Sources: Make or Break Year for HC Chuck Pagano

[BOTT]

Pagano will be back.  Gone 11-5 every year for the last 3 years, albeit the first one he was on sick leave for most of the season.

 

Gone to playoffs every year, gotten progressively further every year.

 

If he makes the playoffs, Pagano is back.

He has to do more than make the playoffs. I'm not a SB or bust kind of guy, but it's more complex than just making the playoffs.

[BOTT]

When you are the owner of the team, and you see the talent you have, I'd have to imagine that he thinks this team under achieved.

The talent isn't exactly overwhelming. The Seahawks the colts are not.

[Superman]

Agreed. Everyone should have accountability, not just Pagano. It should be from the bottom to the top.

 

Pagano's staff is tied directly to him. If there's a new head coach, he'd bring in his own staff, at his own discretion.

[BOTT]

What is the judging stick for Pagano? He just made the AFCCG. Does he have to win the SB to keep his job? That seems extreme.

I think that's a lazy argument.

[Superman]

The talent isn't exactly overwhelming. The Seahawks the colts are not.

 

The Seahawks are two years ahead of the Colts, in terms of roster building. Carroll's first two years, he was 14-18. Year 3, 11-5. 

[BOTT]

The Seahawks are two years ahead of the Colts, in terms of roster building. Carroll's first two years, he was 14-18. Year 3, 11-5.

I'm we'll aware. It wasn't meant to be critique of Grigson, just a fact of where the colts are right now.

[Restored]

This is just flat wrong. The only place he was accused of wearing out his welcome was San Francisco, which turned out to be entirely fabricated by the *ic front office. The players adored him in SF, they've all said this. It was the worst owner in the league (except maybe Snyder?) creating a reason to get rid of a successful coach because Jed wanted full control.

 

No it's not. Jim wanted as much control as Jed did which is why he is now coaching a college team in which he has practically total control over. It doesn't matter if you have the players adore you, if you can't get along with your front office, something isn't right. Jim is a heck of a coach but he hasn't coached longer than 5 years in any one place other than when he was an assistant at WKU. I'll pass at this point.

[GoColts8818]

GIVE ME HARBUAGH OR GIVE ME DEATH

Not going to happen even if they do fire Pagano.  Harbaugh isn't going to leave Michigan after one year.

[Narcosys]

I can only see Harbaugh replacing Pagano. But with Harbaughs' contract with Michigan might get in the way.

[BProland85]

Pagano needs to show major improvement against New England next year to show he's worth a contract extension. Not saying he has to win, but he has to be much more competitive then they have been in the past with the Pats. Once the Colts get past New England, a chance for a title is very attainable.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

This could be true, if so though I think unwarranted! Unless we take a huge step backwards this year!

[HtownColt]

Pep gets elevated to HC if Pagano is gone after the season

[MTC]

Here are my thoughts:

 

Pagano isn't a great coach. Sometimes his team looks really unprepared against good teams (cowboys, patriots, cardinals, etc...)

 

He was brought here to help build a good defense and that hasn't shown at all. The defense has stunk for past three seasons. We still cannot stop the run and cover tight ends. 

 

Do you really credit Pagano for the playoff wins? No, not really. I credit Andrew Luck for that. 

 

With all that being said, would I be upset if Pagano is not re-hired next season? No. Same goes with Grigson. He really needs to nail this draft to keep his job.

 

[BOTT]

No it's not. Jim wanted as much control as Jed did which is why he is now coaching a college team in which he has practically total control over. It doesn't matter if you have the players adore you, if you can't get along with your front office, something isn't right. Jim is a heck of a coach but he hasn't coached longer than 5 years in any one place other than when he was an assistant at WKU. I'll pass at this point.

Part of the reason he hasn't lasted long at any job is high demand for his services. I mean seriously, he was supposed to turn down stanford so he could stay at San Diego? And given what Jed has done since harbaugh left, I'm inclined to think Jimbo was right for wanting more control.

[Superman]

 

Here are my thoughts:

 

Pagano isn't a great coach. Sometimes his team looks really unprepared against good teams (cowboys, patriots, cardinals, etc...)

 

He was brought here to help build a good defense and that hasn't shown at all. The defense has stunk for past three seasons. We still cannot stop the run and cover tight ends. 

 

Do you really credit Pagano for the playoff wins? No, not really. I credit Andrew Luck for that. 

 

With all that being said, would I be upset if Pagano is not re-hired next season? No. Same goes with Grigson. He really needs to nail this draft to keep his job.

 

 

 

I think Pagano was hired to coach the entire football team, not just the defense. And the defense isn't as good as anyone would like, but it doesn't stink. That's a gross over-exaggeration.

 

And I think people like to focus on the bad games to the exclusion of the good games. In 2013, we beat SF, Seattle, Denver, KC twice (had the best record in the conference at the time), etc. This year, we shut out the Bengals, beat the Ravens, beat the Broncos in Denver... Yeah, there's been some bad games, but there's been some good games, too, against top competition.

[BrentMc11]

Don't forget the good ol stubborn Pep Hamilton who insists on running pulling guard plays with Guards who can't do it

Some blame goes to everyone. Lack of running game was a problem sure, but good OC have the ability to make up for it

Remember how the media tried to trash Bill when the Pats sent that OL (who's name I forgot) packing? Look how their offensive line handled it. It's all in the coaching. Not every player is an all star. Gotta learn to work with what you have

Blame for WHAT????????  Getting to the AFC Championship?  This thread is horse ____!

 

Pagano will go out on his own terms if he goes out at all.  Ridiculous is the nonsense about Pep too....Number 1 rated offense most of the year.

 

TK...start watching all of the games instead of bringing snarky comments based on nothing.  Ian Rappaport:  Who gives a crap?

[Nadine]

Well, there's this

https://twitter.com/NBCdianna/status/581180546396643328

Who would release that?

[Superman]

Who would release that?

 

Pagano's agent, for sure.

[In Luck We Trust]

then get rid if Grigs too I'm not saying to now I just mean if the run D is still poor after the season he better hope his FA turn things around for us cause there were alot of good players out there this year

or what about the offensive line? if that don't get better either. haven't they said that Grigs is a OLine type of guy? yet we have had a below average line for the last couple of years. Injuries or not. if they're gonna blame pagano they need to blame grigson also. I mean there were some good Lineman out there that we could have gotten and still have a couple out there, like Dan Connolly, Wisniewski, then there was Franklin, Carpenter, Iupati, and we didn't even go after one knowing that our line needed fixing. 

[TKnight24]

Blame for WHAT???????? Getting to the AFC Championship? This thread is horse ____!

Pagano will go out on his own terms if he goes out at all. Ridiculous is the nonsense about Pep too....Number 1 rated offense most of the year.

TK...start watching all of the games instead of bringing snarky comments based on nothing. Ian Rappaport: Who gives a crap?

You seem upset

And I did watch all the game except for 1 so not understanding your comment there

And notice you said "most of the year" for being #1 in offense. Took some steps backwards when they benched Shipley for Harrison didn't we? Keeping Trent in week after week when he wasn't producing hurt too didn't it?

It's not based off nothing, this coaching staff should take alot of the blame for their head scratching moves.

[TKnight24]

Who would release that?

Idk, I'm just the messenger lol

[Slick_Rick]

I'm neither shocked or appalled. I mean, Pags has been a great players coach, but doesn't strike me as an X's and O's kind of guy. I don't know what it is about this organization. It's like as soon as you put on the Colts uniform, run defense goes out the window. It's been that way forever now. It just seems that now Irsay is more inclined to make changes.

[TKnight24]

I'm neither shocked or appalled. I mean, Pags has been a great players coach, but doesn't strike me as an X's and O's kind of guy. I don't know what it is about this organization. It's like as soon as you put on the Colts uniform, run defense goes out the window. It's been that way forever now. It just seems that now Irsay is more inclined to make changes.

"Run defense goes out the window"

That's a good one

[BrentMc11]

You seem upset

And I did watch all the game except for 1 so not understanding your comment there

And notice you said "most of the year" for being #1 in offense. Took some steps backwards when they benched Shipley for Harrison didn't we? Keeping Trent in week after week when he wasn't producing hurt too didn't it?

It's not based off nothing, this coaching staff should take alot of the blame for their head scratching moves.

Yes.  I do not like a baseless slam on the Football coaches.  This Colt team is family.  I do see changes on the defensive side of the ball.  We have the backers now...need to beef the front up in draft.

 

Sorry, you have been known just to throw comments out here even when you have not seen the game.  Your analysis skills are waning as to this team.  I was all for Shipley, then they tried youth.  It is what it is, and Holmes came on well.

 

Pagano will be back, and Pep will more than likely end up with a head coaching gig in college.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

and our LBers can't cover TEs

 

That isn't unusual, it's not really what they're meant to do.

[Warhorse]

Ian Craprapport.

 

nuff said....

[Solon]

Chuck has been a solid coach. All I can knock him for is what MTC said. We look unprepared at times and that's troubling. Part from that, I've been satisfied with his performance. However, I'm pretty sure Irsay wouldn't have hired him if he knew the rebuilding process would progress so quickly.

[21isSuperman]

It's deserved.  11 win seasons are great when you're rebuilding.  But now, we need to be elite.  We need 12+ wins and we can't have these random blowout games.  While I think Pagano has done a good job with the secondary, I think his head coaching leaves a lot to be desired.  He's made several questionable coaching decisions and I think it's time for him to really show what he's got.  On a side note, Manusky should have already been fired.  When one team can run for that many yards on you in 3 consecutive attempts, I think it indicates something very flawed with your scheme

 

Lol this is a joke he has helped us incredibly and I have no idea how inheriting a brand new rebuilding team and expecting to win a ring the fourth year while taking the job isn't expected. Keep Pagano

What about all those times the team looked unprepared?  The Dallas game, the Pittsburgh game, all those blowouts.  I pin that on coaching.

 

I think at the very least, this is Manusky's final year. If we do get BTFO by New England again, I could see Manusky getting scapegoated. 

Is it scapegoated if he deserves it?

[Tracy Denton]

I forget...after the rebuild, how many years was it before we "start" to challenge for the AFC South title ?

[Solon]

It's deserved.  11 win seasons are great when you're rebuilding.  But now, we need to be elite.  

Hit the nail right on the head.

[John Dee]

I tend to think along these lines...    Chuck has been WAY too stubborn when it comes to depth chart and playing time.

 

Also..    the accountability level on this team last season was non existent.     No consequences for bone head play or actions.   

 

These things are troubling..     BUT....     Wayne has been cut.   So lets see how his ship is run this up coming year.    And it is a huge one for him.     Irsay brought up NE's DOMINANCE on the ground in a statement...    Down to the stats...       Jimmy is watching.

Ian is pretty good solid info. Doubt this is something to be taken lightly. Him & Adam S. are usually on top of things

Personally, I wouldn't mind a more hard nose coach. Like a Rex Ryan kinda guy or Belicheck kinda guy

Pagano is just too nice imo

[TKnight24]

Pep gets elevated to HC if Pagano is gone after the season

......... don't joke about such foul things

[John Dee]

This is the troubling thing...    2013 Indy beat Denver, Seattle, and CLOBBERED a totally healthy SF team.    BUT yet got blown out by Arizona and StL. ?     2014 Indy drills every team they should....      the GOOD ones tho....     DRILLED Indy?   What gives?

 

This is a really big year for the entire organization.     Thus the route the took in FA...    SOLID VETS.   And I love all moves bye the way  Esp Herremans and AJ...     if they can stay in the game this is HUGE.

I forget...after the rebuild, how many years was it before we "start" to challenge for the AFC South title ?

[John Dee]

Cards, Rams, Bengals, and even SD..   Dominated the Colts in 13, and the BIG wins...  only SF was a total whipping.   Sea and Denver where down to the wire.

 

Bottom line this team under Pagano is feast or famine.         Especially against really good competition.    And I have stated my issues with the coach to death on this board.   

 

Well.   this is his chance to put it all together.         He has the QB, and the GM has given him a roster that on paper looks like a SB favorite?  Or at least in the mix.     Lets see how it unfolds.   .

 

I think Pagano was hired to coach the entire football team, not just the defense. And the defense isn't as good as anyone would like, but it doesn't stink. That's a gross over-exaggeration.

 

And I think people like to focus on the bad games to the exclusion of the good games. In 2013, we beat SF, Seattle, Denver, KC twice (had the best record in the conference at the time), etc. This year, we shut out the Bengals, beat the Ravens, beat the Broncos in Denver... Yeah, there's been some bad games, but there's been some good games, too, against top competition.

[antipatriot]

Although I like where the team is headed we cant continually get blown out by the same team in the same manner that is not progress.  I have always been a believer that an HC should get 3 years to prove himself and continually progress.  Lets see what happens this season as I think on paper we are already better than last season. 

 

Grigs also must be held accountable. 

 

This is a big year for the Colts I am not saying it is Superbowl or bust but we need to at least show up if we meet the Pats in the playoffs again.

[21isSuperman]

Although I like where the team is headed we cant continually get blown out by the same team in the same manner that is not progress.  I have always been a believer that an HC should get 3 years to prove himself and continually progress.  Lets see what happens this season as I think on paper we are already better than last season. 

 

Grigs also must be held accountable. 

 

This is a big year for the Colts I am not saying it is Superbowl or bust but we need to at least show up if we meet the Pats in the playoffs again.

Agreed.  I'm still a little unsure about some of the free agents we've signed because of their ages.  He also needs to have a really good draft.  If he has another poor draft like he did in 2013 and our free agents don't contribute much, it might be time to look at someone else for the GM spot.

[Tracy Denton]

Agreed.  I'm still a little unsure about some of the free agents we've signed because of their ages.  He also needs to have a really good draft.  If he has another poor draft like he did in 2013 and our free agents don't contribute much, it might be time to look at someone else for the GM spot.

4 of the 7 2013 class are still on the roster with some starting.

[21isSuperman]

4 of the 7 2013 class are still on the roster with some starting.

Werner: I think he's been a huge disappointment as a first round pick.  I think this pick was a big mistake.  I didn't like it when it happened and I still don't like it.  Werner has shown some improvement, but I don't think he is where a former first round pick should be.

Thornton: Decent (but not great) when he plays, but can't stay healthy.

Holmes: Same as Thornton

Hughes: Pagano hyped up this guy like he was the second coming of Reggie White.  I think he said something like Hughes moves as quickly at Haloti Ngata and is as fast as guys 100 lbs lighter.  The hype on Hughes was really high, but I think he's failed to live up to it.  I haven't been that impressed with his play on the field.

Boyett:

Williams: Played decently well for Arizona last year

Cunningham: Not on the Colts

 

I understand that all GMs miss more than they hit, but I don't see a single reliable player in this group.  Werner is the closest, but he was scratched for the playoff game against the Pats.  When your super-hyped up first round pick (who "beats you with his want-to", according to Grigson) is a healthy scratch for the most important game your franchise has had in 4 years, that's a problem.

[AntonMcG]

Some things to note here:

 

1. I don't want Jim Harbaugh. While he is a good coach and has had success, he always seems to wear our his welcome fairly quickly wherever he's been. It's not necessarily a knock against him, it's just how his personality is based upon what's been said about him over the years.

 

2. The lack of defensive success thus far must fall on his shoulders as much as it does Grigson's. Grigson has preached non-stop about building the offensive and defensive lines but has had very little success in bringing in players that make a lasting impact. Now, some of that has been to injuries but overall, it's been a disappointment thus far.

 

3. On the other side of the ball, the main issue has been getting Andrew Luck a true weapon outside of TY and lack of running success. I'm not sure this can exactly fall on Pagano. They simply haven't had the outside weapon (until this year with Andre Johnson) nor the RB (Frank Gore changes this as well) to really make the Colts offense balanced in the way it needs to be. This year could see a change in that.

 

4. Like the saying goes, "It's sometimes better to stick it out with the devil you know then go looking for the angel you don't". While I'm sure there will be a boatload of coordinators and the like avaliable come end of this year, it may not exactly best for the Colts to shake up what they already have in place. There are plenty of teams that would be fine with the progress the Colts have made in such a short amount of time after a rebuild.

 

1. Harbaugh was adored at Stanford and adored in San Fran. You have very little basis for this comment.

 

2. Manusky is the DC, deserves a huge share of the blame... that said, our defense performed well for the majority of last year.

 

3. Reggie Wayne used to play for the Colts. Look him up.

 

4. You're saying it wrong.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

GIVE ME HARBUAGH OR GIVE ME DEATH

 

You'll be missed .