Colts offseason discussion / Ballard Grievances (merge)

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6 hours ago, ArmchairQB said:

Generally speaking week one is where all the sexy FA’s get overpaid.  Unless he sees something so important he needs to throw all caution to the wind I think it’s not terrible to let the dust settle.

Like... backup nose tackle... 

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5 hours ago, chad72 said:

Keenan Allen traded to The Bears

BTW this is very interesting. The Chargers are losing both of their top receivers this off-season. Wonder what their plan is to provide weapons to Herbert. 

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5 hours ago, chad72 said:

If that means Brian Thomas Jr. or Rome Odunze falls to us, I’d be fine with that too 

It just means the Chargers are almost for certain picking a WR, because they lost both their best receivers this off-season. And the Cardinals losing Hollywood Brown almost certainly means they will be picking WR too. So... 4 and 5 will be WRs. And if the Pats decide to go with WR over QB then this means all top 3 WRs will be gone by 5. And if not... the Giants at 6 have severe lack of receivers ... Titans... Jets... Broncos... 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Regarding why I brought up Partridge in the first place it’s because YOU asserted Partridge had influence in asset allocation.  
And you said you’d be worried if Ballard was listening to CP about asset allocation.  I stated that was not true, that spending is entirely up to Ballard.  Your argument was incorrect.   I don’t know how and why we’re missing each other on this? 

 

That's not how it happened.

 

You brought up DL coach Charlie Partridge in the first place, just as in your comment above, to say that Ballard brought him to improve the defensive line players in pass rush (among other things), and how Partridge would've had influence in deciding to get the backup NT Raekwon Davis in free agency.

 

So, you brought him into the discussion.

 

After that only, Superman said it'd be worrisome if Ballard needed Partridge to advise on asset allocation. 

 

I don't think Superman "asserted Partridge had influence in asset allocation.", he was implying what you said (as stated in the first para here). 

 

Apart from what Superman thinks, I think you're bringing up Partridge to make assertive statements like 

 

Quote

And you’re going to bring up not enough pressures and my answer to that is Charlie Partridge.  

Quote

Look, you know Ballard can’t get rid of his D lineman so instead he brings in a guy he believes will help them all get more pressures. I’m not saying you have to love Partridge as I do, all I’m suggesting is Ballard had a plan in place and you seem reluctant at best to acknowledge it.  

There's no sure thing Ballard brought Partridge to Indianapolis to help get more pressures in the games from his DLmen.

 

When a DL coach is hired by an NFL team, it's to develop the defensive linemen and identify prospects in the league or draft to coach them up in schemes, disguises, edge setting, pass rush, run stop, mechanics and techniques, coverages, blitzes, etc.,

 

But, just because Partridge is here doesn't mean it guarantees improvement in pass rush and pressure rate, as you assert above.

 

How do you expect others NOT Reluctant to accept that at the face value? 

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[VikingsFanInChennai]

16 minutes ago, stitches said:

It just means the Chargers are almost for certain picking a WR, because they lost both their best receivers this off-season. And the Cardinals losing Hollywood Brown almost certainly means they will be picking WR too. So... 4 and 5 will be WRs. And if the Pats decide to go with WR over QB then this means all top 3 WRs will be gone by 5. And if not... the Giants at 6 have severe lack of receivers ... Titans... Jets... Broncos... 

Well Said.

 

So, same for Brock Bowers as well. 

[Solid84]

15 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

Well Said.

 

So, same for Brock Bowers as well. 

Yeah, with the top 3 WRs gone Bowers will be next in line I think. 
 

Too bad, really wanted him as a Colt. 

[NewColtsFan]

54 minutes ago, cbear said:

Hello NCF! My memory isn't the best but when Cross finally started getting playing time with Blackmon, didn't they do well with both basically playing both FS and SS? 

The honest answer is I don’t know.  Because over the last two years our safeties also included Flowers and McCloud.   Not sure who lined up where.  
Sorry I don’t have more. 

[NewColtsFan]

40 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

That's not how it happened.

 

You brought up DL coach Charlie Partridge in the first place, just as in your comment above, to say that Ballard brought him to improve the defensive line players in pass rush (among other things), and how Partridge would've had influence in deciding to get the backup NT Raekwon Davis in free agency.

 

So, you brought him into the discussion.

 

After that only, Superman said it'd be worrisome if Ballard needed Partridge to advise on asset allocation. 

 

I don't think Superman "asserted Partridge had influence in asset allocation.", he was implying what you said (as stated in the first para here). 

 

Apart from what Superman thinks, I think you're bringing up Partridge to make assertive statements like 

 

There's no sure thing Ballard brought Partridge to Indianapolis to help get more pressures in the games from his DLmen.

 

When a DL coach is hired by an NFL team, it's to develop the defensive linemen and identify prospects in the league or draft to coach them up in schemes, disguises, edge setting, pass rush, run stop, mechanics and techniques, coverages, blitzes, etc.,

 

But, just because Partridge is here doesn't mean it guarantees improvement in pass rush and pressure rate, as you assert above.

 

How do you expect others NOT Reluctant to accept that at the face value? 

Forgive me for what I’m about to say, most here know my background, but I’m guessing you don’t.   Because if you did you’d never explain to me what happens when a team hires a DL coach.   
 

I worked in media in Los Angeles for 30 years.  I covered the Rams and Raiders, but also the Lakers and Clippers, the Dodgers and Angels and the Kings and Ducks.   
 

So I know exactly what a DL coach does.  I’ve interviewed NFL owners and GMs, Coaches and scouts, and thousands of players.  
 

I find your characterization of my exchange with Superman to be almost laughable.  There’s part of me that thinks you enjoy yanking my chain.  If I write 2 + 2 = 4 you’ll find something to object to.   I find our exchanges unnecessarily confrontational.  It happens too often to be a coincidence.  If you haven’t noticed when you post something to me, I rarely respond.   We see almost nothing the same.   So I find these back and forth exchanges a waste of my time because they get us no where.  
 

So you’re free to post and point out my flaws.  Have fun.  Odds are I either won’t respond or if I do it’ll be somewhat unpleasant.   Your call. 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Forgive me for what I’m about to say, most here know my background, but I’m guessing you don’t.   Because if you did you’d never explain to me what happens when a team hires a DL coach.   
 

I worked in media in Los Angeles for 30 years.  I covered the Rams and Raiders, but also the Lakers and Clippers, the Dodgers and Angels and the Kings and Ducks.   
 

So I know exactly what a DL coach does.  I’ve interviewed NFL owners and GMs, Coaches and scouts, and thousands of players.  
 

I find your characterization of my exchange with Superman to be almost laughable.  There’s part of me that thinks you enjoy yanking my chain.  If I write 2 + 2 = 4 you’ll find something to object to.   I find our exchanges unnecessarily confrontational.  It happens too often to be a coincidence.  If you haven’t noticed when you post something to me, I rarely respond.   We see almost nothing the same.   So I find these back and forth exchanges a waste of my time because they get us no where.  
 

So you’re free to post and point out my flaws.  Have fun.  Odds are I either won’t respond or it’ll be somewhat unpleasant.  Your call. 

Reason is, exactly like above, not a single word of your reply was about the point of discussion - which is why it may not go well between both of us.

 

So, let's just stay away, and I will let the concerned person reply you going forward. Cheers. 

[NewColtsFan]

8 hours ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

Reason is, exactly like above, not a single word of your reply was about the point of discussion - which is why it may not go well between both of us.

 

So, let's just stay away, and I will let the concerned person reply you going forward. Cheers. 

For what it’s worth, Superman and I are good friends.   I didn’t know for a few years but we live pretty close to each other and have met. 
 

Now I grant you he may not be happy with me over my posts.  We rarely disagree this much.  But we’ve knocked heads before and we’ve gotten past it, and I expect that again.   
 

[csmopar]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I worked in media…..

 

Was that before or after the media went to brainless reporting? 
 

 

 

for the record, that is a joke, with no ill intent other then trying to solicit a laugh or a chuckle. 

[Indeee]

I won't pretend to know what CB and the Colts brass are thinking, in fact I clearly do not as I seem to always criticize it, however, is it just me or does it seem like sometimes Ballard just isn't trying very hard to improve this team.

 

I'm not talking about the massive money haul day one FAs, but using a recent example; Keenan Allen for a 4th?

 

What 4th round pick player could we possibly draft who would be better than Keenan Allen?

 

Could this team really not use a guy like KA? I get he's a little older and maybe he has a good bit of salary with him, but beyond that, all this guy has been is a great person, teammate, player, and massively productive. Oh, and he seems to be always OPEN, so he knows how to create separation consistently. Something most of the current Colts receivers can't seem to do, except Pierce of course because he's always open just no one wants to play with him...

 

This is just one example of course and some will say the Colts are wait see with other players like maybe Sneed, but if you look around most teams also sign or grab other players while they are waiting on players too.

 

Every year over and over. To me, just my view here, none of Ballard's approach ever makes sense when it comes to improving this team's chances of competing with the top tier teams and/or all the others. 

 

Time to insert sad emojis because it really is sad...

 

 

 

 

[w87r]

7 hours ago, Hawkeyecolt said:

If they signed after the new season officially began on Wednesday it would have remained a 3rd Rd. Pick. 

Yeah that's a weird one there.

 

Multiple conditions.

 

Started a 4th, turned into 3rd and could've became a 2nd if he signed before the new season starts, but stays a 3rd if signed after the new season starts.

[smittywerb]

Hard pass on Keenan Allen.  Getting paid a lot.  32 years old.  Can’t stay healthy.  
 

what this means though is a trade back is most likely going to happen.  So many wide receivers are going to be gone by 15 and I don’t see us trading up.  I was so excited about the thought of BTJ or Bowers coming to the Colts.  But that’s not happening now.  
 

ugghh, this sucks.  Maybe Arnold will be there at 15. 

[MFT5]

6 minutes ago, smittywerb said:

Hard pass on Keenan Allen.  Getting paid a lot.  32 years old.  Can’t stay healthy.  
 

what this means though is a trade back is most likely going to happen.  So many wide receivers are going to be gone by 15 and I don’t see us trading up.  I was so excited about the thought of BTJ or Bowers coming to the Colts.  But that’s not happening now.  
 

ugghh, this sucks.  Maybe Arnold will be there at 15. 

 

lol why do yu think that 😂 it’s gonna be BTJr & AMitchell will be there 

[IndyEV]

4 hours ago, stitches said:

It just means the Chargers are almost for certain picking a WR, because they lost both their best receivers this off-season. And the Cardinals losing Hollywood Brown almost certainly means they will be picking WR too. So... 4 and 5 will be WRs. And if the Pats decide to go with WR over QB then this means all top 3 WRs will be gone by 5. And if not... the Giants at 6 have severe lack of receivers ... Titans... Jets... Broncos... 

The holes on this team Ballard just keeps making bigger and bigger! 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

9 hours ago, PRnum1 said:

Why does he look like a young Ballard? 

 

47 minutes ago, w87r said:

Yeah that's a weird one there.

 

Multiple conditions.

 

Started a 4th, turned into 3rd and could've became a 2nd if he signed before the new season starts, but stays a 3rd if signed after the new season starts.

So they had decided to let him test the free agency this year, and obviously he will get picked up. If not, they sign after the new season starts after a couple of days. Either way, they'd lose only 3rd round draft pick this year.

 

They weren't going to give up 2nd round draft pick unless he had taken the league by storm in which case they might have been okay to part with 2nd round pick. 

[Yoshinator]

This is getting a little frustrating now. We missed out on AJ Dillon, we didn't sign Kamren Curl (don't know if we were interested, but he was signed quickly), and now all the WRs are either being signed or being traded for cheap. 

 

I hope we get Sneed and aren't spending all of our time waiting on the Chiefs before signing other FAs. I have a feeling we might be because if we trade for him, the cost to extend him would take most of our remaining salary cap away.

[chad72]

OK @Shive @Superman @shasta519 @OhioColt what were your evaluations of Skyy Moore when he was in the draft?

 

Do you think he’s a good buy low candidate for a 6th or 7th rounder? Not sure if he’s available but just wanted to hear your thoughts.

[shasta519]

16 hours ago, DougDew said:

My comment saw that the pro-colt podcast guy was framing the signings like Ballard intentionally stayed status quo while the other teams were too hapless and ignorant to retain their own good players and then had to scramble to find lesser replacements at a greater cost.  LOL.

 

Why not simply assume that all three teams made moves because they thought it was in the best interests of their teams?  Assume that when our Division rivals let one player go, they did so with the intent of upgrading the position....not just REPLACING what they lost.   Blatant bias in the framing of the issue, IMO.

 

Yep. Maybe Joel and Holder are just being contrarians because the more vocal sentiment is dissatisfaction among the fanbase.

 

But I have long held that the local "media" in Indy is incredibly Ballard-friendly, to the point that they will often carry his water. Doyel and Bowen (sorta) can be critical, but that's really it. Dakich doesn't count lol

 

But guys like Keefer (when he was still here), Holder, the Indy Star guys, Chappy, all of the podcasters, bloggers...they all tend to operate like some extension of Colts PR with how they hype up players/moves and how they spin narratives. The bias is blatant.

 

 

[shasta519]

5 minutes ago, chad72 said:

OK @Shive @Superman @shasta519 @OhioColt what were your evaluations of Skyy Moore when he was in the draft?

 

Do you think he’s a good buy low candidate for a 6th or 7th rounder? Not sure if he’s available but just wanted to hear your thoughts.

 

I loved him. Wrote essays here about how he was much more likely to be a good WR in the NFL than Pierce.

 

Moore had great tape and route running. He was an early declare from a non Power 5 school. Only other guys to do that are Davante Adams and Courtland Sutton. And his analytics were great as well, with a 45% dominator ranking and breaking out at age 20. 

 

So far, I was incredibly wrong about this, well about Moore anyways. AP is not a good WR either. Given they both aren't good, those posts are wasted minutes of my life I will never get back  

 

No idea what has happnened in KC, but he's not been able to make the leap. And it can't be because Reid doesn't like young WRs, we saw Rice force Reid's hand as a rookie. It's especially concerning too, given his draft capital, KC's WR room AND that he's been playing with Mahomes.

 

On the bright side, I guess you could look at Davante's first two seasons in GB and have some hope that Moore can break out at some point, given their similar college profiles. But Adams is a very different WR.

 

For a late-round pick, sure...cause it's a late-round pick. But with Downs already in the slot, it's hard to see where he would get targets.

[AwesomeAustin]

20 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

Yep. Maybe Joel and Holder are just being contrarians because the more vocal sentiment is dissatisfaction among the fanbase.

 

But I have long held that the local "media" in Indy is incredibly Ballard-friendly, to the point that they will often carry his water. Doyel and Bowen (sorta) can be critical, but that's really it. Dakich doesn't count lol

 

But guys like Keefer (when he was still here), Holder, the Indy Star guys, Chappy, all of the podcasters, bloggers...they all tend to operate like some extension of Colts PR with how they hype up players/moves and how they spin narratives. The bias is blatant.

 

 

I kind of feel that’s par for the course to support the team. Colts fans are the ones reading and listening to these people. If they are too critical I feel they would lose their reader base quickly. I’m sure there is a fine line where you can be critical and support the team. I feel most fans just want to read and listen to someone cheerleading the team. I know for myself after a few negative episodes or articles I’m going to lose interest just for the fact negativity weighs really heavy. I can acknowledge they are right but still wouldn’t want to keep visiting that well. 

[w87r]

33 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

They weren't going to give up 2nd round draft pick unless he had taken the league by storm in which case they might have been okay to part with 2nd round pick. 

No doubt, they were definitely not going to do that to themselves with that verbiage in the conditions.

 

I just didn't know about the second part, till Hawkeye quoted me.

 

I thought if he re-signed at all it went to a 2nd.

[chad72]

5 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I loved him. Wrote essays here about how he was much more likely to be a good WR in the NFL than Pierce.

 

Moore had great tape and route running. He was an early declare from a non Power 5 school. Only other guys to do that are Davante Adams and Courtland Sutton. And his analytics were great as well, with a 45% dominator ranking and breaking out at age 20. 

 

So far, I was incredibly wrong about this, well about Moore anyways. AP is not a good WR either. Given they both aren't good, those posts are wasted minutes of my life I will never get back  

 

No idea what has happnened in KC, but he's not been able to make the leap. And it can't be because Reid doesn't like young WRs, we saw Rice force Reid's hand as a rookie. It's especially concerning too, given his draft capital, KC's WR room AND that he's been playing with Mahomes.

 

On the bright side, I guess you could look at Davante's first two seasons in GB and have some hope that Moore can break out at some point, given their similar college profiles. But Adams is a very different WR.

 

For a late-round pick, sure...cause it's a late-round pick. But with Downs already in the slot, it's hard to see where he would get targets.

 

They did have McKenzie spelling Downs and Moore ran a lot of swing routes and wheel routes too in college. I saw McKenzie run those with Josh Allen in Buffalo, now Shakir plays that role, so that can be a chess piece for Steichen. It took a lot to get Rice on the same page as Mahomes, he put in the work and picked Kelce and Mahomes' brains constantly as to what they expect when they see certain formations and how he can get the ball by sometimes breaking off routes like Kelce. Otherwise, Andy Reid's offenses are notorious for not being friendly to rookie wideouts.

 

It could be like Elijah Moore traded from Jets to Browns. Might not be a huge upgrade but useful chess piece.

[ColtStrong2013]

49 minutes ago, IndyEV said:

The holes on this team Ballard just keeps making bigger and bigger! 

give an example… 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

 

[ColtStrong2013]

1 minute ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

 

I honestly thought I was going to beat you on posting this and it showed up when I came over to paste it on… 

 

I won’t even try again. How stupid could I be? 

[RollerColt]

Just now, ColtStrong2013 said:

I honestly thought I was going to beat you on posting this and it showed up when I came over to paste it on… 

 

I won’t even try again. How stupid could I be? 

She's the Twitter/X God 'round these parts! 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

Colts safety room is so bad.

 

 

[Yoshinator]

Just now, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts safety room is so bad.

 

 

Was hoping to get Brandon Jones or Kamren Curl. That unfortunately didn't happen. We may just draft a S in the mid rounds now. 

[shasta519]

2 minutes ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I kind of feel that’s par for the course to support the team. Colts fans are the ones reading and listening to these people. If they are too critical I feel they would lose their reader base quickly. I’m sure there is a fine line where you can be critical and support the team. I feel most fans just want to read and listen to someone cheerleading the team. I know for myself after a few negative episodes or articles I’m going to lose interest just for the fact negativity weighs really heavy. I can acknowledge they are right but still wouldn’t want to keep visiting that well. 

 

That's true. And I don't think a totally negative slant would work at all. But I don't think trying to spin a positive narrative out of everything or hyping up every player is it either. There should be some type of balance.

 

You are probably right though...most of the readers/listeners want that positive spin. And that's a bit of a problem on its own because while we want to cheer on our team, winning should always be the thing that matters most. 

[ColtStrong2013]

Just now, Yoshinator said:

Was hoping to get Brandon Jones or Kamren Curl. That unfortunately didn't happen. We may just draft a S in the mid rounds now. 

what they do at safety might depend on if Sneed is pulled… Feels like that is the first domino in secondary (aside from re-signing Moore) 

[shasta519]

17 minutes ago, chad72 said:

 

They did have McKenzie spelling Downs and Moore ran a lot of swing routes and wheel routes too in college. I saw McKenzie run those with Josh Allen in Buffalo, now Shakir plays that role, so that can be a chess piece for Steichen. It took a lot to get Rice on the same page as Mahomes, he put in the work and picked Kelce and Mahomes' brains constantly as to what they expect when they see certain formations and how he can get the ball by sometimes breaking off routes like Kelce. Otherwise, Andy Reid's offenses are notorious for not being friendly to rookie wideouts.

 

It could be like Elijah Moore traded from Jets to Browns. Might not be a huge upgrade but useful chess piece.

 

I am all for it if they would trade him cheap. He certainly has all the makings of a change of scenery type. And even beyond being a chess piece, having someone that can push Downs or just having two good slot WRs out there (instead of AP) wouldn't be a bad thing at all.

[1959Colts]

7 minutes ago, Restinpeacesweetchloe said:

Colts safety room is so bad.

 

 

Colts could be targeting Cooper DeJean out of Iowa

 

[ColtStrong2013]

1 minute ago, shasta519 said:

And that's a bit of a problem on its own because while we want to cheer on our team, winning should always be the thing that matters most. 

I disagree. Winning the right way and having a pool of star players that have integrity matter more… Would rather cheer for good guys that might not be as successful as we’d like than to have a roster full a character issues that win more… 

[shasta519]

2 hours ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

So, you think in an internet forum, if two persons are replying each other, others shouldn't interfere in their discussion? You don't even know how discussions work in internet? 

 

I hope that's not the case. That's what makes internet forums great...you can enter a conversation/debate without interrupting or talking over people.

[ColtStrong2013]

1 minute ago, shasta519 said:

 

I hope that's not the case. That's what makes internet forums great...you can enter a conversation/debate without interrupting or talking over people.

I’ve had that thrown at me before. “You weren’t even part of this conversation.” 
 

lol. Well I am now apparently… 

[RollerColt]

3 minutes ago, shasta519 said:

 

I hope that's not the case. That's what makes internet forums great...you can enter a conversation/debate without interrupting or talking over people.

 

I think of that quote every day in here. HAHAHA....

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

I am losing hope the secondary is going to be fixed. Right now without Blackmon the secondary is even weaker.