What does the 18th pick overall look like? [Merge]

[NewColtsFan]

 

Looked at the last 16 drafts looking back to 2000.....   and with the exception of about a 3-4 year window in the early/mid-2000's,  the 18th pick gets you a pretty decent player.

 

2015    Marcus Peters      KC   CB

2014    Calvin Pryor          NYJ   S

2013    Eric Reid               SF     S

2012    Melvin Ingram       SD    OLB

2011    Corey Liuget          SD    DT

2010    Markice Pouncy    Pitt     C

2009    Richard Ayers       Den    DE

2008    Joe Flacco            Balt    QB

2007    Leon Hall              Cin     CB

2006    Brain Carpenter    Dal    OLB

2005   Erasmus James    Min    DE

2004   Will Smith              NO    DE

2003   Calvin Pace          Ari      OLB/DE

2002   TJ Ducket             Atl       RB

2001   Jeff Backus          Det      OT

2000   Chad Pennington  NYJ   QB

 

[Bravo]

Ezekiel Elliot 2016! ;)

[MPStack]

Three positions come to mind at 18. Oline, CB and LB. I don`t think the Colts can afford to move up with the lack of talent. I say Conklin, Mackensie or Jack. My wildcard is Nkemdiche.

[IinD]

I was more then happy when I heard 18, people act like it's equivalent to picking 200th.

 

There will 100% be a great day one starter there if you know how to pick.

 

You actually have the chance now to realistically trade up also if you think there's a can't miss stud available a couple spots up. We can even move a couple spots down if someone is willing to offer a haul for droppinga  couple spots.

 

We are in a very solid spot actually. Granted it's not too 5 or anything, but we shoulde easily acquire a solid player at that spot.

[ReMeDy]

37 minutes ago, IinD said:

We are in a very solid spot actually. Granted it's not too 5 or anything, but we shoulde easily acquire a solid player at that spot.

 

Plus, we save money by picking later. Why do people think New England enjoys trading back into the second round so much?

[NewColtsFan]

3 minutes ago, ReMeDy said:

 

Plus, we save money by picking later. Why do people think New England enjoys trading back into the second round so much?

 

The other reason that makes New England trade back out of the first round so often is this....

 

32 picks in the first round,  but there are rarely 32 players who grade out as first round picks.

 

Most years, there are roughly 24 players who get first round grades.    So, the bottom 8 teams are drafting 2nd round guys and paying them 1st round money.

 

Might as well trade back,  add draft pick(s) and save money in the process while at the same time,  drafting a player of similar ability and grade.

 

There's a reason (lots of them actually)  why New England is in the playoffs every year......

 

 

[ReMeDy]

30 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The other reason that makes New England trade back out of the first round so often is this....

 

32 picks in the first round,  but there are rarely 32 players who grade out as first round picks.

 

Most years, there are roughly 24 players who get first round grades.    So, the bottom 8 teams are drafting 2nd round guys and paying them 1st round money.

 

Might as well trade back,  add draft pick(s) and save money in the process while at the same time,  drafting a player of similar ability and grade.

 

There's a reason (lots of them actually)  why New England is in the playoffs every year......

 

 

 

And New England has the scouting and coaching personnel to make that system of trading back work. Their coaches get the most out of their under-developed players, and when they do manage to develop someone, they can trade them to reap even greater rewards. This is why they love drafting backup QB's, because they know the rest of the league thinks everything Belichick touches turns to gold. The NFL is a QB-driven league.

 

The irony is as Brady approaches retirement, the QB's New England drafts will be even more valuable, as teams will believe each QB is increasingly more likely to be Tom Brady's successor.

[Mr. Irrelevant]

3 minutes ago, ReMeDy said:

 

And New England has the scouting department, coaching, and other personnel to make that system of trading back work. Their coaches get the most out of their under-developed players, and when they do manage to develop someone, they can trade them to reap even greater rewards. This is why they love drafting backup QB's, because they know the rest of the league thinks everything Belichick touches turns to gold. People think they're drafting Brady's successor. I disagree (partially), the fact Brady might soon retire puts a higher grade on any QB the Patriots draft, because every other team is thinking the Patriots are holding onto Brady's successor and that gets teams excited.

Since there is a salary cap in place in NFL, the best way to beat that system is to have the very best coaching setup you possible can. And since salary cap does not apply to coaches, assistants, GM, etc, the owner can spend a ton of money to hire the best of the best (if they want to come). That is how you beat the system.

[ReMeDy]

1 minute ago, Mr Clueless said:

Since there is a salary cap in place in NFL, the best way to beat that system is to have the very best coaching setup you possible can. And since salary cap does not apply to coaches, assistants, GM, etc, the owner can spend a ton of money to hire the best of the best (if they want to come). That is how you beat the system.

 

Essentially, the rich get richer.

[Jim H.]

I'll bet there will be a top notch wide out available... <ducks>

[Smonroe]

3 hours ago, bravo4460 said:

Ezekiel Elliot 2016! ;)

 

"You should never draft a running back in the first round!" - SMonroe

 

Amended - "Unless his name is Ezekiel Elliott!"

 

He could give us our Edge for the next 8 years.

[akcolt]

We should get a guy that can help right away. We can do better than Elliott. I would be disappointed.I don't think Elliott's a 1st round talent and we have needs at some crucial spots OL OLB CB DL. 

 

I don't want to see a RB the first two days at all. Elliott is not Gurley. 

[Smonroe]

24 minutes ago, akcolt said:

We should get a guy that can help right away. We can do better than Elliott. I would be disappointed.I don't think Elliott's a 1st round talent and we have needs at some crucial spots OL OLB CB DL. 

 

I don't want to see a RB the first two days at all. Elliott is not Gurley. 

 

I don't want to argue, but I do disagree with your first sentence.  He can help right away.  Gore doesn't have too much time left, we need a star RB.  IMHO, he's the best RB in the draft and is a complete back. 

 

All that being said, I won't be upset with any pick outside of another WR.  18 could be early for an inside O lineman, which is probably our primary need.  If it were up to me, I'd make a pass rusher our first priority.

[Myles]

4 hours ago, ReMeDy said:

 

Essentially, the rich get richer.

The smart get better.

[Valpo2004]

1 hour ago, akcolt said:

We should get a guy that can help right away. We can do better than Elliott. I would be disappointed.I don't think Elliott's a 1st round talent and we have needs at some crucial spots OL OLB CB DL. 

 

I don't want to see a RB the first two days at all. Elliott is not Gurley. 

 

This is the entire problem I have with Grig's drafting style.  If you are gonna spend a first rounder spend it on someone who can help right away.

 

A CB or OL as long as they live up to their draft billing could probably start week 1.  Safety has a good chance as well as does an OLB.  I'm ok with selecting any of those in the first.

[HarryTheCat]

Most of them on that list turned out to be decent players. But then there isn't a "Grigson pick" on that list -- yet.

[Narcosys]

7 hours ago, IinD said:

I was more then happy when I heard 18, people act like it's equivalent to picking 200th.

 

There will 100% be a great day one starter there if you know how to pick.

 

You actually have the chance now to realistically trade up also if you think there's a can't miss stud available a couple spots up. We can even move a couple spots down if someone is willing to offer a haul for droppinga  couple spots.

 

We are in a very solid spot actually. Granted it's not too 5 or anything, but we shoulde easily acquire a solid player at that spot.

 

Its not that they hate the 18th pick, its that it could have been a top 10 pick, or top 15

[bababooey]

7 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

 

Its not that they hate the 18th pick, its that it could have been a top 10 pick, or top 15

After losing on the last drive to Texans we obviously were gonna win out.

[Narcosys]

11 minutes ago, bababooey said:

After losing on the last drive to Texans we obviously were gonna win out.

 

Not if the owner didn't want to.  That is what I don't get.  The owner knows we were practically out of the playoffs, given that the Texans were not going to lose to the jags, and the likelihood of 9 games going our way.  So why would he not be ok with getting a better draft pick, and communicating this to the coaching staff.  Rest our starters for half the game, give those that you need to evaluate more play time.  There were teams already doing that, it was mentioned in our game that Tenn was doing it.  So it is not unlikely that we could have done the same and ensure a better draft pick. 

[bababooey]

2 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

 

Not if the owner didn't want to.  That is what I don't get.  The owner knows we were practically out of the playoffs, given that the Texans were not going to lose to the jags, and the likelihood of 9 games going our way.  So why would he not be ok with getting a better draft pick, and communicating this to the coaching staff.  Rest our starters for half the game, give those that you need to evaluate more play time.  There were teams already doing that, it was mentioned in our game that Tenn was doing it.  So it is not unlikely that we could have done the same and ensure a better draft pick. 

Irsay cares more about being able to say he didn't have a losing season over jumping up negligibly (is this a word? lol) in the draft.

[Narcosys]

5 minutes ago, bababooey said:

Irsay cares more about being able to say he didn't have a losing season over jumping up negligibly (is this a word? lol) in the draft.

10 positions is not a negligible jump.  8th was a possibility.  Could have traded down to 18th and get another pick in the process.

[bababooey]

3 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

10 positions is not a negligible jump.  8th was a possibility.

Didn't realize that. Either way, I personally believe Irsay cares more about "not a losing season" than a top 10 pick that isn't a #1 overall that will change the franchise's future. 8th to 18th is a lot closer in terms of talent/value than 5 to 8 is anyway. 8th is nice but you know all hot seat coach's like to try to end with a win despite hurting next year's draft position (Rex Ryan Jets - still got Williams though, Tom Coughlin Giants this year, Pagano this year).

[Narcosys]

1 minute ago, bababooey said:

Didn't realize that. Either way, I personally believe Irsay cares more about "not a losing season" than a top 10 pick that isn't a #1 overall that will change the franchise's future. 8th to 18th is a lot closer in terms of talent/value than 5 to 8 is anyway. 8th is nice and you know all hot seat coach's like to try to end with a win despite hurting next year's draft position (Rex Ryan Jets - still got Williams though, Tom Coughlin Giants this year, Pagano this year).

 

Which is crazy to me why the owner would want to do that.  The trade value in a top 10 pick can be worth more than the actual person you may get.  According to draft value charts, we could have gotten a first and a second round pick for a top 10 pick from any team picking at 15 or above.

[aaron11]

wish we would have gone with the excuse the bucs used last year when they tanked

 

we need to evaluate the roster

[bababooey]

5 minutes ago, Narcosys said:

 

Which is crazy to me why the owner would want to do that.  The trade value in a top 10 pick can be worth more than the actual person you may get.  According to draft value charts, we could have gotten a first and a second round pick for a top 10 pick from any team picking at 15 or above.

Considering Irsay loves the fact that we won the most games in a decade and made playoffs for some record and won most games in a row or whatever the record is (read his foreward in the book 100 facts all colts fans should know), despite the fact we have one championship in that time, he's only caring more about a winning appearance.

[aaron11]

1 minute ago, bababooey said:

Considering Irsay loves the fact that we won the most games in a decade and made playoffs for some record and won most games in a row or whatever the record is (read his foreward in the book 100 facts all colts fans should know), despite the fact we have one championship in that time, he's only caring more about a winning appearance.

he does care about that, but bulk wins in a bad division are not getting us closer to a SB.  i hate sounding like a poster child for tanking, but this was the year to do it.  especially after the loss to the texans

[bababooey]

2 minutes ago, aaron11 said:

wish we would have gone with the excuse the bucs used last year when they tanked

 

we need to evaluate the roster

That's what makes me laugh when people say we suck for luck despite everyone getting fired or released after that season, we almost blew the pick. The bucs were up 20-7 at halftime, sat their starters, didn't score at all in the second half, gave up 16 4th quarter points and lost by a FG lol

[dgambill]

Not sure there will be an answer to our pass rush issue sitting there at 18 but I could easily see a nice RT/RG that could come in and compete right away for a starting job. It depends on the direction this team takes in 2016 as far as the coaching/personnel but I would think the look long and hard at the offensive line (help run and passing game). We are set at wr (with or without Johnson). The offense is pretty well set with the exception of the right side of our line and rb. The defense needs LB/CB/S help but that will depend a lot on who comes in and what our identity will be. A nice RT would make me very happy....the rest of the draft we could go all defense...just depends on what is on the board. If there is a stud LB/C there I'm sure we take them but going in I think we target OL.

[bababooey]

1 minute ago, aaron11 said:

he does care about that, but bulk wins in a bad division are not getting us closer to a SB.  i hate sounding like a poster child for tanking, but this was the year to do it.  especially after the loss to the texans

You never know. Jets got 2 December wins last year including over Titans and got who they wanted. Maybe it will happen to us.

[cdgacoltsfan]

5 hours ago, Smonroe said:

 

"You should never draft a running back in the first round!" - SMonroe

 

Amended - "Unless his name is Ezekiel Elliott!"

 

He could give us our Edge for the next 8 years.

I agree unless there is a better o-lineman or pass rush OLB available.

[COLTS449]

Myles Jack or Noah Spence all the way.

[chad72]

9 hours ago, bravo4460 said:

Ezekiel Elliot 2016! ;)

 

Leonard Floyd, OLB, Georgia.

 

If you want a Buckeye, I'd rather get Taylor Decker, OT, Ohio State  at #18

[throwing BBZ]

9 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The other reason that makes New England trade back out of the first round so often is this....

 

32 picks in the first round,  but there are rarely 32 players who grade out as first round picks.

 

Most years, there are roughly 24 players who get first round grades.    So, the bottom 8 teams are drafting 2nd round guys and paying them 1st round money.

 

Might as well trade back,  add draft pick(s) and save money in the process while at the same time,  drafting a player of similar ability and grade.

 

There's a reason (lots of them actually)  why New England is in the playoffs every year......

 

 

 

 It really is that simple!

[throwing BBZ]

11 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Looked at the last 16 drafts looking back to 2000.....   and with the exception of about a 3-4 year window in the early/mid-2000's,  the 18th pick gets you a pretty decent player.

 

2015    Marcus Peters      KC   CB

2014    Calvin Pryor          NYJ   S

2013    Eric Reid               SF     S

2012    Melvin Ingram       SD    OLB

2011    Corey Liuget          SD    DT

2010    Markice Pouncy    Pitt     C

2009    Richard Ayers       Den    DE

2008    Joe Flacco            Balt    QB

2007    Leon Hall              Cin     CB

2006    Brain Carpenter    Dal    OLB

2005   Erasmus James    Min    DE

2004   Will Smith              NO    DE

2003   Calvin Pace          Ari      OLB/DE

2002   TJ Ducket             Atl       RB

2001   Jeff Backus          Det      OT

2000   Chad Pennington  NYJ   QB

 

 

 I would like to order a Marcus Peters please! lol
 Or a Pouncey! :-)

 

[NewColtsFan]

 

Boy,  wouldn't either of those be great!!

[DougDew]

13 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Looked at the last 16 drafts looking back to 2000.....   and with the exception of about a 3-4 year window in the early/mid-2000's,  the 18th pick gets you a pretty decent player.

 

2015    Marcus Peters      KC   CB

2014    Calvin Pryor          NYJ   S

2013    Eric Reid               SF     S

2012    Melvin Ingram       SD    OLB

2011    Corey Liuget          SD    DT

2010    Markice Pouncy    Pitt     C

2009    Richard Ayers       Den    DE

2008    Joe Flacco            Balt    QB

2007    Leon Hall              Cin     CB

2006    Brain Carpenter    Dal    OLB

2005   Erasmus James    Min    DE

2004   Will Smith              NO    DE

2003   Calvin Pace          Ari      OLB/DE

2002   TJ Ducket             Atl       RB

2001   Jeff Backus          Det      OT

2000   Chad Pennington  NYJ   QB

 

Lots of edge and secondary players.  Hardly any interior players.  Not surprising.

[NewColtsFan]

12 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Lots of edge and secondary players.  Hardly any interior players.  Not surprising.

 

Sure,  but remember, this is just the 18th pick.....    I didn't list the 19-32nd picks for 16 years.

 

I think you'd see plenty of interior players.     Perhaps not a lot,  but a fair amount.

 

I always think the first round should focus on the premium positions.....

 

[Dark Superman]

I could see the Colts grabbing Elliot here, but I much rather see us go defensive.

[AustexColt]

"best" player available except WR. After that it is OL, DL and CB.

I am hoping that Grigson and team allows the recent new coaches help them evaluate the talent, especially OL and DL. Grigson's team could use the help. 

[SkyBane]

3 minutes ago, AustexColt said:

"best" player available except WR. After that it is OL, DL and CB.

I am hoping that Grigson and team allows the recent new coaches help them evaluate the talent, especially OL and DL. Grigson's team could use the help. 

We are good on DL. If you want a defensive upgrade, the big need is LB.