Is Rivers a HOF?

[danlhart87]

This was a hot topic in another thread this past weekend that several people had various opinions on

 

I also asked Andrew on Colts Mailbag so looking forward to his answer. 

 

What are your thoughts?

IMO yes he has done enough to get in

[coming on strong]

Rivers will get in considering how the voting is now .  I think deion sanders hit the nail on the head when he said the hall of fame used to be for elite players now its just the hall of very good .    To be a HOF used to mean being the best of the best .  Its hard for me to say someone who was never a mvp or considered a top 5 QB during his playing time  belongs .    rivers is in a tough spot because during his career he had peyon , brady , rodgers , ben , drew ,   who were top 5 then wilson and mahomes come in .  can you say someone who was never a top 5 QB during his playing time is the best of the best?   If rivers can win a ring it changes the whole narrative and makes him a first ballad . If not it will take some time maybe 10 or 15 years after he retires to get in .

[IinD]

I think he is. I honestly was never a huge fan when he was in SD, but he's got #'s and longevity as a huge argument.

 

Granted he never dominated, but he was usually a top 10 guy for most of his career.

[danlhart87]

5 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

Rivers will get in considering how the voting is now .  I think deion sanders hit the nail on the head when he said the hall of fame used to be for elite players now its just the hall of very good .    To be a HOF used to mean being the best of the best .  Its hard for me to say someone who was never a mvp or considered a top 5 QB during his playing time  belongs .    rivers is in a tough spot because during his career he had peyon , brady , rodgers , ben , drew ,   who were top 5 then wilson and mahomes come in .  can you say someone who was never a top 5 QB during his playing time is the best of the best?   If rivers can win a ring it changes the whole narrative and makes him a first ballad . If not it will take some time maybe 10 or 15 years after he retires to get in .

You are basing him getting in on winning a ring but that doesn't matter 

 

Several players have gotten in without winning it all

[coming on strong]

1 minute ago, danlhart87 said:

You are basing him getting in on winning a ring but that doesn't matter 

 

Several players have gotten in without winning it all

No you misunderstood my point .   Dan marino no doubt belongs and he has no ring .   To me if a QB does not have a ring he needs to be a top 5 QB in his prime for multiple seasons .   i put rivers in the 6-10 range in his prime i would put him 6 out of 32 QBs in his prime  which is really good .  It depends what you consider hall of fame , if you think someone who is top 10 every year he played then yes he  belongs .   To me it needs to be the best of the best , for a QB it needs to be a players who was considered the best in the nfl for at least one season and a top 5 during his prime every year .  My point was if rivers gets a ring i put him in the same league as big ben and move him from top 6 to top 5 tied with ben

[2006Coltsbestever]

10 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

Rivers will get in considering how the voting is now .  I think deion sanders hit the nail on the head when he said the hall of fame used to be for elite players now its just the hall of very good .    To be a HOF used to mean being the best of the best .  Its hard for me to say someone who was never a mvp or considered a top 5 QB during his playing time  belongs .    rivers is in a tough spot because during his career he had peyon , brady , rodgers , ben , drew ,   who were top 5 then wilson and mahomes come in .  can you say someone who was never a top 5 QB during his playing time is the best of the best?   If rivers can win a ring it changes the whole narrative and makes him a first ballad . If not it will take some time maybe 10 or 15 years after he retires to get in .

Good points but I think Rivers has the longevity, stats, durability, and overall wins to get in. Probably 2nd ballot but I can see that. IMO for his 17 years in the league he has been pretty much a top 10 QB compared to his competition. He is still above average this year.

[crazycolt1]

23 minutes ago, coming on strong said:

Rivers will get in considering how the voting is now .  I think deion sanders hit the nail on the head when he said the hall of fame used to be for elite players now its just the hall of very good .    To be a HOF used to mean being the best of the best .  Its hard for me to say someone who was never a mvp or considered a top 5 QB during his playing time  belongs .    rivers is in a tough spot because during his career he had peyon , brady , rodgers , ben , drew ,   who were top 5 then wilson and mahomes come in .  can you say someone who was never a top 5 QB during his playing time is the best of the best?   If rivers can win a ring it changes the whole narrative and makes him a first ballad . If not it will take some time maybe 10 or 15 years after he retires to get in .

No matter if Rivers wins a ring or not has no bearing on him entering the HOF. 

A ring is a team orientated award. 

What other players did has zero to do with it. 

May I suggest going to the HOF web site and read how a player is voted into the HOF. 

 

 

[coming on strong]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

No matter if Rivers wins a ring or not has no bearing on him entering the HOF. 

A ring is a team orientated award. 

What other players did has zero to do with it. 

May I suggest going to the HOF web site and read how a player is voted into the HOF. 

 

 

rings do matter though .   if eli manning has zero rings does he get into HOF?    Its only one aspect though as i said in my other post .   dan marino is in because of the records and mvps.  My point was if you a player is not a legendary player and is borderline hall of fame then rings matter .   With Eli the rings will push him over the edge , same with rivers  i said rivers is ranked in my opinion 6 out of 32 during his prime a ring pushes him even and makes him tied with big ben for 5th making with a first ballard pick .  

[LJpalmbeacher2]

Depends on how he does in next game.

[csmopar]

56 minutes ago, danlhart87 said:

This was a hot topic in another thread this past weekend that several people had various opinions on

 

I also asked Andrew on Colts Mailbag so looking forward to his answer. 

 

What are your thoughts?

IMO yes he has done enough to get in

Borderline

[coming on strong]

2 minutes ago, csmopar said:

Borderline

that is why i said a ring for rivers will matter .   without it he is borderline hall of fame a ring pushes him into a first ballad pick .  he still will get in without one but it will take a while.

[Indyfan4life]

If Rivers manages to win a ring with us, he’ll make it in within 5 years of retiring. If he doesn’t win a ring, I’d say within 10 years. 

[Sumo63]

12 minutes ago, Indyfan4life said:

If Rivers manages to win a ring with us, he’ll make it in within 5 years of retiring. If he doesn’t win a ring, I’d say within 10 years. 

I have a feeling this team is going to get hot at the right time......homerism?  Probably.  But I do think a ring is possible this year with rivers under center. 

[IinD]

9 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

I have a feeling this team is going to get hot at the right time......homerism?  Probably.  But I do think a ring is possible this year with rivers under center. 

I'd love it obviously, but part of me will hate being remembered as the 'covid season winner', an asterisk type season.

 

But I'd be rooting my * off. Let's hope Rivers has it in him.

[danlhart87]

12 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

I have a feeling this team is going to get hot at the right time......homerism?  Probably.  But I do think a ring is possible this year with rivers under center. 

Any Given Sunday 

[Sumo63]

Just now, IinD said:

I'd love it obviously, but part of me will hate being remembered as the 'covid season winner', an asterisk type season.

 

But I'd be rooting my * off. Let's hope Rivers has it in him.

Honestly for an organization that will hang an "AFC championship participant" banner, a ring in the season of covid would be a step up.....no shame my man.

[2006Coltsbestever]

43 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Depends on how he does in next game.

 , yep. He is a HOFamer this week to many because we won but if plays like doo doo against the Lions and we lose he isn't again . 

 

In all seriousness I think he is though just based off of his stats, durability, and overall wins. He hasn't won a SB but Marino or Kelly didn't either.

[CR91]

I don't know. I kinda put him in the Kenny Anderson category. Great QB with stats to back it up, but no or little success in the post season. He'll get in, but not before Eli and Ben

[coming on strong]

4 minutes ago, Sumo63 said:

Honestly for an organization that will hang an "AFC championship participant" banner, a ring in the season of covid would be a step up.....no shame my man.

that was super embarrassing almost as embarrassing as the jim irsay ring pic

 

[Sumo63]

1 minute ago, coming on strong said:

that was super embarrassing almost as embarrassing as the jim irsay ring pic

jimirsayraw.0.webpUnavailable

Lol yea as a fan it brings me great shame.

[2006Coltsbestever]

Honestly I have no problem with hanging a Final 4 banner. That means you were 1 of the 4 best teams in the league - very tough to do, ask the Texans who have been to 0. To me that is better than winning the division and getting bounced in 1 game, if you win your division and get bounced in the 1st round that is worse but yet owners hang banners for that??

[Sumo63]

2 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Honestly I have no problem with hanging a Final 4 banner. That means you were 1 of the 4 best teams in the league - very tough to do, ask the Texans who have been to 0. To me that is better than winning the division and getting bounced in 1 game, if you win your division and get bounced in the 1st round that is worse but yet owners hang banners for that??

I can respect that.  Personally it just makes me shake my head and laugh a little........

[danlhart87]

10 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Honestly I have no problem with hanging a Final 4 banner. That means you were 1 of the 4 best teams in the league - very tough to do, ask the Texans who have been to 0. To me that is better than winning the division and getting bounced in 1 game, if you win your division and get bounced in the 1st round that is worse but yet owners hang banners for that??

Texans lol 

[Bolts2Colts]

3 hours ago, Sumo63 said:

I have a feeling this team is going to get hot at the right time......homerism?  Probably.  But I do think a ring is possible this year with rivers under center. 

I still vividly remember when Rivers led a 21-pt comeback vs  Bengals in his first year as a starter. Something about the team changed after that. They believed in each other and always knew they could win even if they fell into a big hole. 
 

They finished 14-2. 
 

Maybe we’ll see the same thing in his last season. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

12 minutes ago, Bolts2Colts said:

I still vividly remember when Rivers led a 21-pt comeback vs  Bengals in his first year as a starter. Something about the team changed after that. They believed in each other and always knew they could win even if they fell into a big hole. 
 

They finished 14-2. 
 

Maybe we’ll see the same thing in his last season. 

I think we can beat Tennessee with him under center.

[Four2itus]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I think we can beat Tennessee with him under center.

It begins and ends with stopping Henry. He is the engine that paves the way for the rest. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

19 minutes ago, Four2itus said:

It begins and ends with stopping Henry. He is the engine that paves the way for the rest. 

They have been squeaking by all year beating chumps, they come to Lucas there is no squeaking by 

[Lancer1]

6 hours ago, IinD said:

I'd love it obviously, but part of me will hate being remembered as the 'covid season winner', an asterisk type season.

 

But I'd be rooting my * off. Let's hope Rivers has it in him.

If the Dodgers beat Tampa Bay and win the World Series this year, do you think anyone will discount it due to COVID and the altered postseason eligibility & structure? I think not - they would've still vanquished every team they faced, and coming back from being down 3 games to 1 against the Braves (Atlanta should be renamed to signify their constant choking) is impressive whether you like them or not.

[2006Coltsbestever]

16 minutes ago, Lancer1 said:

If the Dodgers beat Tampa Bay and win the World Series this year, do you think anyone will discount it due to COVID and the altered postseason eligibility & structure? I think not - they would've still vanquished every team they faced, and coming back from being down 3 games to 1 against the Braves (Atlanta should be renamed to signify their constant choking) is impressive whether you like them or not.

If Rivers gets his ring, I could care less what people think. It is a ring under what ever circumstance. Every team is coping with the same stuff.

[Lancer1]

6 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

If Rivers gets his ring, I could care less what people think. It is a ring under what ever circumstance. Every team is coping with the same stuff.

Agreed

[Lancer1]

3 hours ago, Bolts2Colts said:

I still vividly remember when Rivers led a 21-pt comeback vs  Bengals in his first year as a starter. Something about the team changed after that. They believed in each other and always knew they could win even if they fell into a big hole. 
 

They finished 14-2. 
 

Maybe we’ll see the same thing in his last season. 

The following week Philip brought the Chargers back from being down by 17 in the 3rd Quarter to beat the Broncos, pretty impressive to win consecutive games after  having been down by at least 17 points in each.

[2006Coltsbestever]

This is why we brought Philip in, because that is Philip being Philip, down 21 and no problem. Oh what a fun day in here.  - I was never worried, we had Cincy right where we wanted them  

[indykmj]

No. But regardless, he'll probably eventually be voted in.

 

If nothing else, his (likely) post football, media gig will allow him to further score points 

enough voters on the fence to get it done.

[csmopar]

10 hours ago, IinD said:

I'd love it obviously, but part of me will hate being remembered as the 'covid season winner', an asterisk type season.

 

But I'd be rooting my * off. Let's hope Rivers has it in him.

Still a better asterisk than 6 time cheating champions. I mean if pats fans can live with cheating for each of their bowl wins, then surely we can live with winning it, if we did, during this Covid mess

[AZColt11]

By today's standards he will get in.  If this were 1975 he may have to wait a while.

[Myles]

I think he will get in the HOF.

Personally, I wouldn't put him in.  He's never been thought of as one of the 5 best QB's in the league during his career.  I think you have to compare a player to his peers at the time.   He should be in the Hall of Very Good. 

[chad72]

13 hours ago, csmopar said:

Borderline

 

Yep, not first ballot at least. Might take a second or third ballot to get him in. No one will mistake him for Dan Marino without a ring, not the same abilities or prolific nature to get in first ballot without a ring.

[DontEverGiveUp]

He is making the HOF, guaranteed.  Anyone that says otherwise is either a hater or does not have enough information to form their opinion.

 

Rivers will finish top 5 in TDs and yards, top 10 in passer rating, top 10 in wins.  He has 8 pro bowls (should be more) and should have won MVP in 2008...I believe some publications named him MVP that year, but not AP.  He was the best QB in the league over a three year stretch (2008-2010).

 

Had he played for a franchise capable of winning a super bowl, this wouldn't even be a discussion.  There's a reason Eli wasn't "allowed" to play in San Diego.  They had 35+ seasons of Fouts, Brees, and Rivers with no super bowl.  That says it all.

[DontEverGiveUp]

2 hours ago, Myles said:

I think he will get in the HOF.

Personally, I wouldn't put him in.  He's never been thought of as one of the 5 best QB's in the league during his career.  I think you have to compare a player to his peers at the time.   He should be in the Hall of Very Good. 

He has definitely been viewed as a top 5 QB at various points in his career.

 

Edited for further detail:

Rivers was top 5 (or better) in 2008, 2009, 2010, 2013, and 2018.  Top 10 in most of his other seasons.

[DontEverGiveUp]

15 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

 , yep. He is a HOFamer this week to many because we won but if plays like doo doo against the Lions and we lose he isn't again . 

 

In all seriousness I think he is though just based off of his stats, durability, and overall wins. He hasn't won a SB but Marino or Kelly didn't either.

Fouts never went to a SB either, and Rivers shattered all of his Chargers records.  Fouts still has significantly more career INTs as well.