Garcon Contract Rumors [Merge]

[Superman]

I think it will be because while we are going to sign Mathis we were going to do that with or without Garcon anyways. So that's not going to impact Garcon's money. I really don't think they are going to keep Wayne unless they decide they are done with Garcon because of this. The Colts didn't label Wayne as a priority this off-season when they talked about him and all year Wayne has been dropping hints he knows his time in Indy is done. Is it a bit of a risk by Garcon? Sure the Colts could do a double take on Reggie Wayne now but I don't think they are going to do that. I think the Colts will probably be patient and wait see if Garcon isn't getting what he wants on the open market. If he's not Garcon might very well come back for the deal they offered him. I think the Colts will be willing to give Garcon a little time to test the market before they rush off to sign someone else if they truly want Garcon back.

I don't know if Garcon will get more or not it's a crap shoot free agency always is because much like the draft all it takes is one team to fall in love you and give you a big payday. I don't blame Garcon wanting to see if another team is willing to do that. He'll know real quick once free agency starts if a team is willing to do that or not. If they aren't he can go back and talk to the Colts. Garcon and his agent know this. I also think they know the Colts would rather have Garcon back than an older Reggie Wayne and that if Garcon comes back he's going to be the Colts number one WR. There is nothing wrong if that's how the Colts are going to use him for Garcon to say hey if I am going to be your number one I want to be a paid like a number one WR. Remember the Colts have had him for a steal for the past couple years (paying him sixth round money and get number two WR production is a steal) so I am sure Garcon wants to get paid, most players like that do.

I'm just saying that Garcon is walking away from a long-term contract that's right in line with (or slightly above) what his value is on the market. I don't know anything; that's just what I think, based on what other receivers are paid. That yearly average puts him in the top ten of NFL receivers, based on 2011 salaries.

I think that's highly risky. How much more does he expect he can get on the open market? Does he expect to get $8 million per, and if so, is it worth the risk of walking away from the $35 million he's being offered? Do you walk away from $35 million because you want $40 million? I don't know. And on top of that, I don't think he gets $8 million per. The only way this makes sense is if they offered him a paltry signing bonus (highly possible). He might be able to get three years, $24 million with a $5 million signing bonus.

And it's not Reggie vs. Pierre. It's Pierre vs. the field. I'd rather go get Colston or Stevie Johnson or another free agent than overpay for Garcon. I'm not in favor of pushing him out the door, I just don't see how he's worth more than five years, $35 million, unless the signing bonus is ridiculously low. Anything near $10 million signing bonus is fair, though.

[Blue Horseshoe]

Maybe he just doesn't anything to do with the mess that this team is going to be for a while.

[Dustin]

*insert dropping ball joke here*

[cokomenow]

Maybe he just doesn't anything to do with the mess that this team is going to be for a while.

I hope this is the only reason. For him to think that he is worth 7mill/year average with all his inconsistencies is beyond me. His greed will catch up with him in the end, where he'll have to settle for 5~6mill a year

[21isSuperman]

He did have his best year last year, but I am a bit worried about a WR who had his best year in a contract year. How many times in the NFL have we watched players have a breakout year during their contract year, get their pay day and then turn your around and revert back to their old self.

Garcon has been very inconsistent over his career and I would not be dropping 35 million on a guy who put together one consistent year especially with the WR class that probably will be available out there.

Fans who are mad at Garcon for turning down this have to take their fan glasses off and see that all these players are mini corporations and have to do what is best for them because the team is going to do what is best for the team. If I was Garcon I would want to see what I could get in free agency as well. I am sure some team that needs a WR like 49ers, Washington, and others might give him more then what the Colts want to give him.

True, he needs to do what is best for him, but when a guy like Marques Colston says he is looking for a deal in the neighbourhood of $7 mil a year, does Garcon really expect to make more?

[GoColts8818]

I'm just saying that Garcon is walking away from a long-term contract that's right in line with (or slightly above) what his value is on the market. I don't know anything; that's just what I think, based on what other receivers are paid. That yearly average puts him in the top ten of NFL receivers, based on 2011 salaries.

I think that's highly risky. How much more does he expect he can get on the open market? Does he expect to get $8 million per, and if so, is it worth the risk of walking away from the $35 million he's being offered? Do you walk away from $35 million because you want $40 million? I don't know. And on top of that, I don't think he gets $8 million per. The only way this makes sense is if they offered him a paltry signing bonus (highly possible). He might be able to get three years, $24 million with a $5 million signing bonus.

And it's not Reggie vs. Pierre. It's Pierre vs. the field. I'd rather go get Colston or Stevie Johnson or another free agent than overpay for Garcon. I'm not in favor of pushing him out the door, I just don't see how he's worth more than five years, $35 million, unless the signing bonus is ridiculously low. Anything near $10 million signing bonus is fair, though.

I am not doubting that's what his market value is. I am just saying I think Garcon is seeing if he can get more knowing he can probably come back and get the same deal for market value from the Colts if bigger money isn't there.

I also don't think it's Garcon vs. Reggie Wayne. I think the Colts have moved on from Reggie Wayne. Now I would say if they think Garcon is going to play real hardball with them they might rethink their stance on Reggie or they could go after another WR all together. I just don't think it's going to take Garcon long to figure out if he's going to get more money or not and will probably know rather quickly if he can or not and probably before the Colts sign someone else.

Clearly it's not risk free on Garcon's part but if the Colts are offering him market value he can probably still get that if not from the Colts from someone else on the market.

Now with that said I heard Phil B. on JMV today say he thinks Garcon just wants out of Indy all together. I also heard Chap say Garcon would be nuts to take the Colts first offer. JMV also said he heard it was five years for 30 million for six million a year not the 35 million said here so who knows.

I just don't think Garcon is getting really over payed by the Colts for this offer like some are being made out to be. Frankly I think he can probably get about what the Colts are offering him on the open market.

[mmcrazylikeafox]

Anyone thinking the Peyton decision will have a complete domino effect on our current free agents?

I've said all along that having Peyton Manning would bring other talent to the team; so I suppose not having PM would cause a reverse effect to some extent. I like Garcon but if that is his attitude then don't let the door hit ya. Even the great Marvin Harrison couldn't get a better contract or any contract for that matter when he left.

[CR91]

like probably most posters already said, he doesnt want to be playing with anyone but a qb like peyton which is really selfish.

[mmcrazylikeafox]

I'd like to see maybe Robert Meachem from N.O. come here. He's a FA and would require less $ than Wayne.

[Superman]

I am not doubting that's what his market value is. I am just saying I think Garcon is seeing if he can get more knowing he can probably come back and get the same deal for market value from the Colts if bigger money isn't there.

I also don't think it's Garcon vs. Reggie Wayne. I think the Colts have moved on from Reggie Wayne. Now I would say if they think Garcon is going to play real hardball with them they might rethink their stance on Reggie or they could go after another WR all together. I just don't think it's going to take Garcon long to figure out if he's going to get more money or not and will probably know rather quickly if he can or not and probably before the Colts sign someone else.

Clearly it's not risk free on Garcon's part but if the Colts are offering him market value he can probably still get that if not from the Colts from someone else on the market.

Now with that said I heard Phil B. on JMV today say he thinks Garcon just wants out of Indy all together. I also heard Chap say Garcon would be nuts to take the Colts first offer. JMV also said he heard it was five years for 30 million for six million a year not the 35 million said here so who knows.

I just don't think Garcon is getting really over payed by the Colts for this offer like some are being made out to be. Frankly I think he can probably get about what the Colts are offering him on the open market.

I could see him walking on five years, $30 million, depending on the bonus. And if he does just want out of Indy, then don't let the door hit you, and all that. But I don't really trust anything anyone from the Indy media is saying these days. I think a lot of them are so down on the state of the franchise and Irsay's handling of matters that they are projecting their own feelings about the team onto other people, including Manning and now Garcon.

It's not going to take Garcon long, but he'll have to wait until money starts moving around. Once a couple of higher-valued receivers sign, that's going to take options off the table for him. Once we do a couple contracts and hand out some bonus money, that's going to hurt our offer for him. I do think he might be able to beat five years, $30 million. In which case, I hope he has an insanely productive year and we get a nice compensatory pick for him. But I don't see him coming back in a couple of weeks once deals are getting done and getting a better offer from us. I only see our offer being reduced.

[Superman]

I'd like to see maybe Robert Meachem from N.O. come here. He's a FA and would require less $ than Wayne.

He'd probably come for less than Garcon. Good size, good athleticism, not terribly productive so far his career, but he's been the third or fourth option at best for the Saints. As such, if they keep Colston, Brees and Nicks, they won't be spending money on him. I think he could be had for a reasonable price.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=17473&draftyear=2007&genpos=

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MeacRo00.htm

[UndecidedFrog]

He'd probably come for less than Garcon. Good size, good athleticism, not terribly productive so far his career, but he's been the third or fourth option at best for the Saints. As such, if they keep Colston, Brees and Nicks, they won't be spending money on him. I think he could be had for a reasonable price.

http://www.nfldrafts...ar=2007&genpos=

http://www.pro-footb.../M/MeacRo00.htm

Do you remember our discussion about what Garcon would finally accept?

I estimated it would be the average of whatever Colston and Meachem got.

[Superman]

Do you remember our discussion about what Garcon would finally accept?

I estimated it would be the average of whatever Colston and Meachem got.

Yup.

[Ryan Pelley]

That's the thing though. Garcon has not caught 70 balls for 1000 yards.

But he did have 70 catches for 947 yards.

[JoKeR]

Channel 8 said at 5:00 they talked to Garcon's agent and he said that the Colts had not made Garcon a formal offer yet and that he hasn't turned down anything.

Bump again

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

He'd probably come for less than Garcon. Good size, good athleticism, not terribly productive so far his career, but he's been the third or fourth option at best for the Saints. As such, if they keep Colston, Brees and Nicks, they won't be spending money on him. I think he could be had for a reasonable price.

http://www.nfldrafts...ar=2007&genpos=

http://www.pro-footb.../M/MeacRo00.htm

Mecachem would be an upgrade over Garcon, he is real flyer who has been underused by the NO. How tough is he? Cheaper hum not so sure?

[buccolts]

Bump again

I guess the fact that an offer may have never been made shouldn't stand in the way of a good conversation.

I guess anyone could work for ESPN

[UndecidedFrog]

I guess the fact that an offer may have never been made shouldn't stand in the way of a good conversation.

I guess anyone could work for ESPN

With the advent of the interwebs, journalistic integrity is a thing of the past.

[Superman]

Mecachem would be an upgrade over Garcon, he is real flyer who has been underused by the NO. How tough is he? Cheaper hum not so sure?

He hasn't produced even at Garcon's level.

[UndecidedFrog]

He hasn't produced even at Garcon's level.

Yes, that is why I put Garcon in the middle of Meachem and Colston.

[supremecoltsfan300]

He hasn't produced even at Garcon's level.

Meachem has a really great Y/R and his numbers arent that prolific because he has to share receptions with brees' many other weapons (henderson, colston, moore, grahm, thomas, sproles). For being the 4th or 5th option he is really productove.

[Superman]

Meachem has a really great Y/R and his numbers arent that prolific because he has to share receptions with brees' many other weapons (henderson, colston, moore, grahm, thomas, sproles). For being the 4th or 5th option he is really productove.

But he's the 4th or 5th option. You're saying he's suddenly going to get paid like he's the 2nd or 3rd option? On what basis?

[esmort]

We won't know if it was a good offer or not without knowing what the guaranteed money is/was and how is was structured ... it could be a 100 million contract, but if only 1 million is guaranteed and the rest is backloaded at the end of 5 yrs than it is a crap contract ... I know this is an is a completaly unrealistic example, but it is just to illustrate that 5 yr/35 million really doesnt tell us anything about how good the the offer really was.

[Nadine]

I guess the fact that an offer may have never been made shouldn't stand in the way of a good conversation.

I guess anyone could work for ESPN

I was thinking the same thing. I keep wondering if I should close this because people get sucked in and think it's true......then again, there's a good conversation.

Still, right now, it's the most viewed thread on the board. And it is not true. I think I'll change the thread title

[coltsblue1844]

Personally, if it IS true that we offered a 5yr $35mil deal and Garcon turned it down...i would go after Colston. In my opinion, he is quite a bit better than Garcon and has already said that he is looking for basically the exact same deal we offered to Garcon (supposedly).

With the saints having to sign brees/nicks/meechum/colston/franklin etc, i think its safe to say that they wont be able to keep them all...brees and nicks are the top priorities...so the Colts should see if Colston would be interested for what we offered to Garcon...would be an upgrade, i think.

[Scott21]

#1. Adam Schefter's reporting as of late has been somewhat questionable in terms of his sources not always being accurate.

#2. Check out ESPN's blog about the report. This type of thing is very common, if not expected, in contract talks. There is back and forth negotiation. It would be unnatural for any player's agent not to attempt to do so.

#3. Pierre usually discusses major events/moves on his Facebook, and I haven't seen any updates as of yet. He's also come out a couple of times now indicating he'll be with the Colts next season.

No need to worry y'all.

[HarassedOffTheSite]

Adam Schefter's reporting as of late has been somewhat questionable in terms of his sources not always being accurate.

^^^^That^^^^

Schefter has said...

"First candidate the Colts tried to hire for vacant GM job was New England's director of player personnel Nick Caserio." < Irsay said it was not true.

"It's almost a formality that the Colts will release Peyton Manning."

"Peyton would agree to be flexible with contract demands with a new team, accepting an incentive-laden deal that takes into account his rehab from the Sept. 8 neck surgery." < Something Manning himself scoffed at. Saying the only thing he has told his agent is that he is focused on rehab.

"Manning & Irsay would've ironed things out earlier if the Super Bowl had not been in Indy."

"That something will happen by the time the combine rolls around because it is also in Indy."

[BuildtheMonster1285]

Adam Shifty would not survive here, he'd have a permanent ban if he was a poster.

Agreed

[JoKeR]

With the advent of the interwebs, journalistic integrity is a thing of the past.

The internets a series of tubes and some of them start at the bottom of toilets.

[Superman]

I was thinking the same thing. I keep wondering if I should close this because people get sucked in and think it's true......then again, there's a good conversation.

Still, right now, it's the most viewed thread on the board. And it is not true. I think I'll change the thread title

Just because Garcon's agent said that they hadn't turned anything down as of Friday night doesn't mean that nothing has been turned down. It would be just like an agent to say "we haven't turned anything down yet," and then call and turn it down right after making that statement. Three days go by before anymore reporting is done on it, and the story has gotten out of hand.

We don't really know what the story is, and the figures have changed. But either way, I'm glad there's some contract talks taking place right now, and I hope we get some good news on a few fronts.

[Nadine]

Just because Garcon's agent said that they hadn't turned anything down as of Friday night doesn't mean that nothing has been turned down. It would be just like an agent to say "we haven't turned anything down yet," and then call and turn it down right after making that statement. Three days go by before anymore reporting is done on it, and the story has gotten out of hand.

We don't really know what the story is, and the figures have changed. But either way, I'm glad there's some contract talks taking place right now, and I hope we get some good news on a few fronts.

OK, I'll change the title to Garcon contract rumors

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

He hasn't produced even at Garcon's level.

Alot of options in NO

[Superman]

Alot of options in NO

And he's the 4th or 5th option. I think the Saints (especially Payton and Brees) know a lot more about Meachem than we do. They see him in practice every day. And he's still down on the depth chart. I'm not knocking him, I think he's a fine player. But I think his contract is going to be based more on his production than his potential. And there isn't a lot of production so far.

[IndyTrav]

And he's the 4th or 5th option. I think the Saints (especially Payton and Brees) know a lot more about Meachem than we do. They see him in practice every day. And he's still down on the depth chart. I'm not knocking him, I think he's a fine player. But I think his contract is going to be based more on his production than his potential. And there isn't a lot of production so far.

I really see Meachem as 'our' Garcon, but with a much smaller role..

You got Colston on the outside(Reggie)....You got Moore playing slot(Collie)...Then you got Graham(Clark)...but then they got the shiny new toy in Sproles (dont have that lol).....then Henderson I think would be there 'chuck it down field' option....I just dont think there is anywhere for Meachem to play there...

But I could get on board with what you are saying about Brees/Payton...those two are smart enough to know who to go to, and what they can do...

[Superman]

I really see Meachem as 'our' Garcon, but with a much smaller role..

You got Colston on the outside(Reggie)....You got Moore playing slot(Collie)...Then you got Graham(Clark)...but then they got the shiny new toy in Sproles (dont have that lol).....then Henderson I think would be there 'chuck it down field' option....I just dont think there is anywhere for Meachem to play there...

But I could get on board with what you are saying about Brees/Payton...those two are smart enough to know who to go to, and what they can do...

Lance Moore is an undersized and undrafted player who leap-frogged Meachem on the depth chart and continued to remain ahead of him even though he's been in and out of the lineup with injuries.

They just got Jimmy Graham a couple years ago, and he just started performing last year. He also moved ahead of Meachem in the hierarchy.

Henderson is the veteran of the bunch, and is ahead of Meachem in the pecking order, and even he hasn't been that productive in recent seasons.

And they just got Sproles.

Meachem has been there since 2008, and his best season was 45 catches for 722 yards. His production is, quite plainly, on the low end for someone that you want to make a potential #2 receiver, especially if you're saying we have to pay him like a #2 receiver. I like him as a player, but only at a certain price. It also helps that he can return kickoffs. Good size, good hands, decent routes. He's on my list, but on a very modest veteran contract.

[chad72]

If Garcon double dares the Colts organization, Colston would be worth 5 years $40 mil. with $15 guaranteed, just make him sign on the dotted line AND THEN worry if Garcon or Wayne leaves.

[Superman]

If Garcon double dares the Colts organization, Colston would be worth 5 years $40 mil. with $15 guaranteed, just make him sign on the dotted line AND THEN worry if Garcon or Wayne leaves.

I'd do that. If he'd agree to a deal that would have his cap hit for 2012 less than $5 million ($3 million bonus + $2 million base salary), I'm your Huckleberry. I think the $15 million signing bonus would be enough to make that work. But you're probably hurting your chances of keeping Mathis and extending Freeney, with that kind of bonus.

[chad72]

I'd do that. If he'd agree to a deal that would have his cap hit for 2012 less than $5 million ($3 million bonus + $2 million base salary), I'm your Huckleberry. I think the $15 million signing bonus would be enough to make that work. But you're probably hurting your chances of keeping Mathis and extending Freeney, with that kind of bonus.

If the Colston signing happens, you franchise Mathis, and worry about extending Freeney next year (or trading him based on how well he does in the new D).

[IndyTrav]

Meachem has been there since 2008, and his best season was 45 catches for 722 yards. His production is, quite plainly, on the low end for someone that you want to make a potential #2 receiver, especially if you're saying we have to pay him like a #2 receiver. I like him as a player, but only at a certain price. It also helps that he can return kickoffs. Good size, good hands, decent routes. He's on my list, but on a very modest veteran contract.

Both Meachem/Garcon were drafted in 2008.

Meachem-62 Games, 25 starts, 141 Rec, 2269yds, 23Tds, 16.1yds per rec.

Garcon- 58 games, 43 starts, 188rec, 2519yds, 16Tds, 13.4yds per rec.

I'll gladly take him as a #2.

47 less Rec. than Pierre, 250 less yards, 7 more TDs....as the #4 or #5 option....

[Malakai432]

If this thread was any lesson to you, it would seem they get all their information from a magic 8 ball.

Hah, you can say that again but if any 2nd - 3rd teir receiver is ever going to demand Larry Fitzgerald $$$ it's going to be this guy, LOL!