Deflategate Central (one thread, merged, moderated)

[dw49]

Ok that is fine but the Yahoo story is commenting on the transcript and comparing to Roger's appeal letter. So after you read the transcript than re-read Yahoo and it will make more sense.

 

 

As I read it , most of the article refers only to how Brady might explain his conversations with the deflator guy. That's only one aspect of this whole issue. He ( Brady) , IMO has a lot more to explain away than that and I don't see where he addresses much more than the texts between those two. 

[amfootball]

As I read it , most of the article refers only to how Brady might explain his conversations with the deflator guy. That's only one aspect of this whole issue. He ( Brady) , IMO has a lot more to explain away than that and I don't see where he addresses much more than the texts between those two. 

The main point of Weitzel's story is how Goodell mischaracterized Brady's testimony in the appeal letter saying that Brady said he and JJ only talked about prep for SB footballs the day after the AFCCG when Brady in fact said that he discussed both the footballs and the allegations about the deflated footballs. Goodell did this to try to paint Brady's guilt to make the punishment seem warranted.

 

In addition, did you catch the fact the no one in the league office knew footballs could naturally deflate. As Weitzel says, this ignorance lit the fuse of a scandal that is still burning. The NFL was prone to wrongly conclude that any measurement under 12.5 pounds per square inch was an act of cheating. And of course since they made that claim they have had to try to back that up with the bogus science, etc.

[amfootball]

Wow. Jets CB and long time Brady hater Antonio Cromartie defends Brady. He joins Pollard and Suggs who have also defended Brady. Is this the real world?

 

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports/newengland/football/patriots/2015/08/06/antonio-cromartie-jumps-to-tom-bradys-defense-rips-roger-goodell/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[jvan1973]

The main point of Weitzel's story is how Goodell mischaracterized Brady's testimony in the appeal letter saying that Brady said he and JJ only talked about prep for SB footballs the day after the AFCCG when Brady in fact said that he discussed both the footballs and the allegations about the deflated footballs. Goodell did this to try to paint Brady's guilt to make the punishment seem warranted.

In addition, did you catch the fact the no one in the league office knew footballs could naturally deflate. As Weitzel says, this ignorance lit the fuse of a scandal that is still burning. The NFL was prone to wrongly conclude that any measurement under 12.5 pounds per square inch was an act of cheating. And of course since they made that claim they have had to try to back that up with the bogus science, etc.

the manufacturer of the footballs said that they wouldn't lose air pressure.

Also, none of that explains the "deflater" contemplating going to espn with a big story

[BullsColtsFan1]

Wow. Jets CB and long time Brady hater Antonio Cromartie defends Brady. He joins Pollard and Suggs who have also defended Brady. Is this the real world?

 

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports/newengland/football/patriots/2015/08/06/antonio-cromartie-jumps-to-tom-bradys-defense-rips-roger-goodell/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Did you ever think about the fact that these guys are extremely competetive and want to see him on the field for 16 games?  They want to play the best,  I am sorry they probably don't look forward to playing Jimmy G when they could have Tom Brady.  I am a very competetive person myself and I want to play against a team at full strength/health, otherwise it's not as fun.  I am glad Brady will no matter what be out there against the Colts.  I want to see what the Colts are made of and there is no way of knowing going up against a Pats team not at full strength(or any powerhouse team for that matter).  I don't think players or teams should get away with breaking rules/bending rules etc and I think they should pay the consequences but it's honestly no fun playing against a team not at full strength.  Just my opinion

[crazycolt1]

Have you read the appeals transcript?

I thought you said you were going to quit making comments about this till the final results are in? It has gotten to the point where this is no longer a Colt forum. It is now an AM forum with you being the only one who insist on making your personal points with every thought, comment and or any tid bit of news you can come up with. Also adding your own twist and then trying to make it fact. Your non stop ranting and pushing your own opinions and agenda is getting old and stale. I don't mean to sound insulting but do you ever shut up?

[ColtsBlueFL]

Ok that is fine but the Yahoo story is commenting on the transcript and comparing to Roger's appeal letter. So after you read the transcript than re-read Yahoo and it will make more sense.

 

You realize Judge Berman is not re-hearing the case.  Here is the simple skinny on the situation.  Judge Berman wants the NFL and NFLPA to settle.... yesterday... if not sooner.  He knows their positions on each side already, he pretty much knows how he will rule already.  One side will lose all and have to like it.  But he doesn't want to see this through to ruling.  He wants a settlement, and so do I which leads me to this, which I have slowly come up with over last couple days.

 

This is a tough post for me to write, and will likely upset many Colts fans here.  But this describes what I think should happen in the deflategate saga (yes, it is drama to nth degree and we are all a little sick of it).  I have followed this along with all of you.  I have read reports.  I have read the science, I've ran my own calculations based upon the science and documented my own results, and how I interpret them, including my deductive argument on which gauge was used.  I've subscribed and reviewed articles on law sites.  I have read all the thoughts of forum fans on both sides.  I've read some media articles, slanted both ways. What I have recently compelled myself to do is, not guess what may happen, but try to decide what I think should happen.  

In order to do this, I have to strip my emotional bias out of it, and look to what is the least damaging settlement for all parties at this point.  Why settlement?   Judge Berman demands it. Forthwith!  He does.  Those that drag their feet will appear to be slowing the process.  He can and will make things tough on the client whose party slows the process. What process? To get this settled before he makes his ruling  public.  You mean he's already made up hid mind? Yup!  He has pretty much hinted that. Berman has stated he has a "good understanding of your positions from your submissions to date." That's code for, "I have a pretty good idea where I'd rule on this one already."  And if there's no settlement, he will announce his decision in due and proper time in an all or nothing fashion, and one side will have to deal with it and like it (while that side also runs off to appeal that ruling... further lengthening this drama into the regular season).

 

This isn't good for anyone. League, NFLPA, Brady, and not us fans.

So, Judge 'Settle this Right Now' apparently wants to 'settle' in his cushy chair on Sundays come September and root for his favorite team without any shroud of this settled suit clogging his docket.  Why not?  He doesn't want work to pop up on his TV while in the middle of watching a football game!  (OK, I just assume he's a football fan) I, too, think the parties should settle, and the NFL even give slightly more in compromise if necessary, than Brady. Gasp!  Oh Noes, why would you say that CBF?  OK, Here's a few reasons.

IMO, It's gone on for too long already.  So many of us, we're sick and tired of it.  The longer this plays out, the worse both sides look. I don't want this case being precedent for future cases, no matter the outcome.  The more the league stays out of the courts, the better.  I want the league to bolster competitive balance rules, I want the League to explicitly place team and player penalties on conceivable competitive balance infractions under the Conduct Detrimental, Integrity section.  I want every player contract to contain language that they know of and are also subject to all of the rules and punishment for infractions based upon the Conduct Detrimental section. So, what do I hope they come to do?  I just don't know. Really. It's hard to define, but possibly something like this-

1. No admission of guilt by Tom Brady. This is more important to Brady (and his legacy protection) and an ego issue for NFL.

2. Minimal fine only ( Goes to Deflated Football Association of America charity) as NFLPA compromise to settle and make suit go away but no guilt admission. No sweat, to either side.

3. 1 game suspension suspension, but only for obstruction in the appeal, not awareness of football deflation. Then craft a (set of) rule(s) outside of this settlement as such for future cases, not using this as precedent.

4. In fact, No use of anything in this dispute as evidence or precedent in future disputes. (This is more important to NFL, until they bolster their rulebook.).

5. Some blah blah blah about NFL and NFLPA working together to educate players about whatever (newly instituted rules violate Conduct Detrimental... blah blah blah). This is important to both. showing an olive branch toward unity and regaining public trust.

I think we can all agree that so far, the NFL has done a better job when it chooses to inform versus punish.  But as they get their rules, standards, and reasonable punishments for such refined and established, they may have better results in the future.

At this time I need to reiterate my desire for the creation of Conduct Detrimental rules which involve competitive balance issue that are broken be punished at higher rates for deterrent value.  This likely cannot and will not happen in this case, and to push it nonsensical. I no longer want to see NFL discipline and sanctions that are seen as selective, ad hoc or inconsistent.  I want them (NFL) to tighten up the ship here, so sanctions would appear more fair and push back is likely to be reduced. I want them well defined. Any perceived sharp change to sanctions ( the player perception Goodell is making it up on the fly ) will elicit the typical football player culture of deny, hide behind a code of silence, destroy evidence, and obstruct investigations. This never makes any party look good. And becomes an impediment to changes in the right direction.

So I've tried to advance to conclude this case and set up for the future.  And for now I'd like my future to be on the Colts camp and the upcoming games.  However, watching how this plays out is most intriguing to me, especially if I have a grasp on the current situation.  If the NFL and NFLPA / Brady both dislike my settlement, but could 'Live with it", then maybe I might have a grasp on  solution too.  It's called reasonable compromise.  One I know I could live with. :-)

[amfootball]

Did you ever think about the fact that these guys are extremely competetive and want to see him on the field for 16 games?  They want to play the best,  I am sorry they probably don't look forward to playing Jimmy G when they could have Tom Brady.  I am a very competetive person myself and I want to play against a team at full strength/health, otherwise it's not as fun.  I am glad Brady will no matter what be out there against the Colts.  I want to see what the Colts are made of and there is no way of knowing going up against a Pats team not at full strength(or any powerhouse team for that matter).  I don't think players or teams should get away with breaking rules/bending rules etc and I think they should pay the consequences but it's honestly no fun playing against a team not at full strength.  Just my opinion

That may be it in part but I think the bigger issue if you read through Cro's comments is he and the other players are sick and tired of Goodell making up the rules as he goes along and abusing his power. That seems to be the crux of it.

 

It is also interesting to me that so many defensive players have supported Brady as Champ Bailey also said he believed Brady should be suspended. I think they understand more than anyone that air ball pressure had no effect when Brady beat them or any other team.

[amfootball]

You realize Judge Berman is not re-hearing the case.  Here is the simple skinny on the situation.  Judge Berman wants the NFL and NFLPA to settle.... yesterday... if not sooner.  He knows their positions on each side already, he pretty much knows how he will rule already.  One side will lose all and have to like it.  But he doesn't want to see this through to ruling.  He wants a settlement, and so do I which leads me to this, which I have slowly come up with over last couple days.

 

This is a tough post for me to write, and will likely upset many Colts fans here.  But this describes what I think should happen in the deflategate saga (yes, it is drama to nth degree and we are all a little sick of it).  I have followed this along with all of you.  I have read reports.  I have read the science, I've ran my own calculations based upon the science and documented my own results, and how I interpret them, including my deductive argument on which gauge was used.  I've subscribed and reviewed articles on law sites.  I have read all the thoughts of forum fans on both sides.  I've read some media articles, slanted both ways. What I have recently compelled myself to do is, not guess what may happen, but try to decide what I think should happen.  

In order to do this, I have to strip my emotional bias out of it, and look to what is the least damaging settlement for all parties at this point.  Why settlement?   Judge Berman demands it. Forthwith!  He does.  Those that drag their feet will appear to be slowing the process.  He can and will make things tough on the client whose party slows the process. What process? To get this settled before he makes his ruling  public.  You mean he's already made up hid mind? Yup!  He has pretty much hinted that. Berman has stated he has a "good understanding of your positions from your submissions to date." That's code for, "I have a pretty good idea where I'd rule on this one already."  And if there's no settlement, he will announce his decision in due and proper time in an all or nothing fashion, and one side will have to deal with it and like it (while that side also runs off to appeal that ruling... further lengthening this drama into the regular season).

 

This isn't good for anyone. League, NFLPA, Brady, and not us fans.

So, Judge 'Settle this Right Now' apparently wants to 'settle' in his cushy chair on Sundays come September and root for his favorite team without any shroud of this settled suit clogging his docket.  Why not?  He doesn't want work to pop up on his TV while in the middle of watching a football game!  (OK, I just assume he's a football fan) I, too, think the parties should settle, and the NFL even give slightly more in compromise if necessary, than Brady. Gasp!  Oh Noes, why would you say that CBF?  OK, Here's a few reasons.

IMO, It's gone on for too long already.  So many of us, we're sick and tired of it.  The longer this plays out, the worse both sides look. I don't want this case being precedent for future cases, no matter the outcome.  The more the league stays out of the courts, the better.  I want the league to bolster competitive balance rules, I want the League to explicitly place team and player penalties on conceivable competitive balance infractions under the Conduct Detrimental, Integrity section.  I want every player contract to contain language that they know of and are also subject to all of the rules and punishment for infractions based upon the Conduct Detrimental section. So, what do I hope they come to do?  I just don't know. Really. It's hard to define, but possibly something like this-

1. No admission of guilt by Tom Brady. This is more important to Brady (and his legacy protection) and an ego issue for NFL.

2. Minimal fine only ( Goes to Deflated Football Association of America charity) as NFLPA compromise to settle and make suit go away but no guilt admission. No sweat, to either side.

3. 1 game suspension suspension, but only for obstruction in the appeal, not awareness of football deflation. Then craft a (set of) rule(s) outside of this settlement as such for future cases, not using this as precedent.

4. In fact, No use of anything in this dispute as evidence or precedent in future disputes. (This is more important to NFL, until they bolster their rulebook.).

5. Some blah blah blah about NFL and NFLPA working together to educate players about whatever (newly instituted rules violate Conduct Detrimental... blah blah blah). This is important to both. showing an olive branch toward unity and regaining public trust.

I think we can all agree that so far, the NFL has done a better job when it chooses to inform versus punish.  But as they get their rules, standards, and reasonable punishments for such refined and established, they may have better results in the future.

At this time I need to reiterate my desire for the creation of Conduct Detrimental rules which involve competitive balance issue that are broken be punished at higher rates for deterrent value.  This likely cannot and will not happen in this case, and to push it nonsensical. I no longer want to see NFL discipline and sanctions that are seen as selective, ad hoc or inconsistent.  I want them (NFL) to tighten up the ship here, so sanctions would appear more fair and pushback is likely to be reduced. I want them well defined. Any perceived sharp change to sanctions will elicit the typical football player culture of deny, hide behind a code of silence, destroy evidence, and obstruct. This never makes any party look good. And becomes an impediment to changes in the right direction.

So I've tried to advance to conclude this case and set up for the future.  And for now I'd like my future to be on the Colts camp and the upcoming games.  However, watching how this plays out is most intriguing to me, especially if I have a grasp on the current situation.  If the NFL and NFLPA / Brady both dislike my settlement, but could 'Live with it", then maybe I might have a grasp on  solution too.  It's called reasonable compromise.  One I know I could live with. :-)

There is an owners meeting on Tuesday, Aug 11, one day before the court case with Brady and Goodell. I think talk of a settlement will be front and center during that meeting to get the focus back on football.

 

I do love the way Berman has been handling this. Stop the rhetoric and put pressure for the settlement by making everything public.

[ColtsBlueFL]

There is an owners meeting on Tuesday, Aug 11, one day before the court case with Brady and Goodell. I think talk of a settlement will be front and center during that meeting to get the focus back on football.

 

I do love the way Berman has been handling this. Stop the rhetoric and put pressure for the settlement by making everything public.

 

Yes, And Judge Berman is expecting Goodell and Brady to show on Aug. 12, with an agreement in hand.  I hope they do as well.

[ViriLudant]

Umm I'm pretty sure it was the nflpa that didn't want it public. The nfl wanted it public. Seems to contradict this witch hunt you speak of.

Edit: I'm hearing conflicting information.

Wrong.

The appeal testimony clearly shows that Kessel wanted it to go public.

[amfootball]

Yes, And Judge Berman is expecting Goodell and Brady to show on Aug. 12, with an agreement in hand.  I hope they do as well.

Me too.

 

Not sure if you saw but DeMaurice Smith has asked to be a part of the hearing as co-counsel to Brady. I think that may be a good thing too to have him in the same room with Roger and this judge. Maybe something can be agreed upon by both sides.

 

Daniel Wallach ‏@WALLACHLEGAL 3h3 hours ago

NFLPA boss DeMaurice Smith asks for court permission to appear as co-counsel for union in Brady v. NFL; he just filed a motion this morning

[Narcosys]

Wrong.

The appeal testimony clearly shows that Kessel wanted it to go public.

 

That is why i edited the post saying i had received conflicting information.

[BullsColtsFan1]

That may be it in part but I think the bigger issue if you read through Cro's comments is he and the other players are sick and tired of Goodell making up the rules as he goes along and abusing his power. That seems to be the crux of it.

 

It is also interesting to me that so many defensive players have supported Brady as Champ Bailey also said he believed Brady should be suspended. I think they understand more than anyone that air ball pressure had no effect when Brady beat them or any other team.

I don't dis agree about the ball pressure BUT if those balls were doctored illegally, it's still against the rules.  It's clearly easier grip wise and receiving wise when a balls deflated.  Thats an illegal competetive advantage imo.

[ViriLudant]

Now who's cheating?

First the Jaguars, now in the AFCCG. Looks like the Colts should be investigated .

Note that this comes from Stampede Blue:

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2015/5/1...uttal-to-wells

During the second quarter of the AFC Championship Game, a ball thrown by Tom Brady was intercepted by a player for the Colts and the ball was taken to the Colts sideline. On the sideline, Colts equipment personnel used a pressure gauge to measure the inflation level of the ball, determined that it was below the minimum 12.5 psi level and informed a game official and other NFL personnel.

Once the game starts, neither team is allowed to gauge the footballs, pump them, or the like. That is solely the province of the referee, who is to be the "sole judge" of whether footballs comply. The Colts, with advance concerns about psi, did not take the issue to the referee. They took the matter into their own hands and had an intern gauge the football. (pg. 63) This conduct was in violation of Rule 2. Nowhere does the Report identify this conduct as a violation of the Rule.

So basically, the Patriots claim that, when the Colts intercepted the football in the AFC Championship game, a Colts' equipment guy measured the inflation level of the football - which is against the NFL rules because during games only the officials can do that. Rule 2, Section 1 of the NFL rulebook states that, "the Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications."

[Dustin]

 "the Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications."

 

The rule doesn't say that they can't measure the air pressure of the ball. Try again fam.

 

By the way your link is broken. 

[Moose Of Woe]

Wow. Jets CB and long time Brady hater Antonio Cromartie defends Brady. He joins Pollard and Suggs who have also defended Brady. Is this the real world?

 

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports/newengland/football/patriots/2015/08/06/antonio-cromartie-jumps-to-tom-bradys-defense-rips-roger-goodell/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

When I think of character, those are the first three guys that come to mind. 10 kids from eight women in six states (Cromartie), and two cheap shot artists.

 

Rats run together, they don't have to like each other.

[jvan1973]

Now who's cheating?

First the Jaguars, now in the AFCCG. Looks like the Colts should be investigated .

Note that this comes from Stampede Blue:

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2015/5/1...uttal-to-wells

During the second quarter of the AFC Championship Game, a ball thrown by Tom Brady was intercepted by a player for the Colts and the ball was taken to the Colts sideline. On the sideline, Colts equipment personnel used a pressure gauge to measure the inflation level of the ball, determined that it was below the minimum 12.5 psi level and informed a game official and other NFL personnel.

Once the game starts, neither team is allowed to gauge the footballs, pump them, or the like. That is solely the province of the referee, who is to be the "sole judge" of whether footballs comply. The Colts, with advance concerns about psi, did not take the issue to the referee. They took the matter into their own hands and had an intern gauge the football. (pg. 63) This conduct was in violation of Rule 2. Nowhere does the Report identify this conduct as a violation of the Rule.

So basically, the Patriots claim that, when the Colts intercepted the football in the AFC Championship game, a Colts' equipment guy measured the inflation level of the football - which is against the NFL rules because during games only the officials can do that. Rule 2, Section 1 of the NFL rulebook states that, "the Referee shall be the sole judge as to whether all balls offered for play comply with these specifications."

first, that doesn't apply to souvenir balls

second, where does it say the team can't use a gauge?

[dw49]

first, that doesn't apply to souvenir balls

second, where does it say the team can't use a gauge?

 

 

Are you still reading things that guy posts ? If so ....you are a glutton for punishment. It's more rare than a blue moon when he posts something that's not annoying or untrue.

[Bad Morty]

Are you still reading things that guy posts ? If so ....you are a glutton for punishment. It's more rare than a blue moon when he posts something that's not annoying or untrue.

 

So do you think the judge throws this out or what?

[dw49]

So do you think the judge throws this out or what?

 

 

What do I think ? I think the penalty was a bit harsh and if they reduced it to two games it would not be unreasonable. I really haven't read through all the documents released , so I shouldn't be commenting on what I think the judge will do if they don't reach a compromise. If you really want me to guess , I would say that he reduces it . If he was going to uphold it , why would he tell them to settle it ?

[Bad Morty]

What do I think ? I think the penalty was a bit harsh and if they reduced it to two games it would not be unreasonable. I really haven't read through all the documents released , so I shouldn't be commenting on what I think the judge will do if they don't reach a compromise. If you really want me to guess , I would say that he reduces it . If he was going to uphold it , why would he tell them to settle it ?

I don't think the judge can reduce or change the penalty. He's asking the 2 sides to reach a settlement, but I believe his verdict can only be all or nothing...either the NFLPA's claim that the process violated the CBA based on the several factors they cited is upheld or rejected. If the judge upholds the NFLPA's complaint, then the entire punishment is tossed. If he rejects it and sides with the NFL, then it's 4 games. Unless the 2 sides make a deal prior to his ruling.

[dw49]

I don't think the judge can reduce or change the penalty. He's asking the 2 sides to reach a settlement, but I believe his verdict can only be all or nothing...either the NFLPA's claim that the process violated the CBA based on the several factors they cited is upheld or rejected. If the judge upholds the NFLPA's complaint, then the entire punishment is tossed. If he rejects it and sides with the NFL, then it's 4 games. Unless the 2 sides make a deal prior to his ruling.

 

 

Now I get it why he (judge) wants a settlement. Seems to me like they should just settle it at 2 games. It doesn't do the league any good if Brady looks worse and I'm not sure many people would believe nothing happened if the judge threw it out . So only thing to gain or lose would be the length of the suspension. Even there it might make sense to take the 2 games as NE should be able to overcome that. Four could be a back breaker if Garoppolo has a melt down.

[Bad Morty]

Now I get it why he (judge) wants a settlement. Seems to me like they should just settle it at 2 games. It doesn't do the league any good if Brady looks worse and I'm not sure many people would believe nothing happened if the judge threw it out . So only thing to gain or lose would be the length of the suspension. Even there it might make sense to take the 2 games as NE should be able to overcome that. Four could be a back breaker if Garoppolo has a melt down.

Brady didn't do anything wrong. He testified to that repeatedly and adamantly under oath. You may believe him to be a pathological liar, and that's fine...however his testimony has made this an all or nothing proposition for him. He cannot settle at this point based on his sworn testimony. So I don't think there will be a settlement that involves any games. Perhaps he would settle for a fine along the lines of Favre for lack of cooperation, but I can't see him agreeing to settle for even a game at this point. He's all in.

[dw49]

Brady didn't do anything wrong. He testified to that repeatedly and adamantly under oath. You may believe him to be a pathological liar, and that's fine...however his testimony has made this an all or nothing proposition for him. He cannot settle at this point based on his sworn testimony. So I don't think there will be a settlement that involves any games. Perhaps he would settle for a fine along the lines of Favre for lack of cooperation, but I can't see him agreeing to settle for even a game at this point. He's all in.

 

 

Could be you are right that he won't settle for reduced games if he's offered that. I guess maybe that would depend on if he's really innocent. I don't think a person that lies about a particular event is a "pathological liar." It could be that he just felt it was in his better interest to deny it. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

Me too.

 

Not sure if you saw but DeMaurice Smith has asked to be a part of the hearing as co-counsel to Brady. I think that may be a good thing too to have him in the same room with Roger and this judge. Maybe something can be agreed upon by both sides.

 

Daniel Wallach ‏@WALLACHLEGAL 3h3 hours ago

NFLPA boss DeMaurice Smith asks for court permission to appear as co-counsel for union in Brady v. NFL; he just filed a motion this morning

 

Me too.

 

Not sure if you saw but DeMaurice Smith has asked to be a part of the hearing as co-counsel to Brady. I think that may be a good thing too to have him in the same room with Roger and this judge. Maybe something can be agreed upon by both sides.

 

Daniel Wallach ‏@WALLACHLEGAL 3h3 hours ago

NFLPA boss DeMaurice Smith asks for court permission to appear as co-counsel for union in Brady v. NFL; he just filed a motion this morning

 

Yes, I did see that.  He is the latest.  5 others have filed (and granted) motions.  They are-

 

DeMaurice F. Smith to Appear Pro Hac Vice   NFLPA

Andrew S. Tulumello to Appear Pro Hac Vice  Tom Brady

Jonathan J. Amoona to Appear Pro Hac Vice  NFLPA

James E. Tysse to Appear Pro Hac Vice  NFL

Stacey R. Eisenstein to Appear Pro Hac Vice   NFL

Daniel L. Nash to Appear Pro Hac Vice   NFL

 

But as lawyered up as the two sides are, I,m sure the concern is on the settlement first and foremost.  Legal-ese and fireworks last.

 

[GoColts8818]

Here are my thoughts of everything right now.  The following is just my opinion. 

 

1.  I'll admit that the latest release of the Brady hearing transcript has not looked good for the NFL. 

 

2 . I think it might very well get Brady off of his suspension. 

 

3.  If it does get him off I don't think it will clear Brady's name there is still too much smoke around this to buy that nothing truly went on like the Pats have claimed.  The major sticking points for me is video of the Pats working taking the balls into the bathroom before the game.  There is zero reason for him to have done that and then when he said he went in there to use a urinal that doesn't exist looks really bad.  The other one is that the Pats have left the ball boys suspended when they are claiming nothing was done wrong.  You can't have it both ways.  If nothing was done wrong then they should be fighting to clear their names too not just Brady's because he's the franchise QB and they really don't want him to miss four games.  Frankly I think if you put the Pats under truth sermon they would admit that's what they are really concerned about.  I don't think they really care about Brady's name.  I think that's a nice talking point for them but they are concerned about him missing four games. 

 

4.  I have lost any respect I had for Kraft in terms of the way he has handled himself throughout this.  Today's comments about the Colts were the last straw for me.  I am sure it would mean a great deal for the Pats to beat the Colts and I am sure the Pats will come out like buzzsaws to do just that.  However, this is not the Colts fault.  Rather the Pats were doing this or not they reported them to the league that's how things are supposed to work.  No different than when the Colts were accused of pumping in crowd noise.  The Pats (if they were the ones who reported the Colts for that) were not wrong for that just as the Colts are not wrong for doing this.  You can argue they shouldn't have leaked this to media but that's very minor in the grand view of this, someone was going to find out about this sooner rather than latter.  If you don't believe that I have some land on the moon I would like to sell you. 

 

5.  The judge isn't here to rule on if Brady did this or not.  He is here to rule on if Goodell over stepped his bounds in terms of how he acted.  That's why I keep saying a win in court will not clear Brady's name.  I also think the judge can tell that neither side has clean hands in this. I think what has been presented so far shows that Goodell probably did over step his bounds a bit but I also think there is too much smoke for there not to be a fire in terms of did the Pats do this or not.  I also think that's why the judge told both sides to turn down the rhetoric (which is judge speak for talk to each other like adults not children) and wants both sides to settle because odds are Brady probably deserves to be punished but probably not to extent that the league has punished him for.  To me that's two games and that sounds like that's where most have been on this from the start. 

 

As for this forum I am sure there are many on both sides that disagree with my points of view and that is fine.  I am not interested in having long drawn out debates over this where one side is trying to change my mind.  These are simply my opinions and they might be wrong and yes I am sure I am bias just as everyone else is in this thread rather they want to admit it or not but they are my opinions and I am just simply sharing them.  If people wish to share theirs with me that's great but I am not interested in fighting or debating over it. 

[ColtsBlueFL]

Here are my thoughts of everything right now.  The following is just my opinion. 

 

{snipped good review}

 

These are simply my opinions and they might be wrong and yes I am sure I am bias just as everyone else is in this thread rather they want to admit it or not but they are my opinions and I am just simply sharing them.  If people wish to share theirs with me that's great but I am not interested in fighting or debating over it. 

Good stuff.

Not sure if you or anyone else saw mine. 

 

http://forums.colts.com/topic/39306-deflategate-central-one-thread-merged-moderated/page-43?p=1139122#entry1139122

 

I predict a settlement 1 game,  If it goes full distance, I feel judge may uphold 4 games based upon feeling CBA allowed Goodell the power to rule in the appeal and precedent not to interfere in arbitration process and arbitration awards.  Might be wrong n both counts though...

[GoColts8818]

Good stuff.

Not sure if you or anyone else saw mine. 

 

http://forums.colts.com/topic/39306-deflategate-central-one-thread-merged-moderated/page-43?p=1139122#entry1139122

 

I predict a settlement 1 game,  If it goes full distance, I feel judge may uphold 4 games based upon feeling CBA allowed Goodell the power to rule in the appeal and precedent not to interfere in arbitration process and arbitration awards.  Might be wrong n both counts though...

Yeah I a not a lawyer but both sides agreed to the CBA which gave Goodell the power to do this.  No one made the players agree to the contract.  If they didn't want him to have these powers they shouldn't have agreed to the CBA.  I think that's going to be pretty hard for a judge to toss out because it undoes a major part of the CBA and sets some precedent I doubt the judge wants to set.  Again I am not a lawyer so I might be and probably wrong on that. 

[Bad Morty]

Good stuff.

Not sure if you or anyone else saw mine. 

 

http://forums.colts.com/topic/39306-deflategate-central-one-thread-merged-moderated/page-43?p=1139122#entry1139122

 

I predict a settlement 1 game,  If it goes full distance, I feel judge may uphold 4 games based upon feeling CBA allowed Goodell the power to rule in the appeal and precedent not to interfere in arbitration process and arbitration awards.  Might be wrong n both counts though...

If the NFLPA can show that Goodell was not impartial, then that is a violation of the CBA and this will get tossed. The fact that Pash edited the Wells report before releasing and Reisner served as the NFL's representative during the appeal is pretty damaging for the NFL and pretty strongly shows that the impartiality standard wasn't met. Florio explained this pretty well.

[jvan1973]

If the NFLPA can show that Goodell was not impartial, then that is a violation of the CBA and this will get tossed. The fact that Pash edited the Wells report before releasing and Reisner served as the NFL's representative during the appeal is pretty damaging for the NFL and pretty strongly shows that the impartiality standard wasn't met. Florio explained this pretty well.

So, if the parties agree to a one game suspension, you will acknowledge guilt?

[pgt_rob]

So, if the parties agree to a one game suspension, you will acknowledge guilt?

I'm going to go ahead and answer that for you. lol

No.

[ColtRider]

I've read ColtsBlueFL # 1656 ... and ... GoColts8818 # 1676.

Very reasonable, well thought out, and IMO true aspirations of what truly should culminate from this whole mess concerning DeFlateGate. I would add that I'm of the opinion that the Patriots and Brady are guilty of violation(s). I am also in the opinion that the NFL could have conducted the investigation on a higher degree of professionalism. The fact of today's statement by Eric Winston, President of the NFLPA, calling for a lesser degree and/or dismissal of disciplinary actions by the NFL Commissioner in the next CBA or sooner, could either damage what has already been bargained or completely overturn the governing agreement into a whole new array of corrective actions toward said discipline in the future.

With that being said, I would tend to think that due to the vitriolic nature of the last several years concerning disciplinary actions that both parties could engage and play major roles on both sides of the aisle is overdue. A CBA or agreed amendment to a disciplinary action board seems to make the most sense for the NFL as a whole. It would have to be completely unbiased in order to make it feasible and work to ensure both sides with an agreement of total fairness notwithstanding past/present/future anchored positions of engagement.

Whatever the outcome of the following week or so, I truly feel to overcome what has been presented on the table by both sides in this whole debacle needs to somehow be reckoned with in such a manner that it never happens again. A true disciplinary board instituted by the NFL, and for the NFL, should be started by at least discussions on such a matter of great importance as this ASAP! Nothing less will do, IMO. It's important to the league, it's franchises, it's owners, it's players & coaches, and most of all ... It's FANS!

[amfootball]

Some great thoughts posted here about this whole saga. I do hope it ends next week when they meet. They have two conferences on the 12 and the 19 if necessary.

 

I found this great article on Judge Berman - he was definitely the right man for this job, http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory/judge-overseeing-brady-case-stranger-big-personalities-32906239?singlePage=true

 

This is my favorite line from the profile:

Preska said there's a practical reason why Berman prefers parties to settle.

"On the one hand, there's just the fight," she said. "But also, if we have to make a ruling, often it's with a meat cleaver. They can craft a settlement with a scalpel, a much more nuanced settlement that will make everybody happy." 

[crazycolt1]

the manufacturer of the footballs said that they wouldn't lose air pressure.

Also, none of that explains the "deflater" contemplating going to espn with a big story

He would get paid better if he went to TMZ?

[ViriLudant]

Are you still reading things that guy posts ? If so ....you are a glutton for punishment. It's more rare than a blue moon when he posts something that's not annoying or untrue.

Grow up. The only inaccurate post of mine was regarding Minnesota .

Other than that , my facts are accurate. You just can't accept it.

Tell me, why is the national media doing an about-face on this, and more and more are defending the Patriots?

[Bad Morty]

Tell me, why is the national media doing an about-face on this, and more and more are defending the Patriots?

 

The notion that the league was being dishonest in their quest to punish Brady and the Patriots seemed far-fetched to most people in the national media...until this transcript of Brady's appeal was released and Goodell was literally caught pants down in a flagrant lie about Brady not being honest about what he was talking to Jastremski about in the wake of the AFC Championship game. It seems the national media folks are FINALLY starting to put the pieces together on how dirty the NFL has been in this and the narrative is changing. Goodell is an incompetent bum. That was the STRONG opinion of most people prior to deflate gate...he won some people over by going after the team everyone is jealous of, but even that goodwill is starting to crumble as the veil slowly gets lifted on this. 

[pgt_rob]

I want to know why it was well known around the league that the Patriots used deflated footballs. After reading that, it just seemed like everybody knew about it but didn't want to step up and go at them about it. Till now. Huge mess, but hopefully resolved soon. This whole thing needs to end officially.

[amfootball]

The notion that the league was being dishonest in their quest to punish Brady and the Patriots seemed far-fetched to most people in the national media...until this transcript of Brady's appeal was released and Goodell was literally caught pants down in a flagrant lie about Brady not being honest about what he was talking to Jastremski about in the wake of the AFC Championship game. It seems the national media folks are FINALLY starting to put the pieces together on how dirty the NFL has been in this and the narrative is changing. Goodell is an incompetent bum. That was the STRONG opinion of most people prior to deflate gate...he won some people over by going after the team everyone is jealous of, but even that goodwill is starting to crumble as the veil slowly gets lifted on this. 

I didn't think it could be possible but Goodell actually looks worse in this mess than he did with Ray Rice.

[Bubbz]

I didn't think it could be possible but Goodell actually looks worse in this mess than he did with Ray Rice.

Lol, you're obsession is really screwed up