Will Marvin be a first-ballot hof'er? [Merge]

[Jason_]

Marvin's off-field issues, true or not, won't get in the way. The hall in Canton isn't a boy's club that looks done on people like the hall up in Cooperstown. Not meant to be a knock at baseball because I love baseball.

 

I think Marvin can be a first ballot, but I don't think he will be. Too many receivers in line.

 

let's play hypothetical just for a minute then...suppose that Marvin had been charged and was convicted of the shooting and murder.  do you think he would still get in the HOF?

[GoColts8818]

Marvin has the numbers of the second greatest WR to ever play the game and unlike a guy like Cris Carter he wasn't hated as a person.  The only two things that you can hold against Marvin are the lack of playoff success and the off the field issue in which he was never charged so I don't know how you can honestly hold him accountable for something that they couldn't even bring charges against him for.  So take that out of the equation for a second and realistic Marvin had a career much like Manning one of top two to three guys to ever play the game at his position without a glowing post season.  So if you say Marvin shouldn't go in on the first ballot IMO then you shouldn't argue Manning should go in on the first ballot either.  If presented like that I don't think many would argue Manning shouldn't go in on the first ballot when his time comes.  So that probably tells you where Marvin stands IMO.

 

Dungy is also up next year and while I don't know who else is up in 2014 it's my understanding it's a pretty stacked group.  I think Marvin should go in regardless of who he is up against.  I think Dungy might have to wait a little bit but will go in sooner or later. 

[Jason_]

Marvin has the numbers of the second greatest WR to ever play the game and unlike a guy like Cris Carter he wasn't hated as a person.  The only two things that you can hold against Marvin are the lack of playoff success and the off the field issue in which he was never charged so I don't know how you can honestly hold him accountable for something that they couldn't even bring charges against him for.  So take that out of the equation for a second and realistic Marvin had a career much like Manning one of top two to three guys to ever play the game at his position without a glowing post season.  So if you say Marvin shouldn't go in on the first ballot IMO then you shouldn't argue Manning should go in on the first ballot either.  If presented like that I don't think many would argue Manning shouldn't go in on the first ballot when his time comes.  So that probably tells you where Marvin stands IMO.

 

Dungy is also up next year and while I don't know who else is up in 2014 it's my understanding it's a pretty stacked group.  I think Marvin should go in regardless of who he is up against.  I think Dungy might have to wait a little bit but will go in sooner or later. 

 

If this were directed at all towards me, I did not say Marvin shouldn't get in on the first ballot.  I said that if Carter didn't then I doubt Marvin will either.  Not that he should or should not but that he won't imo.  Marvin had one more career reception than Carter and Carter had 2 more TD catches so their numbers are remarkably similar.  It took Carter what, 5 years to get in?  Going strictly from a "what they did on the field" perspective, I don't see what MH did that was so much more remarkable than what Carter did that would allow MH to get in first ballot when it took CC 5 years.  

[Dustin]

If this were directed at all towards me, I did not say Marvin shouldn't get in on the first ballot. I said that if Carter didn't then I doubt Marvin will either. Not that he should or should not but that he won't imo. Marvin had one more career reception than Carter and Carter had 2 more TD catches so their numbers are remarkably similar. It took Carter what, 5 years to get in? Going strictly from a "what they did on the field" perspective, I don't see what MH did that was so much more remarkable than what Carter did that would allow MH to get in first ballot when it took CC 5 years.

Marvin played 28 less games.

[jamesie jr]

Yes he should get in 1st ballot

[coltsfanatic24]

He will make it he's one of the top 5 WR's of all time.

[John Waylon]

Marvin has the numbers of the second greatest WR to ever play the game and unlike a guy like Cris Carter he wasn't hated as a person.  The only two things that you can hold against Marvin are the lack of playoff success and the off the field issue in which he was never charged so I don't know how you can honestly hold him accountable for something that they couldn't even bring charges against him for.  So take that out of the equation for a second and realistic Marvin had a career much like Manning one of top two to three guys to ever play the game at his position without a glowing post season.  So if you say Marvin shouldn't go in on the first ballot IMO then you shouldn't argue Manning should go in on the first ballot either.  If presented like that I don't think many would argue Manning shouldn't go in on the first ballot when his time comes.  So that probably tells you where Marvin stands IMO.

 

Dungy is also up next year and while I don't know who else is up in 2014 it's my understanding it's a pretty stacked group.  I think Marvin should go in regardless of who he is up against.  I think Dungy might have to wait a little bit but will go in sooner or later. 

 

I'd beat the like button to death if I could. 

 

This post is so full of common sense they should shut the thread down and leave it be at this.

 

Dungy is the dark horse, I think. He turned Tampa from a perennial joke to a yearly contender, first African-American to reach, and win the Super Bowl.... I think he is going to get in next year.

 

As far as others becoming elligible, the list includes: Derrick Brooks, Mike Holmgren, Shaun Alexander, Rodney Harrison, Zach Thomas, and Willie McGinest. 

 

Brooks is the only name on that list I expect to get first ballot consideration. 

 

Just imagine FNIA if Dungy got in and Harrison didn't.... 

[NewColtsFan]

I'm not the least bit worried by Marvin's off the field issues....

 

That said, I think there's little to no chance that Marvin gets in on the first ballot.    He'll eventually get in...   but if guys like Cris Carter,  Tim Brown,  Andre Reed and others had to wait,  then Marvin is going to have to wait.

 

Jerry Rice got in on the first ballot.   Marvin was great,  but he was not Jerry Rice great.    So, Marvin has to weight...

 

Remember, the NFL is only letting in about 5-6 players a year...   that's it.   The others are a coach/owner and some old timer...

 

There just aren't enough spaces for all the deserving players.     It may not be fair, but it is what it is.

 

Yes, he gets into the Hall,  but not on the first ballot.     And...   I'm OK with that.....

 

Just one person's view, and your mileage may vary.....

[AllYouNeedIsLuck]

He's 3rd all time in receiving yards and 9th in TD's. I don't see why not. 

[Le Neon]

Marvin has the numbers of the second greatest WR to ever play the game and unlike a guy like Cris Carter he wasn't hated as a person.  The only two things that you can hold against Marvin are the lack of playoff success and the off the field issue in which he was never charged so I don't know how you can honestly hold him accountable for something that they couldn't even bring charges against him for.  So take that out of the equation for a second and realistic Marvin had a career much like Manning one of top two to three guys to ever play the game at his position without a glowing post season.  So if you say Marvin shouldn't go in on the first ballot IMO then you shouldn't argue Manning should go in on the first ballot either.  If presented like that I don't think many would argue Manning shouldn't go in on the first ballot when his time comes.  So that probably tells you where Marvin stands IMO.

 

Dungy is also up next year and while I don't know who else is up in 2014 it's my understanding it's a pretty stacked group.  I think Marvin should go in regardless of who he is up against.  I think Dungy might have to wait a little bit but will go in sooner or later. 

 

The difference is Manning has clearly separated himself from the pack and will have no competition splitting votes.

 

Marvin Harrison will have to beat Tim Brown, who has similar receiving numbers but significantly more all purpose yards, and Andre Reed. I think Marvin is clearly ahead of Reed, not as sure about Brown.

[southwest1]

He should be, but I have a feeling it might take him a while...

Yup, well put Coltswarriors. SW1 never views the HOF as 1st ballad, 2nd ballot, 3rd ballot, or 4th ballot...It's like being pregnant. You either are or you aren't. Marvin will get in this exclusive club eventually just be patient.

[T Y Goodbye]

Stupid question, that may or may not be relevant...Did Marvin actually formally retire?...Would that have any affect if he didn't since he's been unsigned for the required time now?

[Superman]

Stupid question, that may or may not be relevant...Did Marvin actually formally retire?...Would that have any affect if he didn't since he's been unsigned for the required time now?

I'm not sure if he filed paperwork, or if he'd be required to for eligibility. But he hasn't been active since 2008, and that's what I think matters.

[T Y Goodbye]

I'm not sure if he filed paperwork, or if he'd be required to for eligibility. But he hasn't been active since 2008, and that's what I think matters.

 

Thanks..i wasn't really sure how the whole process works to determine HOF eligibility

[BOTT]

I'm hoping Don Coryell makes it

[UKColt13]

As long as he gets in I'm not worried. But it would be nice to see him get in 1st time. No one can say that he doesn't deserve it.

[southwest1]

Thanks..i wasn't really sure how the whole process works to determine HOF eligibility

I just wish the NFL HOF committee would get more former players on it vs TV & print personalities on it. And for the love of God, please put some former defensive greats on it...I beg of you. D never gets enough respect IMO. Put Charles Haley on it so a 5 time SB Champion can get his just dues before I or he passes on please. It's getting pathetic already. Thank you.

 

Put Rod Woodson on the list of HOF voters too...JMO...

[jvan1973]

I just wish the NFL HOF committee would get more former players on it vs TV & print personalities on it. And for the love of God, please put some former defensive greats on it...I beg of you. D never gets enough respect IMO. Put Charles Haley on it so a 5 time SB Champion can get his just dues before I or he passes on please. It's getting pathetic already. Thank you.

Put Rod Woodson on the list of HOF voters too...JMO...

i think all living members of the hall should get a vote

[NewColtsFan]

I'm hoping Don Coryell makes it

 

I'm with you....    the list of great coaches who got their start under Coryell is incredibly impressive...

 

And this story details his remarkable.    A completely under-rated coach....  and those that know him,  all claim he was scary smart at his business..

 

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/page/coachingtreecoryell130524/greatest-nfl-coaches-don-coryell-branch-sid-gillman-coaching-tree

[#12]

Based on what he did on the field, it should be a no-brainer.  As far as the "scandal" goes, who knows what really happened.  To this day, I couldn't tell you what was true and what was sensational reporting. 

[southwest1]

HOF doesn't consider off field incidents....not supposed to anyway.

You are probably right BOTT, but what I worry about is close player bids for HOF consideration & writers use off the field scraps as justification to eliminate a worthy candidate like Marvin Harrison. Sometimes journalists look for any excuse to say no to a guy. That's part of the reason I want legendary safeties, LBs, DE's, & Corners on the HOF voting lists because they know who the the toughest, smartest, & never give up TEs, WRs, & RBs are because they faced them week in, week out for years. 

[Deathiltis]

Top 5 receiver all time. No question he should be a first ballad HOF

[southwest1]

i think all living members of the hall should get a vote

If that is true & I have no reason to doubt you Jvan, That does make me feel a little better.   It still troubles me to see some many journalists on that HOF list are journalists though. I respect journalists. Nothing against them. Some do fantastic work. I just wanna see a nice mix of reporters, offensive players, defensive players, & make a special teams HOF category too. 

[jvan1973]

If that is true & I have no reason to doubt you Jvan, That does make me feel a little better. It still troubles me to see some many journalists on that HOF list are journalists though. I respect journalists. Nothing against them. Some do fantastic work. I just wanna see a nice mix of reporters, offensive players, defensive players, & make a special teams HOF category too.

no, i think they should. Right now they don't

[Larry Horseman]

Harrison and Brown are on a different level than Reed statistically. Harrison and Brown are pretty much even in yards and receptions, and Marvin has 28 more TDs than Brown. Brown played 4 more years than Harrison, which make Marvin's numbers look even stronger. Brown does have a leg-up in longevity. Marvin may not get in next year, but I think he has the strongest resume of the three taking everything into consideration.

[FastStarts]

As long as Morten Andersen gets in, my Danish heart is happy!

[Smonroe]

That's one acceptance speech that I won't miss.  Has Marvin ever talked for more than two minutes?  Other than to talk about his favorite cereals.

[IndyTrav]

The over/under on IndyTrav coming in and saying he shouldn't even get in the HoF is 10 posts.

Im late, but Im here.

 

 

Yeah Hines Ward is so much better /s.

 

Haters be hating. I can make the argument for him to be in before Marvin again, if everyone would like to see.

But with Carter now going in, I think Marvin does in fact make it. But Im guessing its going to be at least a 7yr process.

[PrincetonTiger]

He will be in Canton but probably not on his first try.

[Dustin]

Im late, but Im here.

Haters be hating. I can make the argument for him to be in before Marvin again, if everyone would like to see.

But with Carter now going in, I think Marvin does in fact make it. But Im guessing its going to be at least a 7yr process.

I would love to see it.

[Andy]

He definitely deserves to be in the HOF.

 

Does he deserve to be in the Hall next year over Tim Brown and/or Andre Reed. That's a tough question and because they've been waiting awhile, I don't think Marvin will get in over them. Now, some of you may think "why can't all three go in?" because it's very rare for 3 players that play the same position to go in in one class. 

 

He'll get in, just maybe not next year. 

[southwest1]

no, i think they should. Right now they don't

Okay, my bad. SW1 should have realized that sounded too good to be true.  The eternal optimist inside of me needs to wise up & let the sarcastic side of my personality take over sometimes.

 

You know, you make an excellent point Jvan, why in the world don't HOF greats get a chance to vote anyway? What's the point of inducting new members if your voice is irrelevant after the yellow jacket is put on? Sure, players who excelled at this game & know this great game blindfolded, don't deserve an opportunity to lay down their input or footprint for subsequent NFL generations that follow them...Crazy just crazy, if you ask me Jvan. Well said man. Well said. 

[southwest1]

Hey, why doesn't NFL Network or ESPN 30 for 30 document what campaigning for a successful HOF bid really entails? Use Marvin Harrison & Charles Haley as your test cases. I want somebody like Haley used because he refuses to kiss the media's caboose. A player can let their record speak for itself without stroking the egos of reporters IMO. Be respectful without selling your soul to the media devil IMO. It's not easy. But like Johnny Cash sang "I walk the line."

 

Explore what's really involved. Developing an intense fan club, going on a national radio media tour, speaking directly with your state senator, doing interviews on 60 minutes Steve Kroft a superb investigative journalist. Talk about the current state of the league, penalties stacked up against defense, the evolution of the league over time, & whether many reporters who never played a down of pro ball deserve the supreme authority to decide who gets a bust in Canton & who doesn't. 

 

Also, what credentials are required to get on the HOF list as a writer & former player & what is protocol for replacing a person who resigns from this list & evaluating other players? SW1 wants to eat the forbidden fruit & see behind the mysterious curtain. Just like politics & legislation, how is the sausage in HOF circles really made? Hmmm....

[supremecoltsfan300]

I dont see anyway Marvin gets in 1st ballot. I think maybe on the 5th try he'll get in. Scandal will play a role in the wait.

[The Old Crow]

One of the things I hear from Indy fans is that the Colts will be in Indy longer than Baltimore soon. The surprising thing is the Hall of Fame members of the Colts. Out of ten Colts in the Hall of Fame, nine played for the Baltimore Colts, and one went in as a LA Ram. Eric Dickerson was the only one who played for the Indy Colts, but went in as a Ram.

 

It's hard to believe that out of the almost 30 years of the Colts in Indianapolis, there have been no Hall Of Famers during that era. Manning is a rock solid lock, but Harrison and Wayne will be iffy. The fact that Chris Carter got in should improve their chances, particularly Harrison, whose stats are similar to Carters. Of course, Andre Reed and Tim Brown just add to the backlog of receivers waiting to get into the Hall.  If Harrison doesn't get in right away, he may be waiting for awhile. 

[oldunclemark]

Marvin Harrison? Its close. The HALL is hard on receivers but Tony Dungy is a first ballot Hall-of-Famer..

 

No question..won over 65% of his games.

 

Took Indy from the basement to the Super Bowl

Made the playoffs every year..

 

Played for a Super Bowl champ and helped build Tampa into a title team....

invented the Tampa-2 defense...

 

..and is probably the most highly-regarded living ex-coach to present day players and coaches..

..Wasnt he voted the 20th best coach of all-time by ESPN?

[jvan1973]

One of the things I hear from Indy fans is that the Colts will be in Indy longer than Baltimore soon. The surprising thing is the Hall of Fame members of the Colts. Out of ten Colts in the Hall of Fame, nine played for the Baltimore Colts, and one went in as a LA Ram. Eric Dickerson was the only one who played for the Indy Colts, but went in as a Ram.

It's hard to believe that out of the almost 30 years of the Colts in Indianapolis, there have been no Hall Of Famers during that era. Manning is a rock solid lock, but Harrison and Wayne will be iffy. The fact that Chris Carter got in should improve their chances, particularly Harrison, whose stats are similar to Carters. Of course, Andre Reed and Tim Brown just add to the backlog of receivers waiting to get into the Hall. If Harrison doesn't get in right away, he may be waiting for awhile.

Players don't go into the hall for any particular team. Marshall Faulk is the only Indy colt to be drafted as a colt. Ofcourse it's only a matter of time until Peyton and Marvin get in

[21isSuperman]

Here's what Elliot Harrison has to say (http://www.nfl.com/halloffame/story/0ap1000000226326/article/michael-strahan-charles-haley-headline-next-50-hall-of-famers):

 

4) Marvin Harrison
» Wide Receiver
» 1996-2008 (Indianapolis Colts)
» Eligible in 2014

Will a mysterious and allegedly sordid off-the-field life derail Harrison's prospects to be a first-ballot inductee come next Super Bowl weekend? This has to be the Hall of Fame voters' most interesting dilemma, although off-the-field stuff is supposed to be checked at the door of the voters' room. If you go by the numbers, Harrison belongs in Canton ASAP. Forget the bloated passing numbers of this era; Harrison eclipsed his contemporaries. His stunning achievement of notching 143 catches in 2002 still stands as the NFL record. Meanwhile, his career numbers of 1,102 catches (third) and 14,580 yards (sixth) rank him among the all-time greats. Harrison was a more reliable receiver than Terrell Owens or Randy Moss.

--

He has Marvin ranked as the 4th player that will get in next, behind Mike Strahan, Charles Haley, and Derrick Brooks.  So Marvin is the highest ranked offensive player, according to Harrison

[The Old Crow]

Players don't go into the hall for any particular team. Marshall Faulk is the only Indy colt to be drafted as a colt. Ofcourse it's only a matter of time until Peyton and Marvin get in

[The Old Crow]

I thought Ted Hendricks went in as an Oakland Raider ?