[Will Carroll] Ballard and Irsays have already compiled coaching short lists. No unexpected names. Unlikely to fire Pagano in-season

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 minutes ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

A year ago GB was just as bad as we were. They don't have that much more talent than we do. 

They have an OL, better receiving core, FAR better defense with some stars, they are better IMO.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

2 hours ago, csmopar said:

I love how all of a sudden, everyone on this forum is suddenly an experienced NFL head coach....

I'm not saying this is all on Pagano. But we already took care of 1/3 of the problem with Grigson fired, Ballard is working on fixing the other 1/3(lack of talent) the only thing left to try to fix is the coaching problem and thus it falls on Pagano. 

A coach in pee wee knows this!!!! Not rocket science, unless of coarse you haven't coached ANYTHING!!!

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

1 hour ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

Okay, I gotta know... what is the deal with this David Toub guy, and why does everyone want him so badly? If there's anyone I'm going for from that coaching staff, it's their offensive coordinator, not their special teams guy. I've seen Toub's name thrown around for the past few months like he's a shoe in for the gig, and I don't get it. Why would we promote a special teams coordinator to head coach? That seems like a terrible idea to me.

Agree

[John Waylon]

What purpose does firing Pagano at this point serve? Especially if we intend to clean house? We aren't going to hire his replacement until January. And the worst thing that could happen would be chud taking over, winning a couple games, and making an argument that he deserves the job and getting it. 

 

So really. Other than satisfying your own lust to see him gone, what purpose does it serve?

[PrincetonTiger]

1 hour ago, Restored said:

 

Which is why the Colts have rarely, if ever, fired a head coach during the season.

 

But to another point, this will be the best head coaching vacancy available to a prospective coach:

 

-Solid ownership

-Good GM that has connections all across the league.

-Good QB coming back next season.

-Top 5/10 draft pick

Nicely put

[aaron11]

the only thing making this job desirable over somewhere else is luck 

 

if he doesn't come back healthy then we have a bottom three roster with few building pieces on long term deals 

[Defjamz26]

1 hour ago, krunk said:

No one wants him here anymore.  Not even the people explaining what could have been. We all are pretty much concluded time is up.

I would hope so. I’ve already turned my attention to the draft and off-season.

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, csmopar said:

Actually, my mind isn't made up. But I'm not seeing how Pagano is retained.  

You mean a Defense that is coached by a supposed Defensive guru, yet every year he's been a head coach, his D has ranked in the bottom of the league every year thru two different coordinators?  

Yep, he coached sub par players with no linebackers.

[crazycolt1]

3 hours ago, J@son said:

 

This is simply not true.  the Colts have been competitive in all but 2 games.  In each of the other games, they led going into the second half and in all but one of those games they were leading heading into the 4th quarter.  An inexperienced QB throwing an inopportune Pick-6 I can accept and get past.  Poor game planning, not taking advantage of other teams' weaknesses, not challenging the Mack TD vs. the Rams, playing excessive prevent defense waaaaay to early in games, taking all creativity out of offensive playcalling once you have a lead, a complete inability to make 2nd half adjustments...none of these things have anything to do with the talent, or lack thereof, on the team.

Creativity out of offensive playcalling?  Yeah, right with a offensive line that cant protect a QB that looks good at times but in the end losses the games for us. With a new QB there is a simplified playbook that has no what you call creativity. You seem to think coaching young inexperienced players is easy for some reason. Why? I have no clue because you do know the basics of what needs to be done.

Too many want to point a finger all at Chuck when this teams have more problems any coach could overcome.

[Smoke317]

2 hours ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

They have an OL, better receiving core, FAR better defense with some stars, they are better IMO.

Are they though???  I believe Luck and his Colts are 2-0 against Rodgers & his Packers.  Which is weird because I think they are better coached & schemed but I don’t think their talent is far superior to ours. In fact, their OLine hasn’t been routinely categorized as one of the best. Their success comes because ARod is great at escaping and getting the ball out quickly. Also, he’s excellent pre snap.  I personally think we are on par with them talent wise, but I think they are coached and schemed better. 

[superrep1967]

5 hours ago, PrincetonTiger said:

Good Question 

in other words, Carroll doesn't know. 

[PrincetonTiger]

3 minutes ago, superrep1967 said:

in other words, Carroll doesn't know. 

Yep

[TheMarine]

One advantage I believe to Toub will be in theory his ability to focus on the game management aspect, and let the Coordinators do their jobs. His handprint will be on the staff he hires, instead of one aspect of the team (Sean Payton, Offense or Pete Caroll, Defense, etc). He favors defense by nature, has show serious creativity with special teams. Apparently HIGH on details. Would probably be best paired with a strong offensive coordinator who could take advantage of field positioning, and not put the team at risk with poor play calling

[IinD]

This guys really going out on a limb with this. I'm shocked Pagano might be on his way out AND they actually have a list of potential candidates? What??

[IndyScribe]

I'm curious as to who is on their list. Probably Nagy and Toub, maybe a couple of SEA coaches. 

[csmopar]

1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

Yep, he coached sub par players with no linebackers.

What was his excuse in Baltimore as the secondary coach with a pass defense ranked 21st while he was their coach, only to have the exact same players turn around the year he leaves and become 4th in the league?

[crazycolt1]

Just now, csmopar said:

What was his excuse in Baltimore as the secondary coach with a pass defense ranked 21st while he was their coach, only to have the exact same players turn around the year he leaves and become 4th in the league?

Look, I am not going to do this. We just have different points of view and look at the game a different way. All this has already been debated and argued enough. There is nothing more to say.

[2006Coltsbestever]

9 minutes ago, IndyScribe said:

I'm curious as to who is on their list. Probably Nagy and Toub, maybe a couple of SEA coaches. 

Peyton

[csmopar]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

Look, I am not going to do this. We just have different points of view and look at the game a different way. All this has already been debated and argued enough. There is nothing more to say.

No. I'm simply asking you to convince me as to why I should support keeping Pagano, my mind isn't made up, part of me wants to fire him, part wants to keep him. If you can't provide a solid reason to keep him other than Luck being injured or alleged lack of talent(Rick Venturi and several other experts think it's more players being played out of place and not to their strengths) then how does that truly look on Pagano. Please fine me a single game where he's truly out coached another coach in the NFL

[crazycolt1]

1 minute ago, csmopar said:

No. I'm simply asking you to convince me as to why I should support keeping Pagano, my mind isn't made up, part of me wants to fire him, part wants to keep him. If you can't provide a solid reason to keep him other than Luck being injured or alleged lack of talent(Rick Venturi and several other experts think it's more players being played out of place and not to their strengths) then how does that truly look on Pagano. Please fine me a single game where he's truly out coached another coach in the NFL

If Luck being injured, lack of talent, young and inexperienced is not enough then I have nothing to add.

[deedub75]

3 hours ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

Look I know its popular to dog Pagano on here! I believe when he has been given the tools, hes a a pretty good coach. Some would disagree, but thats how I see it.No not elite but good. The players play for him! Will he back next year, IMO unfortunately probable not which means Luck will probable be learning a new offense.

 

A healthy Luck carrying this team for 3 season and covering up mistakes was Pagano’s best tool. 

[Smoke317]

14 minutes ago, csmopar said:

What was his excuse in Baltimore as the secondary coach with a pass defense ranked 21st while he was their coach, only to have the exact same players turn around the year he leaves and become 4th in the league?

If that stat is true, then there’s hope for our defense next year with Chuck & Ted both gone.

[crazycolt1]

2 minutes ago, deedub75 said:

 

A healthy Luck carrying this team for 3 season and covering up mistakes was Pagano’s best tool. 

 No QB carries any team without talent around him. A QB does zero without the supporting cast around him.

[CF4L]

I don't get what would be the point of Pagano being fired mid season he's doing such a good job getting us that possibly Top 5 pick why ruin it?

 

That being said whoever the new coach is I hope its not a retread.

[Smoke317]

12 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

 No QB carries any team without talent around him. A QB does zero without the supporting cast around him.

Yeah, Luck had some talent around him back then.  He had Reggie, TY, Allen, & Fleener, Avery, & Brazil.  We had pretty good offensive talent during Luck’s first few years. Or at least we knew how to use those weapons more often than not. I think Luck has been missing Wayne these last few years.  As good as TY is, I don’t think he’s as consistent as Reggie at getting open and making tough catches. 

[crazycolt1]

12 minutes ago, Smoke317 said:

Yeah, Luck had some talent around him back then.  He had Reggie, TY, Allen, & Fleener, Avery, & Brazil.  We had pretty good offensive talent during Luck’s first few years. Or at least we knew how to use those weapons more often than not. I think Luck has been missing Wayne these last few years.  As good as TY is, I don’t think he’s as consistent as Reggie at getting open and making tough catches. 

Reggie was a true possession receiver. He made those tough catches especially for first downs. The only receiver we have on the team that is even close to him is Doyle.

[Jackie Daytona]

7 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Really?  He was doomed when this season started. He was given a team that don't have enough talent to be competitive in the NFL.

He's had 5 years, hasn't developed any notable depth, let alone starters, and makes the same boneheaded coaching mistakes..... so yes, in my opinion, "really".

[Coltsman1788]

7 hours ago, ManningGM said:

Are we seriously still defending Pagano out here?! 

 

You can't be serious. 

Unfortunately he is.  Must be one of Pagano's relatives or something.  lol

[will426]

Stop with the lack of talent comments..better talent than last year and is being utilized like garbage  especially on the defensive side of the ball. Same could go for the offense as well too..we could've won many games this year if it wasn't for questionable playcalling on both sides of the ball playing Zone on defense..not running the ball when we're averaging a good ypc..never adjusting the offense to benefit this crappy online..the talent is there the coaching isn't hasn't and probably won't be there till they're all gone 

[Jason_]

3 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Creativity out of offensive playcalling?  Yeah, right with a offensive line that cant protect a QB that looks good at times but in the end losses the games for us. With a new QB there is a simplified playbook that has no what you call creativity. 

 

In regard to the simplified playbook, Yeah no kidding. That doesn't mean you have to go run run run punt starting in he 3rd quarter just because you have a lead. Chud doesn't seem to understand the concept of high percentage throws. That's on him. But it's been going on long enough that Pagano should have stepped in. 

 

BTW the playcalling and OL have been good enough to get the team into the 4th quarter with a lead in I believe 5 out of 8 games played. The sacks are just as much on Brissett for holding the ball and chud's playcalling as they have been about the OL. Bottom line though this team has the talent to he competitive and win some games when they have even decent game planning and playcalling. There is not, however enough talent to overcome bad coaching. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

1 hour ago, will426 said:

Stop with the lack of talent comments..better talent than last year and is being utilized like garbage  especially on the defensive side of the ball. Same could go for the offense as well too..we could've won many games this year if it wasn't for questionable playcalling on both sides of the ball playing Zone on defense..not running the ball when we're averaging a good ypc..never adjusting the offense to benefit this crappy online..the talent is there the coaching isn't hasn't and probably won't be there till they're all gone 

Not having Luck is the killer = his talent, we were 8-7 with him starting last season. I think with him this season we would be 5-3 instead of 2-6, 4-4 at worse. I think we beat the Cards and Bengals so 4-4 at worse. I think we probably even beat the Titans with Luck since he owns them. That is how important Luck is.

[crazycolt1]

4 hours ago, Shafty138 said:

He's had 5 years, hasn't developed any notable depth, let alone starters, and makes the same boneheaded coaching mistakes..... so yes, in my opinion, "really".

Depth? You have to be kidding?

[Darryl Lewis II]

Long time lurker but I had to come and get this off my chest. I cannot wait any longer and wake up to see Pagano has been fired. Thank you that is all.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

1 minute ago, Darryl Lewis II said:

Long time lurker but I had to come and get this off my chest. I cannot wait any longer and wake up to see Pagano has been fired. Thank you that is all.

 

61 days. Hang in there.

[NewColtsFan]

5 hours ago, Smoke317 said:

Yeah, Luck had some talent around him back then.  He had Reggie, TY, Allen, & Fleener, Avery, & Brazil.  We had pretty good offensive talent during Luck’s first few years. Or at least we knew how to use those weapons more often than not. I think Luck has been missing Wayne these last few years.  As good as TY is, I don’t think he’s as consistent as Reggie at getting open and making tough catches. 

 

The offense for most of the Pagano era, which was under Grigson control had no offensive line and a poor running game.   

 

The offense had Luck and TE's and WR's.       Those all work even better when you have an O-line and a ground game.

 

[will426]

2 hours ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Not having Luck is the killer = his talent, we were 8-7 with him starting last season. I think with him this season we would be 5-3 instead of 2-6, 4-4 at worse. I think we beat the Cards and Bengals so 4-4 at worse. I think we probably even beat the Titans with Luck since he owns them. That is how important Luck is.

Yeah I understand what you mean but everyone makes it seem like there's 0 talent outside Luck which isn't true yes he's the top talent we have but we do have other with talent who haven't been used properly 

[2006Coltsbestever]

14 minutes ago, will426 said:

Yeah I understand what you mean but everyone makes it seem like there's 0 talent outside Luck which isn't true yes he's the top talent we have but we do have other with talent who haven't been used properly 

He means so much to this team, having said that I agree we have some talent. TY and Doyle are solid, I like Mack as well. Frank is a tough old dude too.

[Narcosys]

12 hours ago, #12. said:

"No unexpected names."

 

What are the expected names?

Exactly what I was thinking

[Darryl Lewis II]

I have a question why do so many of you guys want Josh Mcdaniels? Something about that Nagy guy intrigues me Alex Smith is statistically having his best year with him as OC.

[DaColts85]

5 hours ago, Darryl Lewis II said:

I have a question why do so many of you guys want Josh Mcdaniels? Something about that Nagy guy intrigues me Alex Smith is statistically having his best year with him as OC.

Andy Reid calls the plays not Nagy.  Nagy is just a glorified guy holding the position of OC, but he is not calling the plays for Alex Smith.