end of the 3rd. The guy might go early to mid third. So when we take him at the end of the 2nd to get him, we get dinged for it. But it is smart in my book.

 

2) They rarely ever truly consider scheme fit. They will say "they took Willis when A.Hooker was out there" or "They took Ya-Sin when they could have taken Greedy". They don't consider that the guy we take is a better fit than the other guy they had ranked higher. I see this a ton in the secondary. Where they wanna ding us for not take a solid FS type when we never would w us having Hooker. We had a stronger need for a box guy. Or they talk about Ya-Sin's man press skills and say "if you're gonna play some man then you should take Greedy". They don't consider all facets like that we play zone w man principles and that you absolutely must be a sure tackler.

 

3) They often will look at players we passed when we made a pick or move and evaluate as if we could have had him and do not consider that we purposefully and willingly passed because we clearly did not value that guy. I saw this a few times this weekend. Stuff like The Colts traded out of pick 26, when they could have stayed there and taken Montez Sweat, an edge rusher that they needed. Or, The Colts traded out of pick 46 and passed up Greedy Williams who they could have used. They do not consider all the downstream effects of the moves or that we willingly bypassed those players for a reason.

 

Either way, I liked this draft for us.

 

Some guys I wasn't as knowledgeable about as others. But so far I like what I am hearing. I do wonder what the LB picks mean for us. We invested some decent capital in LBs when we have recently only been keeping 2 on the field most of the time. I imagine that may not bode well for Walker long term. But I also think it gives us a lot of options in nickel and dime packages that we did not have before this weekend.

[stitches]

3 hours ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I understand why writers do draft grades, I mean what else are they gonna do after the draft? But yeah, not to be taken too seriously. Saying that, I don't really think they were too harsh on grades other than Okereke and Willis. And possibly Speed too.

I'm willing to bet 99% of the people giving grades today have watched a grand total of ZERO snaps of EJ Speed...

[Fisticuffs111]

Just now, stitches said:

I'm willing to bet 99% of the people giving grades today have watched a grand total of ZERO snaps of EJ Speed...

Very much agree with that. I kind of doubt any of these mainstream writers/analysts have watched any snaps of Speed. Which is partly why I'm so intrigued by him. Not to mention because he was brought in by a handful of teams for a workout.

[horseshoecrabs]

Don't care about the grades no more than last year. until the season progresses this year it is a mute point. Injuries can play a major factor as you well know. We have a really tough schedule this coming year , and every game will be  tougher.  I hope you know that we are no longer flying under the radar., and the league knows we are not a given this year. So we are under the spot light now.  It will be tougher than a lot of people realize to even duplicate last year's success.

I really think we can progress this coming year barring major injuries. I am excided on taken the next step , and  have the Colts as a major player in the NFL for years to come.    

[stitches]

8 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

Very much agree with that. I kind of doubt any of these mainstream writers/analysts have watched any snaps of Speed. Which is partly why I'm so intrigued by him. Not to mention because he was brought in by a handful of teams for a workout.

This is why when I grade this one I will not put any grade on it unless I find at least 2-3 games of him... I think I can safely say I follow the draft more than most people and not only have I not watched EJ Speed, but I just learned that there is such a thing as Tarleton State(and my phone just tried to auto-correct it so even our future overlords the computers don't know % about it).  

[EastStreet]

16 minutes ago, stitches said:

I'm willing to bet 99% of the people giving grades today have watched a grand total of ZERO snaps of EJ Speed...

 

I give him an A+ for name off the bat

 

3 minutes ago, stitches said:

This is why when I grade this one I will not put any grade on it unless I find at least 2-3 games of him... I think I can safely say I follow the draft more than most people and not only have I not watched EJ Speed, but I just learned that there is such a thing as Tarleton State(and my phone just tried to auto-correct it so even our future overlords the computers don't know shot about it).  

 

i was looking for film on him earlier, and was not successful lol. 

you can typically find highlight cuts of guys, but you can't grade a guy on a highlight cut. bad plays don't make the highlights :-)

[EastStreet]

8 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

I used CBS in an earlier thread and you said they wasn't dependable and discredited them.

And now you use them?

I'm just providing the info. I'm not arguing for them, or using them to support an argument (I actually disagree in some areas).

 

Looks like you just want to argue again per usual though lol..

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, Irish YJ said:

I'm just providing the info. I'm not arguing for them, or using them to support an argument (I actually disagree in some areas).

 

Looks like you just want to argue again per usual though lol..

No argument at all.

Like I said. I used them and you discredited them.

And then you posted them yourself to make a point?

It's that simple.

[EastStreet]

6 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

No argument at all.

Like I said. I used them and you discredited them.

And then you posted them yourself to make a point?

It's that simple.

And as i said, I'm not posting them to make a point. Just posting their grades (and others). Since I made no point or commented on their grades (except some replies to others), and you jumped in..., pretty sure you're doing your typical poke in an attempt to create drama. It's that simple. Low energy, low contribution... I don't expect anything else from you.

 

BTW, There's bad analysis (and good) from all the mainstream sites. CBS has some good, and bad "experts" just like ESPN, NFL.com, Fox, and NBC. CBS is not great overall, but they are better than NBC. Depends on the author.

[crazycolt1]

5 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

And as i said, I'm not posting them to make a point. Just posting their grades (and others). Since I made no point or commented on their grades (except some replies to others), and you jumped in..., pretty sure you're doing your typical poke in an attempt to create drama. It's that simple. Low energy, low contribution... I don't expect anything else from you.

 

BTW, There's bad analysis (and good) from all the mainstream sites. CBS has some good, and bad "experts" just like ESPN, NFL.com, Fox, and NBC. CBS is not great overall, but they are better than NBC. Depends on the author.

Now who is trying to be argumentative?

When you used them as an example you are attempting to make a point.

Like I said, it's that simple. No argument.

[EastStreet]

5 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Now who is trying to be argumentative?

When you used them as an example you are attempting to make a point.

Like I said, it's that simple. No argument.

specifically how did i use them as an example? does simply posting pure data on our draft grades imply agreement or that i'm using them as an example? keep on trolling...