Colts NFLPA Report card (Not great) (MERGE)

[csmopar]

5 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Seems like food would be one of the easier things to fix.  Find out what your guys like and make it for them.

Ever been inside the cafeteria at the colts complex on w 56th? I was many times during my security days for them. That menu is HUGE HUGE HUGE. The players can dang near order anything they could dream of, even exotics given enough notice. So unless something has changed since 2008 when I left, I find the food thing a bit odd.

[csmopar]

5 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I think your reaction is potentially over the top. I say that because there's simply not enough information being shared to really know. And I don't say this just as a fan of the Colts, I'm trying to maintain some perspective with the reports for all the teams.

 

I mentioned an example earlier with the Chiefs. They were expecting to upgrade the locker room at the practice facility. The upgrades weren't made, they only added new seats. So the Chiefs grade for practice facilities went down from last year, even though we could probably say the facilities were improved, just not as much as the players hoped they would be.

 

The grade for the Colts food offerings is funny to me. I'm sure there's nothing wrong with the freshness of the food, and it probably tastes fine also. 

 

If they can't figure out the plane seating thing, though, that's a problem. Two years in a row. However, they say players don't have to share rooms anymore. 

 

And the weight room, last year some players wanted more modern equipment, but the grade was a B. This year, the grade went down to a C. I doubt the equipment got worse.

 

Just seems like a lot of this is sensationalized.

I agree. Wasn’t it just last year when the colts upgraded the locker room to make it larger at the request of the internal player council? Larger lockers, more comfortable seating etc. 

[AwesomeAustin]

I get the position of the players and appreciate their concerns compared to other teams. However, one thing I’ve learned owning a company is employees are the hardest group to ever make happy. My top manager came to me frustrated about how the workers were always complaining no matter what he did to make things better. I showed him how 80% of employees that have been hired by us have either quit or been fired despite us offering 30% higher pay, paid vacation, sign on bonuses and other perks our competitors don’t. Nearly 60% of those that quit have inquired about coming back. That’s the number that lets us know we are doing it right. I told my manager he will never be able to make them all happy so be a leader, make balanced decisions and get used to it.  We could give them all $10k today and half of them will be complaining about something next week. Just comes with the territory. 

[Crunked]

....Heavy......

[Indeee]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Hmmm…

Sorry, but I don’t see how your viewpoint is fair and reasonable while mine is somehow over the top?  
 

Ballard was asked about this today.  He gave one very strong answer.  That it’s his experience that that the vast majority of players who have been Colts want to be Colts.   Good answer.   Then he said they’d go through the report to see where they might get better.   
 

As to the differences from one year to another, it’s a different team.  Likely younger.  The Colts lost vets like Gilmore and Ingoukwe.   So the newer, younger players might have a different view.  
 

Ballard said he talks to the players all the time.  Might’ve said there’s a players council he talks to.  All well and good.  But from my perspective I think it’s important not to downplay this or dismiss it in any way.   The Colts are competing against the other 31 teams.   They have to make the facility as good as they can,  it’s something they can control.  If the Colts have a poorly rated facility, that’s something they can control and it’s also something that can be used against them by other franchises.  
 

I think the Colts need to make better decisions.  By not spending money to help themselves, this can lead to something that can hurt them.   Cut down on unforced errors.  
 

Sorry we couldn’t find common ground here. 

I realize that we are talking about two different things here, but are we? To me this is a pattern under Ballard's watch. Why would anybody believe that the guy who is notoriously FRUGAL with his spending for actual players, would be any less FRUGAL when it comes to player amenities. 

 

I really wanted to say "cheap" here but went with frugal. Pretty sweet right?  

[csmopar]

57 minutes ago, Indeee said:

I realize that we are talking about two different things here, but are we? To me this is a pattern under Ballard's watch. Why would anybody believe that the guy who is notoriously FRUGAL with his spending for actual players, would be any less FRUGAL when it comes to player amenities. 

 

I really wanted to say "cheap" here but went with frugal. Pretty sweet right?  

I’d like to know where this notion of cheap or frugal is coming from. 
 

ballard has handed out several contracts since his first year to players making them either top paid in their position, or at least in the top 5. No he hasn’t gone all Grigson and signed washed up FAs to those types of contracts, but he’s not exactly been cheap. In fact, he just did it again with JT and Matt Gay last season and probably doing it again with MPJ in the next week. It can be argued about what positions he should or shouldn’t have done such with but he’s spent the money. 
 

The colts also spent over 2.5 million refurbishing their practice facility just last offseason.  That’s not exactly being cheap. 

[indyagent17]

This report is very damming. When players rate their owner a middle grade. that says a lot about what they think about Irsay. Secondly, way too many categories are below average. It makes you wonder what the environment is like in the players head when it comes to ignoring needs. Ballard needs to clean the stuff up.

[Indeee]

8 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I’d like to know where this notion of cheap or frugal is coming from. 
 

ballard has handed out several contracts since his first year to players making them either top paid in their position, or at least in the top 5. No he hasn’t gone all Grigson and signed washed up FAs to those types of contracts, but he’s not exactly been cheap. In fact, he just did it again with JT and Matt Gay last season and probably doing it again with MPJ in the next week. It can be argued about what positions he should or shouldn’t have done such with but he’s spent the money. 
 

The colts also spent over 2.5 million refurbishing their practice facility just last offseason.  That’s not exactly being cheap. 

There were aspects of the article that hinted at potentially being frugal with certain amenities. My point maybe wasn't clarified properly. I was referring to the money not going to the right places as viewed by the players. I.E. food and family care, etc. Your assessment of Ballard putting money into certain player areas is valid however I would argue that it has not been the correct areas as a whole, QB aside and that is what I was referring to. It's an apples to oranges viewpoint based on how you or others might see it

 

 

[csmopar]

13 minutes ago, Indeee said:

There were aspects of the article that hinted at potentially being frugal with certain amenities. My point maybe wasn't clarified properly. I was referring to the money not going to the right places as viewed by the players. I.E. food and family care, etc. Your assessment of Ballard putting money into certain player areas is valid however I would argue that it has not been the correct areas as a whole, QB aside and that is what I was referring to. It's an apples to oranges viewpoint based on how you or others might see it

 

 

I’ll give you the strength and medical staff stuff, that is legit concerning and needs addressed before any of the others. But daycare and food are so trivial compared to the rest, it’s comical they’re even on the list

[shasta519]

30 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

This report is very damming. When players rate their owner a middle grade. that says a lot about what they think about Irsay. Secondly, way too many categories are below average. It makes you wonder what the environment is like in the players head when it comes to ignoring needs. Ballard needs to clean the stuff up.

 

It's not that surprising if there actually is a large gap between how most Colts fans perceive Jim Irsay...vs. just about everybody else, including Colts players. 

 

 

[shasta519]

15 hours ago, Superman said:

Colts

Food / Cafeteria

C

22ND

They rank 20th overall in food taste 

They rank 24th overall in food freshness 

 

LOL

 

Wait til later this summer...the locker room will have all the freshest, most delicious corn these guys could ever want.

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, Indeee said:

I realize that we are talking about two different things here, but are we? To me this is a pattern under Ballard's watch. Why would anybody believe that the guy who is notoriously FRUGAL with his spending for actual players, would be any less FRUGAL when it comes to player amenities. 

 

I really wanted to say "cheap" here but went with frugal. Pretty sweet right?  

We don’t know if the issue is Ballard or Irsay.    I doubt Ballard has control of most of these issues.  Ultimately the person who controls the money is the owner.  

[Superman]

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Sure I’d like more information.  I don’t recall if the report stated what the Colts were last year or not?   It’s late and I may have to the-read the report looking for that detail.   But operating off some sleep deprived memory, I’d guess the Colts weren’t great last year.   
 

I always say to people who are skeptical about PFF grades, that they’re not perfect by any means but that if they’re off, they’re likely off by one level.  So maybe a player isn’t good, but he’s at least above average.  My point is if this report is imperfect, it’s at least in the ball park.  We might be in the bottom third two years in a row?   Bottom half two years in a row?    So I always want to be better. 
 

I think the Colts have a fair amount of disadvantages of being a small market team, so I want to control what we can control much better.    Hope I’ve clarified a bit more….  

 

All of this is fair. I'm just trying to promote a deeper than surface level consideration of these reports.

 

Ultimately, I don't think there's a significant amount of impact on free agent decisions. Free agency is and always has been about the money first. After that, considerations like the city, coaching staff, status, etc., have varying degrees of importance for different players. But for 95% of players, it's about the money. No one is turning down the contract they want because they don't like the team plane situation.

[Superman]

5 hours ago, csmopar said:

I agree. Wasn’t it just last year when the colts upgraded the locker room to make it larger at the request of the internal player council? Larger lockers, more comfortable seating etc. 

 

I don't know. The practice facility upgrade was in 2018. Was something more recent done?

 

Also, some of this is about the practice facility locker rooms, not the stadium locker rooms.

[csmopar]

21 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

I don't know. The practice facility upgrade was in 2018. Was something more recent done?

 

Also, some of this is about the practice facility locker rooms, not the stadium locker rooms.

Not sure which they did, i just know at the fan day at the opening of training camp, they were displaying a big display board with all the new updates. 

[NewColtsFan]

19 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Probably right. This is from the Chargers report card, who got an F in this category:

 

But it seems like most teams provide daycare at no charge.

 

How do the Rams have onsite daycare, but the Chargers don't? 

Regarding the Rams/Chargers issue….

 

Im guessing because the Stadium was built by and for the Rams.   And the Chargers are a tenant.   Sort of like the Lakers and Clippers at the former Staples.  Built for the Lakers but Clippers rent from them. 
 

[Superman]

2 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Regarding the Rams/Chargers issue….

 

Im guessing because the Stadium was built by and for the Rams.   And the Chargers are a tenant.   Sort of like the Lakers and Clippers at the former Staples.  Built for the Lakers but Clippers rent from them. 
 

 

Sure, but if the building has a daycare facility, why can't the Chargers use it? The report card says the Rams have onsite daycare, but the Chargers have inconvenient offsite daycare. I would understand the Chargers having players pay for daycare, but I don't get why they can't use the same facility the Rams players use.

[NewColtsFan]

5 hours ago, AwesomeAustin said:

I get the position of the players and appreciate their concerns compared to other teams. However, one thing I’ve learned owning a company is employees are the hardest group to ever make happy. My top manager came to me frustrated about how the workers were always complaining no matter what he did to make things better. I showed him how 80% of employees that have been hired by us have either quit or been fired despite us offering 30% higher pay, paid vacation, sign on bonuses and other perks our competitors don’t. Nearly 60% of those that quit have inquired about coming back. That’s the number that lets us know we are doing it right. I told my manager he will never be able to make them all happy so be a leader, make balanced decisions and get used to it.  We could give them all $10k today and half of them will be complaining about something next week. Just comes with the territory. 

This is a very impressive post.  Thanks for writing it, sharing your real world experience.   Appreciate you trying to do the right thing in business and life even when it’s hard.  Especially when it’s hard. 
 

Mad props to you.    

[NewColtsFan]

Just now, Superman said:

 

Sure, but if the building has a daycare facility, why can't the Chargers use it? The report card says the Rams have onsite daycare, but the Chargers have inconvenient offsite daycare. I would understand the Chargers having players pay for daycare, but I don't get why they can't use the same facility the Rams players use.

Maybe they can….   But at a cost the Chargers don’t want to pay?   Just a guess. 

[csmopar]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe they can….   But at a cost the Chargers don’t want to pay?   Just a guess. 

Exactly why no city should have more than one team.

[Jason_]

11 hours ago, Superman said:

 

All 65-75 of them... I bet the food is fine. Not five star Michelin, but does it need to be? 

 

I prefer my food not come from Michelin.  That's just me though.

[Jason_]

6 hours ago, csmopar said:

Ever been inside the cafeteria at the colts complex on w 56th? I was many times during my security days for them. That menu is HUGE HUGE HUGE. The players can dang near order anything they could dream of, even exotics given enough notice. So unless something has changed since 2008 when I left, I find the food thing a bit odd.

 

I'm thinking there's more than a decent chance that some things might have changed in the past 16 years.  

[Superman]

9 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

I prefer my food not come from Michelin.  That's just me though.

 

Maybe the chicken is a little rubbery...

[csmopar]

11 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

I'm thinking there's more than a decent chance that some things might have changed in the past 16 years.  

I would hope for the better. At least that was what I was trying to convey. 

[Superman]

15 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Maybe they can….   But at a cost the Chargers don’t want to pay?   Just a guess. 

 

Functionally, I don't understand it. Obviously there's something to it, but I don't get why the Chargers wouldn't have access to the game day daycare facility, of all places. If Philip Rivers was still there, this wouldn't be an issue.

 

When you talk about unforced errors and shooting yourself in the foot, this seems like a good example. The Chargers should be able to at least use the onsite facility. If they want to charge the players, that's one thing. But if the facility is there, don't send the families offsite. 

[richard pallo]

The reigning back to back Super Bowl champions Kansas City Chiefs rank 31st.  I’m not concerned about our ranking.  I doubt they are really concerned about theirs.  Getting paid and winning is what really matters to players.  Not these lists.

[Jason_]

22 minutes ago, csmopar said:

I would hope for the better. At least that was what I was trying to convey. 

 

you would hope, but it would be one of the only food service establishments to have improved over the past several years rather than regress lol

[Superman]

Another head scratching example, for me:

 

 

Okay, not good. But...

 

 

I'm not sure how this affected any specific grade, their team travel grade was B-, 10th in the league. But it's also an example of why I'm skeptical about what some of this stuff means in real life. If a player's car gets stolen because he left his keys in his car, I don't see that as a team responsibility.

[Jason_]

1 minute ago, Superman said:

But it's also an example of why I'm skeptical about what some of this stuff means in real life. If a player's car gets stolen because he left his keys in his car, I don't see that as a team responsibility.

 

agreed.  2 things that are lacking from the report card are context and tone.  To use the daycare as an example, that conversation could have gone multiple ways.

 

ex 1.
 

interviewer:  what are some areas of the Colts organization that could be improved?

player: oh wow how long do you have.  Let's see, first, most teams offer daycare on gamedays.  Colts brass want me out on the field but don't care about my family and their needs?!!!!

 

ex 2.

 

interviewer:  what are some areas of the Colts organization that could be improved?

player: you know, honestly I love playing here. I love the atmosphere, the facilities etc.

interviewer: ok but if you HAD to mention something, what would it be?

player: well I do know that most other teams offer daycare on game days.   that would be nice to have. 

 

 

Just reading the report doesn't tell us how serious nor to what level these complaints are.  

[stitches]

4 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

This report is very damming. When players rate their owner a middle grade. that says a lot about what they think about Irsay. Secondly, way too many categories are below average. It makes you wonder what the environment is like in the players head when it comes to ignoring needs. Ballard needs to clean the stuff up.

That one is interesting because Irsay's grades last year was much better and the quotes they had on Irsay were very positive. I wonder what changed. Was it the JT's situation? Was it some promise that Irsay gave and didn't deliver on? No idea... 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

I don't like that the players have to travel in smaller seats than the front office.....especially because Ballard believes in building in the trenches, which means a lot of our better players are Big OL/DL and feel more cramped than other players.AND front office people!!! 

 

[Superman]

20 minutes ago, stitches said:

That one is interesting because Irsay's grades last year was much better and the quotes they had on Irsay were very positive. I wonder what changed. Was it the JT's situation? Was it some promise that Irsay gave and didn't deliver on? No idea... 

 

Irsay didn't have his best year from a PR standpoint, that's for sure.

[Dingus McGirt]

16 hours ago, Blueblood23 said:

Colts players don’t give a ringing endorsement to ownership.

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-report-card-rankings-for-all-32-teams-213054888.html

Spoiled millionaires complain about everything.

[G8R]

18 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

This isn’t something that is just now working its way to the pros.  The NFL, NBA, MLB and NHL have been dealing with this for decades.   Literally 35-40 years.   It’s a huge issue at the pro level. 

No doubt. My point was that the disparity is getting so wide, and the expectation that many of the guys coming from higher or even mid level schools will have, will force the facilities war into the pro game. Some teams have obviously already sensed that and have become committed to it, others clearly have not. Yet. 

[teganslaw]

I don't understand the team travel grade of "D."  Does that mean the type of plane used (private or commercial)? 

 

Also, ownership is "C". I thought Irsay was liked by most of the players. Maybe there are some things he does that they don't approve. 

[K2CColt]

It's pretty telling that only 3 coaches got a grade lower than a B-

Those 3 coaches were relieved of their coaching duties. I see this

as the players not biting the hand that gives them playing time.

Maybe not, but that's the way I read it.

 

[VikingsFanInChennai]

22 minutes ago, teganslaw said:

I don't understand the team travel grade of "D."  Does that mean the type of plane used (private or commercial)? 

 

Also, ownership is "C". I thought Irsay was liked by most of the players. Maybe there are some things he does that they don't approve. 

Team travel plan includes a lot -  their own travel class, how their families are allowed to travel, the type of facilities they get in different cities - training, good, nutrition, how the team equipment travels along with the team and be ready for practice in New places, how their travel and family experience got impacted during a monsoon week or heavy snowfall week , how the same experience varies when the team needs to travel internationally - how the team adjusts for jet lag, sleep, food change, etc., 

so on.. you imagine every scenario that they go through during the season, and during off-season as well.

 

There's an Equipment team in every NFL franchise for transporting equipments - from helmet, pads, etc., to make stickers for different events such as cancer awareness week or military appreciation week, to prepare new jerseys and helmets fitting to the T on the first day the rookies arrive at the facility after the Draft, to have player requested custom stickers on Cleats, etc., 

etc., 

It all adds up to the Player Experience. 

[Jason_]

 

7 minutes ago, VikingsFanInChennai said:

It all adds up to the Player Experience. 

 

Which is going to be very subjective

[csmopar]

8 minutes ago, Jason_ said:

 

 

Which is going to be very subjective

Honestly, we on this forum probably care about this survey more than any of the players or the staff of the colts do

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

2 hours ago, teganslaw said:

I don't understand the team travel grade of "D."  Does that mean the type of plane used (private or commercial)? 

 

Also, ownership is "C". I thought Irsay was liked by most of the players. Maybe there are some things he does that they don't approve. 

I have heard they don’t stay in the best hotels.