Patriots trade Jamie Collins to Cleveland

[Bad Morty]

2 minutes ago, Derakynn said:

That trade was all about the pick. Cooper had not done well and they knew it. No surprise he didn't pan out. But they still got the sweet pick for a player that would've commanded a contract that New England doesn't give out frequently. 

 

And given that Az is under .500 halfway through the season, that pick is looking a lot better than people probably thought it would look when the deal was made.

[Iancolts]

Yup Grigson isn't going to offer a third for a top ten LB/DE.  That's not the Grigson way.  He would only do this deal if we gave up a 1st like we did for Trent.  Plus Collins is to young for a guy lile

Grigson to trade for.  He loves older FA that he thinks is good because of his smart football contracts given to them.  Had Collins have the production and age as Trent Cole oh man Grigson would've been all over this trade. 

[DougDew]

Really good for the Patriots.  Really good.  They draft him in the second round, he plays well for three years, then they trade him back for a third rounder. 

 

Cleveland is Cleveland.  They are o for the season and need picks.  They  give up a valuable pick for a guy they will have to compete for in free agency four months from now...or franchise him...and he is not a franchise LB because he really doesn't pass rush.  Really, really stupid trade by Cleveland.

[21isSuperman]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Really good for the Patriots.  Really good.  They draft him in the second round, he plays well for three years, then they trade him back for a third rounder. 

 

Cleveland is Cleveland.  They are o for the season and need picks.  They  give up a valuable pick for a guy they will have to compete for in free agency four months from now...or franchise him...and he is not a franchise LB because he really doesn't pass rush.  Really, really stupid trade by Cleveland.

If Cleveland can lock him up to a long term deal, it'll be a good move for them.  I'm sure they're aware of his contract situation and they wouldn't have given up so much if they didn't expect to sign him to a new contract

[Bluefire4]

If the Patriots weren't going to re-sign him this offseason than this is a good deal for them. Might as well get something back from him even though he is one of their best defensive players so we will have to see how the defense plays the rest of the season.

 

It is only a good deal for the Browns if he has agreed to sign a multi-year deal. It is very stupid if he leaves this offseason.

[DougDew]

3 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

If Cleveland can lock him up to a long term deal, it'll be a good move for them.  I'm sure they're aware of his contract situation and they wouldn't have given up so much if they didn't expect to sign him to a new contract

They could've done that 4 months from now and saved the pick. 

 

I don't get why Cleveland is interested in giving up a pick in May AFTER giving him free agent money by April.

[21isSuperman]

2 minutes ago, DougDew said:

They could've done that 4 months from now and saved the pick. 

 

I don't get why Cleveland is interested in giving up a pick in May AFTER giving him free agent money by April.

If he's on your roster now, he can't negotiate with anyone else.  If he makes it to free agency, he can negotiate with anyone.  A player of his caliber would be in high demand, so chances of him signing with Cleveland would be low.  This way, Cleveland guarantees they have the first crack at signing him to a contract. 

[DougDew]

6 minutes ago, 21isSuperman said:

If he's on your roster now, he can't negotiate with anyone else.  If he makes it to free agency, he can negotiate with anyone.  A player of his caliber would be in high demand, so chances of him signing with Cleveland would be low.  This way, Cleveland guarantees they have the first crack at signing him to a contract. 

So a team that is 0-8 gives up a third round pick for the rights to talk to a non-pass rushing LB before any other team can talk to him.  I think that is a bad trade for Cleveland.

 

[Bluefire4]

I just thought of two things that make this a bad deal for the Pats and a good deal for the Browns.

 

1. The Browns can franchise tag Collins even if he doesn't sign to where he would have to stay for at least next season.

 

2. The Patriots probably would have gotten a third round compensatory pick if they just let Collins go in the offseason and kept him for the postseason run.

[Bluefire4]

27 minutes ago, Iancolts said:

Yup Grigson isn't going to offer a third for a top ten LB/DE.  That's not the Grigson way.  He would only do this deal if we gave up a 1st like we did for Trent.  Plus Collins is to young for a guy lile

Grigson to trade for.  He loves older FA that he thinks is good because of his smart football contracts given to them.  Had Collins have the production and age as Trent Cole oh man Grigson would've been all over this trade. 

We can't afford him.

[csmopar]

can we trade a 2nd to cleveland for him?! lol how do the pats always manage to fleece players around and still win?!

[BPindy]

23 minutes ago, Bluefire4 said:

I just thought of two things that make this a bad deal for the Pats and a good deal for the Browns.

 

1. The Browns can franchise tag Collins even if he doesn't sign to where he would have to stay for at least next season.

 

2. The Patriots probably would have gotten a third round compensatory pick if they just let Collins go in the offseason and kept him for the postseason run.

 

But that comp pick would be for 2018. Now they get it earlier

[Coltsfan0112]

For anyone who said Grigson should have traded for him is dumb. Chandler is a really solid player but he becomes a free agent at the end of the year and is going to demand high $$$. I rather not give up a draft pick for a possible half year service when he alone will not save the season. Hold onto the picks this year and try and make moves in free agency

[krunk]

Maybe this is why:

 

â michael lombardi (@mlombardifoxtv) October 31, 2016

Collins on the second play of the game does whatever he wants and Bills gain 28 yards. Been happening all year. It was not going to continue

[Steamboat_Shaun]

1 minute ago, krunk said:

Maybe this is why:

 

â michael lombardi (@mlombardifoxtv) October 31, 2016

Collins on the second play of the game does whatever he wants and Bills gain 28 yards. Been happening all year. It was not going to continue

 

And there's the difference between New England and Indy. A pro-bowl LB is out there freelancing in a 41-25 blowout WIN, Belichick trades him for a 3rd rounder the next day. Doesn't even blink.

 

TJ Green gets multiple costly personal fouls in pretty much every game, gets a nice round of applause from Pagano and a "Get em next time." Todman knocks ANOTHER perfectly placed punt into the endzone, "Don't worry about it." Castonzo negates a 40 yard gain with a terrible holding call, and singlehandedly is responsible for multiple sacks in yesterday's game, "It's ok. I've got your back."

 

Bad culture all around, with no consequences or repercussions for *ic play.

[krunk]

1 minute ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

And there's the difference between New England and Indy. A pro-bowl LB is out there freelancing in a 41-25 blowout WIN, Belichick trades him for a 3rd rounder the next day. Doesn't even blink.

 

TJ Green gets multiple costly personal fouls in pretty much every game, gets a nice round of applause from Pagano and a "Get em next time." Todman knocks ANOTHER perfectly placed punt into the endzone, "Don't worry about it." Castonzo negates a 40 yard gain with a terrible holding call, and singlehandedly is responsible for multiple sacks in yesterday's game, "It's ok. I've got your back."

 

Bad culture all around, with no consequences or repercussions for *ic play.

TJ Green and Clayton Geathers both have a ways to go in coverage, plus TJ is still making a nice handful of costly rookie mistakes.  And that's what kills the defense even worse.  It's bad enough to have bad coverage linebackers, but on top of that we have safeties who can't even cover tight ends and running backs either.   That just adds to the stinkiness of the situation on defense. Lot of rough pills to swallow this year!

[Steamboat_Shaun]

Just now, krunk said:

TJ Green and Clayton Geathers both have a ways to go in coverage, plus TJ is still making a nice handful of costly rookie mistakes.  And that's what kills the defense even worse.  It's bad enough to have bad coverage linebackers, but on top of that we have safeties who can't even cover tight ends and running backs either.   That just adds to the stinkiness of the situation on defense. Lot of rough pills to swallow this year!

 

They're both playing a lot more snaps than the coaches probably anticipated, kind of a raw deal as far as depth goes. To this day I still don't understand why we got rid of Dwight Lowery.

 

Speaking of coverage LBs, Collins was the best coverage LB in the league, and Belichick was just like "Cool, you wanna freelance and not play your assignments? Okay, you can go do it in Cleveland, and watch while we roll the league and win a Super Bowl without you."

[krunk]

1 minute ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

They're both playing a lot more snaps than the coaches probably anticipated, kind of a raw deal as far as depth goes. To this day I still don't understand why we got rid of Dwight Lowery.

 

Speaking of coverage LBs, Collins was the best coverage LB in the league, and Belichick was just like "Cool, you wanna freelance and not play your assignments? Okay, you can go do it in Cleveland, and watch while we roll the league and win a Super Bowl without you."

They'll probably use Van Noy or Mingo for that.  Plus with the way Brady is slicing everybody up now it doesn't even matter.  Bill didn't even blink on that move I'm sure.

[digroute88]

I can see the headline now... , Browns win super bowl ! 
 

[krunk]

15 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

And there's the difference between New England and Indy. A pro-bowl LB is out there freelancing in a 41-25 blowout WIN, Belichick trades him for a 3rd rounder the next day. Doesn't even blink.

 

TJ Green gets multiple costly personal fouls in pretty much every game, gets a nice round of applause from Pagano and a "Get em next time." Todman knocks ANOTHER perfectly placed punt into the endzone, "Don't worry about it." Castonzo negates a 40 yard gain with a terrible holding call, and singlehandedly is responsible for multiple sacks in yesterday's game, "It's ok. I've got your back."

 

Bad culture all around, with no consequences or repercussions for *ic play.

Geathers plays hard, but lately all you ever see is  # such and such, run after the catch, Geathers on the tackle.  Guy keeps getting burnt.

[krunk]

I feel bad for Monachino in some ways.  He doesn't have much to rely on in terms of executing the defense and I'm not even totally talking about talent.  More so I'm talking about guys executing the play call from start to finish.

[ReMeDy]

I find it funny a lot of people here are saying he's great, or he's a stud, or whatever. The only reason he's good was because he was with the Patriots. The Patriots know how to coach their players and put them in the best position to succeed. It's the "everything Belichick touches turns to gold" effect.

 

The Pats once again robbed the Browns. They got good production out of a rookie, then when it was time to pay up, they ditch him and almost recoup the cost it took to draft him. Yea, I'm sure the Pats would have preferred Collins had asked for less money, but the Pats certainly aren't crying about losing him either.

[Yehoodi]

2 hours ago, Bad Morty said:

I gave up questioning Bill long ago as he doesn't ever get burned on these deals, head-scratching as they may be. The Pats have (had, I guess) Hightower, Malcolm Butler, and Collins all coming up for new contracts, so it was widely known that one of them wasn't coming back. Take it for what it's worth, but Mike Lombardi (former personnel guy in New England and in Cleveland) says he's not surprised at all. Collins committed the cardinal sin in New England...he wouldn't play ball with his new contract, and he wasn't performing on field. Lombardi said he's been free-styling all year and given up plays...Buffalo busted a 28 yard off tackle run yesterday on their opening drive that Lombardi said was 100% on Collins for going off-script.

 

He was also the one that gave up two TDs in the AFCCG last year from what I recall.  Sorry to see him go, but from the rumblings I have heard, he wanted Von Miller money and that is not going to happen if we have to also sign Hightower.  If we give Collins Von Miller money what do the pats say to Hightower.

 

I had hoped we could keep all three, Hightower, Collins and Butler, but we lost Collins, unless he does a Blount next year.  

 

So we traded 8 games of Collins for a 3rd round pick.   And if were not going to resign him, i am not too upset about the trade, we have been stacking up on LBs this year.      

[Yehoodi]

Given Gronk's injury history and Bennett's production, would love to sign Bennett long term, maybe the Pats could sneak him in now that Collins is gone.  Time will tell.  But it would be nice for the pats, and many pats fans, for the team to keep the present skilled players on offense with the team for a few years moving forward.  

[Gavin]

Word is according to various reports the Patriots wanted to re-sign Collins to 11 mill and that Collins balked at that. Word also is the franchise tag for Linebackers is going to hit about 15 million. This is coming from Paul Perillo of Patriots Football Weekly on the Patriots site. Word is from Adam Schefter that Collins is looking for Von Miller money.

 

Not sure he would get Von Miller money. However given the opportunity I think he could put up elite pass rush production so I could see him being worth that money. Collins only has 42 pass rush snaps to Millers 240

[Dustin]

Stupid trade for the Patriots. They would have gotten a 3rd round comp pick if they let him walk in free agency.

[Dustin]

5 hours ago, DougDew said:

So a team that is 0-8 gives up a third round pick for the rights to talk to a non-pass rushing LB before any other team can talk to him.  I think that is a bad trade for Cleveland.

 

 

Even if they lose him they'll get a 3rd round comp. pick for him. 

[Gavin]

1 minute ago, Dustin said:

 

Even if they lose him they'll get a 3rd round comp. pick for him. 

Just curious but to me its obvious Colts brass is not one of the teams that subscribes to PFF. You think they do? I mean they finally gave in and got a analytics guy. Not sure to what capacity they use him but was wondering if you thought the Colts are one of the teams that subscribe to PFF info they deliver to teams pretty much exclusively unless you want to pay a hefty price

[B~Town]

6 hours ago, Bluefire4 said:

I just thought of two things that make this a bad deal for the Pats and a good deal for the Browns.

 

1. The Browns can franchise tag Collins even if he doesn't sign to where he would have to stay for at least next season.

 

2. The Patriots probably would have gotten a third round compensatory pick if they just let Collins go in the offseason and kept him for the postseason run.

Almost seem NE is sending a message our way or the highway the highway of course is being shipped to the worst team in the league .

[oldunclemark]

I don't get this......must be something off the field

[19colt]

PM tossed 2 TD's to Owen Daniels (now out of the league) vs Jamie Collins in last years AFCCG. Bill probably still angry. 

[oldunclemark]

1 minute ago, 19colt said:

PM tossed 2 TD's to Owen Daniels (now out of the league) vs Jamie Collins in last years AFCCG. Bill probably still angry. 

Has to be more than that..and more than the salary..

They could have let him walk after the season ended.....

 

.....They are always in a 'win now' mode....this does not help them win now

[Gavin]

Rookie Elandon Roberts has played very well for the Patriots and has shown the ability to do everything Collins can do for cheaper

[IinD]

Good for them. Smartest team in the league because of moves like this.

 

The rich getting richer. 

[dgambill]

9 hours ago, King Colt said:

Man he must have done something real bad.

Yep...it's called NOT "do your job". He was going off script...in a tight moment in the playoffs that could cost you the SB. I'm sure they tried to straighten him out but when he wouldn't listen and he wasn't going to be a long term solution because of his contract they moved on. They will use that money for Hightower and butler guys that have proven over and over they listen and are in the right place to do their job. Sends a big signal to the rest of the team. They've also had a rookie step up and play well at his position so it's next man up. While Bill couldn't draft a Wr to save his life he had shown over and over again he can find LBs all over and coach them up. They will get better in the long run and the offense is so good with Brady the defense can take a small step back and survive. I do think Cleveland has gotten the best of both of these trades though...swapped pass rushers and 3rd and 5th rounders. They got a proven playmaker and still have draft picks coming out their whazoo. Cleveland has tons of cap space...no way they accepted the trade without knowing what his demands were and feeling comfortable they would sign him long term.

[dgambill]

4 hours ago, Dustin said:

Stupid trade for the Patriots. They would have gotten a 3rd round comp pick if they let him walk in free agency.

Not necessarily. They get picks based on who they lose and who they bring in....perhaps they bring in more free agents and they only end up with a 4 or 5. That said I have to believe this had more to do with insubordination more than draft picks. Even a guy like Collins it still could be addition by subtraction if it gets bill's point across and inspires the guys to "do their job".

[southwest1]

10 hours ago, Happy2BeHere said:

BB is @ it again...he knows what he's doing is all I can say

Can you imagine leaving the best team in football preparation wise & going to the worst? OUCH! 

 

Something tells me Collins won't be sending Billy a nice Christmas card & fruit basket this yr. 

[rock8591]

2 minutes ago, southwest1 said:

Can you imagine leaving the best team in football preparation wise & going to the worst? OUCH! 

 

Something tells me Collins won't be sending Billy a nice Christmas card & fruit basket this yr. 

 

I'm surprised the trade didn't violate any NFL civil rights laws, trading a player to the Cleveland Browns. That pretty much is torture in the NFL sense.

[southwest1]

32 minutes ago, IinD said:

Good for them. Smartest team in the league because of moves like this.

 

The rich getting richer. 

There's a lot of truth to this. BB gets premium value out of solid players & trades them before their speed, agility, & skill sets crumble. Even if you detest NE, you gotta admire how BB correctly assesses talent: When & where to draft it & when to unload or dump it for more roster ammo. 

 

Darn, Emperor Palpatine is good. I kid; I kid. Yes, I'm jealous. I will own that. 

 

Just look at where he drafted QB Jimmy G & how well he played over the 1st 4 weeks man. Hades, Bill even made Matt Cassel look respectable in 2008. I watch NE games every yr. They are a well oiled machine. Jesus. Reggie Wayne even said so. 

[southwest1]

34 minutes ago, rock8591 said:

 

I'm surprised the trade didn't violate any NFL civil rights laws, trading a player to the Cleveland Browns. That pretty much is torture in the NFL sense.

I would have loved to hear that conversion. 

 

"Jamie, step into my office for a second. Close the door. You've been a tremendous asset to our team." 

 

"Wait Bill, what's with the past tense dialog bro? Did I accidentally park in Brady's spot or something?" 

 

"Your rookie deal expires after this yr & you don't jump off the screen in film study breakdowns anymore. We're letting you go." 

 

"Huh, is this a sick Halloween joke? Where am I going? Seattle, Denver, Atlanta where? 

 

"The Browns."

 

"Bah! Ha! Ha! Now, I know you are playing." 

 

Bill sits there with no emotion whatsoever. 

 

"Come on man. Knock it off. This ain't funny homie." 

 

"I'm not joking Collins. The deal has already been made. Buy some warmer clothes." 

 

"Son Of a #%$*" 

 

Security walks him out after getting his playbook & his locker room items. Jamie knows he will never win another ring again. 

 

Jamie immediately calls Wes Welker & leaves a voicemail. Wes, I understand why you left for Orange Crush now back in 2013. Call me, we will get a beer, a meal, & vent."