Winners and Loser among the players with GM change

[dgambill]

On 1/27/2017 at 2:42 PM, Buddy Lee said:

Of the three links you posted, the first two indicate that drops were a problem with Dorsett especially in critical situations. Regarding playing with the three worst Miami QBs... Brad Kaaya has set numerous school records at Miami and, with NFL scout input, is entering the draft after his junior year. Kiper has him as a late 2nd or a 3rd round pick in this upcoming draft. He doesn't sound like a terrible QB to me.

How many years did he play with Kaaya and that was like his freshman year correct? The qb play though I would say wasn't consistent. 

 

They always list the positives and the negatives...no one was saying he didn't have any warts. He isn't perfect or a finished product but when someone says he isn't talented than I just think that's nonsense. Point is he has more talent than just being fast. I think it's too soon to call him a bust....and I think a lot of people think the coaching staff has done a poor job utilizing him. The kid has 4.2 speed and we never throw him a wr screen never run a reverse for him basically just use him as a decoy to tie up the safety to open up TY underneath...sure that's great sometimes but if we would just run a quarter of the plays for him that we do for TY we might actually get to see what this kid can do.

[Buddy Lee]

3 hours ago, dgambill said:

How many years did he play with Kaaya and that was like his freshman year correct? The qb play though I would say wasn't consistent. 

 

They always list the positives and the negatives...no one was saying he didn't have any warts. He isn't perfect or a finished product but when someone says he isn't talented than I just think that's nonsense. Point is he has more talent than just being fast. I think it's too soon to call him a bust....and I think a lot of people think the coaching staff has done a poor job utilizing him. The kid has 4.2 speed and we never throw him a wr screen never run a reverse for him basically just use him as a decoy to tie up the safety to open up TY underneath...sure that's great sometimes but if we would just run a quarter of the plays for him that we do for TY we might actually get to see what this kid can do.

I haven't given up on Dorsett in the least. Not like some on this site. My comment was primarily directed at taking him in the first round. BTW, when did you clock him at 4.2?

[dgambill]

1 hour ago, Buddy Lee said:

I haven't given up on Dorsett in the least. Not like some on this site. My comment was primarily directed at taking him in the first round. BTW, when did you clock him at 4.2?

He was reported to have been clocked in the 4.2s at Miami on both his pro day runs but he was suffering from an injury when he ran his 4.33 at the combine. We can all agree he is fast....and yes let's not give up. I still have hope some day we hire a competent OC....or Peyton feels sorry for us Colts fans and saved us LOL.

[Coltfreak]

On 1/26/2017 at 1:18 PM, Defjamz26 said:

Tired of hearing this. What talent!? He's fast, that's it. He wasn't even good in college. Grigson is gone. Why still make excuses for his picks?

Actually he was good in college and projected right where we picked him. There were other teams that were in line to take him if we didn't 

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/phillip-dorsett?id=2552424

[Colts1324]

On 1/26/2017 at 10:02 AM, Defjamz26 said:

Manning also set what would be the record for TDs by a rookie QB until 2012 when Wilson tied it. He also held the rookie records for passing yards in a season and a single game. Green hasn't done anything spectacular his rookie year besides look like he can't play football. He's speedy and that's it. And in no way is he a quality backup. If he weren't a high round pick, he would've been on the PS.

 

"Cheap rookie deal " gets used way too much around here. Who cares if they're cheap. If they're underperforming and you can get better then you move on from them. Either trade them or cut them. Why let people who aren't good take up a roster spot? It's not like this is rare either. Green-Beckham got traded after a year. Eric Rowe did. D'Juon got cut after a year where he was injured for most of it. Stanley Jean-Baptiste. What makes Green so special? Why is it always the Colts players who are above reproach?

If you were a middle school basketball coach, and you had a sixth grade kid playing basketball who was really good(better than the other players at shooting, dribbling), but he was too short to keep up to par on defense with the other kids and costing your team points, but the doctor's predicted he would grow 4 or 5 inches in the next year. Would you try to develop him that year so he could be a good starter next year or cut him cause he isn't performing? Think about it. Kind of like developing a player in the NFL. We knew Green was going to be bad his rookie year. 

[superrep1967]

On 1/26/2017 at 7:54 AM, SilentHill said:

I expect sweeping changes of aging and ineffective players

Yes it will happen. 

[superrep1967]

16 hours ago, Colts1324 said:

If you were a middle school basketball coach, and you had a sixth grade kid playing basketball who was really good(better than the other players at shooting, dribbling), but he was too short to keep up to par on defense with the other kids and costing your team points, but the doctor's predicted he would grow 4 or 5 inches in the next year. Would you try to develop him that year so he could be a good starter next year or cut him cause he isn't performing? Think about it. Kind of like developing a player in the NFL. We knew Green was going to be bad his rookie year. 

 

Yeah, He's still learning the position. But he is a gamble. 

[superrep1967]

16 hours ago, dgambill said:

He was reported to have been clocked in the 4.2s at Miami on both his pro day runs but he was suffering from an injury when he ran his 4.33 at the combine. We can all agree he is fast....and yes let's not give up. I still have hope some day we hire a competent OC....or Peyton feels sorry for us Colts fans and saved us LOL.

 

I feel he's not used probably we need to get him the ball in the flat like a Sproles. 

[superrep1967]

On 1/26/2017 at 2:17 PM, Jason_S said:

 

if that's the plan, then just fire chuck now and get started right away.  doing what you suggest would completely undermine the idea of giving him a legit chance to be the coach beyond 2017.

 

I agree!

[Colts1324]

23 minutes ago, superrep1967 said:

Yeah, He's still learning the position. But he is a gamble. 

He def is. But I'm not ready to give up on him.

[Superman]

On 1/27/2017 at 0:42 PM, Buddy Lee said:

Of the three links you posted, the first two indicate that drops were a problem with Dorsett especially in critical situations. Regarding playing with the three worst Miami QBs... Brad Kaaya has set numerous school records at Miami and, with NFL scout input, is entering the draft after his junior year. Kiper has him as a late 2nd or a 3rd round pick in this upcoming draft. He doesn't sound like a terrible QB to me.

 

Kaaya was a freshman in 2014, and he wasn't very good. I don't think very highly of him as an NFL prospect even now, to be honest, but that's JMO.

 

Dorsett had 1 drop his last year at Miami. His hands were never an issue in college.

[King Colt]

With all due respect there is no way any one knows anything on this.

[Jdubu]

On 1/26/2017 at 1:28 AM, GoColts8818 said:

Loser:  butler.  

 

Maybe Grigson's best find and has been very solid here but is an aging free agent.  I doubt a new GM brings him back.

If he looks at production, he comes back. Does he look at him as a slot cb or as a safety? Does the new GM go to the coaches and try and get their honest opinion of the players and then try and see it on tape or vise versa? Does he trust the coaches to decide player evaluations right now? 

[GoColts8818]

1 hour ago, Jdubu said:

If he looks at production, he comes back. Does he look at him as a slot cb or as a safety? Does the new GM go to the coaches and try and get their honest opinion of the players and then try and see it on tape or vise versa? Does he trust the coaches to decide player evaluations right now? 

Or he could with younger players or guys he's more familiar with which is common for new GMs.

[I'm mad, bro]

I think its DQ art and Kendall and maybe pat Robinson. We won't re sign cole Walden or Adams. I think we re sign jack and hopefully Darius. Young bad draft picks are what they are they're not going anywhere, worst case become special team guys

[dgambill]

Totally off topic but does anyone know if D'joun Smith cleared waivers and if we ever placed him on the IR? Could he get another shot in training camp or did he get a settlement and gone entirely? I know he probably is a wash out but maybe under a new regime he get another try out?

[Superman]

9 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Totally off topic but does anyone know if D'joun Smith cleared waivers and if we ever placed him on the IR? Could he get another shot in training camp or did he get a settlement and gone entirely? I know he probably is a wash out but maybe under a new regime he get another try out?

 

He was released from IR with an injury settlement. He had a number of tryouts around the league, then finally signed with the Titans. 

[krunk]

13 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Totally off topic but does anyone know if D'joun Smith cleared waivers and if we ever placed him on the IR? Could he get another shot in training camp or did he get a settlement and gone entirely? I know he probably is a wash out but maybe under a new regime he get another try out?

You must have missed that one bro.  He's with the Titans

[dgambill]

2 hours ago, krunk said:

You must have missed that one bro.  He's with the Titans

Yeah I was really really reaching. lol I missed it. Just thought maybe it was a Grigson thing and maybe a fresh look from a new GM might see something worthwhile....but I was pretty sure he was a lost cause. Oh well this draft is loaded with secondary talent.

[Myles]

I'd be disappointed if Ballard did anything with Gore.   He is good, had a good season last year and is a positive in the locker room.   He's not that expensive either.   Best would be to keep him this year and have a RB spell him with the goal of taking the starting role in 2018.

 

 

[OLD FAN MAN]

expect to see  upgrades at  most defensive positions, and  overpaid spots on o-line and te

[akcolt]

I don't see any of the young guys getting cut before camp. I could see a guy like Morrison not making the 53 man. He was a reach in the 4th nearly every predraft site had him as a 7th- UDFA. He's not going to get faster or more athletic. Deion Jones is going to be next seasons E Jackson. If we sign a guy like Hodges and draft an ILB that could do it. He may not beat out Rhodes. Typical Grig's sleuth LB.

 

Parry will face some competition too. Ferguson shouldn't be back. It will be interesting how we handle the vets Walden and Butler in particular. I'm not married to Gore would bring back Todman . Gore's been a bit of a disappointment IMO. I recall numerous instances of butter fingers in the red zone.  I'd like to see Ayers and Doyle back. 

[theanarchist]

On ‎1‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 11:31 PM, ztboiler said:

A change in GM equals increased roster turnover compared to standard.  No loyalty to underperforming draft picks, questionable fits for scheme adjustments, aging vets.....

 

It's interesting to consider potential winners and losers among the players...obviously depends a lot on who is selected.

 

First young player that comes to my mind who is more vulnerable now than before...Antonio Morrison. 

 

First vet player that comes to mind....Frank Gore.

Lets hope! This roster is weak. It needs turnover. I agree about Morrison. Plenty of other dead weight on that defense too. Ballard will put his stamp on it.

[coltsfeva]

I remember Tom Moore talking about getting separation vertically and horizontally. I would love to see all three (four if you count Rogers) WRs utilized this way as they all have the speed to take the top off of defenses. Keep them guessing. So many question marks on defense:  can the secondary stay healthy and be effective as is or do they need that #2 shutdown corner? Will Morrison make up for his lack of speed with experience or can they land a guy like Foster? The D-line has to be better but will Langford and a healthy Anderson solve some deficiencies? Lastly, I saw where NE uses 5 defensive backs 88% of the time. If that becomes the norm, how big is it that Geathers may be able to be an effective "tweeter"? I'm looking forward to next season!

 

[Buddy Lee]

2 hours ago, coltsfeva said:

I remember Tom Moore talking about getting separation vertically and horizontally. I would love to see all three (four if you count Rogers) WRs utilized this way as they all have the speed to take the top off of defenses. Keep them guessing. So many question marks on defense:  can the secondary stay healthy and be effective as is or do they need that #2 shutdown corner? Will Morrison make up for his lack of speed with experience or can they land a guy like Foster? The D-line has to be better but will Langford and a healthy Anderson solve some deficiencies? Lastly, I saw where NE uses 5 defensive backs 88% of the time. If that becomes the norm, how big is it that Geathers may be able to be an effective "tweeter"? I'm looking forward to next season!

 

I haven't seen any of Geathers' "tweets" to judge their effectiveness

 

Lots of mock drafts show Foster going to the Bengals ahead of us. But if he falls to us I would love to have him.

[Chucklez]

10 hours ago, akcolt said:

I don't see any of the young guys getting cut before camp. I could see a guy like Morrison not making the 53 man. He was a reach in the 4th nearly every predraft site had him as a 7th- UDFA. He's not going to get faster or more athletic. Deion Jones is going to be next seasons E Jackson. If we sign a guy like Hodges and draft an ILB that could do it. He may not beat out Rhodes. Typical Grig's sleuth LB.

 

Parry will face some competition too. Ferguson shouldn't be back. It will be interesting how we handle the vets Walden and Butler in particular. I'm not married to Gore would bring back Todman . Gore's been a bit of a disappointment IMO. I recall numerous instances of butter fingers in the red zone.  I'd like to see Ayers and Doyle back. 

Considering what we have had since Addai and considering the line he has been running behind, you are hard to please.....

Considering what he has been working with and his age, Gore has been more than solid... If he had a real line that was even average or slightly above average in the running game, he might have produced some high end rushing numbers for us. The fact that he is the first 1000 yard rusher since Addai in 2007, i really dont see how you can say he has been disappointing.

[coltsfeva]

6 hours ago, Buddy Lee said:

I haven't seen any of Geathers' "tweets" to judge their effectiveness

 

Lots of mock drafts show Foster going to the Bengals ahead of us. But if he falls to us I would love to have him.

Darn spellcheck... I meant tweener

[bleevit]

My only comment at this point is regarding Frank Gore. We get a thousand yard rusher and because of his age some are doubting him? Until he shows definite degrading of his skills, his experience and drive merit renewal of his modest contract. Hell, I'd give him a raise (and bring in a young running back for him to teach).