Pittman Out

[csmopar]

9 hours ago, open window said:

Per zack Keifer Pittman out sunday, crap.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

ballard has made the colts into a one receiver team, now what?

[Nesjan3]

Id love for one of our guys to show out tomorrow but I dont have high hopes. It blows me away that in the past few years the league has clearly started to value pass catchers very highly, and Ballard just flat out refuses to see it as an issue, as if he is smarter than 31 other GMs. He would rather pay a G 20 mil a year lol. Ive been a Ballard guy but im starting to think he stinks. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

Id love for one of our guys to show out tomorrow but I dont have high hopes. It blows me away that in the past few years the league has clearly started to value pass catchers very highly, and Ballard just flat out refuses to see it as an issue, as if he is smarter than 31 other GMs. He would rather pay a G 20 mil a year lol. Ive been a Ballard guy but im starting to think he stinks. 

I don’t think he failed to see it as a issue. I mean he has drafted 3 2nd round picks since 2019. But to expect them to immediatly come in and be a star is just to slow of a approach. Imagine instead of pierce being 2 he should be 4 and a vet should be 2. Let these guys develop. He takes the long road and it’s not getting us anywhere. If you go get Ryan who is 37 you should do everything to be all in before he retires.

[GRUMPY OLD MAN]

9 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I don’t think he failed to see it as a issue. I mean he has drafted 3 2nd round picks since 2019. But to expect them to immediatly come in and be a star is just to slow of a approach. Imagine instead of pierce being 2 he should be 4 and a vet should be 2. Let these guys develop. He takes the long road and it’s not getting us anywhere. If you go get Ryan who is 37 you should do everything to be all in before he retires.

how is ballards method working for us????

[Nesjan3]

5 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I don’t think he failed to see it as a issue. I mean he has drafted 3 2nd round picks since 2019. But to expect them to immediatly come in and be a star is just to slow of a approach. Imagine instead of pierce being 2 he should be 4 and a vet should be 2. Let these guys develop. He takes the long road and it’s not getting us anywhere. If you go get Ryan who is 37 you should do everything to be all in before he retires.

Tyreek Hill changed teams, Davonte Adams changed teams, AJ Brown changed teams, even Christian Kirk is better than our 2nd WR he changed teams. Ballard has never gone after a savy vet, he drafts guys second round and expects them to be game changers day 1.  Or drafts guys round 6 or 7 and throws up a hope and a prayer that one of them works out.

[OLD FAN MAN]

2 hours ago, Goatface Killah said:

This is not good.

 

But we are playing the Jaguars, not the Chiefs. The Colts obviously need to win this game and this makes it a little harder, but I have no doubt they still have a good chance tomorrow. We are gonna have to play really well defensively and on special teams and we are gonna need Matt Ryan to spread the ball around all day. 

 

Sometimes when you are missing your top guy it can help you in some aspects because the opponent doesnt know who to key on. Taylor is hard to stop even if you stack the box.

 

Bottom line: if we are actually as good as we hope this team can be this year, we can win this game without Pittman and Pierce. 

pierce has showed nothing

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

21 minutes ago, Nesjan3 said:

Tyreek Hill changed teams, Davonte Adams changed teams, AJ Brown changed teams, even Christian Kirk is better than our 2nd WR he changed teams. Ballard has never gone after a savy vet, he drafts guys second round and expects them to be game changers day 1.  Or drafts guys round 6 or 7 and throws up a hope and a prayer that one of them works out.

Yes I realize what he does I just don’t agree with it.

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

22 minutes ago, DEFENSE said:

how is ballards method working for us????

I don’t agree with it. Pierce should be 4. A proven vet should be two.

[rockywoj]

38 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

I don’t think he failed to see it as a issue. I mean he has drafted 3 2nd round picks since 2019. But to expect them to immediatly come in and be a star is just to slow of a approach. Imagine instead of pierce being 2 he should be 4 and a vet should be 2. Let these guys develop. He takes the long road and it’s not getting us anywhere. If you go get Ryan who is 37 you should do everything to be all in before he retires.

When Campbell was taken, DK Metcalf was there for the taking.  At the time, I was really disappointed they passed on Metcalf, but I thought, ok, let’s see if Campbell can change my mind.

 

Metcalf stepped in first year and became a budding star, and he is now considered one of the elite receivers in the league.  I agree that Ballard has indeed tried to upgrade the WR position, even using multiple 2nd rounders.  I am still a Ballard fan, but he sure is make a lot of swings with a miss.  You can’t keep striking out, simply put.  He needs to turn more of these swings into hits.

 

Meanwhile, granted the misfortune of all his injuries, but what’s Campbell doing for the Colts?  I still hope he can come round, but I am now going beyond dubious.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, NFLfan said:

 

Well said. I use the word "we" when referring to the teams I root for (Vikings, NY Mets, Stanford football). However, losses do not affect my life. I believe many fans see the performance of their teams as a reflection of themselves. If their teams are winners, then those fans believe they too are winners. And if their teams lose, it is as if they have lost. Some fans cover their faces when their teams lose a lot. I believe they do that because the losses makes them feel they are losers. 

 

I try to keep it in perspective. I enjoy games but I don't live and die with wins and losses of the teams I root for, especially because I have absolutely no control over what happens in games. 

 

Stanford Football?    Really?    Do I know this?    Perhaps in my old age I once knew this and forgot?     I’m always a little surprised to find a fellow Stanford fan from time to time.   

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

11 minutes ago, rockywoj said:

When Campbell was taken, DK Metcalf was there for the taking.  At the time, I was really disappointed they passed on Metcalf, but I thought, ok, let’s see if Campbell can change my mind.

 

Metcalf stepped in first year and became a budding star, and he is now considered one of the elite receivers in the league.  I agree that Ballard has indeed tried to upgrade the WR position, even using multiple 2nd rounders.  I am still a Ballard fan, but he sure is make a lot of swings with a miss.  You can’t keep striking out, simply put.  He needs to turn more of these swings into hits.

 

Meanwhile, granted the misfortune of all his injuries, but what’s Campbell doing for the Colts?  I still hope he can come round, but I am now going beyond dubious.

Metkalf jd the one that had injuries concerns. Lots of teams passed on him.

[rockywoj]

22 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Metkalf jd the one that had injuries concerns. Lots of teams passed on him.

He was taken shortly after Campbell. Indeed, several teams blew it. At the time, I felt like the Colts were one of those teams that blew it.  With retrospective knowledge, all things being equal, not sure passing on Metcalf is all that defensible, especially in resorting to the lots of teams blew it defence.  
 

The point was, we have another example here of Ballard taking a swing and a miss, rather than hitting a home run with a player many people were calling for to be the selection.  Like I alluded to, I am still on team Ballard, but his hold on me becomes more tenuous with every swing and a miss when known alternative options people are calling for are sitting there, but passed over.  I give him credit for trying to upgrade the position, but so far, he gets a failing grade in execution.  As a note, it was very well publicized how much Reich was lobbying for Campbell.  Is this another case of Ballard ceding to his coach’s desires?  Who should be held more accountable, the GM that gives the coach what he is lobbying for, or the coach that is making poor lobbying decisions?

 

Kind of a tough spot for a GM, don’t give the coach the players said coach is wanting, then if things fail, failure falls on the GM.  But alternatively, give in and give the coach what he asks for, blame will fall on the coach, but at the same time, also upon the GM for not overriding the coach on personnel decisions.  I guess why coach & GM success are so closely intertwined. 

[Restinpeacesweetchloe]

4 minutes ago, rockywoj said:

He was taken shortly after Campbell. Indeed, several teams blew it. At the time, I felt like the Colts were one of those teams that blew it.  With retrospective knowledge, all things being equal, not sure passing on Metcalf is all that defensible, especially in resorting to the lots of teams blew it defence.  
 

The point was, we have another example here of Ballard taking a swing and a miss, rather than hitting a home run with a player many people were calling for to be the selection.  Like I alluded to, I am still on team Ballard, but his hold on me becomes more tenuous with every swing and a miss when known alternative options people are calling for are sitting there, but passed over.

He was still passed up by every team at least once. That is just hindsight. Campbell was the smart choice because of his speed and the different things he can do. He fit this offense at the time. We will see if Reich uses him like he should this year. You want to get him in space. 

[Introspect]

4 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Was Frank using Hines effectively with Luck and rivers as the QB and he had over 60 catches both years?    The answer is yes.   
 

We spent the entire off-season talking about using him more.  The Ryan connection to Hines was written about and talked about by everyone. 
 

Why you have no confidence in Frank using him correctly is a “you” issue.  

I hope this is just a "you" issue but we shall see. 

[rockywoj]

9 minutes ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

He was still passed up by every team at least once. That is just hindsight. Campbell was the smart choice because of his speed and the different things he can do. He fit this offense at the time. We will see if Reich uses him like he should this year. You want to get him in space. 

Well, at the time I didn’t think it was the smart choice, and there were a lot of others that also didn’t think it was the smart choice.  Ergo, it is not “just” hindsight.  Hindsight, however, has proven to substantiate the opinion of those like me, that wanted DK to be the chosen WR, at that point in the draft.

 

Want another example of hindsight?  For the life of me, given all he had accomplished in college, I could not understand how Jonathan Taylor was not the number 1 rated RB in his draft year.  His accomplishments should’ve put him at that spot, and so too should his speed and athleticism put him in that spot.  I was completely ELATED when the Colts got him!  I thought it a steal, and hindsight is substantiating my opinion, just like it’s doing in the case of Campbell vs DK Metcalf.

 

 But alas, the DK vs Campbell thing is water under the bridge, a strike against Ballard to be on his permanent record.  Similarly, though, the swing and a home run on Taylor is also on Ballard’s permanent record.  A needed counter weight.

[NewColtsFan]

5 minutes ago, Introspect said:

I hope this is just a "you" issue but we shall see. 

If we don’t use Hines a LOT tomorrow, no one will be more surprised and disappointed than me.  

 

I’ll eat both crow and humble pie!   I just hope I don’t have to.     

[Introspect]

10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

If we don’t use Hines a LOT tomorrow, no one will be more surprised and disappointed than me.  

 

I’ll eat both crow and humble pie!   I just hope I don’t have to.     

Frank needs to give play calling to the OC.. why the heck not use a young mind... Jaguars know his tendencies on the road. I hope I'm wrong brother.

[Moosejawcolt]

1 hour ago, TaylorTheStudMuffin said:

Metkalf jd the one that had injuries concerns. Lots of teams passed on him.

I think Metcalf is severely over rated. If not for injuries, I felt  Campbell would have been better. We shall see.

[RollerColt]

 

I’ve got a bad feeling… Feel better Pittman.

[AKB]

So campbell will be number one receiver next week? 

[NewColtsFan]

45 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

So campbell will be number one receiver next week? 

Next week?    Tomorrow. 
 

Next week we are hoping Pittman and Pierce are back healthy. 

[AKB]

12 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

Next week?    Tomorrow. 
 

Next week we are hoping Pittman and Pierce are back healthy. 

yeah sorry im using vitamins.. i meant tomorrow, but maybe next week too? who knows. And Pierce has shown nothing that says he is better than campbell, so i guess even if they play together, campbell would still be the number one. 

[GoColts8818]

14 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

yeah sorry im using vitamins.. i meant tomorrow, but maybe next week too? who knows. And Pierce has shown nothing that says he is better than campbell, so i guess even if they play together, campbell would still be the number one. 

Judging by the snap counts last week Campbell looked to be the number two so I assume he’d become the number one with Dulin the number two and either Mike or Patmon as the number three.  Now how they use them could be interesting.  Campbell may see a lot time in the slot with the others on row outside.  There is also the Hines factor in there.

[AKB]

4 minutes ago, GoColts8818 said:

Judging by the snap counts last week Campbell looked to be the number two so I assume he’d become the number one with Dulin the number two and either Mike or Patmon as the number three.  Now how they use them could be interesting.  Campbell may see a lot time in the slot with the others on row outside.  There is also the Hines factor in there.

i just want to see them use the speed we have on offense. it's really sad how little our deep passing game has been involved so far

[stitches]

8 hours ago, Archer said:

Boy, you guys are the worst!  You’re condemning them for their receivers’ poor day on a game that hasn’t even been played yet!  I wonder what your demeanor will be if and when these guys do step up and win us the game…?  Will you be upset that you were wrong or happy that the Colts won?

What? No, I'm not! I'm saying IF they have a poor day and we lose another game we should be winning because of the decisions of this front office and this coaching staff, then someone needs to bear responsibility for it and noone should be letting them use the excuse of "our best receiver was injured". 

 

I'd be elated if our depth pieces show up and have a great game. All of those players are very likeable and deserve to have success and I would be rooting for their success. Don't confuse my skepticism with some selfish desire for "I told you so" development. 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, stitches said:

What? No, I'm not! I'm saying IF they have a poor day and we lose another game we should be winning because of the decisions of this front office and this coaching staff, then someone needs to bear responsibility for it and noone should be letting them use the excuse of "our best receiver was injured". 

 

I'd be elated if our depth pieces show up and have a great game. All of those players are very likeable and deserve to have success and I would be rooting for their success. Don't confuse my skepticism with some selfish desire for "I told you so" development. 

“Bear responsibility” ???

 

So if we lose tomorrow, what do you want to happen so that you as a fan know that someone was held responsible? 
 

Does some have to get fired?   And when? Monday?    End of the season?    
 

Someone being held responsible is the new hot buzz phrase for the last year-plus.   What that means may be different for everyone.  So what does it mean for you? 
 

[ScotColt]

13 hours ago, SOMDColtsfan said:

Megastrachan time! Be lying if said wasn't excited to see what this guy has to offer   

Agreed! This is the only ‘good’ thing to come out of this. I really think he could be a dark horse. 
 

still thing Ballard should’ve done better with WR over the years and reich needs to stop play calling - just thought I’d throw that in there lol

[Goatface Killah]

7 hours ago, OLD FAN MAN said:

pierce has showed nothing

Well, he did earn a starting spot on an NFL team in the offseason, as a rookie, so theyve obviously got way more of a look at him than either of us. And hes apparently shown more than Strachan or Campbell or Patmon.

 

[stitches]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

“Bear responsibility” ???

 

So if we lose tomorrow, what do you want to happen so that you as a fan know that someone was held responsible? 
 

Does some have to get fired?   And when? Monday?    End of the season?    
 

Someone being held responsible is the new hot buzz phrase for the last year-plus.   What that means may be different for everyone.  So what does it mean for you? 
 

It's not as simple as someone getting fired over this one specific thing. First, I want acknowledgement of the mistake.... if there was a mistake. Then I want committment to fixing the mistake... if there was a mistake. Then I want actually fixing the mistake. And one mistake doesn't automatically mean someone needs to get fired. But then there are accumulations of mistakes/omissions/miscalculations/straight up horrible strategy... so yeah... when tons of those accumulate and the people hired to do the job don't seem to learn from those mistakes then yes... I would want some of them to be removed from their positions so others would have their chance to build a championship roster. 

 

The thing with the WRs is the most obvious to all of us. We've been harping on the need for better and more established receiving options for years! Every single year this quesiton is put in front of Ballard and Reich and every single year they tell us how much they like their young players and depth and how they are happy with what they have. Well, I'm sorry but even without injuries this receiving corps is bad. We have ONE receiver who is above average and everything else is unproven or straight up below average NFL talent. And this is not the first year of this being a question. Have we ever had an above average receiving corps since Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne? 

 

What does accountability mean to you? Lets say we lose today and our receivers suck. Lets say Pittman recovers but is unable to prop up this bad receiving corps and we miss the playoffs again, partly because of lack of receiving weapons. What does taking accountability and responsibility mean? Because it's easy for Ballard and Reich to say "we take full responsibility". They did that exact thing this off-season too. And then went and the only thing they changed was the QB. No proven WR talent added. No proven TE talent added. No OL talent added. In essence both Frank and Ballard told you they thought the only problem of this offense was the QB. They changed nothing else of consequence. What happens if we flame out in a similar way to last year after all the noise about how bad our WR corps was last year and Ballard did nothing to address it. What needs to happen? "I take full responsibility" ... Do you have any belief that he will go out and fix this? Or the LT... or the long-term QB position? How many years of him "taking responsibility" without actually doing anything to fix the issues he's taking responsibility for? 

[stitches]

27 minutes ago, Goatface Killah said:

Well, he did earn a starting spot on an NFL team in the offseason, as a rookie, so theyve obviously got way more of a look at him than either of us. And hes apparently shown more than Strachan or Campbell or Patmon.

 

That would be impressive if we had a receiver with more than 300 yards in a season on the roster(other than Pittman). At best what it tells us is that he's the best of bad/unproven options. Patmon has 2 catches in his career! Strachan had 2 catches in his career prior to last game... Now has 4. Dulin has 18 catches for 250 yards in 3 years!!! Campbell had 350 yards in 3 years! If you are drafting a receiver in the second and you tell me this is his competition, I sure would hope he would beat those 3 for starting spots. 

[Solid84]

22 minutes ago, stitches said:

It's not as simple as someone getting fired over this one specific thing. First, I want acknowledgement of the mistake.... if there was a mistake. Then I want committment to fixing the mistake... if there was a mistake. Then I want actually fixing the mistake. And one mistake doesn't automatically mean someone needs to get fired. But then there are accumulations of mistakes/omissions/miscalculations/straight up horrible strategy... so yeah... when tons of those accumulate and the people hired to do the job don't seem to learn from those mistakes then yes... I would want some of them to be removed from their positions so others would have their chance to build a championship roster. 

 

The thing with the WRs is the most obvious to all of us. We've been harping on the need for better and more established receiving options for years! Every single year this quesiton is put in front of Ballard and Reich and every single year they tell us how much they like their young players and depth and how they are happy with what they have. Well, I'm sorry but even without injuries this receiving corps is bad. We have ONE receiver who is above average and everything else is unproven or straight up below average NFL talent. And this is not the first year of this being a question. Have we ever had an above average receiving corps since Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne? 

 

What does accountability mean to you? Lets say we lose today and our receivers suck. Lets say Pittman recovers but is unable to prop up this bad receiving corps and we miss the playoffs again, partly because of lack of receiving weapons. What does taking accountability and responsibility mean? Because it's easy for Ballard and Reich to say "we take full responsibility". They did that exact thing this off-season too. And then went and the only thing they changed was the QB. No proven WR talent added. No proven TE talent added. No OL talent added. In essence both Frank and Ballard told you they thought the only problem of this offense was the QB. They changed nothing else of consequence. What happens if we flame out in a similar way to last year after all the noise about how bad our WR corps was last year and Ballard did nothing to address it. What needs to happen? "I take full responsibility" ... Do you have any belief that he will go out and fix this? Or the LT... or the long-term QB position? How many years of him "taking responsibility" without actually doing anything to fix the issues he's taking responsibility for? 

 

10 minutes ago, stitches said:

That would be impressive if we had a receiver with more than 300 yards in a season on the roster(other than Pittman). At best what it tells us is that he's the best of bad/unproven options. Patmon has 2 catches in his career! Strachan had 2 catches in his career prior to last game... Now has 4. Dulin has 18 catches for 250 yards in 3 years!!! Campbell had 350 yards in 3 years! If you are drafting a receiver in the second and you tell me this is his competition, I sure would hope he would beat those 3 for starting spots. 

PREACH!

[Goatface Killah]

Just now, stitches said:

That would be impressive if we had a receiver with more than 300 yards in a season on the roster(other than Pittman). At best what it tells us is that he's the best of bad/unproven options. Patmon has 2 catches in his career! Strachan had 2 catches in his career prior to last game... Now has 4. Dulin has 18 catches for 250 yards in 3 years!!! Campbell had 350 yards in 3 years! If you are drafting a receiver in the second and you tell me this is his competition, I sure would hope he would beat those 3 for starting spots. 

I think its pretty obvious the Colts have a young unproven receiving corps. That has nothing to do with what I actually said.

 

 

[Goatface Killah]

46 minutes ago, stitches said:

It's not as simple as someone getting fired over this one specific thing. First, I want acknowledgement of the mistake.... if there was a mistake. Then I want committment to fixing the mistake... if there was a mistake. Then I want actually fixing the mistake. And one mistake doesn't automatically mean someone needs to get fired. But then there are accumulations of mistakes/omissions/miscalculations/straight up horrible strategy... so yeah... when tons of those accumulate and the people hired to do the job don't seem to learn from those mistakes then yes... I would want some of them to be removed from their positions so others would have their chance to build a championship roster. 

 

The thing with the WRs is the most obvious to all of us. We've been harping on the need for better and more established receiving options for years! Every single year this quesiton is put in front of Ballard and Reich and every single year they tell us how much they like their young players and depth and how they are happy with what they have. Well, I'm sorry but even without injuries this receiving corps is bad. We have ONE receiver who is above average and everything else is unproven or straight up below average NFL talent. And this is not the first year of this being a question. Have we ever had an above average receiving corps since Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne? 

 

What does accountability mean to you? Lets say we lose today and our receivers suck. Lets say Pittman recovers but is unable to prop up this bad receiving corps and we miss the playoffs again, partly because of lack of receiving weapons. What does taking accountability and responsibility mean? Because it's easy for Ballard and Reich to say "we take full responsibility". They did that exact thing this off-season too. And then went and the only thing they changed was the QB. No proven WR talent added. No proven TE talent added. No OL talent added. In essence both Frank and Ballard told you they thought the only problem of this offense was the QB. They changed nothing else of consequence. What happens if we flame out in a similar way to last year after all the noise about how bad our WR corps was last year and Ballard did nothing to address it. What needs to happen? "I take full responsibility" ... Do you have any belief that he will go out and fix this? Or the LT... or the long-term QB position? How many years of him "taking responsibility" without actually doing anything to fix the issues he's taking responsibility for? 

I want to actually see the team play a few games before I write an essay about it.

[NFLfan]

10 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Exactly.  Once you accept you are just a fan and you have no control on anything that happens in a game (other than maybe causing a false start if you and 60,000 of your closest friends are being loud at a game) it’s really freeing and makes accepting loses a lot easier.  At least that’s what I’ve found.  Doesn’t mean people can’t have opinions about what happened or what will happen.  It just means you accept it’s not about you imo.

 

Yep

[NFLfan]

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Stanford Football?    Really?    Do I know this?    Perhaps in my old age I once knew this and forgot?     I’m always a little surprised to find a fellow Stanford fan from time to time.   

 

You and I exchanged a few personal messages a long time ago. I believe you were the first person to send me a personal message. You introduced me to the Stanford message board. That was back in 2014, I believe. 

 

Anyway there was another big-time Stanford fan here. I have not seen him in a few years.

[stitches]

8 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

Stanford Football?    Really?    Do I know this?    Perhaps in my old age I once knew this and forgot?     I’m always a little surprised to find a fellow Stanford fan from time to time.   

How's McKee doing? He's the only QB projected to go in the first several rounds that I haven't seen? 

[chickenMan]

Someone call up Charlie Jones from Purdue and get him a flight to Jacksonville ASAP, we need a real WR on the field today

[MikeCurtis]

I would rather have Pittman and Pierce, but......

 

It was an extremely small sample, but the two passes that Mike Strachan caught, he had very crisp routes.

 

I am anxious to see how he does today, as our WR crew is depleted

 

We will see if he steps it up

 

 

[Goatface Killah]

The Colts had zero trouble moving the ball thru the air last week. And Colts fans are still complaining about receivers.

 

Matt Ryan is on pace to throw for around 5k yards so far, and it cant even convince these people to have a little patience. Its absurd.

 

You all should be complaining about the coach not instilling more discipline in his team and trying to call stupid plays in the redzone.

 

That is why they didnt win last week. It wasnt about talent at receiver.