Mock Draft-Colts Buffalo Trade: VERSION 2

[Hoose]

Same scenario as the first time. The players the Colts want at #6 are taken. Buffalo calls and makes them an offer they can't refuse: Picks 12, 22, 56 and 65. The Colts give them picks 6 and 104. The Colts now own picks 12, 22, 36, 37, 49, 56, 65 and 67. 

 

12. Josh Jackson, CB.   Alpha Dog corner. Will become Colts' #1 CB. 

22. Will Hernandez, G.   He's not Nelson, but he's an outstanding player. Long term starter.

36. Maurice Hurst, DT    Apparently over his heart issues. Still slips because of that issue plus only fits 4-3 D. Super quick.

37. Ty Crosby, T             PAC 12 offensive lineman of the year. did not allow a sack in 2017.

49. Dante Pettis, WR     Excellent hands; solid route runner; great punt returner. He can become Robin to TY Hilton's Batman.

56, Darius Leonard, LB  The one holdover from other draft. He's a rock solid player. 

65. Josh Sweat, DE       One of the stars of the combine. He can play too. Great speed and bend. 

67. Royce Freeman, RB Forgotten talent with deep RB class. #2 20 yd shuttle; #3 30 yd cone at combine. Hands and speed and big time power.

 

Your comments would be appreciated.

[tvturner]

Derwin James is better if we're going to go to the secondary in the 1st round

[WarGhost21]

Not a fan of Josh Jackson, good in coverage but terrible athletic ability. Love the rest of the draft, but not sure Hurst will fall to the second even with those issues. 

[MarquisJ]

18 minutes ago, WarGhost21 said:

Not a fan of Josh Jackson, good in coverage but terrible athletic ability. Love the rest of the draft, but not sure Hurst will fall to the second even with those issues. 

terrible athletic ability really? that one handed catch against ohio state was one of the most athletic plays I’ve ever seen... Not the most athletic out of the db group but he is not terrible

[Coffeedrinker]

 

1 hour ago, Hoose said:

36. Maurice Hurst, DT    Apparently over his heart issues. Still slips because of that issue plus only fits 4-3 D. Super quick.

 

Hurst does not have a heart issue that he "apparently" got over.  At the combine they hooked him up to a machine that gave them a reading that basically told the doctor that further evaluation is necessary.  They further evaluated it and found there was no issue.

 

It has happened to me a few times. 

 

Additionally, he probably won't drop that far.  one, there are a lot of teams that run a 4-3, so if you think he only fits a 4-3 that does not mean he is not wanted or needed.  2nd, he is the best 4-3 DT in the draft, 3rd he would also fit a lot of teams that run a 3-4 like the Colts have for the past few years.  He would play the same position that Anderson played.  There are a lot of teams that would be able to take advantage of incredible burst off the snap.

 

If you think Josh Jackson is worth #12, I'm guessing you are an Iowa fan?  Jackson had an incredible season and the couple/three games I watched he is fearless at the CB spot which is a huge plus to me.  But I personally don't think any one year college starter is worth a first round pick.  If it took them 3 or 4 years to crack the starting line up in college, they will not pick up the pro game quickly.

[Cynjin]

1 hour ago, Hoose said:

Same scenario as the first time. The players the Colts want at #6 are taken. Buffalo calls and makes them an offer they can't refuse: Picks 12, 22, 56 and 65. The Colts give them picks 6 and 104. The Colts now own picks 12, 22, 36, 37, 49, 56, 65 and 67. 

 

12. Josh Jackson, CB.   Alpha Dog corner. Will become Colts' #1 CB. 

22. Will Hernandez, G.   He's not Nelson, but he's an outstanding player. Long term starter.

36. Maurice Hurst, DT    Apparently over his heart issues. Still slips because of that issue plus only fits 4-3 D. Super quick.

37. Ty Crosby, T             PAC 12 offensive lineman of the year. did not allow a sack in 2017.

49. Dante Pettis, WR     Excellent hands; solid route runner; great punt returner. He can become Robin to TY Hilton's Batman.

56, Darius Leonard, LB  The one holdover from other draft. He's a rock solid player. 

65. Josh Sweat, DE       One of the stars of the combine. He can play too. Great speed and bend. 

67. Royce Freeman, RB Forgotten talent with deep RB class. #2 20 yd shuttle; #3 30 yd cone at combine. Hands and speed and big time power.

 

Your comments would be appreciated.

 

Personally, I would want the Colts to get their 1st next year added in somehow.

[krunk]

13 minutes ago, MarquisJ said:

terrible athletic ability really? that one handed catch against ohio state was one of the most athletic plays I’ve ever seen... Not the most athletic out of the db group but he is not terrible

I don't even know if I understand that comment Ghost made there.   I thought the main objective was that the guy be able to cover and cover well. That to me should turn you on more than anything else.

[BProland85]

Many reaches in your mock 

[richard pallo]

1 hour ago, Hoose said:

Same scenario as the first time. The players the Colts want at #6 are taken. Buffalo calls and makes them an offer they can't refuse: Picks 12, 22, 56 and 65. The Colts give them picks 6 and 104. The Colts now own picks 12, 22, 36, 37, 49, 56, 65 and 67. 

 

12. Josh Jackson, CB.   Alpha Dog corner. Will become Colts' #1 CB. 

22. Will Hernandez, G.   He's not Nelson, but he's an outstanding player. Long term starter.

36. Maurice Hurst, DT    Apparently over his heart issues. Still slips because of that issue plus only fits 4-3 D. Super quick.

37. Ty Crosby, T             PAC 12 offensive lineman of the year. did not allow a sack in 2017.

49. Dante Pettis, WR     Excellent hands; solid route runner; great punt returner. He can become Robin to TY Hilton's Batman.

56, Darius Leonard, LB  The one holdover from other draft. He's a rock solid player. 

65. Josh Sweat, DE       One of the stars of the combine. He can play too. Great speed and bend. 

67. Royce Freeman, RB Forgotten talent with deep RB class. #2 20 yd shuttle; #3 30 yd cone at combine. Hands and speed and big time power.

 

Your comments would be appreciated.

In this scenario we are taking a RB way before 67.  Way before.

[Four2itus]

Not near enough attention to the LB position...IMO. 

[Hoose]

14 minutes ago, BProland85 said:

Many reaches in your mock 

Ok. Which ones? I get that some don't love Josh Jackson. But many do, so its a push. But where else? Just curious and appreciate the feedback. 

[WarGhost21]

1 hour ago, MarquisJ said:

terrible athletic ability really? that one handed catch against ohio state was one of the most athletic plays I’ve ever seen... Not the most athletic out of the db group but he is not terrible

At 12th overall 4.56 speed isn’t going to be worth it. With a top 16 pick, you need a stud athlete with stud potential, not just a stud player with okay athleticism. Everything else was fantastic though!

[MarquisJ]

41 minutes ago, WarGhost21 said:

At 12th overall 4.56 speed isn’t going to be worth it. With a top 16 pick, you need a stud athlete with stud potential, not just a stud player with okay athleticism. Everything else was fantastic though!

12th overall i do not agree with either Id try to snag him with our first second round pick for sure but the kid is definitely #1cb potential

[CheezyColt]

I'd think Hurst would have to be taken at 12 of we want him. Possibly 22. Unfortunately, I don't think he falls out of the first round. Part of me wants to try to grab both Hurst and Taven Bryan somehow and get this D- line purring.

[Hoose]

i totally understand the push back on Jackson.Some love him some don't.  But the Colts need a stud CB or two. or three. 

If not Jackson, who? Give us some feedback rather than no input. Lots of smart members here. Lets hear from you.

[ztboiler]

We don't know enough about this new scheme to know how Corners will play, but we know enough to suspect that we won't be drafting premium 1st Round press corners anymore.

 

Additionally, Hurst is a premium, disruptive player as he projects to the next level.  His fit really isn't ambiguous at this stage of the league's evolution.  Some team will think he is Aaron Donald or at least Sheldon Rankin and pick him between 10 and 20.

[#7ForDays]

3 minutes ago, ztboiler said:

We don't know enough about this new scheme to know how Corners will play, but we know enough to suspect that we won't be drafting premium 1st Round press corners anymore.

 

Additionally, Hurst is a premium, disruptive player as he projects to the next level.  His fit really isn't ambiguous at this stage of the league's evolution.  Some team will think he is Aaron Donald or at least Sheldon Rankin and pick him between 10 and 20.

 

Forgive me if I come across as an * but bear with me:

 

1) Rankins is not in the same airfield as Donald. There is Donald and then there is Rankins. Only comparison between the two invovles the words "is significantly better than". 

 

2) Hurst is not even comparable to Donald. The game tape shows that much. Just because their both short and freakishly strong at the point of attack doesn't mean they are equalivant talents. Donald's quickness is elite. Hurst, unfortunately, doesn't stack up.

 

3) Hurst is far more comparable to, like you said, Rankins. That's his ceiling barring any significant injury or complication. 

[Briggs32]

19 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

 

Hurst does not have a heart issue that he "apparently" got over.  At the combine they hooked him up to a machine that gave them a reading that basically told the doctor that further evaluation is necessary.  They further evaluated it and found there was no issue.

 

It has happened to me a few times. 

 

Additionally, he probably won't drop that far.  one, there are a lot of teams that run a 4-3, so if you think he only fits a 4-3 that does not mean he is not wanted or needed.  2nd, he is the best 4-3 DT in the draft, 3rd he would also fit a lot of teams that run a 3-4 like the Colts have for the past few years.  He would play the same position that Anderson played.  There are a lot of teams that would be able to take advantage of incredible burst off the snap.

 

If you think Josh Jackson is worth #12, I'm guessing you are an Iowa fan?  Jackson had an incredible season and the couple/three games I watched he is fearless at the CB spot which is a huge plus to me.  But I personally don't think any one year college starter is worth a first round pick.  If it took them 3 or 4 years to crack the starting line up in college, they will not pick up the pro game quickly.

So you think Hooker was a bad choice?  Lattimore for the Saints last year?  Ward as a top 10 pick as well?  They were also only one year starters. 

[ztboiler]

42 minutes ago, #7ForDays said:

 

Forgive me if I come across as an * but bear with me:

 

1) Rankins is not in the same airfield as Donald. There is Donald and then there is Rankins. Only comparison between the two invovles the words "is significantly better than". 

 

2) Hurst is not even comparable to Donald. The game tape shows that much. Just because their both short and freakishly strong at the point of attack doesn't mean they are equalivant talents. Donald's quickness is elite. Hurst, unfortunately, doesn't stack up.

 

3) Hurst is far more comparable to, like you said, Rankins. That's his ceiling barring any significant injury or complication. 

I figured someone might over-read that and make this leap...so I should have written a disclaimer:  No direct comparison is stated nor implied by the writer of this post.  My fault.

 

Another disclaimer I make every year around here:  I don't do player evaluations.  

Evidently you do...

 

Donald was drafted 13th 

Rankin was drafted 12th

The suggestion here is that some teams will see Hurst as teams saw Donald or Rankins on draft day when they projected them as worthy of a high pick.

 

[#7ForDays]

2 hours ago, ztboiler said:

I figured someone might over-read that and make this leap...so I should have written a disclaimer:  No direct comparison is stated nor implied by the writer of this post.  My fault.

 

Another disclaimer I make every year around here:  I don't do player evaluations.  

Evidently you do...

 

Donald was drafted 13th 

Rankin was drafted 12th

The suggestion here is that some teams will see Hurst as teams saw Donald or Rankins on draft day when they projected them as worthy of a high pick.

 

I don't disagree my friend. Some team will, and in my opinion, erroneously, draft Hurst in the hope is like Donald.

 

I hope Colts are NOT that team. 

 

PS: Donald was drafted 13th in one of the strongest drafts in recent memory and, for all intents and purposes, the best interior lineman in the NFL. Rankins, although very good, has yet to make the Pro Bowl (still young and going into his 3rd year).

[rock8591]

 

Might be a bit unrealistic for rounds 1-4, but I'd love this.

[il vecchio]

What would be Buffalo's motivation in giving up so many picks?  Who are they trying to get ahead of that makes such a trade necessary?

I've haven't seen many mocks that show a QB selected by TB, CHI, SF, OAK or MIA.

[GoColts00]

18 hours ago, Hoose said:

i totally understand the push back on Jackson.Some love him some don't.  But the Colts need a stud CB or two. or three. 

If not Jackson, who? Give us some feedback rather than no input. Lots of smart members here. Lets hear from you.

Personally I think Jaire Alexander is better than Jackson. 2017 was a bad season for Alexander bc of injuries. I think he bounces back. I think he's the best zone CB in this draft. I also like M.J. Stewart as a slot CB. ONLY a slot CB tho. He's absolutely horrible outside.

[Coffeedrinker]

On 3/24/2018 at 11:51 AM, Briggs32 said:

So you think Hooker was a bad choice?  Lattimore for the Saints last year?  Ward as a top 10 pick as well?  They were also only one year starters. 

Do I think he was a bad choice?  No but like my post said, personally I do not think any one year starter is worth a 1st round pick and I do not think Hooker was worth a 1st round pick. 

 

And yes there are exceptions to the rule that does not change the fact that I don't think a one year starter is worth a 1st round pick.  But I will admit that DBs are more likely to be the exception to the rule because they can get significant playing time without being a starter. 

 

Also you will never see me claim a team reached or overdrafted a player because they drafted that player before I thought they should.

 

 

[Coffeedrinker]

On 3/24/2018 at 11:21 AM, #7ForDays said:

 

Forgive me if I come across as an * but bear with me:

 

1) Rankins is not in the same airfield as Donald. There is Donald and then there is Rankins. Only comparison between the two invovles the words "is significantly better than". 

 

2) Hurst is not even comparable to Donald. The game tape shows that much. Just because their both short and freakishly strong at the point of attack doesn't mean they are equalivant talents. Donald's quickness is elite. Hurst, unfortunately, doesn't stack up.

 

3) Hurst is far more comparable to, like you said, Rankins. That's his ceiling barring any significant injury or complication. 

Forgive me if I come across as an * but bear with me.

 

You claim the "game tape shows" and then you say Hurst doesn't have the quickness of Donald?  If that's the case then I question your ability to diagnose what you are seeing on the "game tape".

 

 

[#7ForDays]

8 hours ago, Coffeedrinker said:

Forgive me if I come across as an * but bear with me.

 

You claim the "game tape shows" and then you say Hurst doesn't have the quickness of Donald?  If that's the case then I question your ability to diagnose what you are seeing on the "game tape".

 

 

Sir, I would implore you to give Aaron Donald's tape from 2013 a look and then compare it to Mr. Hurst's. The comparison simply doesn't exist. Hurst, as talented as he is, isn't nearly the Calibre of athlete that Aaron Donald is. His quickness, although good for college standards, is NOT elite. This much was proved at the combine where Hurst scored in the bottom half in quickness (3 cone drill). I will not detract from Hurst's ability as a DT, as he is still one of the better interior lineman in this draft. However, that said, in NFL ceiling is as a rotational DT or a specialist on 3rd downs in subpackages.

 

You can accept that reality or you can disagree. 

 

[Hoose]

On 3/24/2018 at 5:54 PM, il vecchio said:

What would be Buffalo's motivation in giving up so many picks?  Who are they trying to get ahead of that makes such a trade necessary?

I've haven't seen many mocks that show a QB selected by TB, CHI, SF, OAK or MIA.

Arizona and Miami could both trade up for the #6 pick. That competition is plenty of motivation if a QB is available that you believe can take your franchise to the next level. Buffalo traded up to #12 for a reason, and they have the additional ammo to outbid Arizona and Miami in a trade.  Now, they could also trade with the Giants, who might take the same deal I have the Colts getting if the G-men decide they don't need Eli's replacement in this draft. I do think the Giants take a QB,however, which would likely make 3 of the top 4 QBs off the board when the Colts choose. One left: who wants him bad enough?

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

On 3/23/2018 at 2:19 PM, Coffeedrinker said:

 

Hurst does not have a heart issue that he "apparently" got over.  At the combine they hooked him up to a machine that gave them a reading that basically told the doctor that further evaluation is necessary.  They further evaluated it and found there was no issue.

 

It has happened to me a few times. 

 

Additionally, he probably won't drop that far.  one, there are a lot of teams that run a 4-3, so if you think he only fits a 4-3 that does not mean he is not wanted or needed.  2nd, he is the best 4-3 DT in the draft, 3rd he would also fit a lot of teams that run a 3-4 like the Colts have for the past few years.  He would play the same position that Anderson played.  There are a lot of teams that would be able to take advantage of incredible burst off the snap.

 

If you think Josh Jackson is worth #12, I'm guessing you are an Iowa fan?  Jackson had an incredible season and the couple/three games I watched he is fearless at the CB spot which is a huge plus to me.  But I personally don't think any one year college starter is worth a first round pick.  If it took them 3 or 4 years to crack the starting line up in college, they will not pick up the pro game quickly.

Malik Hooker?

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

On 3/23/2018 at 2:58 PM, Hoose said:

Ok. Which ones? I get that some don't love Josh Jackson. But many do, so its a push. But where else? Just curious and appreciate the feedback. 

Crosby, Pettis & Freeman are and picked to high.

[Hoose]

Ok. I don’t agree but appreciate the feedback. 

[Coffeedrinker]

12 hours ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

Malik Hooker?

See above.  But no I would not have drafted Hooker in the first round.

[Coffeedrinker]

14 hours ago, #7ForDays said:

Sir, I would implore you to give Aaron Donald's tape from 2013 a look and then compare it to Mr. Hurst's. The comparison simply doesn't exist. Hurst, as talented as he is, isn't nearly the Calibre of athlete that Aaron Donald is. His quickness, although good for college standards, is NOT elite. This much was proved at the combine where Hurst scored in the bottom half in quickness (3 cone drill). I will not detract from Hurst's ability as a DT, as he is still one of the better interior lineman in this draft. However, that said, in NFL ceiling is as a rotational DT or a specialist on 3rd downs in subpackages.

 

You can accept that reality or you can disagree. 

 

 

I have watched Donald for a while, he's a fun player to watch, one of my favorite non Colts players and one of the single most disruptive players in the NFL.  Hurst's quickness off the snap is right there with him, he doesn't have the upper body strength of Donald nor the leg drive so I don't think he's as good as Donald but it's not because he's not as quick..  I've been watching Hurst for a while as well since I'm a Michigan fan.

 

Also I'm not sure how Hurst scored in the bottom half of 3 cone drill at the combine considering he didn't participate at the combine.  But if you watch Hurst and how often he is on the other side of the LOS before the olineman gets his hands on him his quickness his elite.  

[Hoose]

I agree with Coffeedrinker on this one. Hurst is elite, and he'll likely go late first early second round. He is definitely the kind of disrupting player the Colts are searching for. That said, I believe the talent at LB, Oline, WR, CB and RB will shape the Colts' first two-three rounds. Excellent players at positions of need. DT is arguably not nearly as critical, but we'll see.

[TdungyW/12]

On 3/23/2018 at 1:05 PM, Hoose said:

Same scenario as the first time. The players the Colts want at #6 are taken. Buffalo calls and makes them an offer they can't refuse: Picks 12, 22, 56 and 65. The Colts give them picks 6 and 104. The Colts now own picks 12, 22, 36, 37, 49, 56, 65 and 67. 

 

12. Josh Jackson, CB.   Alpha Dog corner. Will become Colts' #1 CB. 

22. Will Hernandez, G.   He's not Nelson, but he's an outstanding player. Long term starter.

36. Maurice Hurst, DT    Apparently over his heart issues. Still slips because of that issue plus only fits 4-3 D. Super quick.

37. Ty Crosby, T             PAC 12 offensive lineman of the year. did not allow a sack in 2017.

49. Dante Pettis, WR     Excellent hands; solid route runner; great punt returner. He can become Robin to TY Hilton's Batman.

56, Darius Leonard, LB  The one holdover from other draft. He's a rock solid player. 

65. Josh Sweat, DE       One of the stars of the combine. He can play too. Great speed and bend. 

67. Royce Freeman, RB Forgotten talent with deep RB class. #2 20 yd shuttle; #3 30 yd cone at combine. Hands and speed and big time power.

 

Your comments would be appreciated.

As good as it sounds/looks CB already stated he doesn’t want to move out of the top 10. 

 

And we we need Oline, LB & DE over any spot

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

1 hour ago, Coffeedrinker said:

See above.  But no I would not have drafted Hooker in the first round.

Saw it after I remarked coffee! I agree with you to a point! But I disagree with your thinking if it's say a power school big time program! In many cases the Alabamas, Ohio St, USC's, Auburns, and so on just stack player at positions and you wait your time. Not that you are not good there is just a pecking order!  And you wait for your turn so to  speak. Sometimes it's a coach player issue, seeing both of us have played I am sure we have seen this issue as well. At smaller schools agree 100%. As far as Hooker where we drafted him I was cool with it, but doesn't mean there aren't concerns, yes he's a freak of nature with  ridiculous  ball skills, range, and athleticism, but in the same vein he's a former basketball player, limited football experience, just   Scratching the surface of his ability? Your macking and educated guess as to what he will become! There is risk!  I do fantasy baseball every year andyou'll see the guy in his first year and he really goes off typically I won't draft that guy the following year because you're not sure what his second year has in store I stay away from those types of players unless I'm absolutely sure you will get the most bang for your pick!  Someone with a long track record is certainly a safer pic more  attractive pic to me.

[T Hamby]

On 3/23/2018 at 4:05 PM, Hoose said:

 

 

12.  Harold LANDRY. DE

22. Mike Hughes. CB

36. Darius Guice RB

37. Ty Crosby, T            

49. Conner Williams T/G

56, Malik Jefferson. LB

65. Anthony Miller WR

67.  J Baker LB

 

I really hope we trade for the most high round picks we can get..  

On 3/23/2018 at 4:05 PM, Hoose said:

 

Your comments would be appreciated.

 

[Coffeedrinker]

9 minutes ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

Saw it after I remarked coffee! I agree with you to a point! But I disagree with your thinking if it's say a power school big time program! In many cases the Alabamas, Ohio St, USC's, Auburns, and so on just stack player at positions and you wait your time. Not that you are not good there is just a pecking order!  And you wait for your turn so to  speak. Sometimes it's a coach player issue, seeing both of us have played I am sure we have seen this issue as well. At smaller schools agree 100%. As far as Hooker where we drafted him I was cool with it, but doesn't mean there aren't concerns, yes he's a freak of nature with  ridiculous  ball skills, range, and athleticism, but in the same vein he's a former basketball player, limited football experience, just   Scratching the surface of his ability? Your macking and educated guess as to what he will become! There is risk!  I do fantasy baseball every year andyou'll see the guy in his first year and he really goes off typically I won't draft that guy the following year because you're not sure what his second year has in store I stay away from those types of players unless I'm absolutely sure you will get the most bang for your pick!  Someone with a long track record is certainly a safer pic more  attractive pic to me.

And I am willing to admit, I'm old school and perhaps this is the way of the NFL now.  Maybe teams figure since they are going to have to unteach what the kids learned in college and teach them they way they want it done, it better to draft someone with the attributes they are looking for rather than someone who has shown they can put those attributes to good use for multiple years.

[Coltsfanforlife12]

On 3/23/2018 at 4:35 PM, tvturner said:

Derwin James is better if we're going to go to the secondary in the 1st round

James is good but I don’t get your obsession with drafting him.  He’s a safety and not a corner... we have safeties...

[tvturner]

10 hours ago, Coltsfanforlife12 said:

James is good but I don’t get your obsession with drafting him.  He’s a safety and not a corner... we have safeties...

We have 1 injured safety and a a quality backup 

[OffensivelyPC]

No one is going to mention what a gross overpay this is?  Buffalo overpaid with the two first round picks to begin with, let alone throwing in a 2nd and 3rd round pick.  What the blazes is everyone smoking?  I'm not draconian when it comes to the draft trade chart, but the OP has it down to about -1300 points.  That's basically like giving us a free top 10 pick.  An offer we can't refuse?  Well yeah, because it's so blatantly lopsided.  

 

Mocking trades is fun and all, but for *'s sake, let's at least stay in the orbit of reality.  We're picking 6th...dropping back to 12 isn't going to get us Buffalo's entire 2018 draft.