Braden Smith

[Dark Superman]

16 hours ago, Jdubu said:

Lmao!! If it’s so proven you can find them anywhere, how is it that the colts haven’t found a RT or a solid back up LT all these years? The last dominate LT and RT this team has had was Glenn and Meadows. 

Don't you mean Ryan Diem?

Nevermind. I forgot Diem came in a little later, but you're right. He was no Adam Meadows.

[Colts_Fan12]

7 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

You may be right but IMO Frank is pretty happy with Nick Sirianni.

He's not the Oline coach tho he is OC lockeddown said he thinks he will get a new line coach 

[LockeDown]

7 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

You may be right but IMO Frank is pretty happy with Nick Sirianni.

I agree and he might keep Eberflus too.  I think Reich, just like Dungy, probably wants his “guys”to Get shots at coaching gigs.  I say that because it seems he has character and cares.

[BOTT]

20 hours ago, Trueman said:

Thought he did well all things considered. Still want us to draft at least one tackle high next year.

We're still not done building the trenches -- not even close.

Damn, having spent 3 first rounders and a second on the offensive line I hope they are getting kinda close.

[BOTT]

1 hour ago, LockeDown said:

I agree and he might keep Eberflus too.  I think Reich, just like Dungy, probably wants his “guys”to Get shots at coaching gigs.  I say that because it seems he has character and cares.

I don't think Dungy made many changes to the offensive staff he inherited. I think Reich keeps guys that prove they are worth keeping.

[Trueman]

54 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Damn, having spent 3 first rounders and a second on the offensive line I hope they are getting kinda close.

I mean sure, we've invested draft capital in the OL , but AC was 7 years ago and he's 30. We can't really bank on a ton of more production from him and he's not an elite LT. I can't really envision an Andrew Whitworth post 30 career for him. Maybe I'm wrong in that assessment. 

Two more OT's to really solidify the group would be my guess. One to start at RT , and one to provide depth/hopefully take over for AC. I wish some of Grigson's OT selections worked out , but they haven't. We can't punish Ballard for errors from the past regime. Our OT depth is pretty crap , and it needs to be addressed in the draft. 

Really, there's 3 pieces you could consider long term options: Nelson, Kelly, Smith... I mean, it's pretty evident we need some quality young tackles. Considering how offensive line play has significantly dropped off due to the CBA (lack of practice time/reps) , getting two guys in whilst we still have a starting option like AC wouldn't be a bad idea, imo.

If there was ever a positional group to stack , it would be the OL for me. 

Personally, I want one of those freakish 3-tech's in the 1st round , and then draft an OT with one of our 2nd rounders. But, if a Greg Little or Jonah Williams is available at our selection , I wouldn't mind it if Ballard takes him. Adding a Tarik Glenn level player would be immense. 

I don't see the point in half-as(s)ing it now that we're here. We almost destroyed one of the greatest QB prospects of all-time , lets make damn sure it doesn't happen. We need more on the OL. If the draft board cooperates, I strongly believe Ballard should take an OT with one of our top 3 selections. 





 

[masterlock]

18 hours ago, Jdubu said:

Lmao!! If it’s so proven you can find them anywhere, how is it that the colts haven’t found a RT or a solid back up LT all these years? The last dominate LT and RT this team has had was Glenn and Meadows. 

Because the people doing the scouting aren't good at identifying talent. 

[IinD]

37 minutes ago, Trueman said:

If the draft board cooperates, I strongly believe Ballard should take an OT with one of our top 3 selections. 

I could easily see that as well. Granted our skill positions aren't great. Fixing the oline helps long term. 

 

It's like we finally did enough on the inside and the outside now has huge cracks (OT's).

[#12.]

16 hours ago, Trueman said:

100% , I get that. But look at the modern dynasty of the Patriots , how much draft capital have they invested in WR's/RB's? It's essentially the same philosophy. Build a complete team around an elite QB with the draft , and supplement him with skill positions when the rest of the team is built , or externally via trade/free agents. 

WR:

2000- 0 WR's taken
2001- 0 WR's taken 
2002- 2nd Round Deion Branch, 7th round David Givens
2003- 2nd Bethel Johnson  
2004- 5th P.K Sam 
2005- 0 WR's taken
2006- 2nd round Chad Jackson
2007- 0 WR's taken
2008- 5th Matt Slater
2009- 3rd Brandon Tate , 7th Julian Edelman
2010- 3rd Taylor Price
2011- 0 WR's taken
2012- 7th Jeremy Ebert
2013- 4th Josh Boyce
2014- 7th Jeremy Gallon
2015- 0 WR's taken
2016- 4th round Malcom Mitchell , 7th Devin Lucien
2017- 0 WR's taken
2018- 6th round Braxton Barrios

So in 18 years , the Patriots have never drafted a WR in the first round. Not once. And only 3 times in the 2nd round. 

You know what they did? They realized : a) they could scheme production , b) Brady makes receivers better than they are ; c) they needed specific receiver types (Welker, Amendola, Edelman etc) to maximize their system and Brady's skillset (quick release/decision making)... and those receivers weren't valued around the league; d) the market is flooded with receivers constantly , so they made trades/signings and used the valuable draft capital on positions that weren't easy to acquire.

2001- Signed David Patten
2006- Signed Reche Caldwell
2007- Traded 4th round pick for Randy Moss (lol); Traded 2nd and 7th picks for Welker; signed Dante Stallworth
2010- Traded 4th for Deion Branch 
2011- Traded 5th and 6th for Chad Johnson
2012- Signed Brandon Lloyd
2013- Signed Amendola
2014- Signed Brandon Lafell
2015- Signed Chris Hogan
2017- Traded 1st and 3rd picks for Brandin Cooks
2018-  Traded 5th round pick for Cordarrelle Patterson , traded 5th for Josh Gordon

As for RB's , they've invested a little more , but still not a ton. It's essentially the same deal. They find free agents/vets to plug the holes because the talent pool is supremely deep in comparison to other positions. 

1st rounders : 2
2nd : 1
3rd : 2
4th:  2

7 times in 18 years the Patriots have selected a back in the top 4 rounds. Three times in the top 2. There's the modern dynasty , doing essentially the same thing as Bill Walsh did back in the 80's. 
 

Yes, and I'm suggesting you should almost never expend high draft picks on RB's or WR's. There's more good RB's and WR's in every draft than any other position. It may not always be top heavy , but it's almost always the two deepest position groups. If I can get good talent later in the draft , and trade for good players for mid-round picks ... why would I ever spend significant draft capital on skill positions? Look no further than last draft for an extreme example......  Barkley over Darnold? Are you kidding me? No chance. You take the elite QB prospect 10 out of 10 times. 
 

No , you can't have scrubs , but teams do get by  without expending high draft capital. Which is all I'm saying. You can find good WR's in the trade/FA market every year  , and late round gems that can contribute. Look no further than the Steelers taking a WR gem almost every year in the mid-to-late rounds. 
 

See, to me , it's almost the opposite. The rules are making increasingly easier for the offense every year. That means even when you don't have great talent offensively , you're gunna be able to put up more points than would've been able to 10 years ago. 

Therefore, it's almost to the point where if you want to play any kind of respectable defense , you need a ton of playmakers and studs. Like , more, than you used to need because you essentially can't touch anyone anymore. That means you need sensational athletes and gifted players in the air-- everywhere. If you want a good defense in the modern game... you need to invest in it. Gameplanning/coaching can only do so much nowadays. 
 

Again, just because I'm saying I wouldn't invest high picks in skill positions right now , doesn't mean I think we can keep going with Pascals and Chester Rogers of the world. No, far from it. 

I'm just saying it's much easier to find good players at skill positions later in the draft and in trades/free agency. 

Once we have a solid drafted core and foundation in the areas that Ballard values , then we can look to add the stud WR in the 1st round. 

We're building this thing from the inside out , like we should've from 1998 onwards. 
 

If you try to model yourselves after the Patriots, you will fail, as has every team who brought in a Patriot coach and attempted to do so(thanks, Josh - bullet dodged).  Unique, once in a lifetime coach.  Unique situation.

 

When we were beating the Patriots 5 out of 6 and beating them in the playoffs, how did we do it?  We did it by putting more weapons around Manning than New England could stop.  Belichick said it himself.  He admitted it's what drove them to bring in Moss and Welker.  

 

Ten-to-15 years ago, I didn't love the Polian method, but with the rule changes and where the league is heading offensively, the Polian method might work well in the coming years.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

23 hours ago, Trueman said:

100%. The WR & RB crowd can clamour all they want. If an offensive mind like Bill Walsh believed wide receivers were the last pieces to add to a team , then that should tell you something. And the rules have only made it easier for receivers nowadays.

As for RB, you can manufacture elite production with multiple backs ; you cannot manufacture elite line-play ... you can only mask it.

We can address the skill positions in the later rounds and in free agency/trades; there's a ton available every offseason. The real draft capital needs to be invested in the defense and the trenches.

Now, this isn't to say I think we should ignore skill positions . For example , I wanted us to sign Sammy Watkins , but he ultimately priced himself out of where Ballard was willing to go. Like Ebron, if we can find a young guy with some upside/something to prove , and he can be a part of the roster for multiple seasons at a good price , I'm more than willing to find a better receiver or two in FA. Geronimo Allison/Devin Funchess ... or even a camp tryout for someone like Kevin White are potential options. I'm sure there'll be a ton of unforeseen options available , but looking at the pending UFA list as of today , those are the type of guys I'd target. Pulling a Grigson , and signing a 31 year old Golden Tate for 4 years isn't something I want to see us do.

If we could get a 3rd round pick for Brissett , we'd have a top 10-12 pick , two 2nds , and two 3rds. And I'd do exactly what Ballard did last draft again. Defense and trenches. 

If everything fell in place perfectly , I'd go : DT , OT , DE , CB, OT
 

Exactly.

We can address the RB position in the later rounds like the 6th, and 7th and UDFA.

[richard pallo]

29 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Exactly.

We can address the RB position in the later rounds like the 6th, and 7th and UDFA.

" It's madness I tell you it's madness"

[indyagent17]

On 10/5/2018 at 2:45 PM, Scott Pennock said:

His first NFL Start at RT...

 

On the road...

 

In New England...

 

Didn't allow a sack...

 

Perhaps when Castonzo comes back, Clark and Good become swing tackles/Guards with Glowinski as the other interior olineman and they let Smith run with the job?

 

Maybe he locks it down and then T becomes less of a draft need next year and we can focus on the missing skill players that everyone seems to be clamoring for!?

 

Thoughts on his performance? 

He is a very high draft pick and I'm sure that was the plan all along 

[richard pallo]

9 minutes ago, indyagent17 said:

He is a very high draft pick and I'm sure that was the plan all along 

I believe the plan is for him to take Slausson's spot at RG.  It appears he came very close from Reichs comments.  I think Good goes back there at RT. 

[Jdubu]

12 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

Assume what you want.....still waiting for a valid argument or any shred of proof from you. 

 

And yes, lineman can come from anywhere and turn into quality lineman. I'll give you another one, this time with Colts ties......Jeff Saturday was an All Pro Center who was an UDFA for the Colts.

 

 

By this measurement, any position can be had anywhere, anytime. Tom Brady? Idk 

[LockeDown]

9 hours ago, BOTT said:

I don't think Dungy made many changes to the offensive staff he inherited. I think Reich keeps guys that prove they are worth keeping.

Fair enough.  I say he keeps Eberflus and not  DeGuglielmo.  Brings in his own guy for that.  

[NewColtsFan]

23 hours ago, Trueman said:

100% , I get that. But look at the modern dynasty of the Patriots , how much draft capital have they invested in WR's/RB's? It's essentially the same philosophy. Build a complete team around an elite QB with the draft , and supplement him with skill positions when the rest of the team is built , or externally via trade/free agents. 

WR:

2000- 0 WR's taken
2001- 0 WR's taken 
2002- 2nd Round Deion Branch, 7th round David Givens
2003- 2nd Bethel Johnson  
2004- 5th P.K Sam 
2005- 0 WR's taken
2006- 2nd round Chad Jackson
2007- 0 WR's taken
2008- 5th Matt Slater
2009- 3rd Brandon Tate , 7th Julian Edelman
2010- 3rd Taylor Price
2011- 0 WR's taken
2012- 7th Jeremy Ebert
2013- 4th Josh Boyce
2014- 7th Jeremy Gallon
2015- 0 WR's taken
2016- 4th round Malcom Mitchell , 7th Devin Lucien
2017- 0 WR's taken
2018- 6th round Braxton Barrios

So in 18 years , the Patriots have never drafted a WR in the first round. Not once. And only 3 times in the 2nd round. 

You know what they did? They realized : a) they could scheme production , b) Brady makes receivers better than they are ; c) they needed specific receiver types (Welker, Amendola, Edelman etc) to maximize their system and Brady's skillset (quick release/decision making)... and those receivers weren't valued around the league; d) the market is flooded with receivers constantly , so they made trades/signings and used the valuable draft capital on positions that weren't easy to acquire.

2001- Signed David Patten
2006- Signed Reche Caldwell
2007- Traded 4th round pick for Randy Moss (lol); Traded 2nd and 7th picks for Welker; signed Dante Stallworth
2010- Traded 4th for Deion Branch 
2011- Traded 5th and 6th for Chad Johnson
2012- Signed Brandon Lloyd
2013- Signed Amendola
2014- Signed Brandon Lafell
2015- Signed Chris Hogan
2017- Traded 1st and 3rd picks for Brandin Cooks
2018-  Traded 5th round pick for Cordarrelle Patterson , traded 5th for Josh Gordon

As for RB's , they've invested a little more , but still not a ton. It's essentially the same deal. They find free agents/vets to plug the holes because the talent pool is supremely deep in comparison to other positions. 

1st rounders : 2
2nd : 1
3rd : 2
4th:  2

7 times in 18 years the Patriots have selected a back in the top 4 rounds. Three times in the top 2. There's the modern dynasty , doing essentially the same thing as Bill Walsh did back in the 80's. 
 

Yes, and I'm suggesting you should almost never expend high draft picks on RB's or WR's. There's more good RB's and WR's in every draft than any other position. It may not always be top heavy , but it's almost always the two deepest position groups. If I can get good talent later in the draft , and trade for good players for mid-round picks ... why would I ever spend significant draft capital on skill positions? Look no further than last draft for an extreme example......  Barkley over Darnold? Are you kidding me? No chance. You take the elite QB prospect 10 out of 10 times. 
 

No , you can't have scrubs , but teams do get by  without expending high draft capital. Which is all I'm saying. You can find good WR's in the trade/FA market every year  , and late round gems that can contribute. Look no further than the Steelers taking a WR gem almost every year in the mid-to-late rounds. 
 

See, to me , it's almost the opposite. The rules are making increasingly easier for the offense every year. That means even when you don't have great talent offensively , you're gunna be able to put up more points than would've been able to 10 years ago. 

Therefore, it's almost to the point where if you want to play any kind of respectable defense , you need a ton of playmakers and studs. Like , more, than you used to need because you essentially can't touch anyone anymore. That means you need sensational athletes and gifted players in the air-- everywhere. If you want a good defense in the modern game... you need to invest in it. Gameplanning/coaching can only do so much nowadays. 
 

Again, just because I'm saying I wouldn't invest high picks in skill positions right now , doesn't mean I think we can keep going with Pascals and Chester Rogers of the world. No, far from it. 

I'm just saying it's much easier to find good players at skill positions later in the draft and in trades/free agency. 

Once we have a solid drafted core and foundation in the areas that Ballard values , then we can look to add the stud WR in the 1st round. 

We're building this thing from the inside out , like we should've from 1998 onwards. 
 

 

This might be one of the best posts I’ve read here in my seven years here...

 

Simply a great post.    And a great understanding of things by you throughout this thread.

 

My only note of caution is reading too much into what Walsh did...   remember, that was roughly 30-40 years ago.    What applied then doesn’t necessarily work today. 

 

Personally...   I see the Colts first three picks going to the lines.

 

1.   DE or DT

2.   DT or DE

2.   OT. (Our future right tackle)

 

I think our first round pick in 2020 is the pick to replace AC.  

 

I see Ballard continuing to build the lines...    I don’t think he’s done.

 

Thanks for your posts in this thread.  They’ve been fantastic.

 

[BOTT]

19 hours ago, Trueman said:

I mean sure, we've invested draft capital in the OL , but AC was 7 years ago and he's 30. We can't really bank on a ton of more production from him and he's not an elite LT. I can't really envision an Andrew Whitworth post 30 career for him. Maybe I'm wrong in that assessment. 

Two more OT's to really solidify the group would be my guess. One to start at RT , and one to provide depth/hopefully take over for AC. I wish some of Grigson's OT selections worked out , but they haven't. We can't punish Ballard for errors from the past regime. Our OT depth is pretty crap , and it needs to be addressed in the draft. 

Really, there's 3 pieces you could consider long term options: Nelson, Kelly, Smith... I mean, it's pretty evident we need some quality young tackles. Considering how offensive line play has significantly dropped off due to the CBA (lack of practice time/reps) , getting two guys in whilst we still have a starting option like AC wouldn't be a bad idea, imo.

If there was ever a positional group to stack , it would be the OL for me. 

Personally, I want one of those freakish 3-tech's in the 1st round , and then draft an OT with one of our 2nd rounders. But, if a Greg Little or Jonah Williams is available at our selection , I wouldn't mind it if Ballard takes him. Adding a Tarik Glenn level player would be immense. 

I don't see the point in half-as(s)ing it now that we're here. We almost destroyed one of the greatest QB prospects of all-time , lets make damn sure it doesn't happen. We need more on the OL. If the draft board cooperates, I strongly believe Ballard should take an OT with one of our top 3 selections. 





 

 

When you take into account AC's relatively healthy career and the new offensive scheme I see no reason he can't play well another 4 yrs.

 

I would be kinda shocked if Ballard didn't take a OT in the first 3-4 rounds. 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

On 10/5/2018 at 5:29 PM, Trueman said:

100%. The WR & RB crowd can clamour all they want. If an offensive mind like Bill Walsh believed wide receivers were the last pieces to add to a team , then that should tell you something. And the rules have only made it easier for receivers nowadays.

As for RB, you can manufacture elite production with multiple backs ; you cannot manufacture elite line-play ... you can only mask it.

We can address the skill positions in the later rounds and in free agency/trades; there's a ton available every offseason. The real draft capital needs to be invested in the defense and the trenches.

Now, this isn't to say I think we should ignore skill positions . For example , I wanted us to sign Sammy Watkins , but he ultimately priced himself out of where Ballard was willing to go. Like Ebron, if we can find a young guy with some upside/something to prove , and he can be a part of the roster for multiple seasons at a good price , I'm more than willing to find a better receiver or two in FA. Geronimo Allison/Devin Funchess ... or even a camp tryout for someone like Kevin White are potential options. I'm sure there'll be a ton of unforeseen options available , but looking at the pending UFA list as of today , those are the type of guys I'd target. Pulling a Grigson , and signing a 31 year old Golden Tate for 4 years isn't something I want to see us do.

If we could get a 3rd round pick for Brissett , we'd have a top 10-12 pick , two 2nds , and two 3rds. And I'd do exactly what Ballard did last draft again. Defense and trenches. 

If everything fell in place perfectly , I'd go : DT , OT , DE , CB, OT
 

 

Respectfully Disagree.

In a day & age where all the rules & penalties favour offense, and SCORING continues to rise, you want to compete with other HIGH POWERED OFFENSES & Offensive innovaters(chiefs, rams, etc..) with basically scrubs at the skill positions.

 

Inferior offenses are usually the teams with the worst records in todays nfl.

[throwing BBZ]

20 hours ago, richard pallo said:

I believe the plan is for him to take Slausson's spot at RG.  It appears he came very close from Reichs comments.  I think Good goes back there at RT. 

 

 The Plan is to develop him to be the best player he can become. And Ballard would be tickled to death if he exceeds their expectations and can become good at RT. The same is true of Clark. They both may be good at one or more positions in their futures.

 But i am ready for a right side of Smith & Clark.
 I would cut Good, he is wasting one of our 53 slots.

[Moosejawcolt]

On 10/6/2018 at 5:56 AM, shakedownstreet said:

 

My thoughts exactly

[Jackie Daytona]

On 10/6/2018 at 11:12 AM, LockeDown said:

I agree and he might keep Eberflus too.  I think Reich, just like Dungy, probably wants his “guys”to Get shots at coaching gigs.  I say that because it seems he has character and cares.

Gug's (OL coach) and Eberflus weren't Reich's picks, but Siriani absolutely was...  and I doubt Eberflus goes anywhere.

[Hoose]

Some great posts here. But WR has to be a priority as well. Likely a FA pickup. 

[lollygagger8]

I still think PFF is a joke, but I was really sweating Smith starting at tackle. To my pleasant surprise, he did WAY better than I expected. Albeit, it was against NE, but he played much better than anticipated. 

[Coffeedrinker]

On 10/5/2018 at 5:45 PM, Jdubu said:

Lmao!! If it’s so proven you can find them anywhere, how is it that the colts haven’t found a RT or a solid back up LT all these years? The last dominate LT and RT this team has had was Glenn and Meadows. 

Glenn and Diem?

[Valpo2004]

On 10/5/2018 at 6:51 PM, #12. said:

 

Not sure Walsh actually believed that, but were he watching the NFL in 2018, he might say, surround your franchise QB with weapons early and often.  You can't touch the QB.  You can't touch a receiver.  Scoring?  It's at a historic rate.  

 

What is the best way to build a team in 2018?  2019?  Good question.

 

I'm sort of with you here.  Guy was a genius in building NFL teams for the '80's.  But the game is different now.  Not sure the approach to building a team would be the same now.  

[Jdubu]

1 hour ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Glenn and Diem?

If my bad memory serves me right, it was Glenn and meadows that were drafted together. Glenn was supposed to take the LT and Meadows the RT but Glenn held out, ticked off Polish and he made him play at RT his first year while Meadows held down the LT spot, then the following year, they switched back and all was well there. Yes Diem did play with Glenn but I still think Meadows was better. JMO. 

[Coffeedrinker]

25 minutes ago, Jdubu said:

If my bad memory serves me right, it was Glenn and meadows that were drafted together. Glenn was supposed to take the LT and Meadows the RT but Glenn held out, ticked off Polish and he made him play at RT his first year while Meadows held down the LT spot, then the following year, they switched back and all was well there. Yes Diem did play with Glenn but I still think Meadows was better. JMO. 

Meadows and Glenn were draft the same year and yes, Glenn held out and play RG all year and Meadows played LT as a rookie and then moved to RT the following year.  By Polish, I assume you mean Polian and that is not correct because Glenn and Meadows were drafted before Polian became the GM.

 

Diem came later and while arguments could be made about who was better Diem or Meadows, the fact is Diem was a 10 year starter and RT for the Colts and he locked down that position so much that the Colts did not have to worry about finding a starting RT for all those years.  And considering Glenn did not become a great LT until the Colts drafted Freeney, the only time the OTs were dominant for the Colts was during the Glenn/Diem years.  During the Glenn/Meadows years, Glenn was just a good LT who could not handle speed rushers and Meadows was solid in all aspects.  From 2003 to 2006 the Colts had one of the most dominating Olines in the NFL and it was because of Glenn/Diem.  Then Glenn retired after the SB because he didn't want to lose weight at the beginning of training camp again and the Colts struggled to find a LT until AC.  They have struggled to find a RT since 2011 (Diem played that year but you could see that age and knees were catching up with him and he could not move nearly as well anymore.

[Jdubu]

18 minutes ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Meadows and Glenn were draft the same year and yes, Glenn held out and play RG all year and Meadows played LT as a rookie and then moved to RT the following year.  By Polish, I assume you mean Polian and that is not correct because Glenn and Meadows were drafted before Polian became the GM.

 

Diem came later and while arguments could be made about who was better Diem or Meadows, the fact is Diem was a 10 year starter and RT for the Colts and he locked down that position so much that the Colts did not have to worry about finding a starting RT for all those years.  And considering Glenn did not become a great LT until the Colts drafted Freeney, the only time the OTs were dominant for the Colts was during the Glenn/Diem years.  During the Glenn/Meadows years, Glenn was just a good LT who could not handle speed rushers and Meadows was solid in all aspects.  From 2003 to 2006 the Colts had one of the most dominating Olines in the NFL and it was because of Glenn/Diem.  Then Glenn retired after the SB because he didn't want to lose weight at the beginning of training camp again and the Colts struggled to find a LT until AC.  They have struggled to find a RT since 2011 (Diem played that year but you could see that age and knees were catching up with him and he could not move nearly as well anymore.

I said it was old memory but I had some of it right and some close. Diem played 10 seasons at RT for us? Man, it sure didn’t seem that way. Must have been Tobin that was * and shifted Tarik over lol. I will yield to your better knowledge of all this because you are usually spot on, one of my favorite posters here actually. Thanks for setting the record right. 

[chad72]

On 10/7/2018 at 10:32 AM, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

 

Respectfully Disagree.

In a day & age where all the rules & penalties favour offense, and SCORING continues to rise, you want to compete with other HIGH POWERED OFFENSES & Offensive innovaters(chiefs, rams, etc..) with basically scrubs at the skill positions.

 

Inferior offenses are usually the teams with the worst records in todays nfl.

 

The truth is somewhere in the middle but for the most part, I do agree with you.

 

Do you think we have defensive minds like Belichick? That man conceded the run and jammed the heck out of Jim Kelly's high tempo WRs, and it took a while for the Bills to adjust and the Giants won a wide-right SB. That man ran rough shod on his own field for HFA to slow down Peyton's offense. He dared the Colts offense of the Peyton era to run and asked Bruschi and Vrabel to play pass always increasing the depth of their drops, and confused Peyton constantly including when he played Rodney Harrison at CB and Ty Law at safety. The simple answer is no. SBs in the early 2000s, make no mistake about it, were won with more physical play by DBs, that are pretty much allowed sparingly now, so you have to adapt to the times. 

 

Heck, the game was different in the early 2000s too till around 2005, contact vs WRs was enforced. So, all the Parcells era guys like McGinnest, Ty Law, Lawyer Milloy, Bruschi were augmented with Vrabel, Rodney Harrison and the dynasty was born. When the rules changed, guess what Belichick did - he went ahead and invested in Randy Moss, Wes Welker and Donte Stallworth. When the Randy Moss experiment fizzled, he realized elite Ds do not give time for 5 and 7-step drops, he adapted and went and signed 2 TEs to improve his underneath game - Gronk in top of Round 2 and Hernandez in Round 3 (though it did not work out), and constantly signed/drafted RBs for the underneath passing game. 

 

The whole premise of the "early pick on a WR or RB is not warranted" is based on the premise that all coaches are equal in prowess if the same level of talent can be maximized. Plus, how many other franchises had 3 SBs in the bag that you could sign a WR or RB in free agency or trade for one for moderate market value without having to pay a bit more? Only the Patriots. Would they look at the Colts the same way? Heck no.  Ballard will find that in the next off season and maybe he found that out the previous off season with possible cases of "close but no cigar". 

 

Other teams that have won multiple SBs - Giants won twice with Plaxico Burress and Hakeem Nicks making big plays, both first round WRs. Next would be Steelers - if Santonio Holmes, a first round wide out had not caught his game winning TD, another first round wide out Larry Fitzgerald would have won the honors in that Steelers-Cardinals SB. If the Falcons had just the run ball in the Patriots SB and kicked a FG to go up 31-20, Julio Jones' spectacular catch would have given another first round wide out a SB. Make no mistake, you need a rounded team to win the SB nowadays with the D making plays but to suggest that you could pull any WR with marginal talent off the street that is a system fit and make them all stars with an elite QB is not feasible most of the time with every coach.

 

Even Belichick and folks realized that they needed to make a move for Josh Gordon, a talent like David Patten is not going to work nowadays. The early dynasty Patriots had the OL, and the Patriots have always had top notch OL coaching and unless we can have our OL play at a high level where we can run 40 times and win a game if necessary with the run, I am not going to run with the "do everything the Patriots did and it will work for the Colts" gang.

 

I am not saying we have to invest a first round pick on a WR or an RB. But if a Day 2 pick is available that can help your team considerably, you have to consider it. 

[compuls1v3]

Not sure if anyone else posted this, but here's a good read on Smith against the Patriots.

 

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2018/10/8/17949008/film-room-braden-smith-impresses-in-first-nfl-start

[DougDew]

21 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Meadows and Glenn were draft the same year and yes, Glenn held out and play RG all year and Meadows played LT as a rookie and then moved to RT the following year.  By Polish, I assume you mean Polian and that is not correct because Glenn and Meadows were drafted before Polian became the GM.

 

Diem came later and while arguments could be made about who was better Diem or Meadows, the fact is Diem was a 10 year starter and RT for the Colts and he locked down that position so much that the Colts did not have to worry about finding a starting RT for all those years.  And considering Glenn did not become a great LT until the Colts drafted Freeney, the only time the OTs were dominant for the Colts was during the Glenn/Diem years.  During the Glenn/Meadows years, Glenn was just a good LT who could not handle speed rushers and Meadows was solid in all aspects.  From 2003 to 2006 the Colts had one of the most dominating Olines in the NFL and it was because of Glenn/Diem.  Then Glenn retired after the SB because he didn't want to lose weight at the beginning of training camp again and the Colts struggled to find a LT until AC.  They have struggled to find a RT since 2011 (Diem played that year but you could see that age and knees were catching up with him and he could not move nearly as well anymore.

Diem was a 4th round draft choice from Northern Illinois.  RTs (and Gs) don't have to be a high pick.

[jbaron04]

On 10/5/2018 at 2:45 PM, Scott Pennock said:

His first NFL Start at RT...

 

On the road...

 

In New England...

 

Didn't allow a sack...

 

Perhaps when Castonzo comes back, Clark and Good become swing tackles/Guards with Glowinski as the other interior olineman and they let Smith run with the job?

 

Maybe he locks it down and then T becomes less of a draft need next year and we can focus on the missing skill players that everyone seems to be clamoring for!?

 

Thoughts on his performance? 

I think we should draft a LT and move constanzo to Rt from Smith for RG with Kelly at C and Nelson at at lG

[Coffeedrinker]

2 hours ago, compuls1v3 said:

Not sure if anyone else posted this, but here's a good read on Smith against the Patriots.

 

https://www.stampedeblue.com/2018/10/8/17949008/film-room-braden-smith-impresses-in-first-nfl-start

Thanks for posting.  It is a pretty good write up.  I should show these to my kids to show them the benefits of moving their feet.

[Scott Pennock]

7 hours ago, jbaron04 said:

I think we should draft a LT and move constanzo to Rt from Smith for RG with Kelly at C and Nelson at at lG

Not a bad idea....provided said rookie plays better as a rookie than Castonzo.....perhaps put the rookie at RT for his first year to cut his teeth!?