Question for the Old Timers... Is Colts QB history repeating itself?

[Indeee]

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

Johnny U's playing days led directly into Bert Jones and once Jones was gone it took 12 years until Harbough, but 15 years until Manning whose playing days led directly into Luck and since Luck has been gone it's been 6 years

 

You see the pattern? Are we experiencing Deja-vu all over again in regard to the QBs? 

 

6 years now and we will have 6 different starting QBs 

 

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

It does to me and I'm a not so Old, Old Timer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[LiveAndLetAddai]

  I remember Jonny U, I loved Bert, and I hated the 80's....regarding the Colts.  No. I see no trend, just evolution...

[DeepseaColt]

8 minutes ago, Indeee said:

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

Johnny U's playing days led directly into Bert Jones and once Jones was gone it took 12 years until Harbough, but 15 years until Manning whose playing days led directly into Luck and since Luck has been gone it's been 6 years

 

You see the pattern? Are we experiencing Deja-vu all over again in regard to the QBs? 

 

6 years now and we will have 6 different starting QBs 

 

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

It does to me and I'm a not so Old, Old Timer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I certainly hope it's not 15 years! 

[RollerColt]

6 minutes ago, Indeee said:

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

Johnny U's playing days led directly into Bert Jones and once Jones was gone it took 12 years until Harbough, but 15 years until Manning whose playing days led directly into Luck and since Luck has been gone it's been 6 years

 

You see the pattern? Are we experiencing Deja-vu all over again in regard to the QBs? 

 

6 years now and we will have 6 different starting QBs 

 

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

It does to me and I'm a not so Old, Old Timer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Possibly, but it’s hard to tell what the future holds 10-15 years from now. You just never know when that it factor QB walks into the laps of the organization. You could argue there’s no hope, but I’m going to just hold on a little longer that perhaps something good will happen to this organization again. Will it be this year or next? Who knows.

[Blueblood23]

1 hour ago, Indeee said:

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

Johnny U's playing days led directly into Bert Jones and once Jones was gone it took 12 years until Harbough, but 15 years until Manning whose playing days led directly into Luck and since Luck has been gone it's been 6 years

 

You see the pattern? Are we experiencing Deja-vu all over again in regard to the QBs? 

 

6 years now and we will have 6 different starting QBs 

 

Does it seem eerily familiar?

 

It does to me and I'm a not so Old, Old Timer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They just may have unloaded a talented QB today. Wentz has the physical attributes, but had little help from the OL due to injuries and a weak WR group. Would have liked to see Wentz for one more year with some WR help. Colts owner Irsay wanted him gone no matter what. So now Wentz is gone with no upgrade on the horizon. If they trade for Carr, most likely will overpay. Don’t see Carr or anyone else available an upgrade over Wentz. I see a mediocre future for a few years ahead. 

[The Old Crow]

Sounds eerie to me. Owner runs the QB out of town, and refuses to meet with him and clear the air. He tweets about 1980 Baltimore Colts but dead silence on Twitter on the Wentz deal. Reich apologizing hat in hand to owner on the Wentz deal. Almost a Baltimore 1980’s flashback !

[jvan1973]

8 minutes ago, The Old Crow said:

Sounds eerie to me. Owner runs the QB out of town, and refuses to meet with him and clear the air. He tweets about 1980 Baltimore Colts but dead silence on Twitter on the Wentz deal. Reich apologizing hat in hand to owner on the Wentz deal. Almost a Baltimore 1980’s flashback !

Except he did meet Wentz.   At least get the story right

[The Old Crow]

9 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Except he did meet Wentz.   At least get the story right

The story I heard was that he “ was out of town,” when a meeting was requested to clear the air, but they had a “ conversation “ later. Very cryptic . 

[Boondoggle]

There's two types of QBs in this league I think.  Developing and Elite.  If you're not the latter you're the former and there's no telling which of these guys will get to the latter.  So for me the concern is that Irsay is going to wield an axe on any option his team is going to be able to bring in.  Because the options aren't good.

 

I'm hoping they pull off something folks don't expect like a trade for Carr.  But I see no reason why teams that own those options would move them.  I mention the Raiders because someone drew a parallel between the head coach and Garoppolo which I find interesting.  That sort of opportunity though, if it does come up, is going to require quick action and aggressive offers of picks to emerge as the team with the QB, assuming it's possible.

 

Feels like this might be a rough season.  Which is probably going to doom Frank too.  So idk just a crazy direction here with what doesn't feel like a fallback plan in place but we'll see.

[Four2itus]

No. This team is way better assembled that when the Colts were QB poor in the past. 

 

However. the fans are WAY whinier than in the past. Apparently having internet on a phone and a twitter account makes you G.M. level smart....especially when seeing the choices in hindsight. 

[King Colt]

Don't lose sight of the old saying "It's very hard to get to the Super Bowl." I think Wents had a total of eight games with 200 yards passing. He was not the same QB after his covid and the stunning loss to Jacksonville was his guillotine. As far as the history of the Cots since Unitas there were definitely some lean years when they were embarrassing. Jones was great to watch and the Colts were a force. Jones to Carr was one of the best connections in the NFL much like Unitas to Berry. I am not looking forward to this coming season but I'll watch every game as always.

[JColts72]

Seems so after Bert Jones left until Peyton got drafted. 

[IndyD4U]

Shew! I'm just glad this question wasn't targeted towards me and my age group at 42 years old.

 

I was already preparing my 'damned kids' response.

[Indeee]

9 hours ago, The Old Crow said:

Sounds eerie to me. Owner runs the QB out of town, and refuses to meet with him and clear the air. He tweets about 1980 Baltimore Colts but dead silence on Twitter on the Wentz deal. Reich apologizing hat in hand to owner on the Wentz deal. Almost a Baltimore 1980’s flashback !

I, like you, lived through that 80's nightmare as I was in grade school and high school during those years and boy did I take a ribbing from other classmates and friends...Ha!! It was a comical nightmare of QB's during that time and I'm afraid we might be staring at it all over again. When Luck got injured/retired roughly in the same time frame Bert's career ended, it really ghosted me. I really hope I'm wrong about all of this

[Dingus McGirt]

9 hours ago, Blueblood23 said:

They just may have unloaded a talented QB today. Wentz has the physical attributes, but had little help from the OL due to injuries and a weak WR group. Would have liked to see Wentz for one more year with some WR help. Colts owner Irsay wanted him gone no matter what. So now Wentz is gone with no upgrade on the horizon. If they trade for Carr, most likely will overpay. Don’t see Carr or anyone else available an upgrade over Wentz. I see a mediocre future for a few years ahead. 

That would have been just another wasted season - at an unacceptable financial cost to the owner.  It's a business - never lose sight of that.

[The Old Crow]

53 minutes ago, Indeee said:

I, like you, lived through that 80's nightmare as I was in grade school and high school during those years and boy did I take a ribbing from other classmates and friends...Ha!! It was a comical nightmare of QB's during that time and I'm afraid we might be staring at it all over again. When Luck got injured/retired roughly in the same time frame Bert's career ended, it really ghosted me. I really hope I'm wrong about all of this

Those were definitely tough days to live through culminating in the Art Schleichter and John Elway debacles. 
The Wentz situation is interesting. Irsay seems to be taking the Wentz situation very personally, and his tweets , or lack there of, tell the tale. He has time to tweet about some old Baltimore Colt named Ricky Jones, but dead silence on the Wentz trade. 
In my opinion , when any owner makes proclamations about two SB’s in a decade, it puts pressure on the front office, and sometimes hasty decisions and signings are made, versus a more long term approach. Jerry Jones is certainly an example of this. 
You just have to be careful , and not let emotions rule the roost. 

[Smonroe]

I think we have a really good owner now, and a good front office (who knows for how long).

 

But that QB situation makes or breaks teams. 

 

There's no pattern, but the Colts have been one of the luckiest teams ever as far as QBs.  Maybe the football gods are now saying it's karma time?

[Indeee]

3 minutes ago, The Old Crow said:

Those were definitely tough days to live through culminating in the Art Schleichter and John Elway debacles. 
The Wentz situation is interesting. Irsay seems to be taking the Wentz situation very personally, and his tweets , or lack there of, tell the tale. He has time to tweet about some old Baltimore Colt named Ricky Jones, but dead silence on the Wentz trade. 
In my opinion , when any owner makes proclamations about two SB’s in a decade, it puts pressure on the front office, and sometimes hasty decisions and signings are made, versus a more long term approach. Jerry Jones is certainly an example of this. 
You just have to be careful , and not let emotions rule the roost. 

Well I was really just looking at this from a simple lens. The time periods were different and the details will always be. The outcome from that period vs. the potential outcome of this time period is really what I was referring to. As I stated earlier, 2022 will be 6 years in from Luck. It's quite possible that 6-9 years from 2022 might go by and this organization would not have found a long term solution to the QB as they didn't through the early 80's to mid 90's

[2006Coltsbestever]

10 hours ago, Blueblood23 said:

They just may have unloaded a talented QB today. Wentz has the physical attributes, but had little help from the OL due to injuries and a weak WR group. Would have liked to see Wentz for one more year with some WR help. Colts owner Irsay wanted him gone no matter what. So now Wentz is gone with no upgrade on the horizon. If they trade for Carr, most likely will overpay. Don’t see Carr or anyone else available an upgrade over Wentz. I see a mediocre future for a few years ahead. 

Wentz didn't have it between the ears. I tried to tell many in here it was a mistake when we traded for him. Then he did win me over and then I got duped 

[Indeee]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Wentz didn't have it between the ears. I tried to tell many in here it was a mistake when we traded for him. Then he did win me over and then I got duped 

Please don't get off topic in this thread. This isn't about any particular QB, it's about a freaky pattern of an organization having 2 elite QBs twice come their way and the time in-between them it took to find the elite QB again once those QBs retired or left the league. 

[AwesomeAustin]

It happens to most teams that have elite QBs

 

49rs have been irrelevant since Montana and Young

Denver after Elway took PM to get them back

Dolphins haven’t found the guy since Marino

Bengals did nothing since Boomer until this year

Bucs searched for 20yrs until Brady and probably will be in for another long stretch

Rams needed 20 years to get back to contending 

Redskins were a powerhouse in the 90s and have done nothing since

 

Its just the way it goes until you find the right QB and surround him with a good to great roster. Look at the Falcons, they have had Matt Ryan and made a SB and honestly cant tell you mich about any of their other years. Contending is extremely hard so buckle up folks...we are in for a long ride.  We will eventually reach our destination but it may take 2yrs or it could be 20.  We will always have 2006 tho!!

 

[2006Coltsbestever]

7 minutes ago, Indeee said:

Please don't get off topic in this thread. This isn't about any particular QB, it's about a freaky pattern of an organization having 2 elite QBs twice come their way and the time in-between them it took to find the elite QB again once those QBs retired or left the league. 

To your topic, I don't think it is repeating itself. We will find our QB shortly. I have faith in Ballard and Irsay. We had the misfortune of Luck retiring and then Rivers retiring so the 5 different QB's in 5 years is because 2 retired.

[Smonroe]

19 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

It happens to most teams that have elite QBs

 

49rs have been irrelevant since Montana and Young

Denver after Elway took PM to get them back

Dolphins haven’t found the guy since Marino

Bengals did nothing since Boomer until this year

Bucs searched for 20yrs until Brady and probably will be in for another long stretch

Rams needed 20 years to get back to contending 

Redskins were a powerhouse in the 90s and have done nothing since

 

Its just the way it goes until you find the right QB and surround him with a good to great roster. Look at the Falcons, they have had Matt Ryan and made a SB and honestly cant tell you mich about any of their other years. Contending is extremely hard so buckle up folks...we are in for a long ride.  We will eventually reach our destination but it may take 2yrs or it could be 20.  We will always have 2006 tho!!

 

 

Well, the 49ers have been in the SB twice since Young, so I wouldn't call that irrelevant. 

 

But your point is solid - without that franchise QB, you chances of grabbing the brass ring aren't very good.

[AwesomeAustin]

39 minutes ago, Smonroe said:

 

Well, the 49ers have been in the SB twice since Young, so I wouldn't call that irrelevant. 

 

But your point is solid - without that franchise QB, you chances of grabbing the brass ring aren't very good.

I saw I didn’t say until recently and didn’t feel like editing my post. I figured people would understand what I meant. 

[Blueblood23]

2 hours ago, Dingus McGirt said:

That would have been just another wasted season - at an unacceptable financial cost to the owner.  It's a business - never lose sight of that.

We will never know. I don’t think Wentz had a fair chance. 

[Four2itus]

1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Wentz didn't have it between the ears. I tried to tell many in here it was a mistake when we traded for him. Then he did win me over and then I got duped 

Duped? I still think that the Wentz attempt was a good one. It failed, but it was not a bad attempt. He could have used the opportunity to change his spots. It was the perfect set up. I believed in him, and even though he let himself down, he didn't let me down. 

 

Hey....I'm still here.....and he's gone. I win!

[John Waylon]

We’re about to have our 6th different starting QB in 6 years. We don’t need old timers to know if history is repeating…

[LJpalmbeacher2]

2 hours ago, Indeee said:

I, like you, lived through that 80's nightmare as I was in grade school and high school during those years and boy did I take a ribbing from other classmates and friends...Ha!! It was a comical nightmare of QB's during that time and I'm afraid we might be staring at it all over again. When Luck got injured/retired roughly in the same time frame Bert's career ended, it really ghosted me. I really hope I'm wrong about all of this

 

Also, during those eerie times, the colts drafted elway and he wouldn't come to the colts. So why they didn't try to trade him to bills for Kelly or Miami for Marino, I don't know....instead they wound up with Mark Hermann 

 

And then the colts were heading for another #1 pick with Testaverde in the draft but won the last two games to spoil that.

Turns out Testaverde didn't pan out anyway, I think with Tampa?

 

Anyway it does seem similar and I wouldn't be surprised if the colts don't acquire a "elite" QB for a long, long time. 

[bWild]

It’s only been 6 years of a QB carousel and we’ve been in the playoffs. This is nowhere near as bad as those 3-5 win seasons we suffered for years. Enjoy this time of us being competitive, would be my suggestion. 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

27 minutes ago, Blueblood23 said:

We will never know. I don’t think Wentz had a fair chance. 

 

Around the third week or so, a few of us said Irsay would use him as the scapegoat after he publicly started criticizing him....and he did.

But Wentz wasn't the answer.

 

[The Old Crow]

14 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

 

Around the third week or so, a few of us said Irsay would use him as the scapegoat after he publicly started criticizing him....and he did.

But Wentz wasn't the answer.

 

I don’t think Wentz was the answer, but why criticize publicly ? You just make the job of the GM harder in getting fair trade compensation. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

3 minutes ago, The Old Crow said:

I don’t think Wentz was the answer, but why criticize publicly ? You just make the job of the GM harder in getting fair trade compensation. 

Because Irsay put the pressure on to get a better QB. Ballard did a fantastic job by getting 2 3rds and getting rid of that contract. Now we need to make it right and stick with a QB for years.

[The Old Crow]

4 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Because Irsay put the pressure on to get a better QB. Ballard did a fantastic job by getting 2 3rds and getting rid of that contract. Now we need to make it right and stick with a QB for years.

The question is will Ballard reach for Jimmy G , or another mediocre QB because of the pressure , instead of taking a more measured approach. The other question is did they reach for Wentz because of the pressure ? Sure he got two thirds , but how about losing a one and three ? I think the best thing Ballard did was get rid of that full salary. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

4 minutes ago, The Old Crow said:

The question is will Ballard reach for Jimmy G , or another mediocre QB because of the pressure , instead of taking a more measured approach. The other question is did they reach for Wentz because of the pressure ? Sure he got two thirds , but how about losing a one and three ? I think the best thing Ballard did was get rid of that full salary. 

I would put Jimmy G in the good category, is he very good or great I would say no. To me Wentz like a Tannehill are above average. Carr is in the good category too. Problem with Carr is he has never had a team around him like we can provide. Give him Taylor then things will change. Hines would have a career year with Carr or Jimmy G as well. Pittman is good as well.

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, Four2itus said:

Duped? I still think that the Wentz attempt was a good one. It failed, but it was not a bad attempt. He could have used the opportunity to change his spots. It was the perfect set up. I believed in him, and even though he let himself down, he didn't let me down. 

 

Hey....I'm still here.....and he's gone. I win!

He let me down the last 2 weeks of the season. I was really starting think he was in the good category so yeah I used the word duped 

[The Old Crow]

14 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would put Jimmy G in the good category, is he very good or great I would say no. To me Wentz like a Tannehill are above average. Carr is in the good category too. Problem with Carr is he has never had a team around him like we can provide. Give him Taylor then things will change. Hines would have a career year with Carr or Jimmy G as well. Pittman is good as well.

You never know how they are going to do until they suit up, but do you want to take a chance on another shoulder surgery guy ? If you sign him, and recovery is moving slowly , do you think a few tweets may not come out that may cause him to rush the recovery because he’s not all chips in  ? Could be a scary Luck- like situation. 

[throwing BBZ]

 

 At some point we need to draft in the top 12-15 to get a shot at a really good QB prospect. Then he actually has to get good. lol

 If we draft one now he won't likely be that good till his year 3.

 Irsay is getting old, and we have a number of our best young players hitting their prime. 
 So it does make sense to pay a big price for someone that could get us to a SB. Who dat now, who dat next year?  Rotsa Ruck Jimbo! 

[buccolts]

If I respond, I'm admitting I'm old? 

Nice try.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Just now, buccolts said:

If I respond, I'm admitting I'm old? 

Nice try.

At least you are older than me  but I am old and feel old at 50. Pirates will probably be better than Cubs again that is how old we are.

[ColtV]

4 hours ago, Dingus McGirt said:

That would have been just another wasted season - at an unacceptable financial cost to the owner.  It's a business - never lose sight of that.

I agree, and I think that's one of the things that caused Irsay to make the public comments. The Colts have been spending big the last 2 seasons($450m in real dollars according to Spotrac). He's not getting what he's paying for.