Colts sign CB Patrick Robinson

[a06cc]

Don't jump the gun on this one. Let's wait and see what this team fields week one of this season. I'm excited too see. I personally just need to see week 1. Last season I expected great things. There were moments for sure last season. 

[DougDew]

3 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

How are you OK with our pass rush? I just don't get how you can be good with Cole and Mathis. I mean I love Mathis, and I think he might have another double digit sack season or 2 left in him. I definitely think he'll be even better than last year, but with his age we cant bet on that. As for Cole.....He's just awful. He had what? 2 sacks last year? Then we have Walden. Who is just Walden. He does his job stopping the run and setting a good edge against the run. He's not going to put up no 10-12 sacks. To put it simply. We absolutely have to have another pass rusher. We have to add one early in the draft, and said pass rusher needs to make an impact immediately in order for us to be true SB contenders IMO.

It doesn't look like there are any really good edge rushers in this year's draft.  But there seems to be quite a few from smaller schools that have some nice talent.  I predict the Colts will draft more than one in the mid to late rounds and let them develop this year.

 

The value at rounds 1 and 2 this year is at DT, OL, and CB.  We no longer need a starting CB so the other 2 areas are probably being looked at closely..as well as ILB Reggie Ragland.

[richard pallo]

Sorry, don't agree on reaching for a pass rusher at 18.  That would be a waste of a pick.  Protecting Luck is priority No.1  All the good pass rushers would be gone at 18 and it's not even a good pass rushing class.  No reaches please, BPA in position of need.  You can reach in the later rounds.  I want two starters in the first two rounds. 

[COLTS449]

8 minutes ago, DougDew said:

It doesn't look like there are any really good edge rushers in this year's draft.  But there seems to be quite a few from smaller schools that have some nice talent.  I predict the Colts will draft more than one in the mid to late rounds and let them develop this year.

 

The value at rounds 1 and 2 this year is at DT, OL, and CB.  We no longer need a starting CB so the other 2 areas are probably being looked at closely..as well as ILB Reggie Ragland.

 

I think we'll draft one in the 1st actually. No later than the 2nd. I'd be happy with Floyd, Spence, Ogbah, or Correa. Ogbah and Correa in a trade down, or Correa in the 2nd. Floyd and Spence should definitely be double digit sack OLB's IMO. And I think Correa has that kind of potential too. But I like some late round guys too. I hope we draft Floyd or Spence, then get a guy like Ochi, Judon, McCalister, Cowser, etc in the 5th or 7th.

 

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if we went Ragland at 18. Then Correa in the 2nd, and a G or C in the 3rd.

[ColtRider]

The signing definitely upgraded the defense. By how much? A good bit as far as the secondary goes v. last couple seasons. Overall defensive grade? Yet to be seen. The "new"direction of the franchise started to roll with "new"coaching. Today, another good move that reflects that. Robinson & Davis will have a lot to talk about. That's a good thing. Nice pick up, Indy. Forge on.

[BlueShoe]

1 hour ago, RealityIsLuck said:

3 years around 12 million according to Ian Rappaport. Great.

 

That is a steal for us.

 

This could turn out to be Grigson's best free agent signing (not already Colts) to date.

[DougDew]

22 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I think we'll draft one in the 1st actually. No later than the 2nd. I'd be happy with Floyd, Spence, Ogbah, or Correa. Ogbah and Correa in a trade down, or Correa in the 2nd. Floyd and Spence should definitely be double digit sack OLB's IMO. And I think Correa has that kind of potential too. But I like some late round guys too. I hope we draft Floyd or Spence, then get a guy like Ochi, Judon, McCalister, Cowser, etc in the 5th or 7th.

 

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if we went Ragland at 18. Then Correa in the 2nd, and a G or C in the 3rd.

Cole and Walden will start.  #18 pick you want to start right away, and we really don't need a starting OLB, but we need more rushers in the NASCAR package.  I think a lot of the guys you mentioned are a bit light to hold up against the run and are more suited for a rotational role, IMO. 

 

I think the 3 DL's need more help.  Parry gets worn down, and Henry and Jones are both coming off of injury.  Kerr is rotational.  Langford is really the only steady solid player at this point.  Another solid starter at #18 would align need and value quite well.  Especially if its Billings at NT, giving Parry backup duties.

 

Of course, the issue at OL is well known.

 

Last year, I was one of the few who thought that WR was a need, and we draft Dorsett, who was also BPA.  As it stands now, the signing of Robinson filled the biggest need, and I now think its DL or ILB...and I hope we don't draft Ragland because he would not be BPA if Billings or one of the OLs are still on the board.

[JlynRN]

Sounds like a good signing to me !!  Welcome to the Colts Patrick

[COLTS449]

9 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Cole and Walden will start.  #18 pick you want to start right away, and we really don't need a starting OLB, but we need more rushers in the NASCAR package.  I think a lot of the guys you mentioned are a bit light to hold up against the run and will be used only in passing downs. 

 

I think the 3 DL's need more help.  Parry gets worn down, and Henry and Jones are both coming off of injury.  Kerr is rotational.  Langford is really the only steady solid player at this point.  Another solid starter at #18 would align need and value quite well.  Especially if its Billings at NT, giving Parry backup duties.

 

Of course, the issue at OL is well known.

 

Last year, I was one of the few who thought that WR was a need, and we draft Dorsett, who was also BPA.  As it stands now, the signing of Robinson filled the biggest need, and I now think its DL or ILB...and I hope we don't draft Ragland because he would not be BPA if Billings or one of the OLs are still on the board.

 

I just gotta disagree with you on the OLB's Doug. First of all. Mathis will probably start over Cole if that's the case. 2nd. That is nowhere near a good enough pass rush for us to compete with the Pats, Steelers, and maybe even the Texans. We have Walden who's a good SAM. He does his job well. We need a pure pass rusher, even if he's not stout against the run (Floyd). I mean I just see it like, we have to have a young pass rusher who can put up double digit sacks if we want to be in the same category as NE, and Pitt. Both Spence and Floyd are worthy of the 18th overall pick. That's just what we need.  A young, game wrecking, double digit sack OLB. We may not be able to get a OLB like Spence or Floyd in next year's draft. I think we gotta pull the trigger. I agree with you about the DL. We need a big run stuffing NT. But one of Clark or Johnson will be there in the 2nd. I'm not as big on Clark, but I think Johnson can be a very good starting NT. Also as for the BPA thing. I feel either rone of Floyd or Spence would be the best player available at 18. Any OLB with double digit sack potential is typically going to be the BPA at 18.

[Gavin]

27 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Cole and Walden will start.  #18 pick you want to start right away, and we really don't need a starting OLB, but we need more rushers in the NASCAR package.  I think a lot of the guys you mentioned are a bit light to hold up against the run and will be used only in passing downs. 

 

I think the 3 DL's need more help.  Parry gets worn down, and Henry and Jones are both coming off of injury.  Kerr is rotational.  Langford is really the only steady solid player at this point.  Another solid starter at #18 would align need and value quite well.  Especially if its Billings at NT, giving Parry backup duties.

 

Of course, the issue at OL is well known.

 

Last year, I was one of the few who thought that WR was a need, and we draft Dorsett, who was also BPA.  As it stands now, the signing of Robinson filled the biggest need, and I now think its DL or ILB...and I hope we don't draft Ragland because he would not be BPA if Billings or one of the OLs are still on the board.

Leonard Floyd-244lbs

Ogbah-273lbs (Don't really want him)

Spence-251lbs

Mathis for comparison-245lbs

Cole-270lbs

Obiora-240lbs

Walden-250lbs

 

Weight is a non issue for any of them. If anything I think Cole and Ogbah would be better off dropping 10-15lbs

[DougDew]

1 minute ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I just gotta disagree with you on the OLB's Doug. First of all. Mathis will probably start over Cole if that's the case. 2nd. That is nowhere near a good enough pass rush for us to compete with the Pats, Steelers, and maybe even the Texans. We have Walden who's a good SAM. He does his job well. We need a pure pass rusher, even if he's not stout against the run (Floyd). I mean I just see it like, we have to have a young pass rusher who can put up double digit sacks if we want to be in the same category as NE, and Pitt. Both Spence and Floyd are worthy of the 18th overall pick. That's just what we need.  A young, game wrecking, double digit sack OLB. We may not be able to get a OLB like Spence or Floyd in next year's draft. I think we gotta pull the trigger. I agree with you about the DL. We need a big run stuffing NT. But one of Clark or Johnson will be there in the 2nd. I'm not as big on Clark, but I think Johnson can be a very good starting NT. Also as for the BPA thing. I feel either rone of Floyd or Spence would be the best player available at 18. Any OLB with double digit sack potential is typically going to be the BPA at 18.

Actually, we don't need a run stuffing NT.  We need one to get some pass rush from the middle, which is what Billings supposedly can do.

 

There is a thread over in the NFL draft forum that talks about teams needs and picks post Robinson, so I'm going to now confine my draft comments for over there.......

[COLTS449]

45 minutes ago, richard pallo said:

Sorry, don't agree on reaching for a pass rusher at 18.  That would be a waste of a pick.  Protecting Luck is priority No.1  All the good pass rushers would be gone at 18 and it's not even a good pass rushing class.  No reaches please, BPA in position of need.  You can reach in the later rounds.  I want two starters in the first two rounds. 

 

If a pass rusher with double digit potential is sitting there available at 18 how is he a reach or not the BPA? And yes protecting Luck is something we HAVE to do. but we can get a very good day 1 starting Guard AND Center in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. I think something like Spence/Whitehair/Westerman would be the best possible scenario for us. We'd get our premier pass rusher, a stud RG, and Westerman, who IMO, could end up being a very good Center in our new ZBS.

[Patagonia Chris]

These are the kind of signings that Grigson has excelled at while in Indianapolis. I think that the secondary has a chance to be really good this season. Now, if they could just add some pass rushers....

[DougDew]

2 minutes ago, Gavin said:

Leonard Floyd-244lbs

Ogbah-273lbs (Don't really want him)

Spence-251lbs

Mathis for comparison-245lbs

Cole-270lbs

Obiora-240lbs

Walden-250lbs

 

Weight is a non issue for any of them. If anything I think Cole and Ogbah would be better of dropping 10-15lbs

I never compare any college player to Mathis.  He is/was a one-off special player.  I simply think that any OLB rush guy we draft will be #3 behind Cole and Mathis.  Re-doing Cole's deal pretty much told me that they were going to rely on him to get most of the PT at the rush spot this year.  Maybe not, but I think the Colts are looking at Ragland, OL, or DT for pick #18.

 

I'll talk about draft options over in the other section.....

 

[DougDew]

7 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

If a pass rusher with double digit potential is sitting there available at 18 how is he a reach or not the BPA? And yes protecting Luck is something we HAVE to do. but we can get a very good day 1 starting Guard AND Center in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. I think something like Spence/Whitehair/Westerman would be the best possible scenario for us. We'd get our premier pass rusher, a stud RG, and Westerman, who IMO, could end up being a very good Center in our new ZBS.

I'd rather have Mathis, Cole, and Billings than Spence, Parry and either Mathis or Cole sitting on the bench earning $5 million.

[Virtuoso80]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

If you look at Rappaports post,  it says MORE THAN 12 Mill.   

 

So,  odds are the $14 Mill figure is correct.

yeah i did mention that in a later post after my original post.

[Yoshinator]

Just learned the news and I'm very excited! This is why you have a little patience. Proud of Grigson for securing him and giving us a little present before the draft!

[SaturdayAllDay]

1 hour ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I think we'll draft one in the 1st actually. No later than the 2nd. I'd be happy with Floyd, Spence, Ogbah, or Correa. Ogbah and Correa in a trade down, or Correa in the 2nd. Floyd and Spence should definitely be double digit sack OLB's IMO. And I think Correa has that kind of potential too. But I like some late round guys too. I hope we draft Floyd or Spence, then get a guy like Ochi, Judon, McCalister, Cowser, etc in the 5th or 7th.

 

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if we went Ragland at 18. Then Correa in the 2nd, and a G or C in the 3rd.

How many years do you think it will take before Spence or Floyd get 10+ sacks in a season? I'm all for fixing the pass rush but I think it will take time. 

[NorthernBlue]

3 minutes ago, SaturdayAllDay said:

How many years do you think it will take before Spence or Floyd get 10+ sacks in a season? I'm all for fixing the pass rush but I think it will take time. 

Floyd especially 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I think we'll draft one in the 1st actually. No later than the 2nd. I'd be happy with Floyd, Spence, Ogbah, or Correa. Ogbah and Correa in a trade down, or Correa in the 2nd. Floyd and Spence should definitely be double digit sack OLB's IMO. And I think Correa has that kind of potential too. But I like some late round guys too. I hope we draft Floyd or Spence, then get a guy like Ochi, Judon, McCalister, Cowser, etc in the 5th or 7th.

 

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if we went Ragland at 18. Then Correa in the 2nd, and a G or C in the 3rd.

 

The problem with hoping for Correa in the 2nd is that there are likely going to be a large number of teams who will want him in the 2nd.     I've seen mocks with Correa in the bottom of the 1st.     But even if he's not taken there,  any team who didn't get the OLB-pass rusher they wanted will likely hope for Correa in the 2nd.   So, the odds of him falling to the Colts at pick 48 is not great.      Odds are he'll be long gone by then.

 

I hope I'm wrong --- I'd love to snag him there --- but I wouldn't get my hopes up too high....    it's a LEAN year for pass rush...

 

[COLTS449]

22 minutes ago, SaturdayAllDay said:

How many years do you think it will take before Spence or Floyd get 10+ sacks in a season? I'm all for fixing the pass rush but I think it will take time. 

 

Its just my opinion, but I fell from a pass rush standpoint, that both can come in and make an impact right away. I think both have the ability to get 8 or 10 sacks in their rookie years. It may take Floyd a year to improve in other areas, but he can straight up get after the QB. Some disagree, but I just think both can make an early impact.

[ColtRider]

1 hour ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I think we'll draft one in the 1st actually. No later than the 2nd. I'd be happy with Floyd, Spence, Ogbah, or Correa. Ogbah and Correa in a trade down, or Correa in the 2nd. Floyd and Spence should definitely be double digit sack OLB's IMO. And I think Correa has that kind of potential too. But I like some late round guys too. I hope we draft Floyd or Spence, then get a guy like Ochi, Judon, McCalister, Cowser, etc in the 5th or 7th.

 

I wouldn't be one bit surprised if we went Ragland at 18. Then Correa in the 2nd, and a G or C in the 3rd.

 

I know I've stated this over & over, but if RR is there at BPA 18? Grabbing this kid at ILB would serve many purposes. Run stopper. QB rusher. Intelligent. A very good tackler. Can see plays before they develop (instinct). Turnover factor. Moves laterally across the field with ease. Sheds blockers. Coverage weakness overblown. A proven team leader on defense. That's a lot of quantity with quality. 

[Gavin]

5 minutes ago, SaturdayAllDay said:

How many years do you think it will take before Spence or Floyd get 10+ sacks in a season? I'm all for fixing the pass rush but I think it will take time. 

2 years at the most I'm thinking unless they bench him for not playing like an All Pro from day 1, Also lets not forget he is versatile enough to play ILB, Keep in mind also it took Newsome 1 year to get 6 because he has a quick first step. Floyds is a bit quicker and also plays with more play recognition and with a couple pass rush moves to match

[MTC]

 

3 years $14 million.

[SaturdayAllDay]

14 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

Its just my opinion, but I fell from a pass rush standpoint, that both can come in and make an impact right away. I think both have the ability to get 8 or 10 sacks in their rookie years. It may take Floyd a year to improve in other areas, but he can straight up get after the QB. Some disagree, but I just think both can make an early impact.

I won't say that they won't make an impact, but 10+ sacks for a rookie is something that hasnt been seen in the last four draft classes (at least, that's all I have data for). I don't think Spence or Floyd are significantly better then any pass rusher from the last four years. The most according to the data I had was 8,  from Irvin (2012), ansah (2013) and P Smith (2015), with the average amount of sacks per rookie (top 50 picks only)  being just over 3 sacks a year. 

With Spence I could see 6-8,  And MAYBE around there from Floyd if he has a late push. I just don't see either of them as once in a generation players, which they would need to be to break 10 sacks as a rookie.  

[Coltsman1788]

We don't know yet if he can be the answer at #2.  He is known to be better in the slot than the outside where he has had his limitations.  Of course Griggs signs him to play outside as the 2.   Lol.   Better than Toler at least but nothing to hoop and holler about until we see how he looks in our system where he will likely be forced outside because we have a secondary full of slot caliber corners and Vontae. 

[Gavin]

58 minutes ago, SaturdayAllDay said:

I won't say that they won't make an impact, but 10+ sacks for a rookie is something that hasnt been seen in the last four draft classes (at least, that's all I have data for). I don't think Spence or Floyd are significantly better then any pass rusher from the last four years. The most according to the data I had was 8,  from Irvin (2012), ansah (2013) and P Smith (2015), with the average amount of sacks per rookie (top 50 picks only)  being just over 3 sacks a year. 

With Spence I could see 6-8,  And MAYBE around there from Floyd if he has a late push. I just don't see either of them as once in a generation players, which they would need to be to break 10 sacks as a rookie.  

Once in a generation players rarely go as low as 18, Great players? Of course. Hall Of Fame players? Of course...Once in a generation?. I also don't really see why you settled with 10 sacks for a rookie 1st round pass rusher

 

Bruce Smith had 6.5 his rookie year (Doouble digits year 2)

Reggie White-13 rookie year

Kevin Green-0 (Did not have double digits till year 4)

Chris Doleman-0.5 rookie year, double digits year 3

Micheal Strahan-1 sack rookie year, double digits year 5

Jason Taylor-5 sacks his rookie year, double digits year 4

John Randle-1 sack rookie year, double digits year 3

Richard Dent-3 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Jared Allen-9 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Julius Peppers-12 sacks rookie year

Demarcus Ware-8 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

John Abraham-4 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Lawrence Taylor-I read 9.5

Leslie O'neal-12.5 rookie year

Ricky Jackson-8 rookie year

Derrick Thomas-10 rookie year

Simeon Rice-12 sacks rookie year

Clyde Simmons-2 sacks rookie year

Dwight Freeney-13 sacks rookie year

Robert Mathis-3.5 sacks rookie year

 

That's the top 20 all time sack leaders to date to. 6 of 20 put up double digits. 9 of 20 put up 5 or less.

 

Most draft picks don't play like all pros or many times not even real well at all in year 1. Also once in a generation means.....well once..... Maybe every 10 years or so. Now there are plenty of players that have the physical skill to claim that and produce great for a few years but ya got to have long term production in my opinion

 

 

 

 

[SaturdayAllDay]

32 minutes ago, Gavin said:

Once in a generation players rarely go as low as 18, Great players? Of course. Hall Of Fame players? Of course...Once in a generation?. I also don't really see why you settled with 10 sacks for a rookie 1st round pass rusher

 

Bruce Smith had 6.5 his rookie year (Doouble digits year 2)

Reggie White-13 rookie year

Kevin Green-0 (Did not have double digits till year 4)

Chris Doleman-0.5 rookie year, double digits year 3

Micheal Strahan-1 sack rookie year, double digits year 5

Jason Taylor-5 sacks his rookie year, double digits year 4

John Randle-1 sack rookie year, double digits year 3

Richard Dent-3 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Jared Allen-9 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Julius Peppers-12 sacks rookie year

Demarcus Ware-8 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

John Abraham-4 sacks rookie year, double digits year 2

Lawrence Taylor-I read 9.5

Leslie O'neal-12.5 rookie year

Ricky Jackson-8 rookie year

Derrick Thomas-10 rookie year

Simeon Rice-12 sacks rookie year

Clyde Simmons-2 sacks rookie year

Dwight Freeney-13 sacks rookie year

Robert Mathis-3.5 sacks rookie year

 

That's the top 20 all time sack leaders to date to. 6 of 20 put up double digits. 9 of 20 put up 5 or less.

 

Most draft picks don't play like all pros or many times not even real well at all in year 1. Also once in a generation means.....well once..... Maybe every 10 years or so. Now there are plenty of players that have the physical skill to claim that and produce great for a few years but ya got to have long term production in my opinion

 

 

 

 

Which was the point I was making..... That pass rushers rarely get 10+ sacks as a rookie, which was what COLTS449 said he expected out of Floyd AND Spence in year one. To get 10 sacks as a rookie is a once in a generation thing. We are on the same page here, just a little mis-communication I think. 

[ty4atd]

33 minutes ago, Gavin said:

 

Most draft picks don't play like all pros or many times not even real well at all in year 1. Also once in a generation means.....well once..... Maybe every 10 years or so. Now there are plenty of players that have the physical skill to claim that and produce great for a few years but ya got to have long term production in my opinion

 

 

 

 

 

That's exactly why drafting Spence or Floyd and expecting either to be 8-10+ sack guys in year one is unlikely. They may be good picks in the long run but odds are they won't be getting a tonne of sacks year 1. I'd like Floyd in the 1st because I think he had more upside in the future while still giving us better depth and rush but not huge things year 1, Spence I wouldn't touch in the 1st only if he slides to our 2nd pick.

[Superman]

6 hours ago, CR91 said:

 

not exactly a shutdown, but dependable. he wont get beaten easily

 

He didn't give up very many yards last season. I think less than 400...

[Gavin]

14 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

He didn't give up very many yards last season. I think less than 400...

I haven't watched any of him since NO but I read from multiple articles he played in the slot and gave up 300......But we are bringing him in supposedly to be our #2 and hes going to be in Man coverage a lot so.......We shall see. To be honest I'm expecting a healthier version of Toler but hoping for the best

[HungarianColtsFan]

IMO this is a smart signing, DL needs some decent addition.

[SteelDragon]

Great signing,  indeed.  A veteran starter at CB for a little more than 4 mil/per?solid move

[Dustin]

Kind of meh on this. He had a great season in San Diego but was beyond hot garbage in New Orleans. 

[JPFolks]

10 hours ago, csmopar said:

No, that's being saved for if he picks a RB at 18....

If Elliot is there, they should pick him, but a lot of folks say he'll be long gone... no one else in the entire draft is worth a pick in any round in my opinion.  This is a one back class.  Otherwise Gore and our two signings will have to do.  

[ProblChld32]

I am ecstatic, Robinson is a very Solid Corner, we now have a legitimate #2 corner 

[lollygagger8]

All those coaching changes really helped out since he had ties to the San Diego DB coach. Good job Pagano/Grigs. 

 

I am SO happy we got someone to replace Toler!!!!  

[SilentHill]

I feel like Grigson is finally understanding the value of Luck and culture. You don't need to overpay these FA's a lot of them would come here for less to play with the likes of Andrew Luck and co.

[Jason_]

33 minutes ago, SilentHill said:

I feel like Grigson is finally understanding the value of Luck and culture. You don't need to overpay these FA's a lot of them would come here for less to play with the likes of Andrew Luck and co.

 

what about this signing gives you that impression?

[SilentHill]

Just now, Jason_S said:

 

what about this signing gives you that impression?

 

Well i thought it was 3yr 12 mil but now I'm seeing diff numbers?