2.63%...

[SkyBane]

And one opinion by a fan doesn't make his one of the worst guards in the league....unless of course you have actually studied all the guards in the league this season.

If so, my bad.

Various sites like PFF and football outsiders that are paid to be impartial grade him as the second worst guard in the NFL, worse than backups in some cases.

[backshoulderfade]

Man, next season we have the best te corps in the league for sure.

[House]

Not really. Everyone drops Andrews inaccurate passes. Most EVERYTING last season was thrown late, behind, or to high.

The guy just isn`t an accurate thrower unless he has time to think, and he can find an open Primary receiver, but he is slowly doing better.

As Andrew keeps his throws within 15 yards, they all do better.

This may be the most hyperbolic post I've read in awhile lol.

[Warhorse]

Various sites like PFF and football outsiders that are paid to be impartial grade him as the second worst guard in the NFL, worse than backups in some cases.

Ahh, stats. So if one DB is lined up against the #1 WR most of the time, his stats aren't affected? If a RB faces a defense that the MLB changes the scheme during the snap count and puts him in a worse situation....his stats aren't affected? A QB that throws in the wind more often....his stats aren't affected? Stats give trends, but they never tell the whole story. There is a reason that time after time, fans on this board throw MM under the bus, yet our GM and coach still play the man. My guess is, they never look to fantasy based stat sites for information. 

 

If it sounds like I am dissing you, I am not. Anyone has a right to use information to back their opinion. It just happens that I use the validity and experience of our head coach and GM as a greater source of information than any stat sites that may exist. To each his own. 

 

For any fan to use the words "sucks" about one of our players will never fly with me....ever. That is how I roll. It is why I defend MM so much. In addition, the way he laid that block is not the ability of a player who sucks. 

[dw49]

It's possible that part of it's in his head, and my opinion on that is that a lot of it has to do with him still gaining familiarity with our offense.  People often blame his vision, and while that is partially accurate, it's also somewhat inaccurate.  He's learning a new playbook and all it's nuances (which is always different from one team to the next), he's workign with a new OL.  So he's going to hesitate with his reads and it makes his field vision look bad.  Then you throw in bad blocking from time to time, and it's no wonder he looks like a deer in headlights at times.  I mean look at Ray Rice this year.  He has always been heralded as a back with great field vision.  He has virtually the same OL at the beginning of the season, and struggled mightily, even before the McKinnie trade and his hip injury.  Did he all the sudden lose all his attributes as a running back?  Of course not.  But productivity of any RB cna change when an OC begins implementing his offensive scheme. 

 

Trent needs an offseason and more time with this offense.  It's just as simple as that.  Yeah, he had an offseason with the Browns, but they did a fullsail coaching swap this offseason with a new playbook, scheme, etc.  So it was back to square one, and then he got traded like 2 or 3 games into the season, and again, back to square one. 

Now, if he's still having the same struggles come mid-regular season next year, then it may well be time to question his abilities.  I'm not really sure what to make of all of this, but all I can say is, for Trent, he needs time and patience.  He can be an asset to us in the future, but for this season, I don't see him breaking out. 

 

 

This is all true , and if he has a great tack record in Cleveland , I would tend to say the above is probably true. However the fact is , Cleveland traded him for what they probably figured was a low 1st round pick and paid half his salary to boot. So you have to say that the jury is still out on him. Plus RB's often can pick up offenses a little more quickly than say a WR due to the nuture of the two positions. 

 

Like I said , until this week I was 100 % in the Trent Richardson camp. I watched last nights game with a very open mind and came to the conclusion that given the same play , the same hole , we are better off with Brown carrying the football. Can what you say be correct ? Sure and I hope it is. I've just moved to the position that it's a little less the O line and a little more TR .

[ColtsLegacy]

Ahh, stats. So if one DB is lined up against the #1 WR most of the time, his stats aren't affected? If a RB faces a defense that the MLB changes the scheme during the snap count and puts him in a worse situation....his stats aren't affected? A QB that throws in the wind more often....his stats aren't affected? Stats give trends, but they never tell the whole story. There is a reason that time after time, fans on this board throw MM under the bus, yet our GM and coach still play the man. My guess is, they never look to fantasy based stat sites for information. 

 

If it sounds like I am dissing you, I am not. Anyone has a right to use information to back their opinion. It just happens that I use the validity and experience of our head coach and GM as a greater source of information than any stat sites that may exist. To each his own. 

 

For any fan to use the words "sucks" about one of our players will never fly with me....ever. That is how I roll. It is why I defend MM so much. In addition, the way he laid that block is not the ability of a player who sucks. 

 

That's sweet that you treat all of our players like your children but most fans are going to call a turd, a turd. Mike McGlynn's a turd.

[OffensivelyPC]

This is all true , and if he has a great tack record in Cleveland , I would tend to say the above is probably true. However the fact is , Cleveland traded him for what they probably figured was a low 1st round pick and paid half his salary to boot. So you have to say that the jury is still out on him. Plus RB's often can pick up offenses a little more quickly than say a WR due to the nuture of the two positions. 

 

Like I said , until this week I was 100 % in the Trent Richardson camp. I watched last nights game with a very open mind and came to the conclusion that given the same play , the same hole , we are better off with Brown carrying the football. Can what you say be correct ? Sure and I hope it is. I've just moved to the position that it's a little less the O line and a little more TR .

Oh I'm with you in that he's not htere yet.  Could it happen?  Sure.  Will it?  I dunno.  But it's clear that Brown should be our main guy going forward for now.

[coming on strong]

Wait. You mean he's not a second round bust now? And Grigson may know talent?

Sorry, that's not what I've learned from a lot of people who know better.

Now, let's get back to how sorry a trade that was for Richardson...

its not that trent is a bust its that the colts gave up a 1st round pick , which could be used to fix the biggest problem offensive line.

[Smonroe]

its not that trent is a bust its that the colts gave up a 1st round pick , which could be used to fix the biggest problem offensive line.

Could be true, I always said you should never draft a RB in the first. Howevah...

The sarcastic post was trying to point out that maybe, just maybe, our GM and coach may know a little more than us. And it seems like more moves are working out pretty well.

[TKnight24]

......is Coby Fleeners drop percentage this year. The only TE in the league who has lower is Tony Gonzalez.

can we stop with this nonsense that he drops tons of passes now?

Gotta be honest. When I read the thread title, I thought this was how much you saved by switching to Geico.

Definitely should get a refund cause you're supposed to save 15% or MORE

[dgambill]

Its got to be someone's fault when we lose or look bad....it will be someone else next week.....the only thing we DO know is it will never be Luck's fault....he's pretty much the only unanimously supported player. I remember people saying we should cut Adam Vinitari and Donald Brown and others (because I know I was one ready to look for a younger kicker) and they saved our butts last night....so while Coby played terrible early in his career most were upset with his timidness...playing scared and soft...he has had to play through that and he has looked lots better....it was never about his hands....he alligator armed some balls and was looking for the lbs too much early on....I will be excited to see him and Allen on the field together next year too....never know who is blocking and who is releasing etc.

[deedub75]

He doesn't drop a lot of passes.  He usually just doesn't seem to do much once he catches the ball.  He doesn't get much separation and the defender and the ball get there almost simultaneously.  He also seems to have to concentrate really hard to catch the ball and then he's hit immediately.  When he finds some separation, he's as dangerous of a receiver as they come. 

[ponyboy]

I need a new name for fans who dismiss a player before they have truly had a realistic chance to fit into a team, (league for rookie), scheme, locker room, etc. Not trying to stir things here, but I think they have earned a label.

 

 

 

While you’re at it, could you also come up with a name for fans who overreact to any legitimate critique and immediately elevate it to “dismissing”, “impatience”, “disrespecting”, “throwing under the bus”, “and declaring a player a bust”?

 

There’s plenty of that going on here.

[esmort]

Ahh, stats. So if one DB is lined up against the #1 WR most of the time, his stats aren't affected? If a RB faces a defense that the MLB changes the scheme during the snap count and puts him in a worse situation....his stats aren't affected? A QB that throws in the wind more often....his stats aren't affected? Stats give trends, but they never tell the whole story. There is a reason that time after time, fans on this board throw MM under the bus, yet our GM and coach still play the man. My guess is, they never look to fantasy based stat sites for information. 

 

If it sounds like I am dissing you, I am not. Anyone has a right to use information to back their opinion. It just happens that I use the validity and experience of our head coach and GM as a greater source of information than any stat sites that may exist. To each his own. 

 

For any fan to use the words "sucks" about one of our players will never fly with me....ever. That is how I roll. It is why I defend MM so much. In addition, the way he laid that block is not the ability of a player who sucks. 

 

Because coaches and GMs are always right and never make mistakes ... and stats are just random numbers that are never a reflection of anything real (all the things you listed can be statistically accounted for and/or taken into account when interpreting the statistics).  Silly corporations, governments, and research institutes wasting money on statisticians when they could just go ask an NFL coach or GM.

 

And McGlynn does suck, eventually the odds will catch up with any player who is on the field long enough, and they are going to make the occasional play.  But, no sense bringing math back into it, because we all know its just crazy nonsense.

[Warhorse]

While you’re at it, could you also come up with a name for fans who overreact to any legitimate critique and immediately elevate it to “dismissing”, “impatience”, “disrespecting”, “throwing under the bus”, “and declaring a player a bust”?

 

There’s plenty of that going on here.

Sure, Because they are the same...just different sides of the same coin. However, the word you used that makes this whole discussion roll is "legitimate". For myself, any use of the word or words "sucks", "Not worth it", "a bum", etc.....when a player has not ever been through a training camp....is not legitimate. If training camps weren't that inportant....why do they have them and make them mandatory.

 

For what its worth....I am sick of the immature, uninformed repetitive opinions that do not define a player nearly as often as the simply serve the poster as an opportunity to vent. As I have said, and my requests have been shelved, there is not a place to go to escape this activity. 

[House]

While you’re at it, could you also come up with a name for fans who overreact to any legitimate critique and immediately elevate it to “dismissing”, “impatience”, “disrespecting”, “throwing under the bus”, “and declaring a player a bust”?

There’s plenty of that going on here.

Yes. There is already a word for those people.

Rational.

[Warhawk]

Well, he's on pace for 59/702/5 after going 26/281/2 last year.

 

Hey, remember back when you all were talking about how he was a bust and I posted all those rookie season stats of elite/HOF TEs throughout history to demonstrate that rookie TEs tend to do poorly in terms of receiving?  I'd like a pat on the back now please.

 

So, just for sake of comparison, Tony Gonzalez from his rookie season to his second season went from 33/368/2 to 59/621/2.  Now, FWIW, a lot of top-tier TEs actually had a bigger jump than Fleener projects to have from the first to second season (Sharpe, Graham, Gronk, Witten, Gates, etc., all in the 80+/900+ range or better), but I'm not saying, and never said, Fleener will be a HOFer, just that significant statistical jumps in the second year is the norm for TEs (and anyway, if Gonzalez had a similar jump to Fleener, let's not rule anything out).  Plus if Fleener keeps up his level of production from the past 4 games to the end of the season, he'll be looking at more like 70 receptions and 800 yards or so.

[AllYouNeedIsLuck]

Not really. Everyone drops Andrews inaccurate passes. Most EVERYTING last season was thrown late, behind, or to high.

The guy just isn`t an accurate thrower unless he has time to think, and he can find an open Primary receiver, but he is slowly doing better.

As Andrew keeps his throws within 15 yards, they all do better.

It's the same with every QB, ever. 

And Andrew isn't inaccurate lol. In just his 2nd year, he's definitely well above average in accuracy. Watch some Colts games before you make asinine statements. 

[throwing BBZ]

It's the same with every QB, ever. 

And Andrew isn't inaccurate lol. In just his 2nd year, he's definitely well above average in accuracy. Watch some Colts games before you make asinine statements. 

 

 It serves no purpose to ignore the obvious. His accuracy issues were and are discussed by professional post game analysts.

 Not that Anyone can miss it! The #1 reason we are behind constantly. Enjoy your whatever.

[AllYouNeedIsLuck]

 It serves no purpose to ignore the obvious. His accuracy issues were and are discussed by professional post game analysts.

 Not that Anyone can miss it! The #1 reason we are behind constantly. Enjoy your whatever.

What obvious? Name one throw which was "highly inaccurate" and wasn't just a throw away because of no protection. The pass to DHB was tipped by a defender so that doesn't count. The others were on the run and he just threw it away basically. A couple were plain out dropped. 

I can only think of a one truly bad throw. The slant to I think Brazill that could of been picked off but also just as easily could have been caught. 

Overall, Luck has been accurate this season. Completion Percentage don't tell the whole story..

[throwing BBZ]

 ! We don`t agree on the Brazill throw. It was on the money, Brazill got jammed and was therefore a step late to the spot.

 Watched Coach Reggie on the sideline in a teaching moment showing him a way to fix this.

 

 You see accurate, I see a lot of inaccurate throws game in and game out and disappointing decision making. Of course some of this is a lack of experience with some inexperienced, perhaps not so talented receivers.

 That of course explains some of the completion % ratings.

 

 Those are, about 65% completed for the season on 1st down.

 And just a little over 50% on all other downs.

 When Andrew was throwing under 10 yards or thereabout, he did throw some really nice stuff against TN.

 

  Some said last weeks big margin of loss had nothing good about it.

 I posted that the big spread allowed the Rams to play deeper and Forced Andrew to throw underneath.
 Lots of game practice on our short game. We Needed it! Maybe it didn`t help, but I believe the execution against TN. in our short game, was the best we have had in the Andrew area. A Must!

 

TRich- 5 catches on 5 targets at 6.2 yards per play. Sweet! As good as a run, in his case....uh

TY 5 catches on 9 targets for 44 yards. Big plays from TY are great when they happen, but he is just slightly over 50% for the season on targeted passes.

 I`ll keep watching. lol

 Keep an eye on Jack Doyle pulling, blocking. He was really getting to the spot with leverage. VG and much needed.

[Rian Huff]

Wait. You mean he's not a second round bust now? And Grigson may know talent?

Sorry, that's not what I've learned from a lot of people who know better.

Now, let's get back to how sorry a trade that was for Richardson...

lol and you expect someone to be great at learning a new scheme when he has had to learn 3 new playbooks in 2 years and hes only been in the nfl for 2 years....seems a bit ruff imo, i dont think many people could prevail in such a short time just saying

[esmort]

Yes. There is already a word for those people.

Rational.

 

The OP said "overreacting to a legitimate critique" ... that is definitely not "rational"

 

I suggest blue Kool-Aid drinking sheep, or maybe a lemmings.

[House]

The OP said "overreacting to a legitimate critique" ... that is definitely not "rational"

I suggest blue Kool-Aid drinking sheep, or maybe a lemmings.

Overreacting to a legitimate critique. Yes that is often what is discussed here. Legitimate critiques.

Certainly no talk of cutting everyone the second they don't preform. And pining after every average player we let walk from our facilities....

I make legitimate critiques all the time, and I never find my posts destroyed or overreacted to. Perhaps OP is doing something wrong?

[Robin]

This is Fleeners progress